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class="vector-dropdown-label-text">Apariencia</span> </label> <div class="vector-dropdown-content"> <div id="vector-appearance-unpinned-container" class="vector-unpinned-container"> </div> </div> </div> </nav> <div id="p-vector-user-menu-notifications" class="vector-menu mw-portlet emptyPortlet" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="p-vector-user-menu-overflow" class="vector-menu mw-portlet" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="pt-sitesupport-2" class="user-links-collapsible-item mw-list-item user-links-collapsible-item"><a data-mw="interface" href="//donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:FundraiserRedirector?utm_source=donate&utm_medium=sidebar&utm_campaign=C13_lad.wikipedia.org&uselang=lad" class=""><span>Donos</span></a> </li> <li id="pt-createaccount-2" class="user-links-collapsible-item mw-list-item user-links-collapsible-item"><a data-mw="interface" href="/w/index.php?title=Especial:Kr%C3%AEarCuento&returnto=Diskusy%C3%B3n+de+Vikipedya%3AEmbasada" title="Te consejamos de avrir un cuento y hazer entrada allá, portanto no sos obligado" class=""><span>Criar un cuento</span></a> </li> <li id="pt-login-2" class="user-links-collapsible-item mw-list-item user-links-collapsible-item"><a data-mw="interface" href="/w/index.php?title=Especial:Entrada_del_usador&returnto=Diskusy%C3%B3n+de+Vikipedya%3AEmbasada" title="Te consejamos de entrar a tu cuento, portanto no sos obligado [o]" accesskey="o" class=""><span>Entrar</span></a> </li> </ul> </div> </div> </div> <div id="vector-user-links-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown vector-user-menu vector-button-flush-right vector-user-menu-logged-out" title="Más opciones" > <input type="checkbox" id="vector-user-links-dropdown-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-vector-user-links-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox " aria-label="Aparates personales" > <label 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desconectados <a href="/wiki/Ayudo:Introducci%C3%B3n" aria-label="Obtenga más información sobre editar"><span>más información</span></a> </div> <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="pt-anontalk" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Especial:MiDiskusy%C3%B3n" title="Discusión sobre ediciones hechas desde esta dirección IP [n]" accesskey="n"><span>Diskusyón para este adresso de IP</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> </div> </div> </nav> </div> </header> </div> <div class="mw-page-container"> <div class="mw-page-container-inner"> <div class="vector-sitenotice-container"> <div id="siteNotice"></div> </div> <div class="vector-column-start"> <div class="vector-main-menu-container"> <div id="mw-navigation"> <nav id="mw-panel" class="vector-main-menu-landmark" aria-label="Sitio"> <div id="vector-main-menu-pinned-container" class="vector-pinned-container"> </div> </nav> </div> </div> <div class="vector-sticky-pinned-container"> <nav id="mw-panel-toc" aria-label="Contenidos" data-event-name="ui.sidebar-toc" class="mw-table-of-contents-container vector-toc-landmark"> <div id="vector-toc-pinned-container" class="vector-pinned-container"> <div id="vector-toc" class="vector-toc vector-pinnable-element"> <div class="vector-pinnable-header vector-toc-pinnable-header vector-pinnable-header-pinned" data-feature-name="toc-pinned" data-pinnable-element-id="vector-toc" > <h2 class="vector-pinnable-header-label">Contenidos</h2> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-pin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-toc.pin">mover a la barra lateral</button> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-unpin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-toc.unpin">ocultar</button> </div> <ul class="vector-toc-contents" id="mw-panel-toc-list"> <li id="toc-mw-content-text" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a href="#" class="vector-toc-link"> <div class="vector-toc-text">Inicio</div> </a> </li> <li id="toc-Identify_inscription" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1 vector-toc-list-item-expanded"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Identify_inscription"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1</span> <span>Identify inscription</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">3 comentarios</span> <ul id="toc-Identify_inscription-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documents" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1 vector-toc-list-item-expanded"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documents"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">2</span> <span>Question about accessing copies of Ladino versions of Ottoman Empire law documents</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">3 comentarios</span> <ul id="toc-Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documents-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> </ul> </div> </div> </nav> </div> </div> <div class="mw-content-container"> <main id="content" class="mw-body"> <header class="mw-body-header vector-page-titlebar"> <nav aria-label="Contenidos" class="vector-toc-landmark"> <div id="vector-page-titlebar-toc" class="vector-dropdown vector-page-titlebar-toc vector-button-flush-left" > <input type="checkbox" id="vector-page-titlebar-toc-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-vector-page-titlebar-toc" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox " aria-label="Cambiar a la tabla de contenidos" > <label id="vector-page-titlebar-toc-label" for="vector-page-titlebar-toc-checkbox" class="vector-dropdown-label cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet cdx-button--icon-only " aria-hidden="true" ><span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-listBullet mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-listBullet"></span> <span class="vector-dropdown-label-text">Cambiar a la tabla de contenidos</span> </label> <div class="vector-dropdown-content"> <div id="vector-page-titlebar-toc-unpinned-container" class="vector-unpinned-container"> </div> </div> </div> </nav> <h1 id="firstHeading" class="firstHeading mw-first-heading"><span class="mw-page-title-namespace">Diskusyón de Vikipedya</span><span class="mw-page-title-separator">:</span><span class="mw-page-title-main">Embasada</span></h1> <div id="p-lang-btn" class="vector-dropdown mw-portlet mw-portlet-lang mw-portlet-lang-icon-only" > <input type="checkbox" id="p-lang-btn-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-p-lang-btn" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox mw-interlanguage-selector-empty" aria-label="Este artículo existe sólo en este idioma. 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mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Vikipedya:Embasada" title="Ver la hoja del prodjekto [c]" accesskey="c"><span>Hoja del projeto</span></a></li><li id="ca-talk" class="selected vector-tab-noicon mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Diskusy%C3%B3n_de_Vikipedya:Embasada" rel="discussion" title="Diskusyón encima del contènido desta hoja [t]" accesskey="t"><span>Diskusyón</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="vector-variants-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown emptyPortlet" > <input type="checkbox" id="vector-variants-dropdown-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-vector-variants-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox " aria-label="Cambiar variante de idioma" > <label id="vector-variants-dropdown-label" for="vector-variants-dropdown-checkbox" class="vector-dropdown-label cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet" aria-hidden="true" ><span class="vector-dropdown-label-text">Ladino</span> </label> <div 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<div class="vector-pinnable-header vector-appearance-pinnable-header vector-pinnable-header-pinned" data-feature-name="appearance-pinned" data-pinnable-element-id="vector-appearance" data-pinned-container-id="vector-appearance-pinned-container" data-unpinned-container-id="vector-appearance-unpinned-container" > <div class="vector-pinnable-header-label">Apariencia</div> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-pin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-appearance.pin">mover a la barra lateral</button> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-unpin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-appearance.unpin">ocultar</button> </div> </div> </div> </nav> </div> </div> <div id="bodyContent" class="vector-body" aria-labelledby="firstHeading" data-mw-ve-target-container> <div class="vector-body-before-content"> <div class="mw-indicators"> </div> <div id="siteSub" class="noprint">Un artíkolo de la Vikipedya, la ansiklopedya líbera</div> </div> <div id="contentSub"><div id="mw-content-subtitle"></div></div> <div id="mw-content-text" class="mw-body-content"><div class="mw-content-ltr mw-parser-output" lang="lad" dir="ltr"><div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Identify_inscription" data-mw-thread-id="h-Identify_inscription-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Identify_inscription-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z"></span>Identify inscription<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Identify_inscription-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Diskusy%C3%B3n_de_Vikipedya:Embasada&action=edit&section=1" title="Editar el código fuente de la sección: Identify inscription"><span>trocar el manadero</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Geraki-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z-Identify_inscription"></span>Hi all. Are these inscriptions in Ladino, or something else? <a href="/wiki/Dosya:Jewish_gravestone_in_Thessaloniki_01.jpg" title="Dosya:Jewish gravestone in Thessaloniki 01.jpg">File:Jewish gravestone in Thessaloniki 01.jpg</a> <a href="/wiki/Dosya:Jewish_gravestone_in_Thessaloniki_02.jpg" title="Dosya:Jewish gravestone in Thessaloniki 02.jpg">File:Jewish gravestone in Thessaloniki 02.jpg</a> (5673 is 1913 CE, right?)--<a href="/wiki/Usador:Geraki" title="Usador:Geraki">Geraki</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=Messaje_de_Usador:Geraki&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="Messaje de Usador:Geraki (la hoja no egziste)">discusión</a>) <a href="https://lad.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diskusy%C3%B3n_de_Vikipedya:Embasada#c-Geraki-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z-Identify_inscription" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:26 2 sep 2019 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Geraki-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z-Identify_inscription"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">responder</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Geraki-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z-Identify_inscription"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:05:00.000Z-Geraki-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z"></span>@<a href="/wiki/Usador:Geraki" title="Usador:Geraki">Geraki</a>:</span> 5673 is 1913 CE, that's right. (OK, to be technical: 5673 was from sunset of 11 September 1912 to sunset of 1 October 1913.) <ul><li>That picture (#2) does appear to be Ladino, and the date shown is 27 Nisan 5673, equivalent to 4 May 1913 (or the evening before).</li> <li>Picture #2 mentions "edad de 85 anyos" (85 years old).</li> <li>Picture #1 appears to be in Hebrew, not Ladino. It says "the young student, Ya'akov son of Shmuel", and the date given is (if I'm reading right) 15 Tishri 5481, 17 October 1720 (Gregorian), or the evening before, corresponding to the holiday of <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sukkot" class="extiw" title="en:Sukkot">Sukkot</a>. <a href="/wiki/Usador:StevenJ81" title="Usador:StevenJ81">StevenJ81</a> (<a href="/wiki/Messaje_de_Usador:StevenJ81" title="Messaje de Usador:StevenJ81">discusión</a>) • 13 Elul 5779 • <a href="https://lad.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diskusy%C3%B3n_de_Vikipedya:Embasada#c-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:05:00.000Z-Geraki-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:05 12 sep 2019 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:05:00.000Z-Geraki-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">responder</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:05:00.000Z-Geraki-2019-09-02T10:26:00.000Z"></span></li></ul> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:54:00.000Z-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:05:00.000Z"></span>I should add: the conversions shown here are to Gregorian. But the Ottomans weren't using the Gregorian calendar at all—even by 1913. <a href="/wiki/Usador:StevenJ81" title="Usador:StevenJ81">StevenJ81</a> (<a href="/wiki/Messaje_de_Usador:StevenJ81" title="Messaje de Usador:StevenJ81">discusión</a>) • 13 Elul 5779 • <a href="https://lad.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diskusy%C3%B3n_de_Vikipedya:Embasada#c-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:54:00.000Z-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:05:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:54 12 sep 2019 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:54:00.000Z-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:05:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">responder</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:54:00.000Z-StevenJ81-2019-09-12T19:05:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documents" data-mw-thread-id="h-Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documen-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documen-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z"></span>Question about accessing copies of Ladino versions of Ottoman Empire law documents<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documen-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Diskusy%C3%B3n_de_Vikipedya:Embasada&action=edit&section=2" title="Editar el código fuente de la sección: Question about accessing copies of Ladino versions of Ottoman Empire law documents"><span>trocar el manadero</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z-Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documen"></span>Hi! I found versions of the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dustur" class="extiw" title="en:Dustur">en:Dustur</a> and the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Constitution_of_1876" class="extiw" title="en:Ottoman Constitution of 1876">en:Ottoman Constitution of 1876</a> in various languages. I wonder if there are versions in Judaeo-Spanish/Ladino so I can ask Wikipedians to scan and upload copies. I am not sure which libraries would have them. Thanks, <a href="/wiki/Usador:WhisperToMe" title="Usador:WhisperToMe">WhisperToMe</a> (<a href="/wiki/Messaje_de_Usador:WhisperToMe" title="Messaje de Usador:WhisperToMe">discusión</a>) <a href="https://lad.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diskusy%C3%B3n_de_Vikipedya:Embasada#c-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z-Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documen" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:00 25 sep 2019 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z-Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documen"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">responder</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z-Question_about_accessing_copies_of_Ladino_versions_of_Ottoman_Empire_law_documen"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-StevenJ81-2019-09-25T17:07:00.000Z-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z"></span>I'll leave this notice here in case someone actually has something like this. I can ask around at the local Sephardic synagogue this weekend. <a href="/wiki/Usador:StevenJ81" title="Usador:StevenJ81">StevenJ81</a> (<a href="/wiki/Messaje_de_Usador:StevenJ81" title="Messaje de Usador:StevenJ81">discusión</a>) • 25 Elul 5779 • <a href="https://lad.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diskusy%C3%B3n_de_Vikipedya:Embasada#c-StevenJ81-2019-09-25T17:07:00.000Z-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:07 25 sep 2019 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-StevenJ81-2019-09-25T17:07:00.000Z-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">responder</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-StevenJ81-2019-09-25T17:07:00.000Z-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T17:00:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T23:12:00.000Z-StevenJ81-2019-09-25T17:07:00.000Z"></span>That would be great! Thanks! <ul><li>Constitution's title: <i>Konstitusyon del Imperio otomano proklamada el 7 zilhidje 1283 (7 Tevet 5637)</i>. (one printing was Constantinople: Estamparia De Castro en Galata. 1877).</li> <li>Dustur: <i>Koleksyon de las leyes, reglamentos, ordenanzas i instruksyones del Imperio Otomano</i>, published by Moïse del Médico (a.k.a. "Moiz Bey Dalmediko", 1848-1937) and David Fresco (1850-1933) in 1881</li></ul></dd> <dd>There are other documents that are in Judaeo-Spanish too: <ul><li>The Jewish millet constitution, <i>Konstitusyon para la nasyon yisraelita de la Turkia</i> - I believe it was reprinted as <i>Hakhamkhane nizamnamesi – Estatuto organiko dela komunidad israelita promulgado en data del 23 de agosto de 1287</i> (Kostantinopla, Imprimeria Izak Gabay, Galata, 1913).</li> <li><i>Kanun name de Penas</i> (Ottoman Penal Code), 1860, translated by Yehezkel Gabay (1825-1896)</li> <li>Risale-i ahlâk, by Sadık Rif’at Pasha, translated by Gabay</li></ul></dd> <dd><a href="/wiki/Usador:WhisperToMe" title="Usador:WhisperToMe">WhisperToMe</a> (<a href="/wiki/Messaje_de_Usador:WhisperToMe" title="Messaje de Usador:WhisperToMe">discusión</a>) <a href="https://lad.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diskusy%C3%B3n_de_Vikipedya:Embasada#c-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T23:12:00.000Z-StevenJ81-2019-09-25T17:07:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:12 25 sep 2019 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T23:12:00.000Z-StevenJ81-2019-09-25T17:07:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">responder</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-WhisperToMe-2019-09-25T23:12:00.000Z-StevenJ81-2019-09-25T17:07:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl>    </div><noscript><img src="https://login.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:CentralAutoLogin/start?type=1x1" alt="" width="1" height="1" style="border: none; position: absolute;"></noscript> <div class="printfooter" data-nosnippet="">Acojido del aderesso "<a dir="ltr" href="https://lad.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Diskusyón_de_Vikipedya:Embasada&oldid=206357">https://lad.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Diskusyón_de_Vikipedya:Embasada&oldid=206357</a>"</div></div> <div id="catlinks" class="catlinks catlinks-allhidden" data-mw="interface"></div> </div> </main> </div> <div class="mw-footer-container"> <footer id="footer" class="mw-footer" > <ul id="footer-info"> <li id="footer-info-lastmod"> Esta hoja la vez dalcavo se trocó enel 6 dec 2020, a las 21:52 la ora.</li> <li id="footer-info-copyright">El teksto está disponivle debaxo la <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/">Lecencia de Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike</a>; pueden aver otras kondisyones. 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