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Gordon Liddy">G. Gordon Liddy</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Ignaz_Trebitsch_Lincoln" title="Ignaz Trebitsch Lincoln">Ignaz Trebitsch Lincoln</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Lyndon_LaRouche" title="Lyndon LaRouche">Lyndon LaRouche</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Jacob_Zuma" title="Jacob Zuma">Jacob Zuma</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Harvey_Weinstein" title="Harvey Weinstein">Harvey Weinstein</a></li></ul> <div class="vte plainlinks" style="font-size:smaller; text-align:center;"><a href="/wiki/Template:Crimenav" title="Template:Crimenav">v</a> - <a href="/wiki/Template_talk:Crimenav" title="Template talk:Crimenav">t</a> - <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Crimenav&action=edit">e</a></div> </td></tr></tbody></table> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>The barbarous custom of having men beaten who are suspected of having important secrets to reveal must be abolished. It has always been recognized that this way of interrogating men, by putting them to torture, produces nothing worthwhile. The poor wretches say anything that comes into their mind and what they think the interrogator wishes to know.</div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—<a href="/wiki/Napoleon_Bonaparte" title="Napoleon Bonaparte">Napoleon Bonaparte</a><sup id="cite_ref-1" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-1">[1]</a></sup></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><b>Torture</b> is the act of deliberately causing physical or mental anguish, pain, and/or harm, sometimes in order to achieve a specific result, such as obtaining <a href="/wiki/Intelligence_(government)" title="Intelligence (government)">information</a> ("enhanced interrogation" for the <a href="/wiki/Conservative_correctness" title="Conservative correctness">politically correct</a>), or sometimes as revenge or to satisfy the <a href="/wiki/Sadist" class="mw-redirect" title="Sadist">sadistic</a> nature of the torturer. During the <a href="/wiki/Inquisition" title="Inquisition">Inquisition</a>, torture was specifically and formally approved by Pope <a href="/wiki/Lulz" class="mw-redirect" title="Lulz">Innocent</a> IV with his 1252 law, the papal bull <i>Ad Extirpanda</i>.<sup id="cite_ref-2" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-2">[2]</a></sup> </p><p>In spite of a long history of the use of torture by <a href="/wiki/Government" title="Government">governments</a>, <a href="/wiki/Religion" title="Religion">religions</a>, and individuals, research has shown that information obtained through torture is <i>extremely</i> unreliable. </p> <div id="toc" class="toc" role="navigation" aria-labelledby="mw-toc-heading"><input type="checkbox" role="button" id="toctogglecheckbox" class="toctogglecheckbox" style="display:none" /><div class="toctitle" lang="en" dir="ltr"><h2 id="mw-toc-heading">Contents</h2><span class="toctogglespan"><label class="toctogglelabel" for="toctogglecheckbox"></label></span></div> <ul> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-1"><a href="#Problems"><span class="tocnumber">1</span> <span class="toctext">Problems</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-2"><a href="#Current_events"><span class="tocnumber">2</span> <span class="toctext">Current events</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-3"><a href="#Effectiveness"><span class="tocnumber">2.1</span> <span class="toctext">Effectiveness</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-4"><a href="#Terrorist_propaganda_tool"><span class="tocnumber">2.1.1</span> <span class="toctext">Terrorist propaganda tool</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-5"><a href="#Tick.2C_tick.2C_bullshit"><span class="tocnumber">2.1.2</span> <span class="toctext">Tick, tick, bullshit</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-6"><a href="#Guantanamo"><span class="tocnumber">2.2</span> <span class="toctext">Guantanamo</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-7"><a href="#Extraordinary_rendition"><span class="tocnumber">2.3</span> <span class="toctext">Extraordinary rendition</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-8"><a href="#Ashcroft-Gonzales_hospital_incident"><span class="tocnumber">2.4</span> <span class="toctext">Ashcroft-Gonzales hospital incident</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-9"><a href="#World_public_rejects_torture.2C_mostly"><span class="tocnumber">3</span> <span class="toctext">World public rejects torture, mostly</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-10"><a href="#History"><span class="tocnumber">4</span> <span class="toctext">History</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-11"><a href="#Notes"><span class="tocnumber">5</span> <span class="toctext">Notes</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-12"><a href="#References"><span class="tocnumber">6</span> <span class="toctext">References</span></a></li> </ul> </div> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Problems">Problems</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=1" title="Edit section: Problems">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>Torture is unreliable for three particular reasons:<sup id="cite_ref-3" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-3">[3]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-4" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-4">[4]</a></sup> </p> <ol><li>Under torture, a person may say <i>whatever</i> the torturer wants to hear. They may incriminate innocent people or confess to crimes they know nothing about.<sup id="cite_ref-5" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-5">[5]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-6" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-6">[6]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-7" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-7">[7]</a></sup></li> <li>A person under torture has no real interest in helping the torturer, as they are not a willing ally. Assuming they have not been coerced into simply saying whatever the interrogator wants to hear, then their information is likely to be ambiguous, dangerous, or simply wrong.<sup id="cite_ref-senaterep_8-0" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-senaterep-8">[8]</a></sup></li> <li>People undergoing torture aren't exactly in the best state of mind to give accurate information, even if they wanted to in the first place. Neuroscience has shown strong evidence that torture degrades the subject's memory and impairs their ability to think and reason.<sup id="cite_ref-9" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-9">[9]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-10" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-10">[10]</a></sup></li></ol> <p>In addition to those three problems of not getting accurate information, torture hurts your overall policy effectiveness in several ways. This is more applicable for governments than for, say, <a href="/wiki/Organized_crime" title="Organized crime">bank robbers</a>, but all the same: </p> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:252px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Waterboarding.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/26/Waterboarding.jpg/250px-Waterboarding.jpg" decoding="async" width="250" height="166" class="thumbimage" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/26/Waterboarding.jpg/375px-Waterboarding.jpg 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/26/Waterboarding.jpg/500px-Waterboarding.jpg 2x" data-file-width="1024" data-file-height="681" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Waterboarding.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>An anti-waterboarding protest in Iceland</div></div></div> <ul><li>False information gained from torture will likely harm the nation's overall interests. For instance, <a href="/wiki/Japan" title="Japan">Japan</a> tortured an American POW during <a href="/wiki/World_War_Two" class="mw-redirect" title="World War Two">World War Two</a> after the <a href="/wiki/Atomic_bombings_of_Hiroshima_and_Nagasaki" title="Atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki">atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki</a> to find out how many more atom bombs the United States might have. The POW was coerced into claiming there were about 100 such weapons, when the project had in fact been kept secret from the military and the Americans had no more bombs.<sup id="cite_ref-11" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-11">[11]</a></sup> It's almost certain that this alarming but false information helped convince the Japanese to surrender. The US Senate also found that torture of suspects by the <a href="/wiki/CIA" title="CIA">CIA</a> generated significant false data on critical areas of counter-terrorism intelligence and harmed U.S. national security.<sup id="cite_ref-senaterep_8-1" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-senaterep-8">[8]</a></sup></li> <li>Torture makes allies and neutral parties less friendly towards your side. The United States' torture program has harmed its image across the <a href="/wiki/Middle_East" title="Middle East">Middle East</a>, and has been used by <a href="/wiki/Dictator" class="mw-redirect" title="Dictator">dictators</a> to justify their own crimes.<sup id="cite_ref-12" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-12">[12]</a></sup> General Paul Eaton, who was responsible for training Iraqi soldiers, said that the U.S.'s "national interests in the future — and I'm talking about generations to come — have been undermined by the awareness, by the clear truth, ground truth that the United States is going to torture people."<sup id="cite_ref-13" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-13">[13]</a></sup></li></ul> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:252px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Vietconginterrogation1967.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cf/Vietconginterrogation1967.jpg/250px-Vietconginterrogation1967.jpg" decoding="async" width="250" height="167" class="thumbimage" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cf/Vietconginterrogation1967.jpg/375px-Vietconginterrogation1967.jpg 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cf/Vietconginterrogation1967.jpg/500px-Vietconginterrogation1967.jpg 2x" data-file-width="2400" data-file-height="1605" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Vietconginterrogation1967.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>U.S. soldiers torture a Viet Cong prisoner with stress positions during the <a href="/wiki/Vietnam_War" title="Vietnam War">Vietnam War</a></div></div></div> <ul><li>Torture makes other avenues of negotiation/information-gathering ineffective. Even if contacts are otherwise inclined to help the information-seekers, the possibility of being tortured as well for information makes them clam up and feign <a href="/wiki/Ignorance" title="Ignorance">ignorance</a>. After all, any organization brutal enough to torture people for information can't exactly be trusted to keep promises or play fairly. If <a href="/wiki/Gestapo" class="mw-redirect" title="Gestapo">Gestapo</a> agents were offering 100,000 marks for primo information on the underground <a href="/wiki/Communist" class="mw-redirect" title="Communist">communist</a> party, what makes you think they wouldn't just torture you for the information when you come forward to collect the reward?</li> <li>If torture comes to light, it can be used by your adversary as proof of how brutal and inhumane you are, which will <a href="/wiki/Blowback" title="Blowback">decrease your popular support and make whatever cause the victim fought for stronger</a>. The world saw this effect in action during the <a href="/wiki/War_on_Terror" title="War on Terror">War on Terror</a>.<sup id="cite_ref-14" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-14">[14]</a></sup></li> <li>If a combatant thinks they will be tortured if you capture them, they will fight harder and be less likely to surrender or cooperate.</li> <li>Government-sanctioned torture creates a breeding ground for <a href="/wiki/Genocide" title="Genocide">further atrocities</a>. As dodgy as <a href="/wiki/Capital_punishment" title="Capital punishment">capital punishment</a> is, most countries go out of their way to make the process as transparent as possible. However, to avoid the previous problems, most torture is done (even in the most brutal of regimes) with a heavy dose of secrecy. This cocktail of opaqueness and necessarily-dehumanized torture inevitably leads to further <a href="/wiki/Human_rights" title="Human rights">human rights</a> abuses.</li> <li>Torture also creates the problem of needing to do something with the captive once they do give up the information. Even if you otherwise have no interest in whether they live or die, you can't exactly <i>let them go</i>, because they're a witness to what happened and will probably oppose you. You could just imprison them indefinitely, give them a (<a href="/wiki/Kangaroo_court" title="Kangaroo court">probably show</a>) trial, and/or execute them — at the cost of hurting your international standing even further.</li></ul> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Current_events">Current events</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=2" title="Edit section: Current events">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>I don't give a rat's ass if it helps! We are AMERICA! WE DO NOT FUCKING TORTURE!!!</div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—<a href="/wiki/Fox_News" title="Fox News">Fox News</a> anchor Shepard Smith nicely schooling Trace Gallagher, April 23, 2009<sup id="cite_ref-15" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-15">[15]</a></sup></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p>Despite being outlawed by most countries, torture is still practiced by some, particularly <a href="/wiki/Dictatorship" title="Dictatorship">dictatorships</a> and other tyrannical or <a href="/wiki/Authoritarian" class="mw-redirect" title="Authoritarian">authoritarian</a> governments. The <a href="/wiki/United_States" title="United States">United States</a> has a prohibition against it, but this was all-too-frequently circumvented by outsourcing the dirty work to <s>mercenaries</s> <a href="/wiki/Blackwater" title="Blackwater">private contractors</a>, ensuring that no one was actually tortured on American soil, and as a last resort, redefining the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneva_Conventions" class="extiw" title="wp:Geneva Conventions" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Geneva Conventions">Geneva Conventions</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> to suit.<sup id="cite_ref-16" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-16">[16]</a></sup> Ain't obeying the <a href="/wiki/Law" title="Law">law</a> grand, <a href="/wiki/Republican" class="mw-redirect" title="Republican">Republicans</a>? There's increasing <a href="/wiki/Evidence" title="Evidence">evidence</a> that the U.S., in many cases, <i>directly</i> engaged in torture; they just made sure to do it in gray areas, like Guantanamo.<sup id="cite_ref-17" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-17">[17]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-18" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-18">[18]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-19" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-19">[19]</a></sup> </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Effectiveness">Effectiveness</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=3" title="Edit section: Effectiveness">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:202px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Iraqis_tortured_wp-f.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/Iraqis_tortured_wp-f.jpg/200px-Iraqis_tortured_wp-f.jpg" decoding="async" width="200" height="162" class="thumbimage" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/Iraqis_tortured_wp-f.jpg/300px-Iraqis_tortured_wp-f.jpg 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/Iraqis_tortured_wp-f.jpg/400px-Iraqis_tortured_wp-f.jpg 2x" data-file-width="429" data-file-height="347" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Iraqis_tortured_wp-f.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>Prisoner abuse in Abu Ghraib</div></div></div> <p>An example of the unreliability of torture can, surprisingly, be gleaned from the <a href="/wiki/Larry_Craig" title="Larry Craig">Larry Craig</a> affair. Apparently, just the thought of the damage to his reputation and position in society made him plead guilty to a <a href="/wiki/Sex" title="Sex">sex</a>-related disorderly conduct charge, even though he has since claimed he was not guilty. Imagine what he would wrongly plead guilty to if torture, rather than shame, were in the offing? And this man was a tough <a href="/wiki/Conservative" class="mw-redirect" title="Conservative">conservative</a>, not a <a href="/wiki/Liberal" class="mw-redirect" title="Liberal">librul</a> weakling. </p><p>The <a href="/wiki/United_States_Armed_Forces" title="United States Armed Forces">military</a> (and formerly, the <a href="/wiki/CIA" title="CIA">CIA</a>) claimed that torture is a worthless tactic, as the victim will admit anything to stop the torture. For gathering useful intelligence, gaining trust, bribery, or undercover operations are far more useful tactics, and don't result in the physical or mental destruction of anyone. </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Terrorist_propaganda_tool">Terrorist propaganda tool</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=4" title="Edit section: Terrorist propaganda tool">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>With regard to <a href="/wiki/Terrorism" title="Terrorism">terrorism</a>, torture can also serve as a catalyst to increase terrorist activity. A terrorist organization needs to play to prejudices or other discontent on the part of its potential recruits. Beating, arresting, and especially torturing or killing people gives terrorists <a href="/wiki/Propaganda" title="Propaganda">propaganda</a> fuel.<sup id="cite_ref-20" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-20">[20]</a></sup> Treating them like human beings and entering into legitimate, fair political negotiation (even when abstaining from <a href="/wiki/Appeasement" title="Appeasement">appeasing</a> them) does not. </p><p>Most recently, the 2014 Senate report detailing how the U.S. tortured prisoners during the War on Terror was a propaganda goldmine for overseas terrorist groups like <a href="/wiki/Al-Qaeda" title="Al-Qaeda">Al-Qaeda</a>, the <a href="/wiki/Taliban" title="Taliban">Taliban</a>, and <a href="/wiki/DAESH" title="DAESH">DAESH</a>.<sup id="cite_ref-proptool_21-0" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-proptool-21">[21]</a></sup> The <a href="/wiki/FBI" class="mw-redirect" title="FBI">FBI</a> and the Department of Homeland Security released a joint statement saying: "The FBI, DHS, and [National Counterterrorism Center] assess the most likely impact of the report will be attempts by foreign terrorist organizations [...] and their online supporters to exploit the report's findings by claiming they confirm the U.S. government's perceived hypocrisy and oppression of Muslims."<sup id="cite_ref-proptool_21-1" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-proptool-21">[21]</a></sup> The international intelligence community has also noted that DAESH dresses its Western beheading victims in orange jumpsuits to deliberately evoke similarities to prisoners of Guantanamo Bay.<sup id="cite_ref-proptool_21-2" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-proptool-21">[21]</a></sup> </p> <h4><span id="Tick,_tick,_bullshit"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Tick.2C_tick.2C_bullshit">Tick, tick, bullshit</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=5" title="Edit section: Tick, tick, bullshit">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>Those who advocate the use of torture frequently invoke the "ticking bomb" scenario: the need to extract from someone the location of a bomb, usually specified as nuclear, set to go off at an unknown (to the torturers) location sometime in the immediate future.<sup id="cite_ref-22" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-22">[22]</a></sup> This is <a href="/wiki/Bullshit" title="Bullshit">stupid</a> because such a scenario has never happened and will never happen, and torture will be used regardless of whether there's a "ticking bomb" or not.<sup id="cite_ref-23" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-23">[23]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-24" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-24">[24]</a></sup> </p><p>Besides, even if this kind of situation <i>did</i> occur, the person being tortured knows they are in the position of power and needs only to resist for a finite period of time. In this situation, resistance to torture becomes easier, and delaying tactics such as feigning confusion (if it's necessary to feign it), easily produced disinformation, or prolonged silence will achieve the aim of running out the clock. It isn't hard to figure this out. It's already been observed that torture tends to piss the victim off and make them more fanatical and more determined to either resist or mislead their torturers.<sup id="cite_ref-25" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-25">[25]</a></sup> Your enemy's enemy might be your friend, but your torturer certainly isn't. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Guantanamo">Guantanamo</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=6" title="Edit section: Guantanamo">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:202px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Camp_x-ray_detainees.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/65/Camp_x-ray_detainees.jpg/200px-Camp_x-ray_detainees.jpg" decoding="async" width="200" height="200" class="thumbimage" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/65/Camp_x-ray_detainees.jpg/300px-Camp_x-ray_detainees.jpg 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/65/Camp_x-ray_detainees.jpg/400px-Camp_x-ray_detainees.jpg 2x" data-file-width="684" data-file-height="685" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Camp_x-ray_detainees.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>Detainees greeted at Guantanamo</div></div></div> <p>It has been admitted that the U.S. military engaged in torture, including <a href="/wiki/Waterboarding" title="Waterboarding">waterboarding</a>, at the U.S. Navy base in <a href="/wiki/Guantanamo_Bay" title="Guantanamo Bay">Guantanamo Bay</a>, <a href="/wiki/Cuba" title="Cuba">Cuba</a> (in fact, many of the methods later used at <a href="/wiki/Abu_Ghraib" title="Abu Ghraib">Abu Ghraib</a> apparently came from Guantanamo).<sup id="cite_ref-26" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-26">[26]</a></sup> The detention facility (Camp Delta, formerly Camp X-Ray) is an interesting study into the follies of America's current policies regarding detainees. Despite the inhumane treatment of detainees, <a href="/wiki/War_crimes" title="War crimes">clear violations of the Geneva Convention</a> (and the Vienna Convention on Treaties, which allows the camp to <i>exist</i> in the first place), Camp Delta and X-Ray have gathered little workable intelligence. While some high-ranking <a href="/wiki/Al-Qaeda" title="Al-Qaeda">al-Qaeda</a> members have been captured or killed, the organization (which is, in reality, more a philosophy than an actual organization) still remains active worldwide. The <a href="/wiki/Afghanistan_War" title="Afghanistan War">insurgency in Afghanistan</a> is as strong as ever, and al-Qaeda retains significant influence throughout the <a href="/wiki/Middle_East" title="Middle East">Middle East</a> and <a href="/wiki/Africa" title="Africa">Africa</a>. Camp Delta is still operational to this day, despite <a href="/wiki/Barack_Obama" title="Barack Obama">Barack Obama</a>'s promise to close it. </p><p><a href="/wiki/Karl_Rove" title="Karl Rove">Karl Rove</a>, also known as "<a href="/wiki/Bush" title="Bush">Bush</a>'s brain", said he "was proud we used techniques that broke the will of these terrorists."<sup id="cite_ref-27" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-27">[27]</a></sup> Exactly what <a href="/wiki/World_War_II" title="World War II">Imperial Japan</a> said. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Extraordinary_rendition">Extraordinary rendition</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=7" title="Edit section: Extraordinary rendition">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <dl><dd><i>Main article: <a href="/wiki/Extraordinary_rendition" class="mw-redirect" title="Extraordinary rendition">Extraordinary rendition</a></i></dd></dl> <p>Extraordinary rendition is when the United States, determined to break someone without dirtying its own hands, sends a suspect to a <a href="/wiki/State" title="State">state</a> that engages in the worst kind of torture. For example, despite all the heated <a href="/wiki/Rhetoric" title="Rhetoric">rhetoric</a> that the U.S. promulgates about <a href="/wiki/Syria" title="Syria">Syria</a>, some of the people they have captured have been sent there to be tortured. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Ashcroft-Gonzales_hospital_incident">Ashcroft-Gonzales hospital incident</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=8" title="Edit section: Ashcroft-Gonzales hospital incident">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>When then-Attorney General <a href="/wiki/John_Ashcroft" title="John Ashcroft">John Ashcroft</a> was in the hospital (and under sedation), his deputy found that many of the programs of the Bush administration (possibly including torture) were illegal. Then-<a href="/wiki/White_House" class="mw-redirect" title="White House">White House</a> Counsel <a href="/wiki/Alberto_Gonzales" title="Alberto Gonzales">Alberto Gonzales</a> went to visit Ashcroft in the hospital to try to get him to sign off on the programs. Ashcroft refused, rightfully understanding that he was in no position to sign off on anything, and told Gonzalez to talk to his deputy, who was the acting Attorney General at the time. Then, after getting out of the hospital, Ashcroft signed off anyway.<sup id="cite_ref-28" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-28">[28]</a></sup> </p> <h2><span id="World_public_rejects_torture,_mostly"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="World_public_rejects_torture.2C_mostly">World public rejects torture, mostly</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=9" title="Edit section: World public rejects torture, mostly">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>A June 2008 international survey of public attitudes to torture is rather depressing for the <a href="/wiki/Reality-based_community" title="Reality-based community">reality-based community</a>: only 53% think that "All torture should be prohibited." This contrasts with the <a href="/wiki/UK" class="mw-redirect" title="UK">UK</a>, where the figure is 82%. Oddly enough, most of the current techniques used by Americans were developed by the British.<sup id="cite_ref-29" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-29">[29]</a></sup> </p><p>The U.S. falls below states like <a href="/wiki/Ukraine" title="Ukraine">Ukraine</a>, <a href="/wiki/Poland" title="Poland">Poland</a>, and <a href="/wiki/Egypt" title="Egypt">Egypt</a>, and 13% think "Torture should generally be allowed."<sup id="cite_ref-30" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-30">[30]</a></sup> </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="History">History</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=10" title="Edit section: History">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>An <a href="/wiki/Historical" class="mw-redirect" title="Historical">historical</a> aside: in ancient <a href="/wiki/Greece" title="Greece">Greece</a> and <a href="/wiki/Rome" class="mw-redirect" title="Rome">Rome</a>, and possibly elsewhere, the testimony of a <a href="/wiki/Slave" class="mw-redirect" title="Slave">slave</a> could only be accepted by an official tribunal or court after the slave had been tortured. Surprisingly, Greece and Rome were considered at the time to be civilized countries. Of course, pretty much all and every society throughout history has considered itself to be the most advanced civilization ever... </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Notes">Notes</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=11" title="Edit section: Notes">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <div class="references-small" style="font-size:90%;"> </div> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="References">References</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Torture&action=edit&section=12" title="Edit section: References">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <div class="references-small" style="-moz-column-count:2; -webkit-column-count:2; column-count:2; font-size:80%;"> <div class="mw-references-wrap mw-references-columns"><ol class="references"> <li id="cite_note-1"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-1">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Napoleon_I_of_France">Napoleon I of France</a>. <i>Wikiquote</i>.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-2"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-2">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.revolvy.com/page/Ad-extirpanda">Ad extirpanda.</a> <i>Revolvy.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-3"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-3">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://web.archive.org/web/20061229003719/https://www.hrw.org/press/2001/11/TortureQandA.htm">The Legal Prohibition Against Torture</a>, Human Rights Watch.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-4"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-4">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17707-wanted-interrogation-that-works-and-isnt-torture.html">Wanted: Interrogation that works and isn't torture</a>, <i>New Scientist</i>.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-5"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-5">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.upress.virginia.edu/title/1320">Cautio Criminalis, or a Book on Witch Trials</a>. Friedrich Spee. Translated by Marcus Hellyer. Introduction by Marcus Hellyer. The University of Virginia Press.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-6"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-6">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">See the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia" title="Wikipedia">Wikipedia</a> article on <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forced_confession" class="extiw" title="wp:Forced confession" rel="nofollow">Forced confession</a>.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-7"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-7">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/ywkdyg/i-was-tortured-into-giving-a-false-confession-to-chicago-police">I Was Tortured into Giving a False Confession to Chicago Police</a>. By Nicholas Cannariato. <i>Vice.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-senaterep-8"><span class="mw-cite-backlink">↑ <sup><a href="#cite_ref-senaterep_8-0">8.0</a></sup> <sup><a href="#cite_ref-senaterep_8-1">8.1</a></sup></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:US_Senate_Report_on_CIA_Detention_Interrogation_Program.pdf/9">Page:US Senate Report on CIA Detention Interrogation Program.pdf/9</a>. WikiSource. Quote: "While being subjected to the CIA's enhanced interrogation techniques and afterwards, multiple CIA detainees fabricated information, resulting in faulty intelligence. Detainees provided fabricated information on critical intelligence issues, including the terrorist threats which the CIA identified as its highest priorities."</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-9"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-9">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg22830471-200-torture-doesnt-work-says-science-why-are-we-still-doing-it/">The neuroscience of interrogation: Why torture doesn’t work</a>. <i>New Scientist.</i> 11 November 2015.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-10"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-10">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.newsweek.com/science-shows-torture-doesnt-work-456854">Science Shows That Torture Doesn't Work and Is Counterproductive</a>. Rupert Stone. <i>Newsweek.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-11"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-11">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Jerome T. Hagen (1996). War in the Pacific, Chapter 25 "The Lie of Marcus McDilda". Hawaii Pacific University. ISBN 978-0-9653927-0-9.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-12"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-12">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.csis.org/analysis/strategic-cost-torture-racism-and-bigotry">The Strategic Cost of Torture, Racism, and Bigotry</a>. <i>Center for Strategic and International Studies.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-13"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-13">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.humanrightsfirst.org/blog/addressing-america-s-trip-dark-side-cost-torture">Addressing America’s Trip to the “Dark Side”: The Cost of Torture</a>. <i>Human Rights First.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-14"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-14">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://theintercept.com/2018/02/12/torture-terrorists-guantanamo-abu-ghraib/">Blowback: how torture fuels terrorism rather than reduces it</a>. <i>The Intercept.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-15"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-15">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.salon.com/2009/04/23/shep/">Fox anchor: "We are America! We do not f---ing torture!"</a> <i>Salon.</i> April 23, 2009.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-16"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-16">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://newrepublic.com/article/119928/us-violates-un-convention-against-torture-signed-20-years-ago">The U.S. Is Still Violating the Anti-Torture Treaty It Signed 20 Years Ago</a>. <i>The New Republic.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-17"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-17">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2014/dec/09/cia-torture-methods-waterboarding-sleep-deprivation">How the CIA tortured its detainees</a>. <i>The Guardian.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-18"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-18">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-guantanamo-torture/u-n-expert-says-torture-persists-at-guantanamo-bay-u-s-denies-idUSKBN1E71QO">U.N. expert says torture persists at Guantanamo Bay; U.S. denies</a>. <i>Reuters</i>.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-19"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-19">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ex-gitmo-detainee-on-torture-they-broke-me/">Ex-Gitmo detainee on torture: "They broke me"</a>. <i>CBS News.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-20"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-20">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.humanrightsfirst.org/guantanamo-bay-terrorist-propaganda-tool">Guantanamo Bay: A Terrorist Propaganda Tool</a>. <i>Human Rights First.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-proptool-21"><span class="mw-cite-backlink">↑ <sup><a href="#cite_ref-proptool_21-0">21.0</a></sup> <sup><a href="#cite_ref-proptool_21-1">21.1</a></sup> <sup><a href="#cite_ref-proptool_21-2">21.2</a></sup></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://abcnews.go.com/News/senate-torture-report-propaganda-bonanza-islamic-militants-feds/story?id=27483345">Senate Torture Report Is Propaganda Bonanza for Islamic Militants, Feds Say</a>. <i>ABC News.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-22"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-22">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://foreignpolicy.com/2014/12/10/tick-tick-bull-shit-senate-torture-report-cia-ticking-time-bomb/">Tick, Tick, Bull, Shit</a>. <i>Foreign Policy.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-23"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-23">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/12/the-case-for-bringing-back-torture-is-a-ticking-time-bomb/510053/">The Case for Bringing Back Torture Is a Ticking Time-Bomb</a>. <i>The Atlantic.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-24"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-24">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://thinkprogress.org/law-professors-only-jack-bauer-believes-in-the-ticking-time-bomb-scenario-for-torture-c33701aba430/">Law Professors: Only Jack Bauer Believes In The ‘Ticking Time Bomb’ Scenario For Torture</a>. <i>Think Progress.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-25"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-25">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.humanrightsfirst.org/resource/statement-national-security-intelligence-and-interrogation-professionals">Statement of National Security, Intelligence, and Interrogation Professionals</a>. <i>Human Rights First.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-26"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-26">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2004/05/10/torture-at-abu-ghraib">Torture at Abu Ghraib</a>. <i>The New Yorker.</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-27"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-27">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"> <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8563547.stm">Rove 'proud' of US waterboarding terror suspects</a>, BBC</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-28"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-28">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2008/09/what-did-bush-tell-gonzales/307064/?single_page=true">What Did Bush Tell Gonzales?</a>, <i>The Atlantic</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-29"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-29">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2004/may/08/iraq.iraq">UK forces taught torture methods</a> <i>The Guardian</i></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-30"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-30">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://worldpublicopinion.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/WPO_Torture_Jun08_packet.pdf">World Public Opinion on Torture</a> <i>WorldPublicOpinion.org</i></span> </li> </ol></div></div>    </div></div><div class="printfooter">Retrieved from "<a dir="ltr" href="https://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Torture&oldid=2670437">https://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Torture&oldid=2670437</a>"</div> <div id="catlinks" class="catlinks" data-mw="interface"><div id="mw-normal-catlinks" class="mw-normal-catlinks"><a href="/wiki/Special:Categories" 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