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<span class="vcard author"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/mark_darcy/">Mark D'Arcy</a></span> <span class="separator">|</span> <abbr class="published" title="2010-10-21T16:24:42+00:00">16:24 UK time, Thursday, 21 October 2010</abbr> </p> <p class="flt-r"> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/a_surreal_moment.html#comments" title="Comments made about this entry." rel="comments">Comments (0) </a> </p> <div class="cleardiv"><!-- clearing --></div> </div> <div class="post_content"> <p>Continuing my series of weird and wacky moments in Parliament...</p> <p>A surreal moment in the House of Lords this afternoon, when <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/representatives/profiles/24971.stm">Lord James of Blackheath</a> regaled peers with "an obscene account of Herman Goering having sexual congress with a lady kangaroo, which ultimately proved fatal to him because it wouldn't stop jumping..."<br/> </p> <ul class="ami_social_bookmarks"> <li class="bookmark">Bookmark with:</li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://del.icio.us/post?url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/a_surreal_moment.html&title=A surreal moment ">del.icio.us</a> | </li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/a_surreal_moment.html&title=A surreal moment ">Digg</a> | </li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.newsvine.com/_wine/save?popoff=0&u=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/a_surreal_moment.html&h=A surreal moment ">Newsvine</a> | </li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://view.nowpublic.com/?src=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/a_surreal_moment.html">NowPublic</a> | </li> <li><a 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href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/detailed_scrutiny.html#comments" title="Comments made about this entry." rel="comments">Comments (1) </a> </p> <div class="cleardiv"><!-- clearing --></div> </div> <div class="post_content"> <p>I tend to refer, rather glibly, to the "detailed scrutiny" being given to the Parliamentary Voting and Constituencies Bill by the full House of Commons. </p> <p>It turns out that it is more detailed than I imagined, probing the Latin roots of the word "alternative", the better to understand what an "alternative vote" actually is. As a public service here's a taste of the full majesty of that committee stage scrutiny:</p> <blockquote><strong>Mrs Eleanor Laing (Epping Forest) (Con):</strong> The hon. Member for Blackley and Broughton (Graham Stringer) made a good point about some people effectively having three, four or five votes. However, is it not the case that the meaning of the word "alternative" is "one of two", from its true Latin derivation, "alter"? My hon. Friend's amendment is therefore technically and linguistically absolutely correct. If the system is to be called the alternative vote system, the sense of "one of two" must come into it somewhere, not the sense of "one of four or five". <strong> <p>Mr Chope:</strong> I am grateful to my hon. Friend for that point. She and I have not colluded on this, but I took the precaution of looking up the definition of "alternative" and its usage in the "Shorter Oxford English Dictionary", which says:<br/> "Some traditionalists maintain" - I think that she and I are both in that category - "from an etymological standpoint, that you can only have a maximum of two alternatives (from the Latin alter 'other (of two)') and that uses where there are more than two alternatives are erroneous."</p> <p>However, the dictionary then says: "Such uses are, however, normal in modern standard English."</p> <p>More is the pity, but that is the factual situation as described in the dictionary. However, the sense that I have described is how those of us who are traditionalists, as well as a lot of other people, understand the word "alternative". Indeed, although I am reluctant ever to criticise a word that he says, earlier on we heard the Prime Minister use the word "less" when he meant "fewer".</p> <p><strong>Mr Angus Brendan MacNeil (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP):</strong> The hon. Gentleman is giving us a lecture on the difference between prescriptive and descriptive grammar. ...<br/> [...]</p> <p><strong>Mr Chope:</strong> I want to draw another analogy. If the alternative vote system proposed by the Government in the Bill were adopted, people would be encouraged to rank the number of candidates from one to however many, in order of preference. I think that a lot of our constituents have difficulty in being sure about the relative merits of one or two candidates, yet we would be expecting them to list perhaps nine candidates in order of preference. If we tried to rate fast-food outlets in order of preference, we would need not only to work out which one we liked the most, but to rank Starbucks, McDonald's, Subway, Caf茅 Nero, KFC, Burger King and Pret A Manger in order of preference. It is quite complicated for people to rate, say, one as their sixth preference and another as their seventh. Such a voting system would be demanding and result in people having to spend a lot more time in the polling booth poring over the information about the candidates. Indeed, they would need to get a lot more information before they could exercise an informed choice.</blockquote></p> <ul class="ami_social_bookmarks"> <li class="bookmark">Bookmark with:</li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://del.icio.us/post?url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/detailed_scrutiny.html&title=Detailed scrutiny">del.icio.us</a> | </li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/detailed_scrutiny.html&title=Detailed scrutiny">Digg</a> | </li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.newsvine.com/_wine/save?popoff=0&u=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/detailed_scrutiny.html&h=Detailed scrutiny">Newsvine</a> | </li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://view.nowpublic.com/?src=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/detailed_scrutiny.html">NowPublic</a> | </li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://reddit.com/submit?url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/detailed_scrutiny.html&title=Detailed scrutiny">Reddit</a></li> <li class="help"> - <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/podsandblogs/2007/04/social_bookmarks_explained.shtml">What's this?</a></li> </ul> </div> </div> <div class="post" id="entry-267347"> <h2><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/does_mr_afriyie_have_a_plan_to.html" rel="bookmark">Does Mr Afriyie have a plan to scupper IPSA?</a></h2> <div class="meta"> <p class="flt-l "> <span class="vcard author"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/mark_darcy/">Mark D'Arcy</a></span> <span class="separator">|</span> <abbr class="published" title="2010-10-20T13:02:41+00:00">13:02 UK time, Wednesday, 20 October 2010</abbr> </p> <p class="flt-r"> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/does_mr_afriyie_have_a_plan_to.html#comments" title="Comments made about this entry." rel="comments">Comments (2) </a> </p> <div class="cleardiv"><!-- clearing --></div> </div> <div class="post_content"> <p>Are MPs about to strike back against what they regard as the evil empire - their expenses watchdog, <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.ipsa-home.org.uk/">IPSA</a>? </p> <p>It could happen this Friday, if they're prepared to weather the inevitable media storm.</p> <p>Friday in the Commons is private members' bill day, and we can expect some quite lively debate on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/representatives/profiles/25474.stm">John McDonnell's </a>Lawful Industrial Action (Minor Errors) Bill, which seeks to prevent strike ballots being ruled illegal because of what he regards as trivial procedural errors. There are bills on sports ground safety, (from <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/representatives/profiles/83146.stm">Jonathan Lord</a>) secured lending (where a house or some other property is used as a security for borrowing - from <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/representatives/profiles/77092.stm">George Eustice</a>) and electoral law (from <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/representatives/profiles/31691.stm">Peter Bone</a>.) </p> <p>So it looks unlikely, though not impossible, that MPs will reach the fifth bill on their agenda, <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/representatives/profiles/35516.stm">Adam Afriyie's </a>Parliamentary Standards (Amendment) Bill. Mr Afriyie is offering MPs a chance to reform the great bugbear of parliamentary life - the new look expenses system overseen by the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority (IPSA). I've finally laid my hands on a copy of the bill - which seeks to replace the whole elaborate edifice constructed since the expenses scandal with a simple regional allowance system. </p> <p>The argument is that the result would be impossible to cheat, much cheaper to administer, and would save the taxpayer several million pounds - while freeing MPs from a massive and hated bureaucratic burden. </p> <p>MPs would get a single, simple allowance, depending on the region in which their seat was located. But since there would be no item-by-item accounting for how the money was spent, it would arguably be less transparent - although there could be amendments to address that point.</p> <p>Behind the scenes Mr Afriyie has lobbied just about every authority figure in the Commons and hundreds of individual MPs. So will all that effort come to nothing on Friday, if the bill is not debated? That will depend on whether someone objects to the bill going forward - if it is debated, it is unlikely there would be enough MPs present to vote it through, if someone opposed it. </p> <p>If not, at 2.30 on Friday, the clerks will read out a list of bills that which have not been discussed, and after each title is announced, a government whip normally shouts "object". This ritual pushes the bills onto a future agenda. But if no-one (and it doesn't have to be a whip) says "object", the unobjected bill is deemed to have received a second reading, and goes forward for detailed consideration in committee. It looks as if Mr Afriyie is hoping that this will happen to him. </p> <p>Even after the arrival of a new, untainted, generation of MPs, the issue of expenses remains radioactive - and it may well be that the government whips, or even some individual, decides to block the bill. Plenty of MPs hate the current system and almost no-one would die in a ditch to protect it...but many also fear the return of the dread and angst which pervaded Westminster when the scandal was at fever pitch, and a 2pm phone call from the Daily Telegraph could signal the end of a parliamentary career. But if the bill does go into committee, the system could be transformed - although the fear and loathing factor should mean that there is no return to pre-crisis troughing. </p> <p>Alternatively, Mr Afriyie could ask the Backbench Business Committee to allocate time to allow him a second reading debate. IPSA is certainly a matter of concern to all MPs - but there is some question over whether the committee has the power to put bills before the Commons. It would certainly be a precedent-setting move, but then almost every action they take is precedent-setting at the moment. </p> <p>What is obvious, looking at the bill, is that a great deal of careful work has gone into it - far more than would be necessary for a token, doomed piece of legislation. I think Mr Afriyie has a plan...<br/> </p> <ul class="ami_social_bookmarks"> <li class="bookmark">Bookmark with:</li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://del.icio.us/post?url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/does_mr_afriyie_have_a_plan_to.html&title=Does Mr Afriyie have a plan to scupper IPSA?">del.icio.us</a> | </li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/does_mr_afriyie_have_a_plan_to.html&title=Does Mr Afriyie have a plan to scupper IPSA?">Digg</a> | </li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.newsvine.com/_wine/save?popoff=0&u=http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/does_mr_afriyie_have_a_plan_to.html&h=Does Mr Afriyie have a plan to scupper IPSA?">Newsvine</a> | </li> <li><a 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class="cleardiv"><!--clearing div--></div> <!--more--> <div class="related content"> <h2>Other posts from this blog</h2> <div class="grids"> <div class="first unit"> <h3><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/a_nasty_mess_of_porridge.html" rel="bookmark">A nasty mess of porridge</a></h3> <div class="meta"> by <span class="vcard author"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/mark_darcy/">Mark D'Arcy</a></span> on <abbr class="published" title="2010-10-19T15:00:35+00:00">15:00 UK time, Tuesday, 19 October 2010</abbr> <span class="separator">|</span> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/a_nasty_mess_of_porridge.html#comments" title="Comments made about this entry." rel="comments">Comments (6) </a> </div> <p>In the not-too-distant future some unfortunate minister is going to have to lay before the Commons a bill that none of the parties wants anything to do with. It will be a bill to give at least some of the...</p> <p><strong><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/a_nasty_mess_of_porridge.html#more" rel="bookmark">Read more...</a></strong></p> </div> <div class=" unit"> <h3><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/revenge_may_be_sweet.html" rel="bookmark">Revenge may be sweet...</a></h3> <div class="meta"> by <span class="vcard author"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/mark_darcy/">Mark D'Arcy</a></span> on <abbr class="published" title="2010-10-15T17:05:56+00:00">17:05 UK time, Friday, 15 October 2010</abbr> <span class="separator">|</span> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/revenge_may_be_sweet.html#comments" title="Comments made about this entry." rel="comments">Comments (3) </a> </div> <p>If we're going to cut the number of MPs, shouldn't we also cut the number of ministers? That's the question which will be posed next week by Tory backbencher Charles Walker. The Parliamentary Voting and Constituencies Bill includes plans to...</p> <p><strong><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/revenge_may_be_sweet.html#more" rel="bookmark">Read more...</a></strong></p> </div> <div class=" unit"> <h3><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/next_weeks_business_1.html" rel="bookmark">Next week's business</a></h3> <div class="meta"> by <span class="vcard author"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/mark_darcy/">Mark D'Arcy</a></span> on <abbr class="published" title="2010-10-15T16:28:48+00:00">16:28 UK time, Friday, 15 October 2010</abbr> <span class="separator">|</span> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/next_weeks_business_1.html#comments" title="Comments made about this entry." rel="comments">Comments (2) </a> </div> <p>Thanks to those who took a moment to comment on what I should put in my weekly parliamentary preview. I can try to give some advance warning of forthcoming select committee reports - but it may be a while before...</p> <p><strong><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/next_weeks_business_1.html#more" rel="bookmark">Read more...</a></strong></p> </div> <div class=" unit"> <h3><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/new_generation_new_rebellion.html" rel="bookmark">New generation, new rebellion</a></h3> <div class="meta"> by <span class="vcard author"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/mark_darcy/">Mark D'Arcy</a></span> on <abbr class="published" title="2010-10-15T12:08:16+00:00">12:08 UK time, Friday, 15 October 2010</abbr> <span class="separator">|</span> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/new_generation_new_rebellion.html#comments" title="Comments made about this entry." rel="comments">Comments (1) </a> </div> <p>New generations are very much in vogue in Westminster - but one of the most significant emerged on Wednesday night - when a new generation of eurosceptics backed an amendment from the Conservative radical Douglas Carswell, calling on the government...</p> <p><strong><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/new_generation_new_rebellion.html#more" rel="bookmark">Read more...</a></strong></p> </div> </div> </div> <!--end more--> </div> <!--main content ends here--> <div class="cleardiv"><!--clearing div--></div> <div id="explore"> <div class="more content"> <h2><a name="jump_more"></a>More from this blog...</h2> <!--grids--> <div class="grids"> <div class="unit topical"> <div class="title"><h3>Topical posts on this blog</h3></div> <div class="inner"> <div id="beingdiscussedNow"> <h2>Being Discussed Now</h2> <ul class="dna-list"> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/detailed_scrutiny.html">Detailed scrutiny</a><span>(1)</span></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/a_nasty_mess_of_porridge.html">A nasty mess of porridge</a><span>(6)</span></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/does_mr_afriyie_have_a_plan_to.html">Does Mr Afriyie have a plan to scupper IPSA?</a><span>(2)</span></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/revenge_may_be_sweet.html">Revenge may be sweet...</a><span>(3)</span></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/next_weeks_business_1.html">Next week's business</a><span>(2)</span></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/new_generation_new_rebellion.html">New generation, new rebellion</a><span>(1)</span></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/more_changes_on_committee_corr.html">More changes on committee corridor?</a><span>(2)</span></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/slow_-_but_successful_-_progre.html">Slow - but successful - progress</a><span>(1)</span></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/strains_of_office.html">Strains of office</a><span>(1)</span></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/next_weeks_business.html">Next week's business</a><span>(4)</span></li> </ul> </div> </div> </div> <div class="unit archives"> <!--block item - dark green top box--> <div class="title"><h3>Archives</h3></div> <div class="inner"> <p><strong>Past twelve months</strong></p> <ul> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/10/">October 2010 (17)</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/09/">September 2010 (12)</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/07/">July 2010 (21)</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/06/">June 2010 (22)</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/05/">May 2010 (18)</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20101021164033/http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/markdarcy/2010/04/">April 2010 (5)</a></li> <li><a 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