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margin: 0 0 0.5em 0.5em; text-align:left; border: 1px solid #505050; width:175px;"> <tbody><tr> <td style="font-size: 95%; text-align:center; color:White; background-color:#505050"><b>The fault in our stars</b><br /><a href="/wiki/Pseudoastronomy" title="Pseudoastronomy"><font size="3" color="White"><b>Pseudoastronomy</b></font></a> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="background-color:#FFFFFF;" align="center"><a href="/wiki/Category:Pseudoastronomy" title="Category:Pseudoastronomy"><img alt="Icon pseudoastronomy.svg" src="/w/images/thumb/7/78/Icon_pseudoastronomy.svg/100px-Icon_pseudoastronomy.svg.png" decoding="async" width="100" height="100" srcset="/w/images/thumb/7/78/Icon_pseudoastronomy.svg/150px-Icon_pseudoastronomy.svg.png 1.5x, /w/images/thumb/7/78/Icon_pseudoastronomy.svg/200px-Icon_pseudoastronomy.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="200" data-file-height="200" /></a> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="font-size: 95%; color:White; background-color:#505050; text-align:center;"><b><a href="/wiki/Adding_epicycles" title="Adding epicycles"><font color="white">Adding epicycles</font></a></b> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="font-size: 95%; background-color:#FFFFFF;"> <ul><li><a href="/wiki/Herc%C3%B3lubus" title="Hercólubus">Hercólubus</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Earth_changes" title="Earth changes">Earth changes</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Hollow_Moon" title="Hollow Moon">Hollow Moon</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Ra_Material" title="Ra Material">Ra Material</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Astrology" title="Astrology">Astrology</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_Celestial_Mechanics" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - Celestial Mechanics">Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - Celestial Mechanics</a></li></ul> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="font-size: 95%; color:White; background-color:#505050; text-align:center;"><b>Epicyclists</b> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="font-size: 95%; background-color:#FFFFFF;"> <ul><li><a href="/wiki/Richard_Hoagland" title="Richard Hoagland">Richard Hoagland</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/David_Talbott" title="David Talbott">David Talbott</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Suspicious0bservers" title="Suspicious0bservers">Suspicious0bservers</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Fixedearth.com" title="Fixedearth.com">Fixedearth.com</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Robert_W._Felix" title="Robert W. Felix">Robert W. Felix</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Stephen_J._Crothers" title="Stephen J. Crothers">Stephen J. Crothers</a></li></ul> <div class="vte plainlinks" style="font-size:smaller; text-align:center;"><a href="/wiki/Template:Pseudoastronomy" title="Template:Pseudoastronomy">v</a> - <a href="/wiki/Template_talk:Pseudoastronomy" title="Template talk:Pseudoastronomy">t</a> - <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Pseudoastronomy&action=edit">e</a></div> </td></tr></tbody></table> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tila_Tequila" class="extiw" title="wp:Tila Tequila" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Tila Tequila">Tila Tequila</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> also believes that the planet is flat and one rule of life is to believe the exact opposite of what Tila Tequila believes...I know that <a href="/wiki/Neil_deGrasse_Tyson" title="Neil deGrasse Tyson">Neil deGrasse Tyson</a> tweeted a lot of fancy science shit, but it's the <i><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/691655467978919936">"Duude"</a></i> that got me. That's straight guy talk for <i>"Bitch, I can't!"</i></div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—Michael K.<sup id="cite_ref-1" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-1">[1]</a></sup></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><b>Flat Earth</b> (also known as the <b>Flat Earth myth</b>, the <b>Flat Earth theory</b>, <b><a href="/wiki/Pseudoskepticism" title="Pseudoskepticism">Globe Skepticism</a></b>, <b>Globe Denial</b>, <b>flat-Earthism</b>, <b>Earth shape theory</b>, less commonly <b>platygeism</b>, and <b>intelligent geography</b> for parodists of <a href="/wiki/Intelligent_design" title="Intelligent design">intelligent design</a>) refers to the <a href="/wiki/Pseudoscientific" class="mw-redirect" title="Pseudoscientific">pseudoscientific</a> belief that the <a href="/wiki/Earth" title="Earth">Earth</a> — which the vast, vast majority of the population imagine in their heads as this big <i>spherical</i> thing (<a href="#Relativity_of_wrong">or <i>oblate spheroidal</i> thing, pedants</a>) — is actually a <a href="/wiki/Geocentric" class="mw-redirect" title="Geocentric">geocentric</a> flat disk. <a href="/wiki/Poe%27s_Law" title="Poe's Law">Yes, people actually <i>do</i> believe this</a>, although this belief usually involves some form of religious <a href="/wiki/Fundamentalism" title="Fundamentalism">fundamentalism</a>. Modern flat earthism revolves around a quasi-religious, cult-like system of <a href="/wiki/Personality_cult" title="Personality cult">gurus</a> collaboratively grifting their marks.<sup id="cite_ref-2" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-2">[2]</a></sup> </p> <div id="toc" class="toc" role="navigation" aria-labelledby="mw-toc-heading"><input type="checkbox" role="button" id="toctogglecheckbox" class="toctogglecheckbox" style="display:none" /><div class="toctitle" lang="en" dir="ltr"><h2 id="mw-toc-heading">Contents</h2><span class="toctogglespan"><label class="toctogglelabel" for="toctogglecheckbox"></label></span></div> <ul> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-1"><a href="#Flatlining_brain_activity"><span class="tocnumber">1</span> <span class="toctext">Flatlining brain activity</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-2"><a href="#The_characteristics_of_flat-earthism"><span class="tocnumber">1.1</span> <span class="toctext">The characteristics of flat-earthism</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-3"><a href="#Fractal_wrongness"><span class="tocnumber">1.1.1</span> <span class="toctext">Fractal wrongness</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-4"><a href="#Ad_hoc_reasoning"><span class="tocnumber">1.1.2</span> <span class="toctext">Ad hoc reasoning</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-5"><a href="#Thought-terminating_clich.C3.A9s"><span class="tocnumber">1.1.3</span> <span class="toctext">Thought-terminating clichés</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-6"><a href="#Gish_gallop"><span class="tocnumber">1.1.4</span> <span class="toctext">Gish gallop</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-7"><a href="#Unified_conspiracy_theory"><span class="tocnumber">1.1.5</span> <span class="toctext">Unified conspiracy theory</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-8"><a href="#Projection"><span class="tocnumber">1.1.6</span> <span class="toctext">Projection</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-9"><a href="#What_the_Flat_Earth_movement_is_really_about"><span class="tocnumber">1.2</span> <span class="toctext">What the Flat Earth movement is really about</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-10"><a href="#Relativity_of_wrong"><span class="tocnumber">1.3</span> <span class="toctext">Relativity of wrong</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-11"><a href="#Preface_to_debunking"><span class="tocnumber">2</span> <span class="toctext">Preface to debunking</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-12"><a href="#Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth"><span class="tocnumber">3</span> <span class="toctext">Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-13"><a href="#The_Earth"><span class="tocnumber">3.1</span> <span class="toctext">The Earth</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-14"><a href="#The_Moon"><span class="tocnumber">3.2</span> <span class="toctext">The Moon</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-15"><a href="#The_Sun"><span class="tocnumber">3.3</span> <span class="toctext">The Sun</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-16"><a href="#The_Stars"><span class="tocnumber">3.4</span> <span class="toctext">The Stars</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-17"><a href="#Celestial_Mechanics"><span class="tocnumber">3.5</span> <span class="toctext">Celestial Mechanics</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-18"><a href="#Celestial_Objects"><span class="tocnumber">3.6</span> <span class="toctext">Celestial Objects</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-19"><a href="#Astronautics"><span class="tocnumber">3.7</span> <span class="toctext">Astronautics</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-20"><a href="#Astrophotography"><span class="tocnumber">3.8</span> <span class="toctext">Astrophotography</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-21"><a href="#The_Conspiracy"><span class="tocnumber">3.9</span> <span class="toctext">The Conspiracy</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-22"><a href="#Experiments"><span class="tocnumber">4</span> <span class="toctext">Experiments</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-23"><a href="#Joint_Experiments"><span class="tocnumber">4.1</span> <span class="toctext">Joint Experiments</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-24"><a href="#The_Final_Experiment_.282024.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.1.1</span> <span class="toctext">The Final Experiment (2024)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-25"><a href="#David_Weiss.27_peer-reviewed_experiment_.28TBD.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.1.2</span> <span class="toctext">David Weiss' peer-reviewed experiment (TBD)</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-26"><a href="#The_Glober_Experiments"><span class="tocnumber">4.2</span> <span class="toctext">The Glober Experiments</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-27"><a href="#The_Cavendish_Experiment_.281797.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.2.1</span> <span class="toctext">The Cavendish Experiment (1797)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-28"><a href="#Foucault.27s_Pendulum_.281851.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.2.2</span> <span class="toctext">Foucault's Pendulum (1851)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-29"><a href="#Alfred_Russel_Wallace.27s_Reproduction_of_the_Bedford_Level_Experiment_.281870.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.2.3</span> <span class="toctext">Alfred Russel Wallace's Reproduction of the Bedford Level Experiment (1870)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-30"><a href="#Aether_drift_experiments"><span class="tocnumber">4.2.4</span> <span class="toctext">Aether drift experiments</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-4 tocsection-31"><a href="#Airy.27s_Ether_drag_test_.28AKA_Airy.27s_Failure.29_.281871.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.2.4.1</span> <span class="toctext">Airy's Ether drag test (AKA Airy's Failure) (1871)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-4 tocsection-32"><a href="#Michelson-Morley_experiment_.281887.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.2.4.2</span> <span class="toctext">Michelson-Morley experiment (1887)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-4 tocsection-33"><a href="#Michelson-Gale-Pearson_experiment_.281925.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.2.4.3</span> <span class="toctext">Michelson-Gale-Pearson experiment (1925)</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-34"><a href="#Jesse_Kozlowski.27s_Cooper_River_Lake_Curve_Experiment_.282016.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.2.5</span> <span class="toctext">Jesse Kozlowski's Cooper River Lake Curve Experiment (2016)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-35"><a href="#Dan_Olson.27s_Lake_Minnewanka_Curve_Experiment_.282020.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.2.6</span> <span class="toctext">Dan Olson's Lake Minnewanka Curve Experiment (2020)</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-36"><a href="#The_Flerf_Experiments"><span class="tocnumber">4.3</span> <span class="toctext">The Flerf Experiments</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-37"><a href="#Samuel_Rowbotham.27s_Bedford_Level_Experiment_.281838.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.3.1</span> <span class="toctext">Samuel Rowbotham's Bedford Level Experiment (1838)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-38"><a href="#Darryle_Marble.27s_spirit_level_experiment_.282017.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.3.2</span> <span class="toctext">Darryle Marble's spirit level experiment (2017)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-39"><a href="#Jeran_Campanella.27s_flashlight_experiment_.282018.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.3.3</span> <span class="toctext">Jeran Campanella's flashlight experiment (2018)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-40"><a href="#Bob_Knodel.27s_RLG_experiment_.282018.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.3.4</span> <span class="toctext">Bob Knodel's RLG experiment (2018)</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-41"><a href="#Mike_Hughes.27_rocket_experiment_.282018.29"><span class="tocnumber">4.3.5</span> <span class="toctext">Mike Hughes' rocket experiment (2018)</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-42"><a href="#The_scoreboard"><span class="tocnumber">4.4</span> <span class="toctext">The scoreboard</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-43"><a href="#Firmament_fleers"><span class="tocnumber">5</span> <span class="toctext">Firmament fleers</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-44"><a href="#History"><span class="tocnumber">6</span> <span class="toctext">History</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-45"><a href="#Online_resurgence"><span class="tocnumber">7</span> <span class="toctext">Online resurgence</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-46"><a href="#Fundamentalist_endorsements"><span class="tocnumber">7.1</span> <span class="toctext">Fundamentalist endorsements</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-47"><a href="#Celebrity_endorsements"><span class="tocnumber">7.2</span> <span class="toctext">Celebrity endorsements</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-48"><a href="#Christian_flat_Earth_apologetics"><span class="tocnumber">8</span> <span class="toctext">Christian flat Earth apologetics</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-49"><a href="#Appeals_to_the_Bible"><span class="tocnumber">8.1</span> <span class="toctext">Appeals to the Bible</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-50"><a href="#The_king_seeing_all_the_earth"><span class="tocnumber">8.1.1</span> <span class="toctext">The king seeing all the earth</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-51"><a href="#Jesus_seeing_all_the_kingdoms"><span class="tocnumber">8.1.2</span> <span class="toctext">Jesus seeing all the kingdoms</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-52"><a href="#The_Earth_is_a_circle"><span class="tocnumber">8.1.3</span> <span class="toctext">The Earth is a circle</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-3 tocsection-53"><a href="#.22Four_Corners.22"><span class="tocnumber">8.1.4</span> <span class="toctext">"Four Corners"</span></a></li> </ul> </li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-54"><a href="#Islamic_flat_Earth_apologetics"><span class="tocnumber">9</span> <span class="toctext">Islamic flat Earth apologetics</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-55"><a href="#Appeals_to_the_Qur.27an"><span class="tocnumber">9.1</span> <span class="toctext">Appeals to the Qur'an</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-56"><a href="#The_irony_strikes_back"><span class="tocnumber">10</span> <span class="toctext">The irony strikes back</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-57"><a href="#Faking_photos"><span class="tocnumber">10.1</span> <span class="toctext">Faking photos</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-58"><a href="#Faking_quotes"><span class="tocnumber">10.2</span> <span class="toctext">Faking quotes</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-59"><a href="#Using_spherical_Earth_mathematics"><span class="tocnumber">10.3</span> <span class="toctext">Using spherical Earth mathematics</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-60"><a href="#Insecurity_for_you.2C_insecurity_for_me"><span class="tocnumber">10.4</span> <span class="toctext">Insecurity for you, insecurity for me</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-61"><a href="#Antisemitism"><span class="tocnumber">10.5</span> <span class="toctext">Antisemitism</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-62"><a href="#Common_counterarguments_that_do_not_refute_flat-earther_claims"><span class="tocnumber">11</span> <span class="toctext">Common counterarguments that do <i>not</i> refute flat-earther claims</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-63"><a href="#The_shadow_the_Earth_casts_on_the_Moon_is_round.21"><span class="tocnumber">11.1</span> <span class="toctext">The shadow the Earth casts on the Moon is round!</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-64"><a href="#Eratosthenes.27s_shadows_proved_a_round_Earth.21"><span class="tocnumber">11.2</span> <span class="toctext">Eratosthenes's shadows proved a round Earth!</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-65"><a href="#But_the_moon_landing.21"><span class="tocnumber">11.3</span> <span class="toctext">But the moon landing!</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-66"><a href="#Gravity_would_pull_a_disk_that_big_into_a_spherical_shape.21"><span class="tocnumber">11.4</span> <span class="toctext">Gravity would pull a disk that big into a spherical shape!</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-67"><a href="#Proof_by_humor"><span class="tocnumber">11.5</span> <span class="toctext">Proof by humor</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-68"><a href="#Reverse_Flat_Earth_conspiracy_theory"><span class="tocnumber">12</span> <span class="toctext">Reverse Flat Earth conspiracy theory</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-69"><a href="#Helping_Flerfs"><span class="tocnumber">13</span> <span class="toctext">Helping Flerfs</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-70"><a href="#See_also"><span class="tocnumber">14</span> <span class="toctext">See also</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-71"><a href="#Further_reading"><span class="tocnumber">15</span> <span class="toctext">Further reading</span></a> <ul> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-72"><a href="#Rebuttals_of_flat_Earth_conspiracies"><span class="tocnumber">15.1</span> <span class="toctext">Rebuttals of flat Earth conspiracies</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-2 tocsection-73"><a href="#Scientific_papers_against_a_flat_Earth"><span class="tocnumber">15.2</span> <span class="toctext">Scientific papers against a flat Earth</span></a></li> </ul> </li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-74"><a href="#External_links"><span class="tocnumber">16</span> <span class="toctext">External links</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-75"><a href="#Notes"><span class="tocnumber">17</span> <span class="toctext">Notes</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-76"><a href="#References"><span class="tocnumber">18</span> <span class="toctext">References</span></a></li> </ul> </div> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Flatlining_brain_activity">Flatlining brain activity</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=1" title="Edit section: Flatlining brain activity">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="The_characteristics_of_flat-earthism">The characteristics of flat-earthism</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=2" title="Edit section: The characteristics of flat-earthism">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>The flat Earth <a href="/wiki/Conspiracy" class="mw-redirect" title="Conspiracy">conspiracy</a> cult/grift, and interaction with its proponents can be described with following concepts: </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Fractal_wrongness"><a href="/wiki/Fractal_wrongness" title="Fractal wrongness">Fractal wrongness</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=3" title="Edit section: Fractal wrongness">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>If the flat-Earth model were correct, we would need to throw the majority, if not all, of our current knowledge of <a href="/wiki/Science" title="Science">science</a> clean out the window, especially <a href="/wiki/Physics" title="Physics">physics</a>, <a href="/wiki/Geology" title="Geology">geology</a>, and all of <a href="/wiki/Astronomy" title="Astronomy">astronomy</a>. While some fields such as <a href="/wiki/Medicine" title="Medicine">medicine</a> might not be inherently incompatible with the shape of Earth, fractally wrong flerfs<sup id="cite_ref-3" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-3">[note 1]</a></sup> also tend to oppose things like <a href="/wiki/Vaccines" class="mw-redirect" title="Vaccines">vaccines</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/JTfhYyTuT44?feature=shared&t=1862">COVID masks</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/lD-uBaoiNE8?feature=shared&t=148">gender studies</a>, etc. </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Ad_hoc_reasoning"><a href="/wiki/Ad_hoc" title="Ad hoc">Ad hoc</a> reasoning</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=4" title="Edit section: Ad hoc reasoning">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>When confronted, they typically have their own <a href="/wiki/Pseudoscience" title="Pseudoscience"> explanations</a> for their views. The "evidence" they provide is ad hoc and generally <a href="/wiki/PIDOOMA" title="PIDOOMA">pulled out of their asses</a>. The <a href="/wiki/Ad_hoc#Piecemeal_rebuttal" title="Ad hoc">piecemeal rebuttals</a> do not actually work together to form any model, and they <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLHTe_ORjLc&t=2786"><b>admit it</b></a>. </p><p>The only aim of the rebuttals is to shift the <a href="/wiki/Burden_of_proof" title="Burden of proof">burden of proof</a>. The lack of model that explains the phenomena of the physical world (celestial objects, seasons, day/night cycle etc), forces everyone in the cult to memorize statements and to fake understanding. This explains why most flat-earthers have a tendency to talk very similarly to each other, and often cite the same sources and arguments and repeat the same— </p> <h4><span id="Thought-terminating_clichés"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Thought-terminating_clich.C3.A9s"><a href="/wiki/Thought-terminating_clich%C3%A9" title="Thought-terminating cliché">Thought-terminating clichés</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=5" title="Edit section: Thought-terminating clichés">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>Endlessly repeated statements and tautologies like "<i>Water can't stick to a ball</i>", "<i>Gravity is just a theory</i>", or "<i>Pressurized gas needs a container</i>" serve two meanings: The cult leaders use these as recruitment propaganda, and cult members usually scream them as a response to the cognitive dissonance they feel when challenged. </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Gish_gallop"><a href="/wiki/Gish_gallop" class="mw-redirect" title="Gish gallop">Gish gallop</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=6" title="Edit section: Gish gallop">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>Those the cult looks up to (the gurus running the grift) are in charge of defending the community. These gurus are faced with the impossible challenge of beating reality, and its nasty bias that favors logic, college-level math, and peer-reviewed, sound science, so the gurus resort in rhetorical tactics, especially Gish gallop. For an example see <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/he-7vs0BkLE?si=IhOI4w6LTu-RzoTN&t=1100">this</a> debate between Dave Farina and Flat Earth Dave. The tactic is also imitated by the cult members fighting off their <a href="/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance" title="Cognitive dissonance">cognitive dissonance</a>. </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Unified_conspiracy_theory"><a href="/wiki/Unified_conspiracy_theory" class="mw-redirect" title="Unified conspiracy theory">Unified conspiracy theory</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=7" title="Edit section: Unified conspiracy theory">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>If the flat Earth was true, hiding it would require the most elaborate conspiracy in the entire world. </p><p>The conspiracy would employ tens of millions of people. It's obvious that we would need the involvement of every major government entity - especially (though by no means limited to) their militaries and almost 200<sup id="cite_ref-4" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-4">[3]</a></sup> space agencies. Essentially, every professional and amateur astronomer, physicist, geologist, meteorologist, rocket scientist and engineer, architect, pilot and politician in the past <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/J7RwAcL4Iq0?si=f08tnsU-N3NzrSFU&t=15884"><b>five hundred</b></a> years would have to be in on it. All work they put out, every course, lecture, seminar, and talk, every paper and book, every project, every video, would be built on a lie. It would also mean the <a href="/wiki/Moon_landing_hoax" title="Moon landing hoax">Moon landings never happened</a>. Who else would have to be involved? All shipping companies, all airline companies, any transnational company that moves their goods around the world, odometer manufacturers (who would be <i><b>VERY DEEPLY</b></i> involved), satellite TV providers. Oh, and let's not forget about cartographers. Furthermore, all of these people need staff, tools, facilities, entire supply chain systems, and they'd be producing meaningless junk, decade after decade. </p><p>This conspiracy would also be completely pointless. Life for the vast majority of the human population would not be changed in any way if the Earth were revealed tomorrow to be a giant hockey puck instead of <s>a sphere</s> an oblate spheroid. What would be the point of spending all of this time, effort and money into making people think that the shape of the Earth is different? If you ask a flat-earther about this you won't get much of a response. Some might claim that it is "<i>to hide God</i>", which is stupid: there are much simpler ways of accomplishing that, like simply suppressing religion. </p><p>Revealed flat Earth would not change the local politics, at all. We have unused resources sitting around us, right now, in much less adversarial conditions than the supposed Ice Wall (Antarctica on flerf model). On the other hand, would the the Ice Wall hide behind itself a fully automated luxury communism, there would be no need to oppress this world. If the resources were truly limitless, why not bring everyone there? If on the other hand the point is to maximize global wealth disparity, why aren't people being shipped from the Ice Wall paradise to our world? In either case, millions of people would uphold this conspiracy without reaping any of its benefits, and not one of them is complaining about it. There are <a href="/wiki/Flat_Earth#.22But_there_are_whistleblowers.21.22" title="Flat Earth">no flat Earth whistleblowers</a>. No one concerned with the well-being of 3.5 billion poor people missing out on the resources. Not a single student is puzzled by and calling out the supposed indoctrination, or making noise when <i>they</i> finally drop the bomb: "We've been lying to you about <b>everything</b> your whole life." Nobody has fought the power. That is, until now. </p><p>The supposed, hundreds of years old, perfect plot, is now being exposed by a few high-school drop-outs making YouTube content. And for some reason, the co-conspiring governments don't want to deploy their literal assassination squads, like the ones in Russian <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha_Group" class="extiw" title="wp:Alpha Group" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Alpha_Group">Alpha group</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GRU_Unit_29155" class="extiw" title="wp:GRU Unit 29155" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: GRU_Unit_29155">GRU Unit 29155</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> Mossad's <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mossad" class="extiw" title="wp:Mossad" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Mossad">Kidon</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> CIA's <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Activities_Center" class="extiw" title="wp:Special Activities Center" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Special_Activities_Center">SAC</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> or North Korea's <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconnaissance_General_Bureau" class="extiw" title="wp:Reconnaissance General Bureau" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Reconnaissance_General_Bureau">Reconnaissance General Bureau</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>. Russia has murdered hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians in a pointless war over resources, but disappearing the tally count of about 200,000 flerfs (or just their cult leaders) is too big of a hassle. Finding all targets at the same time wouldn't even be too hard, given that Flat Earth Dave's app <a href="/wiki/Flat_Earth#Insecurity_for_you.2C_insecurity_for_me" title="Flat Earth">tracks and leaks the precise geolocation of <b>every</b> flat-earther using the app, whether they've opted in to its friend-finder feature or not</a>. </p><p>Considering all this, it really goes to show how big of a <a href="/wiki/Tinfoil_hat" title="Tinfoil hat">tinfoil hat</a> you'd have to be wearing in order to block out <i>that</i> much of reality.<sup id="cite_ref-5" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-5">[4]</a></sup> Even fucking <a href="/wiki/Alex_Jones" title="Alex Jones">Alex Jones</a> <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/J7RwAcL4Iq0?si=Sb5RwyI4YBDoGi--&t=15218">thinks flat-earthers are ridiculous</a>. </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Projection"><a href="/wiki/Psychological_projection" title="Psychological projection">Projection</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=8" title="Edit section: Projection">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>Last but not least, flat-earthers have an extreme tendency to hypocritically project everything wrong with their cult, and life, to their surroundings: </p> <ul><li><b>Religion:</b> They are not the ones relying on blind faith, it's the science that's a religion, and that's trying to hide… …God.</li></ul> <ul><li><b>Oppression:</b> They are not the sheep being exploited by their cult leaders, we are.</li></ul> <ul><li><b>Individuality:</b> They claim fierce independence, yet they parrot their leaders' thought terminating clichés.</li></ul> <ul><li><b>Orthodoxy:</b> They're not pushing an agenda, they're just asking hard questions. Also, anyone questioning their world-view, (even gurus capable of integrity and introspection like Jeranism), is immediately <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaQnmWf1j4E">branded a government shill</a>.</li></ul> <ul><li><b>Source criticism:</b> They're not the ones taking anything at face value, but TruthSeeker42069 knows what's up.</li></ul> <ul><li><b>Knowledge:</b> In fact, all of science is wrong — except the part they managed to gain an intuitive grasp over during primary school. They're not too dumb to get the rest of it, "it's just where the lies begin".</li></ul> <ul><li><b>Reasoning:</b> They don’t need to be told what’s true, they’ve got ‘common sense’, which is absolutely different from when the scientific community uses their head when building the body of knowledge.</li></ul> <ul><li><b>Testimony:</b> They claim science is all about blindly trusting what others have written about, but the 1600 year old Bible and the cult's own lore from the 19th century are 100% reliable sources.</li></ul> <ul><li><b>Progress:</b> Mainstream physics is a hoax — except when it's busy <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sputtering" class="extiw" title="wp:Sputtering" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Sputtering">sputtering</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> atoms onto <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wafer_(electronics)" class="extiw" title="wp:Wafer (electronics)" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Wafer_(electronics)">silicon wafers</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> to build processors that render the very videos questioning its validity.</li></ul> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="What_the_Flat_Earth_movement_is_really_about">What the Flat Earth movement is really about</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=9" title="Edit section: What the Flat Earth movement is really about">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>The shape of the Earth might actually be the least important belief of Flat Earth.</div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—Dan Olson<sup id="cite_ref-Olson_6-0" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-Olson-6">[5]</a></sup></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p>While debunking flerfs' lies hits all the right spots of fun and not too easy, all of it fails to address the nature of the Flat Earth movement. Dan Olson's video essay <i>In Search of a Flat Earth</i> discusses among other things the nature of Flat Earth, and it may very well be the greatest analysis of the cult out there. You should watch it at least until Part 2.<sup id="cite_ref-7" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-7">[note 2]</a></sup> </p> <table class="navbox collapsible collapsed" style="text-align: left; border: 0px; margin-top: 0.2em;width:100%; max-width: 100%; border: solid 1px silver;"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background-color: #f2dfce; text-align:center;">In Search of a Flat Earth </th></tr> <tr> <td style="padding: 8px; background-color: white;"> <center><div class="thumb embedvideo autoResize" style="width: 648px;"><div class="embedvideo autoResize" style=""><div class="embedvideowrap" style="width: 640px;"><iframe title="Play video" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/JTfhYyTuT44?start=1144" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true"></iframe></div></div></div></center> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br /> </p><p><b>Further analysis</b> </p><p>Like Olson points out, flat-earthers' aim is to simplify the world, the complexity of which has exploded. This is reflected in what Thomas Winship, who wrote Zetetic Cosmogony (a corner-stone of flerf crankery), said: "<i>Modern astronomical teachings affirms [—] that the stars and are worlds and suns, some of them equal in importance to our own Sun himself, and others vastly his superior; that these worlds, inhabited by sentient beings, are without number and occupy space boundless in extent and illimitable in duration</i>" </p><p>In other words, science threatens flerfs' narcissistic worldview of being the God's chosen being, and thus, the center of the world. Their concern is, that if the world is bigger than mankind can ever explore, then we are not the point. Ergo, the Bible is not true, and there is no God, which in turn means death will be the permanent end of the individual's experience, and that thought is <b>scary</b>.<sup id="cite_ref-8" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-8">[note 3]</a></sup> </p><p>Flat Earth is a cult, and with that comes cults' power dynamics. The cult provides a simple system, where the truth is what the flat-earthers make it out to be. The cult leaders <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/SILDuC9hQkQ?si=Mma-vooUAFscXwlw&t=349">state</a> one must "<i>empty their cup to be able to refill it</i>", which signifies how fundamentally incompatible the belief system is, and how the cult expects complete rewriting of the individual's worldview. In the cult environment, the societal chaos is replaced by orthodoxy towards the central doctrine. As long as the doctrine is not challenged, it allows very lively discussion and brain-storming to fill the gaps, to explain why the cult's central thesis is true: simple "proofs" of why the Earth is flat, who are "they", and how and why are "they" hiding the true shape of our world.<sup id="cite_ref-9" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-9">[note 4]</a></sup> </p><p>Thus, flat Earth provides a liberation from the school-years era of "oppression", where wrong (or just dumb) ideas, or wrong connections between ideas, were called out. This creates a breeding-ground for crankery, and repels any, and all logical people. The echo chamber that forms, functions as a walled garden for narcissistic grifters, who are naturally gravitating towards the group to leech off money and admiration from uneducated, gullible, and often desperate people. The cult's ultimate currency is not progress from logical inference, but loyalty, and in exchange for that, the marks (slang term for suckers) get to experience belonging, community, meaning, and (at long last,) a sense of superiority. The extreme anti-establishment nature of the cult rejects contradictory evidence and those stating it, which shields the central narrative. As Olson said, fact checking serves as a filter to keep counteracting forces out. This gives the grifters a carte blanche, and removes ridicule the marks' quixotic struggle would face. </p><p>The inconsistent and contradictory ideas do not matter to flerfs. The goal is not to establish the objective truth. Like QAnon, flat Earth treats facts (and lies) as game pieces to attain the real goal. As Olson points out, "<i>flat-earthers' goal is to un-explain the world, as real explanations impede with their politics</i>". As Olson said about QAnon, "<i>the goal is to find filler to justify support for authoritarian policies directed at people they already don't like</i>", with the aim of making systemic issues go away by silencing those pointing them out. </p><p>As the true believer flerfs' goal is to "red pill everyone" to give them "<a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SauZfMS-lZo&t=29383s">personal sovereignty and newfound belief in God</a>", recruitment while maintaining group cohesion becomes the top priority inside the group. Internally, group dynamics of shunning the non-believer is usually enough, but recruitment of new members requires explanations. The set of explanations does not seek to pass Occam's razor, but energy minimum of explanations and thought terminating clichés that maximizes recruitment with minimal work. This materializes as propaganda that snow-balls from fallacious nuggets into <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAKTD-6aDq4">eight-hour long compilations</a>. Re-use of content in new videos minimizes work and the repetition serves both as <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rehearsal_(educational_psychology)" class="extiw" title="wp:Rehearsal (educational psychology)" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Rehearsal_(educational_psychology)">rehearsal</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> and as the "<i>repeat a lie long enough, and it becomes the truth</i>" propaganda 101 tactic. The cult leaders instruct the members how to do low-effort recruitment: <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/fxDYKSYBJAY?si=lGB5m8NdTK9yQ8Pv&t=210">passively expose them to the material, and instead of engaging with their questions, steer them to the cult's lore</a>. </p><p>As on organizational level modern flat Earth was never much more than an instance of the online grift, "redpilling everyone" mainly served to maximize the number of marks, and lack of action frustrated flerfs. Because of this, flat Earth mainly served a function in the radicalization pipeline: It was the last stepping stone of losing trust in society and its institutions. The next stone would be taking political action. </p><p>The QAnon conspiracy promised "The Storm" and "The Great Awakening", basically a fascist new world order. As fascism is more or less just "society as a cult", many flerfs believe they can thrive in it with the one resource they have an endless supply of: loyalty. After QAnon nabbed most of the flerfs, the flat Earth movement has been a shadow of its former self, consisting mostly of active members' circle-jerk webinars and conventions, and the grifters operating on whoever chose to remain in the cult, or whoever happens to stop by on their way through the radicalization pipeline. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Relativity_of_wrong">Relativity of wrong</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=10" title="Edit section: Relativity of wrong">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <div role="note" class="hatnote">See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/Wronger_than_wrong" title="Wronger than wrong">Wronger than wrong</a></div> <p><a href="/wiki/Isaac_Asimov" title="Isaac Asimov">Isaac Asimov</a> used the idea of a flat Earth in his essay <i>The Relativity of Wrong</i> to make a point about the progress of scientific knowledge.<sup id="cite_ref-10" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-10">[6]</a></sup> He pointed out that the notion of a flat Earth is wrong, but the idea of a <i>spherical</i> Earth is also wrong, as the shape of the Earth is better described as an oblate spheroid (because the Earth is wider than it is tall, flattening out at the poles while bulging around the Equator). Asimov went on to say how these theories aren't equally wrong (and believing such a thing as a flat Earth is "wronger than wrong") but that they do have use. </p><p>An architect working on a small building site would have no use for "Spherical Earth Theory" and would assume the ground is flat, but another designing a bridge, would. A designer of novelty globes wouldn't need to compensate for the oblateness of the earth, but those sending satellites into orbit do (in fact the distortion has quite a dramatic effect on inclined orbits). </p><p>Modern flat-earthery tends to be <a href="/wiki/Not_even_wrong" title="Not even wrong">not even wrong</a>, however. </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Preface_to_debunking">Preface to debunking</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=11" title="Edit section: Preface to debunking">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>First things first. The Earth can not be both flat and a sphere at the same time. This isn't a <a href="/wiki/False_dilemma" title="False dilemma">false dilemma</a> — the two <b>mutually exclude</b> one another. Either the Earth is flat, and <i>all of <a href="/wiki/Scientific_consensus" title="Scientific consensus">established science</a></i> is completely wrong, or the flat Earth is completely wrong, and the people spreading it are cultists and/or scammers. </p><p>Natural sciences are not soft sciences like sociology or political science, where there are different frameworks that explain the topic, with none objectively more valid than the other. Natural science deals with, and explains objective reality, and thus, it has no room for second best theory. </p><p><b>"But theories are just theories!"</b> </p><p>Our everyday "<i>I have this theory that when one is tired, their nose bleeds more often</i>" is what science calls a <b>conjecture</b>. A conjecture is just an idea. A conjecture that can be tested is called a <b>hypothesis</b>. The testing is done using the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method" class="extiw" title="wp:Scientific method" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Scientific_method">scientific method</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>, with a <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Experiment" class="extiw" title="wp:Experiment" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Experiment">scientific experiment</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> that must be able to disprove the hypothesis. If it doesn't disprove it, then the experiment supports the hypothesis. If there are competing explanations, over time new experiments rule them out. Once there's sufficient evidence no other explanation is better, we start calling that explanation a <b>scientific theory</b>. </p><p>The theories are rarely perfect, but the process ensures they only improve over time. E.g., the model of atoms in the atomic theory has evolved from <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dalton#Atomic_theory" class="extiw" title="wp:John Dalton" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: John_Dalton#Atomic_theory">John Dalton's 1803 idea</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> of atoms being tiny particles, to J. J. Thompson's 1904 <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plum_pudding_model" class="extiw" title="wp:Plum pudding model" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Plum_pudding_model">plum pudding model</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bohr_model" class="extiw" title="wp:Bohr model" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Bohr_model">Rutherford-Bohr model</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> by Niels Bohr and Ernest Rutherford in the 1910s, followed by our modern <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_orbital" class="extiw" title="wp:Atomic orbital" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Atomic_orbital">quantum mechanical model</span></a>.<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> Even the scientific method has <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_scientific_method" class="extiw" title="wp:History of scientific method" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: History_of_scientific_method">evolved and improved</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> over the centuries. This pursuit of knowledge in a way that's capable of introspection is not a problem, neither is any imperfect intermediate step towards the right direction: <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_models_are_wrong" class="extiw" title="wp:All models are wrong" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: All_models_are_wrong">All models are wrong</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> but some are useful.<sup id="cite_ref-11" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-11">[note 5]</a></sup> The real problem is those who claim to have all the answers, and those who ask society to take steps back just because it suits their politics. </p><p>In the 19th century, scientists really thought the Earth was stationary. At some point scientists like Viviani ran into precession of pendulums, that they could not explain with their current model. This created the need for a better model, and with the <a href="/wiki/Foucault%27s_pendulum" title="Foucault's pendulum">Foucault's pendulum</a> rotating Earth eventually won. </p><p>For the globe model to remain the prevailing <b>figure of the Earth theory</b>, it must explain as many things as flat Earth for it to be even considered, and more to be accepted. Which it does. Thus, there's nothing <i>suspicious</i> or <i>strangely convenient</i> about the globe model being able to trivially debunk everything flat Earth proponents — both old and new — say. </p><p>Despite this, flat-earthers still continue to misrepresent and distort the truth, using lies — either direct or by omission — and every rhetorical trick in the book, to make it seem flat Earth explains more phenomena. Time to torch their bullshit. </p> <table class="navbox collapsible collapsed" style="text-align: left; border: 0px; margin-top: 0.2em;width:500; max-width: 100%; border: solid 1px silver;"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background-color: #f2dfce; text-align:center;">Flat Earth debunk warm-up </th></tr> <tr> <td style="padding: 8px; background-color: white;"> <center><div class="thumb embedvideo autoResize" style="width: 648px;"><div class="embedvideo autoResize" style=""><div class="embedvideowrap" style="width: 640px;"><iframe title="Play video" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/uexZbunD7Jg?" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true"></iframe></div></div></div></center> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br /> </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth">Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=12" title="Edit section: Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Earth"><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_The_Earth" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - The Earth">The Earth</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=13" title="Edit section: The Earth">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Moon"><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_The_Moon" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - The Moon">The Moon</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=14" title="Edit section: The Moon">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Sun"><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_The_Sun" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - The Sun">The Sun</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=15" title="Edit section: The Sun">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Stars"><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_The_Stars" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - The Stars">The Stars</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=16" title="Edit section: The Stars">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Celestial_Mechanics"><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_Celestial_Mechanics" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - Celestial Mechanics">Celestial Mechanics</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=17" title="Edit section: Celestial Mechanics">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Celestial_Objects"><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_Celestial_Objects" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - Celestial Objects">Celestial Objects</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=18" title="Edit section: Celestial Objects">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Astronautics"><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_Astronautics" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - Astronautics">Astronautics</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=19" title="Edit section: Astronautics">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Astrophotography"><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_Astrophotography" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - Astrophotography">Astrophotography</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=20" title="Edit section: Astrophotography">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Conspiracy"><a href="/wiki/Empirical_evidence_for_the_spherical_shape_of_Earth_-_The_Conspiracy" title="Empirical evidence for the spherical shape of Earth - The Conspiracy">The Conspiracy</a></span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=21" title="Edit section: The Conspiracy">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Experiments">Experiments</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=22" title="Edit section: Experiments">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>Over the centuries, experiments have been performed to determine the shape of the Earth. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Joint_Experiments">Joint Experiments</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=23" title="Edit section: Joint Experiments">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <h4><span id="The_Final_Experiment_(2024)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Final_Experiment_.282024.29">The Final Experiment (2024)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=24" title="Edit section: The Final Experiment (2024)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>See main article for this topic: <a href="/wiki/The_Final_Experiment" title="The Final Experiment">The Final Experiment</a>. </p> <h4><span id="David_Weiss'_peer-reviewed_experiment_(TBD)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="David_Weiss.27_peer-reviewed_experiment_.28TBD.29">David Weiss' peer-reviewed experiment (TBD)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=25" title="Edit section: David Weiss' peer-reviewed experiment (TBD)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>In February 2025, Flat Earth Dave <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/WgzAKamkNpE?feature=shared&t=3330">agreed to</a> design and take part in a rigorous, bipartisan, scientific experiment, with Dr. Shiva Ayyadurai, with the goal of getting it published in a peer-reviewed, accredited journal. The preliminary idea was to measure the curve with a straight flying plane's altitude, as a function of flying distance. Weiss did his best to weasel his way out of this one, but in the end, couldn't find an excuse. The experiment design meeting will take place in June and August, 2025. </p> <table class="navbox collapsible collapsed" style="text-align: left; border: 0px; margin-top: 0.2em;width:500; max-width: 100%; border: solid 1px silver;"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background-color: #f2dfce; text-align:center;">David Weiss fails at Everything, Except Scamming </th></tr> <tr> <td style="padding: 8px; background-color: white;"> <div class="thumb embedvideo autoResize" style="width: 648px;"><div class="embedvideo autoResize" style=""><div class="embedvideowrap" style="width: 640px;"><iframe title="Play video" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/cjwfrSXBIwI?" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true"></iframe></div></div></div> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br /> </p><p>Meanwhile, Michael Toon, who hosted the episode above, is reportedly searching for an extra-long measuring tape to size up Weiss' long face. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Glober_Experiments">The Glober Experiments</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=26" title="Edit section: The Glober Experiments">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <h4><span id="The_Cavendish_Experiment_(1797)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Cavendish_Experiment_.281797.29">The Cavendish Experiment (1797)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=27" title="Edit section: The Cavendish Experiment (1797)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/Cavendish_experiment" title="Cavendish experiment">The Cavendish experiment</a> </p> <h4><span id="Foucault's_Pendulum_(1851)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Foucault.27s_Pendulum_.281851.29">Foucault's Pendulum (1851)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=28" title="Edit section: Foucault's Pendulum (1851)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/Foucault%27s_pendulum" title="Foucault's pendulum">Foucault's pendulum</a> </p> <h4><span id="Alfred_Russel_Wallace's_Reproduction_of_the_Bedford_Level_Experiment_(1870)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Alfred_Russel_Wallace.27s_Reproduction_of_the_Bedford_Level_Experiment_.281870.29">Alfred Russel Wallace's Reproduction of the Bedford Level Experiment (1870)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=29" title="Edit section: Alfred Russel Wallace's Reproduction of the Bedford Level Experiment (1870)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>See main article for this topic: <a href="/wiki/Bedford_Level_experiment#Alfred_Russel_Wallace.27s_Reproduction_.281870.29" title="Bedford Level experiment">Alfred Russel Wallace's Reproduction (1870)</a> </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Aether_drift_experiments">Aether drift experiments</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=30" title="Edit section: Aether drift experiments">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminiferous_aether" class="extiw" title="wp:Luminiferous aether" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Luminiferous_aether">Luminiferous Aether</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> was a hypothetical medium thought to be responsible of carrying electromagnetic radiation (visible light, X-rays, etc), similar to how air carries sound waves. The <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aether_drag_hypothesis" class="extiw" title="wp:Aether drag hypothesis" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Aether_drag_hypothesis">aether drag hypothesis</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> proposed that aether was dragged along by moving matter, such as Earth. If this was the case, then either aether moved with the Earth, and there was no relative movement, or, there was relative movement called <i>aether wind</i>, and it would be detectable with instruments at rest on Earth's surface. </p><p>The aether drift experiments have never been used to prove Earth's shape (this has been known since antiquity), or movement through space (which has been known since <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Bradley#Works" class="extiw" title="wp:James Bradley" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: James_Bradley#Works">James Bradley's 1725 discovery of stellar aberration</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>). This hasn't stopped flat-earthers from lying blatantly about both applicability, and the result supporting their crankery. </p> <h5><span id="Airy's_Ether_drag_test_(AKA_Airy's_Failure)_(1871)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Airy.27s_Ether_drag_test_.28AKA_Airy.27s_Failure.29_.281871.29">Airy's Ether drag test (AKA Airy's Failure) (1871)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=31" title="Edit section: Airy's Ether drag test (AKA Airy's Failure) (1871)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h5> <p>See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/Airy%27s_failure" title="Airy's failure">Airy's failure</a> </p> <h5><span id="Michelson-Morley_experiment_(1887)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Michelson-Morley_experiment_.281887.29">Michelson-Morley experiment (1887)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=32" title="Edit section: Michelson-Morley experiment (1887)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h5> <p>See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/Michelson-Morley_experiment" title="Michelson-Morley experiment">Michelson-Morley experiment</a> </p> <h5><span id="Michelson-Gale-Pearson_experiment_(1925)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Michelson-Gale-Pearson_experiment_.281925.29">Michelson-Gale-Pearson experiment (1925)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=33" title="Edit section: Michelson-Gale-Pearson experiment (1925)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h5> <p>See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/Michelson-Gale-Pearson_experiment" title="Michelson-Gale-Pearson experiment">Michelson-Gale-Pearson experiment</a> </p> <h4><span id="Jesse_Kozlowski's_Cooper_River_Lake_Curve_Experiment_(2016)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Jesse_Kozlowski.27s_Cooper_River_Lake_Curve_Experiment_.282016.29">Jesse Kozlowski's Cooper River Lake Curve Experiment (2016)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=34" title="Edit section: Jesse Kozlowski's Cooper River Lake Curve Experiment (2016)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>Jesse Kozlowski is a surveyor who has been debunking flat-earthers by basically doing his job. Kozlowski uses "reciprocal vertical/zenith angles" to prove the curvature of the Earth. In this case, by measuring with a theodolite the reciprocal angles of two different targets at 7,311 feet from each other in the Cooper River Lake with the same elevation, using the water as the level reference. On a flat Earth, the sum-up angle for these two targets would sum up not more than 180º, and thus there would be no reciprocal vertical/zenith angles. However, Kozlowski measured that the angles of each target were higher than 90°, with a sum-up zenith angle higher than 180º, thus proving the Earth a globe.<sup id="cite_ref-12" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-12">[7]</a></sup> </p> <table class="navbox collapsible collapsed" style="text-align: left; border: 0px; margin-top: 0.2em;width:500; max-width: 100%; border: solid 1px silver;"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background-color: #f2dfce; text-align:center;">Perfectly Flat Level Lake </th></tr> <tr> <td style="padding: 8px; background-color: white;"> <center><div class="thumb embedvideo autoResize" style="width: 648px;"><div class="embedvideo autoResize" style=""><div class="embedvideowrap" style="width: 640px;"><iframe title="Play video" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/ZlP3njwf6h0?" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true"></iframe></div></div></div></center> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br /> </p><p>These reciprocal zenith angles experiments (shared by <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://mctoon.net/radius-reciprocal-angles/">McToon</a>) have also been replicated by <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://walter.bislins.ch/bloge/index.asp?page=Determining+the+Shape+of+the+Earth+with+Zenith+Angle+Measurements&q=Zenith+angles+radius">Walter Bislin</a> and <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7DIQEauai0&ab_channel=TheMaineSurveyor">The Maine Surveyor</a> (see below), confirming again the curvature of Earth: </p> <table class="navbox collapsible collapsed" style="text-align: left; border: 0px; margin-top: 0.2em;width:500; max-width: 100%; border: solid 1px silver;"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background-color: #f2dfce; text-align:center;">Plumb Lines – Still Not Parallel </th></tr> <tr> <td style="padding: 8px; background-color: white;"> <center><div class="thumb embedvideo autoResize" style="width: 648px;"><div class="embedvideo autoResize" style=""><div class="embedvideowrap" style="width: 640px;"><iframe title="Play video" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/P7DIQEauai0?" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true"></iframe></div></div></div></center> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br /> </p> <h4><span id="Dan_Olson's_Lake_Minnewanka_Curve_Experiment_(2020)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Dan_Olson.27s_Lake_Minnewanka_Curve_Experiment_.282020.29">Dan Olson's Lake Minnewanka Curve Experiment (2020)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=35" title="Edit section: Dan Olson's Lake Minnewanka Curve Experiment (2020)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>See main article for this topic: <a href="/wiki/Lake_Minnewanka_curve_experiment" title="Lake Minnewanka curve experiment">Lake Minnewanka curve experiment</a>. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Flerf_Experiments">The Flerf Experiments</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=36" title="Edit section: The Flerf Experiments">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>Every once in a while, flat-earthers do try to actually walk the talk, and perform experiments themselves to disprove globe and confirm their pizza land. </p> <h4><span id="Samuel_Rowbotham's_Bedford_Level_Experiment_(1838)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Samuel_Rowbotham.27s_Bedford_Level_Experiment_.281838.29">Samuel Rowbotham's Bedford Level Experiment (1838)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=37" title="Edit section: Samuel Rowbotham's Bedford Level Experiment (1838)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/Bedford_Level_experiment#Samuel_Rowbotham.27s_Experiment_.281838.29" title="Bedford Level experiment">Samuel Rowbotham's Experiment (1838)</a> </p> <h4><span id="Darryle_Marble's_spirit_level_experiment_(2017)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Darryle_Marble.27s_spirit_level_experiment_.282017.29">Darryle Marble's spirit level experiment (2017)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=38" title="Edit section: Darryle Marble's spirit level experiment (2017)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>In 2017, Darryle Marble tried to prove the Earth flat by taking a spirit level to a plane. </p> <table class="navbox collapsible collapsed" style="text-align: left; border: 0px; margin-top: 0.2em;width:500; max-width: 100%; border: solid 1px silver;"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background-color: #f2dfce; text-align:center;">Flat Earth PROOF: Spirit Level Flight Experiment </th></tr> <tr> <td style="padding: 8px; background-color: white;"> <div class="thumb embedvideo autoResize" style="width: 648px;"><div class="embedvideo autoResize" style=""><div class="embedvideowrap" style="width: 640px;"><iframe title="Play video" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/6nNUEU8gnf4?" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true"></iframe></div></div></div> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br /> </p><p>At the cruising speed of 450 knots, the plane has to adjust its pitch by one degree every 8 minutes. Human pilots make less than half-a-degree corrections every few minutes. Modern autopilots make 0.1 degree corrections at the rate of roughly 10-20 adjustments per minute. These adjustments are imperceptible to human senses.<sup id="cite_ref-13" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-13">[8]</a></sup> In Marble's video, the spirit level's bubble absolutely does not stay still. The pitch compensation for the Earth's curvature is drowned in other disturbances from turbulence etc. </p><p>Marble also seemed to assume the change in pitch would remain constant, because he expected to see the bubble constantly move towards the other end of the spirit level. This completely fails to understand that in the globe model, gravity is always towards the ground, i.e. the geocenter of the Earth, and thus, the spirit level, when propped to the angle that's perpendicular to the zenith, will not detect the curvature. This is because the gravity well that affects the spirit level changes constantly as the plane travels along the curvature. </p><p>So because the spirit level can not detect plane's orientation in the inertial frame of reference, and because the documented bubble movement in the video easily explains 0.1 degree autopilot corrections to pitch, this experiment fails to disprove globe. </p> <h4><span id="Jeran_Campanella's_flashlight_experiment_(2018)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Jeran_Campanella.27s_flashlight_experiment_.282018.29">Jeran Campanella's flashlight experiment (2018)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=39" title="Edit section: Jeran Campanella's flashlight experiment (2018)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>During the filming of the 2018 Netflix documentary <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt8132700/">Behind The Curve</a>, Jeran Campanella, yes, the same Jeranism who later went to Antarctica with The Final Experiment group, recreated the Bedford Level Experiment with a flashlight, and he managed to prove the Earth, a globe. </p> <table class="navbox collapsible collapsed" style="text-align: left; border: 0px; margin-top: 0.2em;width:500; max-width: 100%; border: solid 1px silver;"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background-color: #f2dfce; text-align:center;">Flat-Earther accidentally proves the Earth is round in his own experiment </th></tr> <tr> <td style="padding: 8px; background-color: white;"> <div class="thumb embedvideo autoResize" style="width: 648px;"><div class="embedvideo autoResize" style=""><div class="embedvideowrap" style="width: 640px;"><iframe title="Play video" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/GFqmDazwb6Y?" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true"></iframe></div></div></div> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br /> </p> <h4><span id="Bob_Knodel's_RLG_experiment_(2018)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Bob_Knodel.27s_RLG_experiment_.282018.29">Bob Knodel's RLG experiment (2018)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=40" title="Edit section: Bob Knodel's RLG experiment (2018)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>During the filming of the same documentary, another flat-earther, Bob Knodel, bought a 20,000 USD <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ring_laser_gyroscope" class="extiw" title="wp:Ring laser gyroscope" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Ring_laser_gyroscope">ring laser gyroscope (RLG)</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> to measure the drift caused by the Earth's rotation <b>360° / 24h = 15° / h</b>. Knodel proved Earth to be, a globe. </p> <table class="navbox collapsible collapsed" style="text-align: left; border: 0px; margin-top: 0.2em;width:500; max-width: 100%; border: solid 1px silver;"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background-color: #f2dfce; text-align:center;">Bob Knodel & His Ring Laser Gyroscope Experiment </th></tr> <tr> <td style="padding: 8px; background-color: white;"> <div class="thumb embedvideo autoResize" style="width: 648px;"><div class="embedvideo autoResize" style=""><div class="embedvideowrap" style="width: 640px;"><iframe title="Play video" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/SrGgxAK9Z5A?" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true"></iframe></div></div></div> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br /> </p> <h4><span id="Mike_Hughes'_rocket_experiment_(2018)"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Mike_Hughes.27_rocket_experiment_.282018.29">Mike Hughes' rocket experiment (2018)</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=41" title="Edit section: Mike Hughes' rocket experiment (2018)">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <p>In 2018, "Mad Mike" Hughes launched himself to the sky on a home-made rocket, in the hope of documenting the non-existence of the curve. </p> <table class="navbox collapsible collapsed" style="text-align: left; border: 0px; margin-top: 0.2em;width:500; max-width: 100%; border: solid 1px silver;"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background-color: #f2dfce; text-align:center;">Man launches himself in self-made rocket to prove flat Earth theory </th></tr> <tr> <td style="padding: 8px; background-color: white;"> <div class="thumb embedvideo autoResize" style="width: 648px;"><div class="embedvideo autoResize" style=""><div class="embedvideowrap" style="width: 640px;"><iframe title="Play video" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/iwku5Alsi04?" width="640" height="360" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true"></iframe></div></div></div> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br /> </p><p><br /> Hughes reached the height of 1,875 feet which just under 5% of commercial airliners' cruising altitude (38,000ft). Needless to say, the altitude was not enough to show the curve. Still, the experiment proved beyond any doubt Hughes had the largest balls in the entire flatsphere. </p><p>Hughes died in a subsequent attempt in February 2020.<sup id="cite_ref-14" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-14">[9]</a></sup> </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="The_scoreboard">The scoreboard</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=42" title="Edit section: The scoreboard">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>Adding to the experiments by flerfs </p> <ul><li>the two experiments done at TFE (24 hour Sun recording, and the scale measurement), and</li> <li>the Bedford Level Experiment replication by Dan Olson,</li></ul> <p>we get to the scoreboard. </p> <table class="wikitable"> <tbody><tr> <th></th> <th>Proved The Earth Flat</th> <th>Proved The Earth Globe</th> <th>Failed to Disprove The Globe</th> <th>Failed to Disprove Flat Earth </th></tr> <tr> <td><b>Flerfs</b></td> <td>0</td> <td>2</td> <td>2</td> <td>0 </td></tr> <tr> <td><b>Globers</b></td> <td>0</td> <td>3</td> <td>0</td> <td>0 </td></tr> <tr> <td><b>Total</b></td> <td><b>0</b></td> <td><b>5</b></td> <td><b>2</b></td> <td><b>0</b> </td></tr></tbody></table> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Firmament_fleers">Firmament fleers</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=43" title="Edit section: Firmament fleers">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>Over time, some flat earthers have made it out of the cult. Here we celebrate them for getting their lives back. </p> <table class="wikitable"> <caption>Escaped the firmament </caption> <tbody><tr> <th>Name</th> <th>Left the cult on</th> <th>Reason for leaving </th></tr> <tr> <td>Jeran Campanella</td> <td>2025/01/07</td> <td>Doubts after TFE<sup id="cite_ref-15" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-15">[10]</a></sup> </td></tr> <tr> <td>Patricia Steere</td> <td>2025/02</td> <td>Doubts after TFE<sup id="cite_ref-16" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-16">[11]</a></sup> </td></tr> <tr> <td>Robbie Davidson</td> <td>2025/02</td> <td>Doubts after TFE<sup id="cite_ref-17" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-17">[12]</a></sup> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p>Congratulations everyone! </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="History">History</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=44" title="Edit section: History">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/History_of_Flat_Earth" title="History of Flat Earth">History of Flat Earh</a> </p><p><br /> </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Online_resurgence">Online resurgence</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=45" title="Edit section: Online resurgence">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>Sadly, the flat Earth model is gaining popularity — or at least more vocal proponents — via the Internet, especially on various nutcase-enabling platforms like <a href="/wiki/YouTube" title="YouTube">YouTube</a>.<sup id="cite_ref-auto_18-0" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-auto-18">[13]</a></sup> The starting point for the resurgence can be considered to be flat-earther Mark Sargent's first YouTube video <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8-YdgU-CF4">FLAT EARTH clues Introduction</a> he uploaded in February 2015. The central arguments of the video are about </p> <ol><li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8-YdgU-CF4&t=467s">There existing no 360 degree camera footage from outside the ISS</a> (there <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/Seh-oDCoORM?feature=shared&t=45">now is</a>),</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/T8-YdgU-CF4?feature=shared&t=508">There being no non-composite images of Earth</a> (there is <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://epic.gsfc.nasa.gov/">a whole album</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://explorer1.jpl.nasa.gov/galleries/earth-from-space/">and another</a>), and</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/T8-YdgU-CF4?feature=shared&t=550">There being no straight flights from South America to Australia</a> (<a href="/wiki/Flat_Earth#There_are_direct_flights_between_Australia_and_Southern_America" title="Flat Earth">there is</a>).</li></ol> <p>Funnily enough, the video also <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/T8-YdgU-CF4?feature=shared&t=301">confirms the existence of pressure gradient</a> which proves gravity exists, and which disproves the firmament, as pressurized containers have equal pressure regardless of altitude. </p><p>Flat Earth seems to be rooted in complete and active suspicion of all authority and an assumption that <a href="/wiki/WAKE_UP" class="mw-redirect" title="WAKE UP">Mainstream Science™</a> is just one big, faceless monolith — spreading lies to keep the public in the dark about, er... <i>Some</i> nefarious end! NASA, being part of the <a href="/wiki/Illuminati" title="Illuminati">Illuminati</a> according to the flat-earthers, is possessed of infinite money and control <a href="/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance" title="Cognitive dissonance">while at the same time</a> being so incompetent they leave easily-spotted mistakes in their propaganda that expose the whole thing. Flat-earthers like <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCS_FY5mR4g22L_E9t1D_ExQ">Jeranism</a> make videos filled with a mix of <a href="/wiki/Gish_Gallop" title="Gish Gallop">Gish Gallop</a> and creative misunderstanding, <a href="/wiki/Willful_ignorance" title="Willful ignorance">willful ignorance</a>, and flat (hah!) denial of facts and evidence to the contrary.<sup id="cite_ref-conversation_19-0" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-conversation-19">[14]</a></sup> </p><p>The flat Earth movement shares many of the same beliefs and goals as the <a href="/wiki/Alt-right" title="Alt-right">Alt-right</a>, and have even adopted Alt-right memes into their online presence. They created a variant of <a href="/wiki/Pepe_the_Frog" title="Pepe the Frog">Pepe the Frog</a> called "Fepe," or "Flat Earth Pepe."<sup id="cite_ref-bellingcat17_20-0" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-bellingcat17-20">[15]</a></sup> </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Fundamentalist_endorsements">Fundamentalist endorsements</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=46" title="Edit section: Fundamentalist endorsements">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>Motives for advocating a flat over a round Earth despite evidence to the contrary vary. Many <a href="/wiki/YEC" class="mw-redirect" title="YEC">young-earth creationists</a> who think it's 6,000 years old don't go so far as to say that it's not round.<sup id="cite_ref-21" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-21">[16]</a></sup> However, there are some particularly nutty evangelical flat-earthers.<sup id="cite_ref-22" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-22">[17]</a></sup> </p><p><a href="/wiki/Modern_geocentrism" class="mw-redirect" title="Modern geocentrism">Modern geocentrists</a> make a point of distancing themselves from the flat-Earth belief. Charles K. Johnson based his flat-Earth belief on a hyper-literal interpretation of the <a href="/wiki/Bible" title="Bible">Bible</a> (asserting that <a href="/wiki/Jesus" title="Jesus">Jesus</a>' ascent "up" into <a href="/wiki/Heaven" title="Heaven">Heaven</a> is proof of a flat Earth, since a round Earth would have no "up" or "down").<sup id="cite_ref-23" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-23">[18]</a></sup> </p><p>A flat-Earth movement also exists within fundamentalist <a href="/wiki/Islam" title="Islam">Islam</a>, based on a literal interpretation of several <a href="/wiki/Qur%27an" title="Qur'an"> Qur'anic</a> verses (see the <a href="/wiki/Flat_Earth#Religious_views" title="Flat Earth"> "Religious views" section</a> below). </p><p>While we're on the subject, a common claim by people who arrive at flatheaddery from the Religious Fundamentalism direction is that the globe is a lie propagated by the Satan-controlled media in an attempt to draw people away from the Bible. Although one would think that if Satan had that kind of power, then they'd simply ban Bibles outright. </p><p>To demonstrate the error in thinking of these people (who have apparently never heard of metaphors or hyperbole), let's look at a passage likely very near and dear to their hearts: God setting his bow in the sky after Noah's flood to celebrate his promise never to do that again. According to Hyperliteralist logic, this means that every rainbow ever (even ones produced from garden hoses) is actually all the same specific object, an actual warbow that might potentially be seized by human hands and used to fire arrows one day. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Celebrity_endorsements">Celebrity endorsements</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=47" title="Edit section: Celebrity endorsements">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <div role="note" class="hatnote">See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/Appeal_to_celebrity" title="Appeal to celebrity">Appeal to celebrity</a></div> <p>The rapper <a href="/wiki/B.o.B." class="mw-redirect" title="B.o.B.">B.o.B.</a>, who has had several hits including "Nothin' on You" and "Airplanes", outed himself as a flat-earther in 2016 and released a diss track called "Flatline" aimed at astronomer <a href="/wiki/Neil_deGrasse_Tyson" title="Neil deGrasse Tyson">Neil deGrasse Tyson</a>. Tyson's nephew, who is also a rapper, released a counter-diss track in response.<sup id="cite_ref-24" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-24">[19]</a></sup> Astrophysicist <a href="/wiki/Lawrence_Krauss" title="Lawrence Krauss">Lawrence Krauss</a> wrote in <i>Slate</i> such views can be useful — even if grotesque — when they can be used to check our assumptions. He proposes three clear reasons why the Earth is round: the time zones, the seasons, and the Global Positioning System.<sup id="cite_ref-25" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-25">[20]</a></sup> </p><p>Confusing their ball game proficiency with <a href="/wiki/Dunning-Kruger_effect" class="mw-redirect" title="Dunning-Kruger effect">an understanding of spheres in general</a>, four NBA players also come out as flat-earthers, including <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaquille_O%27Neal" class="extiw" title="wp:Shaquille O'Neal" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Shaquille O'Neal">Shaquille O'Neal</span></a>.<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup><sup id="cite_ref-26" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-26">[21]</a></sup> (He was joking.) </p><p><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tila_Tequila" class="extiw" title="wp:Tila Tequila" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Tila Tequila">Tila Tequila</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> has also endorsed flat-earthery<sup id="cite_ref-celebs_27-0" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-celebs-27">[22]</a></sup> — which seems contradictory, considering she's also endorsed <a href="/wiki/Hitler" class="mw-redirect" title="Hitler">Hitler</a>,<sup id="cite_ref-celebs2_28-0" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-celebs2-28">[23]</a></sup> whom <a href="/wiki/Stopped_clock" title="Stopped clock">we don't think was a flat-earther</a>. </p><p>In November 2024, another rapper, Lorenzo Dechalus (prof. <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lord_Jamar" class="extiw" title="wp:Lord Jamar" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Lord_Jamar">Lord Jamar</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>), expressed his flat Earth crankery on Godfrey's podcast and offered to debate Neil deGrasse Tyson.<sup id="cite_ref-29" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-29">[24]</a></sup> The heavyweight champion of astrophysics was unavailable, but, on January 15, 2025, during a 20 minute "debate" with Professor Dave, Dechalus got his ass handed back to him.<sup id="cite_ref-30" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-30">[25]</a></sup> </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Christian_flat_Earth_apologetics">Christian flat Earth apologetics</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=48" title="Edit section: Christian flat Earth apologetics">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:352px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Old_Testament_Cosmos.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="/w/images/thumb/8/8b/Old_Testament_Cosmos.jpg/350px-Old_Testament_Cosmos.jpg" decoding="async" width="350" height="234" class="thumbimage" srcset="/w/images/thumb/8/8b/Old_Testament_Cosmos.jpg/525px-Old_Testament_Cosmos.jpg 1.5x, /w/images/thumb/8/8b/Old_Testament_Cosmos.jpg/700px-Old_Testament_Cosmos.jpg 2x" data-file-width="1425" data-file-height="952" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Old_Testament_Cosmos.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>The universe according to the Old Testament.</div></div></div> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:352px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Cosmas_Indicopleustes_-_Topographia_Christiana_1.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f6/Cosmas_Indicopleustes_-_Topographia_Christiana_1.jpg/350px-Cosmas_Indicopleustes_-_Topographia_Christiana_1.jpg" decoding="async" width="350" height="323" class="thumbimage" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f6/Cosmas_Indicopleustes_-_Topographia_Christiana_1.jpg/525px-Cosmas_Indicopleustes_-_Topographia_Christiana_1.jpg 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f6/Cosmas_Indicopleustes_-_Topographia_Christiana_1.jpg 2x" data-file-width="548" data-file-height="505" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Cosmas_Indicopleustes_-_Topographia_Christiana_1.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>World picture from <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Topography" class="extiw" title="wp:Christian Topography" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Christian Topography">Christian Topography</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> (c. 6th-century).</div></div></div> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>Even a layperson today can observe that the Earth is not flat.</div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—<a href="/wiki/Answers_in_Genesis" title="Answers in Genesis">Answers in Genesis</a> (<i>even they</i> look smart next to flat-earthers!)<sup id="cite_ref-31" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-31">[26]</a></sup></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>When I first became interested in the flat-earthers in the early 1970s, I was surprised to learn that flat-earthism in the English-speaking world is and always has been entirely based upon the Bible. </div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—Robert Schadewald<sup id="cite_ref-32" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-32">[27]</a></sup></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p>Many <a href="/wiki/Biblical_literalist" class="mw-redirect" title="Biblical literalist">Biblical literalists</a> claim the Bible disproves <a href="/wiki/Evolution" title="Evolution">evolution</a> and other scientific theories <i>prima facie</i>. Since there is no real debate about the shape of the Earth, these passages call Biblical literalism into question. The irony of flat-earthers encouraging people to <a href="/wiki/Pseudoskepticism" title="Pseudoskepticism">stop blindly accepting what they've been taught and do their own research</a> has not gone unnoticed, considering that the primarily cited origin of flat Earth ideas is indeed the Bible. </p><p>In numerous passages, the Bible claims that the Earth is a flat disk and/or rectangular, usually implicitly. Whether or not the Bible "really" says this is often debated — but if the Bible was written by people who lived in societies who were unaware that the Earth is a more or less spherical object which orbits the Sun, then we would expect this view to be reflected in their writings. Presumably, God's concern would be the salvation of their souls, so it's difficult to see why clearing up the true shape of the Earth would be important for that endeavor. </p><p>Biblical flat-Earthism is very rarely accepted. Wilbur Glenn Voliva even offered $5000 as a prize for anyone who can prove that Earth is not flat. Of course, his predictions about Earth ending in 1923, 1927, 1930, and 1935 also failed.<sup id="cite_ref-33" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-33">[28]</a></sup> Teaching about spherical Earth was banned in the schools of Zion, <a href="/wiki/Illinois" class="mw-redirect" title="Illinois">Illinois</a>, at that time. </p><p>Former President of the <a href="/wiki/United_States" title="United States">United States</a> <a href="/wiki/Jimmy_Carter" title="Jimmy Carter">Jimmy Carter</a> mentioned flat-earthers in passing (though he was actually speaking against mandatory teaching of <a href="/wiki/Creation_science" title="Creation science">creation science</a>):<sup id="cite_ref-34" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-34">[29]</a></sup> </p> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>There can be no incompatibility between Christian faith and proven facts concerning geology, biology, and astronomy. There is no need to teach that stars can fall out of the sky and land on a flat Earth in order to defend our religious faith.</div> </td></tr> </tbody></table> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Appeals_to_the_Bible">Appeals to the Bible</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=49" title="Edit section: Appeals to the Bible">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>What the Bible actually says about a flat Earth is clearly a matter for debate amongst Christians. But it is certainly both instructive and amusing to read how some Christians clearly see a flat Earth while other Christians attempt to dismiss their claims as poetry, dreams or something which is "obviously" not to be taken literally. </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="The_king_seeing_all_the_earth">The king seeing all the earth</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=50" title="Edit section: The king seeing all the earth">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <ul><li>"<a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Bible/Daniel#Daniel_4:10" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Bible/Daniel">Daniel 4:10</a>-11. In Daniel, the king “saw a tree of great height at the centre of the earth… reaching with its top to the sky and visible to the earth's farthest bounds.” Only with a flat Earth could a tall tree be visible from "the earth's farthest bounds" — this is impossible on a spherical Earth, or is the tree a rocket?</li></ul> <p><b>Theological rebuttal:</b> The strength of Daniel 4:10-11 as an argument for a flat Earth is considerably reduced by the fact that this part of the Book of Daniel recounts a dream experienced by the Assyrian king of Babylon. Thus, it does not necessarily refer to an actually existing tree or make any statements about real cosmology. This interpretation would seem to indicate that biblical literalists do not even know how to read the Bible properly. This is also <a href="/wiki/Quote_mining" title="Quote mining">quote mining</a>. </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="Jesus_seeing_all_the_kingdoms">Jesus seeing all the kingdoms</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=51" title="Edit section: Jesus seeing all the kingdoms">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:352px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Flat_Earth_versus_Spherical_Earth_(Matthew_4_-_8_and_Luke_4_-_5),_for_RW.PNG" class="image"><img alt="" src="/w/images/thumb/4/49/Flat_Earth_versus_Spherical_Earth_%28Matthew_4_-_8_and_Luke_4_-_5%29%2C_for_RW.PNG/350px-Flat_Earth_versus_Spherical_Earth_%28Matthew_4_-_8_and_Luke_4_-_5%29%2C_for_RW.PNG" decoding="async" width="350" height="255" class="thumbimage" srcset="/w/images/thumb/4/49/Flat_Earth_versus_Spherical_Earth_%28Matthew_4_-_8_and_Luke_4_-_5%29%2C_for_RW.PNG/525px-Flat_Earth_versus_Spherical_Earth_%28Matthew_4_-_8_and_Luke_4_-_5%29%2C_for_RW.PNG 1.5x, /w/images/thumb/4/49/Flat_Earth_versus_Spherical_Earth_%28Matthew_4_-_8_and_Luke_4_-_5%29%2C_for_RW.PNG/700px-Flat_Earth_versus_Spherical_Earth_%28Matthew_4_-_8_and_Luke_4_-_5%29%2C_for_RW.PNG 2x" data-file-width="1463" data-file-height="1065" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Flat_Earth_versus_Spherical_Earth_(Matthew_4_-_8_and_Luke_4_-_5),_for_RW.PNG" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>Shows why you couldn't see all the kingdoms. To be fair, you can <a href="/wiki/Shoehorning" title="Shoehorning">suggest</a> that those outside of lines of sight are not kingdoms.</div></div></div> <ul><li><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Bible/Matthew#Matthew_4:8" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Bible/Matthew">Matthew 4:8</a>: "Again, the <a href="/wiki/Devil" class="mw-redirect" title="Devil">devil</a> taketh him up into an <b>exceeding high mountain</b> [spaceship?], and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world"</li> <li><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Bible/Luke#Luke_4:5" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Bible/Luke">Luke 4:5</a>: "And the devil, taking him up into an high mountain, shewed unto him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time."</li></ul> <p><b>Theological rebuttal again:</b> The strength of using <a href="/wiki/Matthew" class="mw-redirect" title="Matthew">Matthew</a> and <a href="/wiki/Luke" title="Luke">Luke</a> as flat Earth claims is reduced by the fact that "kingdom" is a human construct. If you classify all the places on Earth that you can't see from that particular location as "not kingdoms", such as barbaric tribes and non-monarchies, it can be fitted within that description. However, how the devil knows that those places are not ruled by kings (again, the concept of "king" is also a human concept) is not exactly clear. </p><p>You could also go with the idea that Satan simply showed Jesus all the kingdoms of the world <i>over the course of a trip around the equator</i> or in sequence, because the text does not imply that they were shown <i>together</i>. </p><p>Yet another possible interpretation is that only kingdoms in the <i>then known</i> world (southern Europe, northern Africa and western Asia) are meant, which could be seen from a point in space not far above the surface of the Earth. Take your pick, flatheads. </p> <h4><span class="mw-headline" id="The_Earth_is_a_circle">The Earth is a circle</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=52" title="Edit section: The Earth is a circle">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <ul><li><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Bible/Isaiah#Isaiah_40:22" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Bible/Isaiah">Isaiah 40:22</a>: "He sits enthroned above the <b>circle of the earth</b> (Earth’s orbit?), and its people are like grasshoppers. He stretches out the heavens like a <b>canopy</b> (map), and spreads them out like a tent to live in."</li></ul> <p>Jews and Christians use this quote to "prove" that the Bible implies that the Earth is spherical, although the word is "circular", and may refer to the perception of a 360 degree panoramic view. Some scholars point out that <a href="/wiki/Isaiah" class="mw-redirect" title="Isaiah">Isaiah</a> never uses the Modern <a href="/wiki/Hebrew" title="Hebrew">Hebrew</a> word for sphere <i>Kadur</i>, anywhere.<sup id="cite_ref-35" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-35">[30]</a></sup> It is not clear to Theists whether this is relevant, because the interpretation of the word <i>Kadur</i> in the Bible is disputed by Theists. This line probably <i>does</i> refer to a flat model of the earth, since an alternative translation is "He sits enthroned above the <i>vault</i> of the earth," a reference to the <a href="/wiki/Firmament" title="Firmament">firmament</a>. </p><p>The passage describes the <i>Heavens</i> as like a canopy, not the Earth. This interpretation would seem to indicate that Biblical literalists do not even know how to read <i>sentences</i> properly. </p><p>Some non-flat-earth Christians maintain that this entire text is intended to be poetic in nature, as it talks about God holding the dust of the Earth in a basket. Either this, along with everything else, is meant to be a metaphorical description, or God has a <i>really</i> big basket. </p> <h4><span id=""Four_Corners""></span><span class="mw-headline" id=".22Four_Corners.22">"Four Corners"</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=53" title="Edit section: "Four Corners"">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h4> <ul><li><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Bible/Isaiah#Isaiah_11:12" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Bible/Isaiah">Isaiah 11:12</a> "And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of <a href="/wiki/Israel" title="Israel">Israel</a>, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the <b>four corners</b> [north, south, east and west] of the earth."</li> <li><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Bible/Revelation#Revelation_7:1" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Bible/Revelation">Revelation 7:1</a> "And after these things I saw four <a href="/wiki/Angels" class="mw-redirect" title="Angels">angels</a> standing on <b>four corners</b> of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree."</li></ul> <p>As with the Daniel quote, modern Jews and Christians, who have been educated by Science, don't take this literally; to them the events described in <a href="/wiki/Revelation" title="Revelation">Revelation</a> are a series of visions, rather than an accurate description of the world (which would indicate that you shouldn't take the Holy Bible literally). Another interpretation of this verse is that four corners of the Earth don't refer to literal four corners but to cardinal directions, which is further supported by the description of the four winds which are commonly referenced by their cardinal direction. An additional consideration is that <a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Bible/Leviticus#Leviticus_19:27" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Bible/Leviticus">Leviticus 19:27</a> refers to the "corners of the head"; this means that either A)the authors of the Bible had no problem with using the word "corners" non-literally while discussing round things (which would give the absurd implication that they used idioms and figurative speech just like everyone else ever), or B) The Ancient Israelites had heads like Minecraft Characters (in spite of all fossil evidence to the cont-- Oh wait...). Take for example the <i>modern</i> idiom "The Ends of the Earth." If Isaiah or Revelation had been written today, then this would be the phrase used, and then thousands of years later fundies would take this as proof that the Earth is shaped like a string or rope. </p><p>Even ignoring all the above rebuttals and debate amongst Christians about what the Bible "really" says, there's still the issue that if we are indeed meant to read the Bible this hyper-literally, then that would imply that when Jesus said we were to be "like doves," that he meant we were to grow feathers, eat mostly seed and fruit, regurgitate crop milk, and make mostly cooing noises. </p><p>The problem, of course, is that the very people who insist the Earth is flat because of (their) literal interpretation of the Bible, when pressed on the above points, retreat to a non-literal interpretation of those points, thereby undermining their whole argument that the Earth is flat because the Bible literally says it is. Essentially, they can <a href="/wiki/Cherry_picking" title="Cherry picking">pick and choose</a> what parts of the Bible are hyper literal or not. </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Islamic_flat_Earth_apologetics">Islamic flat Earth apologetics</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=54" title="Edit section: Islamic flat Earth apologetics">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:222px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Qibla_from_Yogyakarta_on_globe,_English_labels_paths.svg" class="image"><img alt="A globe, with a spherical triangle connecting Mecca, the North Pole, and Yogyakarta" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cb/Qibla_from_Yogyakarta_on_globe%2C_English_labels_paths.svg/250px-Qibla_from_Yogyakarta_on_globe%2C_English_labels_paths.svg.png" decoding="async" width="220" height="219" class="thumbimage" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cb/Qibla_from_Yogyakarta_on_globe%2C_English_labels_paths.svg/330px-Qibla_from_Yogyakarta_on_globe%2C_English_labels_paths.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cb/Qibla_from_Yogyakarta_on_globe%2C_English_labels_paths.svg/500px-Qibla_from_Yogyakarta_on_globe%2C_English_labels_paths.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="797" data-file-height="795" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Qibla_from_Yogyakarta_on_globe,_English_labels_paths.svg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>Muslims pray facing the <a href="/wiki/Kaaba" title="Kaaba">Kaaba</a> in <a href="/wiki/Mecca" title="Mecca">Mecca</a>. In the "flat-Earth map" the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qibla" class="extiw" title="wp:Qibla" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Qibla">Qibla</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> will not consistently point to the Kaaba.<sup id="cite_ref-36" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-36">[31]</a></sup></div></div></div> <p>Some <a href="/wiki/Islamic_fundamentalism" class="mw-redirect" title="Islamic fundamentalism">Islamic fundamentalists</a> possibly believe the Earth is flat, using a literal interpretation of several <a href="/wiki/Qur%27an" title="Qur'an">Qur'an</a> verses. In fact, <a href="/wiki/Medieval" class="mw-redirect" title="Medieval">medieval</a> Muslim scholars, like Christians of the same era, readily accepted Greco-Roman astronomy and used a Ptolemaic <a href="/wiki/Geocentric" class="mw-redirect" title="Geocentric">geocentric</a> model of the universe with a spherical Earth.<sup id="cite_ref-37" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-37">[32]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-38" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-38">[33]</a></sup> This would make modern Islamic flat Earth apologetics a <i>step backwards</i>. In 1966 the supreme religious authority of <a href="/wiki/Saudi_Arabia" title="Saudi Arabia">Saudi Arabia</a>, Sheik <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abd_al-Aziz_Bin_Baz" class="extiw" title="wp:Abd al-Aziz Bin Baz" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Abd al-Aziz Bin Baz">Abd al-Aziz Bin Baz</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> is rumored to have declared "The Earth is flat. Whoever claims it is round is an <a href="/wiki/Atheist" class="mw-redirect" title="Atheist">atheist</a> deserving of punishment." However historians such as Robert Lacey believe that this quote was misinterpreted (and that Ibn Baaz was actually asserting that the <a href="/wiki/Modern_geocentrism" class="mw-redirect" title="Modern geocentrism">Earth doesn't orbit around the Sun</a> — but not that the Earth was flat). </p><p>Mohammed Yusuf, founder of terrorist group <a href="/wiki/Boko_Haram" title="Boko Haram">Boko Haram</a>, stated that the <a href="/wiki/Theory_of_Evolution" class="mw-redirect" title="Theory of Evolution">Theory of Evolution</a> as well as spherical Earth teachings should be rejected because they are against <a href="/wiki/Islam" title="Islam">Islam</a>.<sup id="cite_ref-39" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-39">[34]</a></sup> In a 2007 TV debate, an <a href="/wiki/Iraq" title="Iraq">Iraqi</a> Astronomer, Fadil Al-Sa'd, tried hard to push the ideas that the Earth is flat and <b>Qur'an</b>ic verses also support that the Sun (also flat) is much smaller than Earth and <a href="/wiki/Geocentrism" title="Geocentrism">revolves around it</a>.<sup id="cite_ref-40" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-40">[35]</a></sup> </p><p>As in <i>all</i> cases of proof-via-scripture, it's just a question of <a href="/wiki/Shoehorning" title="Shoehorning">making flat-earthery fit</a> by <a href="/wiki/Cherry_picking" title="Cherry picking">cherry picking</a> your preferred translation so it fits your pre-existing beliefs. </p> <h3><span id="Appeals_to_the_Qur'an"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Appeals_to_the_Qur.27an">Appeals to the Qur'an</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=55" title="Edit section: Appeals to the Qur'an">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:222px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Islamic_cosmology.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/67/Islamic_cosmology.jpg/220px-Islamic_cosmology.jpg" decoding="async" width="220" height="318" class="thumbimage" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/67/Islamic_cosmology.jpg/330px-Islamic_cosmology.jpg 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/67/Islamic_cosmology.jpg/440px-Islamic_cosmology.jpg 2x" data-file-width="476" data-file-height="687" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Islamic_cosmology.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_cosmology" class="extiw" title="wp:Islamic cosmology" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Islamic cosmology">Islamic cosmology</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakariya_al-Qazwini" class="extiw" title="wp:Zakariya al-Qazwini" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Zakariya al-Qazwini">Zekeriya Kazvinî</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>. The cosmic bull bears (<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kujata" class="extiw" title="wp:Kujata" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Kujata">Kujata</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>) the earth-disk (rimmed by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Qaf" class="extiw" title="wp:Mount Qaf" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Mount Qaf">Mount Qaf</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>) and stands on the fish (<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahamut" class="extiw" title="wp:Bahamut" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Bahamut">Bahamut</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>).</div></div></div> <p><b><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Qur%27an/The_Cave#Qur.27an_18:47" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Qur'an/The Cave">Qur'an 18:47</a></b> </p> <dl><dd><i>And (remember) the Day We shall cause the mountains to pass away (like clouds of dust), and you will see the Earth as a <b>levelled plain</b>, and we shall gather them all together so as to leave not one of them behind.</i></dd></dl> <p>The Muhsin Khan and Shakir translation seem to use "levelled plain"; other translations, apart from Yusuf Ali, which says "level stretch" rather than "levelled plain", which clearly suggests that <s>God is f@#king punching mountains flat like the badass he is</s> the Earth is a disc. </p><p><b><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Qur%27an/Ta_Ha#Qur.27an_20:53" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Qur'an/Ta Ha">Qur'an 20:53</a></b> </p> <dl><dd><i>Who has made earth for you <b>like a bed</b> (spread out); and has opened roads (ways and paths etc.) for you therein; and has sent down water (rain) from the sky. And We have brought forth with it various kinds of vegetation.</i></dd></dl> <p>Translations again disagree on this. Like a "carpet" and like a "cradle" are also popular. </p><p><b><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Qur%27an/The_Embellishment#Qur.27an_43:10" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Qur'an/The Embellishment">Qur'an 43:10</a></b> </p> <dl><dd><i>Who has made for you the earth <b>like a bed</b>, and has made for you roads therein, in order that you may find your way.</i></dd></dl> <p>Other translations of this "like a bed" indicate that it's metaphorical, with "resting place" being the most popular use. The Dr. Ghali translation still uses "cradle" in place of bed. </p> <dl><dt><b><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Qur%27an/The_Embellishment#Qur.27an_43:38" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Qur'an/The Embellishment">Qur'an 43:38</a></b></dt></dl> <dl><dd><i>Till, when (such a one) comes to Us, he says [to his Qarîn (Satan / devil companion)] "Would that between me and you were the distance of the two easts (or the <b>east and west</b>)" a worst (type of) companion (indeed)!</i></dd></dl> <p>One presumes that this is a tacit admission that there is an absolute point marked "east" and a point marked "west" which isn't possible on a globe because it wraps around. It's not entirely possible on a flat Earth, either as there is no fixed reference. In <a href="/wiki/Terry_Pratchett" title="Terry Pratchett">Terry Pratchett</a>'s <i><a href="/wiki/Discworld" class="mw-redirect" title="Discworld">Discworld</a></i>, set on a flat disc, they use radial co-ordinates of "hubward" (meaning toward the centre) "rimward" (towards the outside) and "turnwise" and "widdershins" for clockwise and counterclockwise respectively. Analogous with east and west on a globe, there are no fixed points on this reference frame. </p><p><b><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Qur%27an/The_Tidings#Qur.27an_78:6" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Qur'an/The Tidings">Qur'an 78:6</a></b> </p> <dl><dd><i>Have We not made the earth as a <b>bed</b>,</i></dd></dl> <p>Only Muhsin Khan says "bed". The rest are "expanse" or variations of it. Dr Ghali continues with "cradle". One has to ask, if someone walked up to you and said that the Earth is like a bed, wouldn't one usually think they meant it was a small, warm, and comfortable thing you sleep in and which a parent lovingly prepares for their child? "Flat" is usually quite far down the list of words associated with beds, and indeed if one wanted to describe something as flat, they usually pick something much closer to two-dimensional, such as parchment. </p><p><b><a href="/wiki/RationalWiki:Annotated_Qur%27an/Those_Who_Pull_Out#Qur.27an_79:30" title="RationalWiki:Annotated Qur'an/Those Who Pull Out">Qur'an 79:30</a></b> </p> <dl><dd><i>And after that He <b>spread</b> the earth;</i></dd></dl> <p>Ironically, the flat-earthers would have been better off with Dr Ghali here, as he is less ambiguous about it: "<i>And the earth, after that He <b>flattened</b> it (for life).</i>" </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="The_irony_strikes_back">The irony strikes back</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=56" title="Edit section: The irony strikes back">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <div role="note" class="hatnote">See the main article on this topic: <a href="/wiki/Irony" title="Irony">Irony</a></div> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Faking_photos">Faking photos</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=57" title="Edit section: Faking photos">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:177px;"><a href="/wiki/File:FEmeme.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="/w/images/thumb/9/90/FEmeme.jpg/175px-FEmeme.jpg" decoding="async" width="175" height="131" class="thumbimage" srcset="/w/images/thumb/9/90/FEmeme.jpg/263px-FEmeme.jpg 1.5x, /w/images/thumb/9/90/FEmeme.jpg/350px-FEmeme.jpg 2x" data-file-width="480" data-file-height="360" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:FEmeme.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>And the original Mars photo can be found where?</div></div></div> <p>Some flat-earthers, who dismiss all photographs of space as fake ― without giving any criteria for what would constitute a genuine one, other than <a href="/wiki/Argument_from_personal_incredulity" class="mw-redirect" title="Argument from personal incredulity">incredulity</a> ― have been known to use deceptive means for making their case. Essentially, they have done the very same thing that they accuse others of doing. The image at the right is among the first that one finds upon searching for “flat Earth” in Google Images. </p><p>Convincing, right? Not so fast. The alleged photo cannot be found in the <a href="/wiki/NASA" title="NASA">NASA</a> archives, because it was done by <a href="/wiki/YouTube" title="YouTube">YouTube</a> user Danny Wilten. It just showed how the <a href="/wiki/Mars" title="Mars">Martian</a> landscapes captured by spatial probes <i>could</i> be photoshopped from one taken in <a href="/wiki/Ireland" title="Ireland">Ireland</a>, not that such a thing actually <i>had</i> taken place.<sup id="cite_ref-41" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-41">[36]</a></sup> To date, no photo of <a href="/wiki/Mars" title="Mars">Mars</a> has been shown to correspond to one taken on <a href="/wiki/Earth" title="Earth">Earth</a>,<sup id="cite_ref-42" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-42">[37]</a></sup> which would be the relevant proof. But it also raises the question, what exactly do these space deniers expect to see on other worlds? Do they expect other rocky planets to be radically different from barren places on Earth? But more importantly, if these photos are so evidently fake, why bother lying? And even if they are fake, it doesn't necessarily mean that the Earth is flat. Absence of evidence doesn't mean evidence of absence. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Faking_quotes">Faking quotes</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=58" title="Edit section: Faking quotes">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>Since there is nobody in the actual scientific community supporting a flat Earth there is a need for the flat Earth community to <s><a href="/wiki/Cherrypicking" class="mw-redirect" title="Cherrypicking">cherry-pick</a></s> quote anybody important for an <a href="/wiki/Argument_from_authority" title="Argument from authority">argument from authority</a>. And who no other than <a href="/wiki/Nikola_Tesla" title="Nikola Tesla">Nikola Tesla</a>! The most cited scientist by/for <a href="/wiki/Cranks" class="mw-redirect" title="Cranks">cranks</a>! In 2016, flat-earthers started to share this "quote" from Tesla: </p> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>Earth is a realm, it is not a planet. It is not an object, therefore, it has no edge. Earth would be more easily defined as a system environment. Earth is also a machine, it is a Tesla coil. The sun and moon are powered wirelessly with the electromagnetic field (the Aether). This field also suspends the celestial spheres with electo-magnetic levitation. Electromag levitation disproves gravity because the only force you need to counter is the electromagnetic force, not gravity. Though free to think and act, we are held together, like the stars in the firmament, with ties inseparable.<br /><i>Though free to think and act, we are held together like the stars in the firmament, with ties inseparable. These ties cannot be seen, but we can feel them, each of us is only part of a whole.</i></div> </td></tr> </tbody></table> <p>While the last sentences <i>in italics</i> are from Tesla, the rest of the quote is actually from some random Facebook guy called ‘Darrell Fox’. However, this hasn't stopped flatties from believing and sharing this false quote. Also, needless to say really but, Tesla was not a flathead.<sup id="cite_ref-43" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-43">[38]</a></sup> </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Using_spherical_Earth_mathematics">Using spherical Earth mathematics</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=59" title="Edit section: Using spherical Earth mathematics">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:302px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Dirth_app_obliquity.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="/w/images/thumb/e/ef/Dirth_app_obliquity.jpg/300px-Dirth_app_obliquity.jpg" decoding="async" width="300" height="224" class="thumbimage" srcset="/w/images/thumb/e/ef/Dirth_app_obliquity.jpg/450px-Dirth_app_obliquity.jpg 1.5x, /w/images/thumb/e/ef/Dirth_app_obliquity.jpg/600px-Dirth_app_obliquity.jpg 2x" data-file-width="2078" data-file-height="1554" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Dirth_app_obliquity.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>Screenshot of the source code in Flat Earth Dave's app reveals the code uses the Earth obliquity (axial tilt) in it's code.</div></div></div> <p>In his video "<i>Flat Earth Dave's App Massive Security Breach</i>" Michael Toon revealed he had been sent a <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_engineering#Software" class="extiw" title="wp:Reverse engineering" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Reverse_engineering#Software">decompiled</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> version of Flat Earth Dave's app <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.flatearthsun">Flat Earth Sun & Moon Clock</a>. The app's friend finder feature was found to determine the distance of friends by using the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haversine_formula" class="extiw" title="wp:Haversine formula" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Haversine_formula">Haversine formula</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> which "<i>determines the great-circle distance between two points on a <b>sphere</b> given their longitudes and latitudes.</i>" This proves Flat Earth Dave is fully aware of the Earth being a globe. The decompiled source code also revealed a plethora of security issues that affected all of its 203,793 users.<sup id="cite_ref-44" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-44">[39]</a></sup> These issues were also analyzed by Dave McKeegan two weeks later.<sup id="cite_ref-45" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-45">[40]</a></sup> McKeegan showed source code from the app that uses the constant <code>OBLIQUITY = 0.40927971</code> which <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=earth%27s+axial+tilt+in+radians">is</a> the Earth's <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axial_tilt" class="extiw" title="wp:Axial tilt" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Axial_tilt">obliquity (axial tilt)</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> in radians. </p><p>Another example of flatties using spherical Earth mathematics is the flat-earther <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://adl.place/shanes-fe-model">Shane St Pierre's model</a>, which is basically an outright <a href="/wiki/Plagiarism" title="Plagiarism">plagiarized</a> copy-paste of <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://walter.bislins.ch/bloge/index.asp?page=Flat+Earth+Dome+Model">Walter Bislins' Flat Earth Dome Model</a>, both code and text. Flat Earth debunker JB Aerospace has not only shown in Shane's plagiarized code uses heliocentric parameters such as <code>RadiusEarth: 6371.0, // km</code> and <code>DistSun: 149600000.0, // km</code> but JPL ephemerides, which are NASA's calculations of the orbits of celestial objects based on observations that flat-earthers reject (such us spacecraft observations), and physical models which flat-earthers also reject (like Newtonian physics).<sup id="cite_ref-46" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-46">[41]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-47" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-47">[42]</a></sup> Walter not only noticed and called out Shane for doing a "flat Earth <a href="/wiki/James_Somerton" title="James Somerton">James Somerton</a>" but he updated his simulator by adding those previous heliocentric parameters as variables, which if it were changed then "the App fails and makes wrong predictions", like with the Final Experiment for example. (See: <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://walter.bislins.ch/bloge/index.asp?page=Flat+Earth+Dome+Model+only+works+Based+on+the+Heliocentric+Model">Flat Earth Dome Model only works Based on the Heliocentric Model</a>). </p> <h3><span id="Insecurity_for_you,_insecurity_for_me"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Insecurity_for_you.2C_insecurity_for_me">Insecurity for you, insecurity for me</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=60" title="Edit section: Insecurity for you, insecurity for me">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>In his Feb. 7, 2025 follow-up video<sup id="cite_ref-48" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-48">[43]</a></sup> Michael Toon revealed a security researcher had tried to report the app's vulnerabilities to Weiss, but the support email Weiss had given Google did not exist. Toon also showed the app claims to collect no data at all, but it clearly did collect PII. It thus violates both Google's ToS, and GDPR, especially as the server is hosted in Finland. Weiss misrepresented the publicly accessible data as "hacker who had gotten into the API, and he claimed all leaked data was publicly shared with other users" except the password. Weiss claimed they had changed everyone's passwords and notified users about the issue. Weiss called the whole thing a "nothing burger by anti-flat Earth trolls". Instead of looking into mirror about his failure to deploy <b>any</b>, let alone <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argon2" class="extiw" title="wp:Argon2" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Argon2">modern password hashing practices</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> Weiss blamed users, who might have re-used the password in other services. </p><p>Next, Toon showed the application included the user's location inside every uploaded packet, even if the user did not opt-in to the app's friend finder feature, and that this information is tied to the user's name and email without their consent. He showed an e-mail by Weiss where he blamed globe Earth proponent "trolls" for the data breach. Weiss claimed to have "enlisted an A-Team that had fixed the security problems, and prevented the use of the service's API. When Toon invited Weiss to join a live stream event to defend his app, Weiss responded with a cease and desist notice which basically threatened Toon with a SLAPP lawsuit. The demands were to "<i>Cease and desist from making or promoting false statements regarding the breach</i>", and "<i>retract any prior statements that falsely suggest more than 100 users were compromised.</i>" </p><p>According to Toon, the following day (on Oct. 17, 2024) Weiss received complaint on X from user who had received same reset password over email. This is wrong on so many levels. The user is never supposed to receive a password over email. They should be sent a link with a rapidly expiring token that allows changing the password. As Toon commented to the user, it was only possible if the server still stored the passwords in plaintext, i.e. without any protection. Weiss later sent a new message to his users telling them their passwords were changed, but they could continue the current app session without logging back in with the new password. Toon then revealed the reason the app could do that, was the app doesn't perform password verification even upon new connections that lacks the session token. Instead, merely spoofing the <code>user_id</code> or the <code>device_id</code> of a user, was enough to login to someone else's account, read their messages, or impersonate them in the conversations. Furthermore, both the <code>user_id</code> and the <code>device_id</code> were available via the public API meaning what the server accepted as a password, was available on the server even if passwords were hashed. Another massive issue Toon highlighted, was the app's location accuracy was so high it allowed determining many users' home addresses. Weiss' "mitigation" strategy to these issues was obfuscation: he only changed the API domain name. He also put the service behind Cloudflare, which only protects from DoS attacks — a non-issue. </p><p>Finally, to highlight the absolutely batshit crazy level of lack of security, <b>Weiss' included his personal $DOME shit-coin PRIVATE KEY in the source code of the application, that he shipped to his 200,000+ users.</b> </p><p>On Feb. 6, 2025, after the industry-standard 90 day notice period, Toon and his team of security professionals <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://github.com/globesec/flatearthsun_public">published their findings on GitHub</a>. </p><p>For now, <b>all the vulnerabilities remained unfixed.</b> </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Antisemitism">Antisemitism</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=61" title="Edit section: Antisemitism">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>Flat-earthers have often complained that <a href="/wiki/NASA" title="NASA">NASA</a> had ex-<a href="/wiki/Nazi" class="mw-redirect" title="Nazi">Nazi</a> collaborators working for them, such as <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wernher_von_Braun" class="extiw" title="wp:Wernher von Braun" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Wernher von Braun">Wernher von Braun</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>. This was indeed true (see <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Paperclip" class="extiw" title="wp:Operation Paperclip" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Operation Paperclip">Operation Paperclip</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>)<sup id="cite_ref-49" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-49">[44]</a></sup> but ultimately this is a poor <i><a href="/wiki/Reductio_ad_Hitlerum" class="mw-redirect" title="Reductio ad Hitlerum">reductio ad Hitlerum</a></i> argument in the end: "Why should I trust a space agency on its topics of expertise, if it also has <a href="/wiki/Antisemitism" title="Antisemitism">antisemites</a> in it?"<sup id="cite_ref-50" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-50">[note 6]</a></sup> Fortunately, almost all those scientists are dead (or retired), so that worry is unsubstantiated. However, the irony is that, bizarrely, many popular flat-earthers have spread some kind of antisemitic conspiracies themselves.<sup id="cite_ref-51" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-51">[45]</a></sup> So much so that <i><a href="/wiki/Answers_in_Genesis" title="Answers in Genesis">Answers in Genesis</a></i> (in an astounding <a href="/wiki/Stopped_clock" title="Stopped clock">stopped clock</a> moment) noticed this too.<sup id="cite_ref-:11_52-0" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-:11-52">[46]</a></sup> And even to the point of <a href="/wiki/Flat_Earth#Faking_photos" title="Flat Earth">faking pictures</a> of <a href="/wiki/Hitler" class="mw-redirect" title="Hitler">Hitler</a> being a flat-earther! No kidding: </p> <ul class="gallery mw-gallery-traditional"> <li class="gallerybox" style="width: 155px"><div style="width: 155px"> <div class="thumb" style="width: 150px;"><div style="margin:15px auto;"><a href="/wiki/File:Flerf_Hitler_1.png" class="image"><img alt="Flerf Hitler 1.png" src="/w/images/thumb/b/b8/Flerf_Hitler_1.png/119px-Flerf_Hitler_1.png" decoding="async" width="119" height="120" srcset="/w/images/thumb/b/b8/Flerf_Hitler_1.png/179px-Flerf_Hitler_1.png 1.5x, /w/images/thumb/b/b8/Flerf_Hitler_1.png/238px-Flerf_Hitler_1.png 2x" data-file-width="803" data-file-height="809" /></a></div></div> <div class="gallerytext"> </div> </div></li> <li class="gallerybox" style="width: 155px"><div style="width: 155px"> <div class="thumb" style="width: 150px;"><div style="margin:34px auto;"><a href="/wiki/File:Gettyimages-2663043-2048x2048.jpg" class="image"><img alt="Gettyimages-2663043-2048x2048.jpg" src="/w/images/thumb/b/b4/Gettyimages-2663043-2048x2048.jpg/120px-Gettyimages-2663043-2048x2048.jpg" decoding="async" width="120" height="82" srcset="/w/images/thumb/b/b4/Gettyimages-2663043-2048x2048.jpg/180px-Gettyimages-2663043-2048x2048.jpg 1.5x, /w/images/thumb/b/b4/Gettyimages-2663043-2048x2048.jpg/240px-Gettyimages-2663043-2048x2048.jpg 2x" data-file-width="2048" data-file-height="1401" /></a></div></div> <div class="gallerytext"> </div> </div></li> <li class="gallerybox" style="width: 155px"><div style="width: 155px"> <div class="thumb" style="width: 150px;"><div style="margin:23.5px auto;"><a href="/wiki/File:HE_KNEW....webp" class="image"><img alt="HE KNEW....webp" src="/w/images/thumb/d/d9/HE_KNEW....webp/120px-HE_KNEW....webp.png" decoding="async" width="120" height="103" srcset="/w/images/thumb/d/d9/HE_KNEW....webp/180px-HE_KNEW....webp.png 1.5x, /w/images/thumb/d/d9/HE_KNEW....webp/240px-HE_KNEW....webp.png 2x" data-file-width="500" data-file-height="430" /></a></div></div> <div class="gallerytext"> </div> </div></li> <li class="gallerybox" style="width: 155px"><div style="width: 155px"> <div class="thumb" style="width: 150px;"><div style="margin:24.5px auto;"><a href="/wiki/File:Adolf-hitler-at-the-wolfs-lair-headquarters-1943-FD83D4.jpg" class="image"><img alt="Adolf-hitler-at-the-wolfs-lair-headquarters-1943-FD83D4.jpg" src="/w/images/thumb/4/4a/Adolf-hitler-at-the-wolfs-lair-headquarters-1943-FD83D4.jpg/120px-Adolf-hitler-at-the-wolfs-lair-headquarters-1943-FD83D4.jpg" decoding="async" width="120" height="101" srcset="/w/images/thumb/4/4a/Adolf-hitler-at-the-wolfs-lair-headquarters-1943-FD83D4.jpg/180px-Adolf-hitler-at-the-wolfs-lair-headquarters-1943-FD83D4.jpg 1.5x, /w/images/thumb/4/4a/Adolf-hitler-at-the-wolfs-lair-headquarters-1943-FD83D4.jpg/240px-Adolf-hitler-at-the-wolfs-lair-headquarters-1943-FD83D4.jpg 2x" data-file-width="1300" data-file-height="1090" /></a></div></div> <div class="gallerytext"> </div> </div></li> </ul> <p>Here are some examples: </p> <ul><li>Edward Hendrie, who in his book <i>The Greatest Lie on Earth: Proof That Our World Is Not a Moving Globe</i> constantly blames Jews, "communists" and "Zionists" for everything, who "control the mass media, which they use to propagandize the people into pushing the politicians into doing their bidding against God and his anointed"<sup id="cite_ref-:11_52-1" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-:11-52">[46]</a></sup> (he may as well have titled his book <i><a href="/wiki/Mein_Kampf" class="mw-redirect" title="Mein Kampf">Mein Kampf</a> 2.0</i>). Hendrie has also written two entire books accusing jews of replacing "God's commands with Satan's Babylonian dogma" by founding communists and rising Hitler into power (we kid you not)<sup id="cite_ref-53" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-53">[47]</a></sup> and ordering <a href="/wiki/9/11" title="9/11">9/11</a>...<sup id="cite_ref-54" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-54">[48]</a></sup> He is an <a href="/wiki/Antivaxxer" class="mw-redirect" title="Antivaxxer">antivaxxer</a> too.<sup id="cite_ref-55" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-55">[49]</a></sup></li></ul> <div class="thumb tright"><div class="thumbinner" style="width:152px;"><a href="/wiki/File:Who_will_prevail.jpg" class="image"><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ef/Who_will_prevail.jpg/250px-Who_will_prevail.jpg" decoding="async" width="150" height="227" class="thumbimage" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ef/Who_will_prevail.jpg/330px-Who_will_prevail.jpg 2x" data-file-width="676" data-file-height="1024" /></a> <div class="thumbcaption"><div class="magnify"><a href="/wiki/File:Who_will_prevail.jpg" class="internal" title="Enlarge"></a></div>Antisemitic poster used in Eric Dubay's YouTube video <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/-Ax_YpQsy88?t=6991"><i>200 Proofs Earth Is Not a Spinning Ball</i></a>.</div></div></div> <ul><li>Yoga instructor <a href="/wiki/Eric_Dubay" title="Eric Dubay">Eric Dubay</a>'s infamous YouTube video <i>200 Proofs Earth Is Not a Spinning Ball</i> mentions <i><a href="/wiki/The_Protocols_of_the_Elders_of_Zion" class="mw-redirect" title="The Protocols of the Elders of Zion">The Protocols of the Elders of Zion</a></i> in his 198<sup>th</sup> "proof",<sup id="cite_ref-56" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-56">[50]</a></sup> features literal "<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Anti-Masonic_Exhibition" class="extiw" title="wp:Grand Anti-Masonic Exhibition" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Grand Anti-Masonic Exhibition">Grand Anti-Masonic Exhibition</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>" propaganda posters and mentions the antisemitic book "Freemasonery and Judaism" of <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A9on_de_Poncins" class="extiw" title="wp:Léon de Poncins" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Léon de Poncins">Léon de Poncins</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>.<sup id="cite_ref-57" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-57">[51]</a></sup> He is also a <a href="/wiki/Holocaust_denier" class="mw-redirect" title="Holocaust denier">Holocaust denier</a> <sup id="cite_ref-58" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-58">[52]</a></sup> who claims "Jewish-controlled mainstream media" has "painted an evil picture of Hitler"<sup id="cite_ref-59" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-59">[53]</a></sup> and wrote a rap about it:</li></ul> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>What you see? Was I right?<br />The Earth’s fucking flat - <a href="/wiki/Holocaust_denial" title="Holocaust denial">holocaust denied</a><br /><a href="/wiki/Hitler" class="mw-redirect" title="Hitler">Hitler</a> was cool and not a bad guy<br />Talmudic Jews have control of your mind</div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—<a href="/wiki/Eric_Dubay" title="Eric Dubay">Eric Dubay</a> - <i><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://genius.com/Eric-dubay-once-you-go-flat-rap-lyrics">Once You Go Flat Rap</a>"</i></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table><p>Twice! (which it isn't a lot but it's weird he did it twice, right?) </p><table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>Nazis took on the Jews and they lost<br />Germany knew just exactly what it’d cost<br />They made the ultimate sacrifice for us<br />Their voices are screaming from the grave listen up<br />Hitler shut down the Rothschild banks!</div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">——Eric Dubay - <i><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://genius.com/Eric-dubay-goyim-revolution-lyrics">Goyim Revolution</a>"</i></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table> <ul><li>In <a href="/wiki/Joe_Rogan" title="Joe Rogan">Joe Rogan</a>'s podcast, the flat-earther Eddie Bravo hints that there's a worldwide Jewish "<a href="/wiki/Globalist" class="mw-redirect" title="Globalist">globalist</a>" conspiracy.<sup id="cite_ref-60" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-60">[54]</a></sup></li> <li>TV personality and social media influencer <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tila_Tequila" class="extiw" title="wp:Tila Tequila" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Tila Tequila">Tila Tequila</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> expressed her belief in flat Earth<sup id="cite_ref-61" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-61">[55]</a></sup> and antisemitism many,<sup id="cite_ref-62" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-62">[56]</a></sup> many,<sup id="cite_ref-63" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-63">[57]</a></sup> MANY,<sup id="cite_ref-64" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-64">[58]</a></sup> times.</li> <li>The Argentinian <a href="/wiki/New_World_Order" title="New World Order">New World Order</a>, <a href="/wiki/9/11_truther" class="mw-redirect" title="9/11 truther">9/11 truther</a>, flat-earther conspiracy theorist Iru Landucci cited the (well-known antisemitic hoax) book "<a href="/wiki/The_Protocols_of_the_Elders_of_Zion" class="mw-redirect" title="The Protocols of the Elders of Zion">The Protocols of the Elders of Zion</a>" in one of his conferences.<sup id="cite_ref-65" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-65">[59]</a></sup></li> <li><sup id="cite_ref-66" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-66">[60]</a></sup> Flat Earth internet influencer "Kaleb.fe"<sup id="cite_ref-67" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-67">[61]</a></sup> has been called out in TikTok for sharing antisemitic content.<sup id="cite_ref-68" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-68">[62]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-69" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-69">[63]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-70" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-70">[64]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-71" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-71">[65]</a></sup> During the 2023 <a href="/wiki/Israel" title="Israel">Israel</a>–<a href="/wiki/Hamas" title="Hamas">Hamas</a> war Kaleb doubled down on the now <a href="/wiki/Elon_Musk#Twitter" title="Elon Musk">antisemitic-friendly social media</a>, owned by anti-flat Earth but <a href="/wiki/Elon_Musk#Antisemitism" title="Elon Musk">antisemitic sympathizer</a> <a href="/wiki/Elon_Musk" title="Elon Musk">Elon Musk</a>, formerly known as <a href="/wiki/Twitter" title="Twitter">Twitter</a>. He stated to "wake up my fellow brothers and sisters to flat Earth, after I will wake them up to the evil that is Jewry"<sup id="cite_ref-72" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-72">[66]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-73" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-73">[67]</a></sup> by quoting Hitler and sharing <a href="/wiki/BitChute" title="BitChute">BitChute</a>'s <a href="/wiki/Neo-Nazism" title="Neo-Nazism">neonazi</a> <a href="/wiki/Great_replacement" class="mw-redirect" title="Great replacement">great replacement</a> shitty documentary <i>Europa: The Last Battle</i>.<sup id="cite_ref-74" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-74">[68]</a></sup><sup id="cite_ref-75" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-75">[69]</a></sup></li> <li>Just <a href="/wiki/Owen_Benjamin" title="Owen Benjamin">Owen Benjamin</a>. No comments.</li> <li>Whoever <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/H110vCGvTmM?feature=shared&t=407">this guy</a> is.</li></ul> <p>In some way, this is unsurprising too, since a flat Earth would require some kind of <a href="/wiki/New_World_Order" title="New World Order">New World Order</a> conspiracy theory. They often land not far away from the oldest grand conspiracy in the book: the <a href="/wiki/International_Jewish_conspiracy" title="International Jewish conspiracy">International Jewish</a> / <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judeo-Masonic_conspiracy_theory" class="extiw" title="wp:Judeo-Masonic conspiracy theory" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Judeo-Masonic conspiracy theory">Judeo-Masonic conspiracy theory</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup>.<sup id="cite_ref-76" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-76">[70]</a></sup> After all, if a spherical Earth is fake, what else is fake? <a href="/wiki/Holocaust_denial" title="Holocaust denial">Maybe the Holocaust?</a> Am I right <a href="/wiki/B.o.B" title="B.o.B">B.o.B.</a>?<sup id="cite_ref-77" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-77">[71]</a></sup> </p> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>Do your research on <a href="/wiki/David_Irving" title="David Irving">David Irving</a><br /> <p><a href="/wiki/Joseph_Stalin" title="Joseph Stalin">Stalin</a> was way worse than <a href="/wiki/Adolf_Hitler" title="Adolf Hitler">Hitler</a><br /> </p> That’s why the <a href="/wiki/President_of_the_United_States" title="President of the United States">POTUS</a> gotta wear a kippah</div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—<a href="/wiki/B.o.B" title="B.o.B">B.o.B</a> - <i><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flatline_(B.o.B_song)" class="extiw" title="wp:Flatline (B.o.B song)" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Flatline (B.o.B song)">Flatline</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup></i><sup id="cite_ref-78" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-78">[72]</a></sup> <p class="mw-empty-elt"> </p> </cite></td></tr></tbody></table> <p>So if they were really worried about <a href="/wiki/Nazism" title="Nazism">Nazism</a>, they could excise the ones in their <s>cult</s> community.<sup id="cite_ref-79" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-79">[note 7]</a></sup> </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Common_counterarguments_that_do_not_refute_flat-earther_claims">Common counterarguments that do <i>not</i> refute flat-earther claims</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=62" title="Edit section: Common counterarguments that do not refute flat-earther claims">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>Just because the thing you're trying to prove happens to be correct doesn't necessarily mean that the "proof" you're trying to use is valid. As such, some of the arguments people use against flatheads have almost as little thought put into them as the ones the flatheads themselves use. Stay away from these arguments. <a href="/wiki/Inverse_stopped_clock" title="Inverse stopped clock">Inverse stopped clocks</a> will be handed out at the ticket booth. </p> <h3><span id="The_shadow_the_Earth_casts_on_the_Moon_is_round!"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="The_shadow_the_Earth_casts_on_the_Moon_is_round.21">The shadow the Earth casts on the Moon is round!</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=63" title="Edit section: The shadow the Earth casts on the Moon is round!">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>This one is more nuanced than it first appears, prohibitively so. Ordinary moon phases are caused by the Sun shining directly upon the lunar sphere from various angles: we see its horizon swivel around. Aristotle observed that during <i>eclipses</i> a bit of Earth gets in the way and casts a shadow on the moon that is <i>always</i> curved to some extent, from our perspective on Earth. </p> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>How else would eclipses of the moon show segments shaped as we see them? As it is, the shapes which the moon itself each month shows are of every kind straight, gibbous, and concave — but in eclipses the outline is always curved: and, since it is the interposition of the Earth that makes the eclipse, the form of this line will be caused by the form of the earth's surface, which is therefore spherical.</div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—Aristotle, <i>On the Heavens</i><sup id="cite_ref-80" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-80">[73]</a></sup></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p>On the other hand, for a coin held in front of a flashlight (flat Earth with Sun below, moon above): oblique lighting squashes <i>that</i> shadow more severely before warping further onto the same spherical moon. </p><p>Contrasting eccentricities to characterize fractions of Earth's silhouette isn't worth it.<sup id="cite_ref-81" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-81">[74]</a></sup> Much less entertaining the flat model where an always-above Sun emits <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://wiki.tfes.org/Lunar_Eclipse_due_to_Electromagnetic_Acceleration">upwardly-curved light</a> across the sky at the moon. </p> <h3><span id="Eratosthenes's_shadows_proved_a_round_Earth!"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Eratosthenes.27s_shadows_proved_a_round_Earth.21">Eratosthenes's shadows proved a round Earth!</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=64" title="Edit section: Eratosthenes's shadows proved a round Earth!">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>Eratosthenes's experiment assumed a Sun sufficiently large and distant that its rays are near-parallel when they reach earth. Guess what happens when you swap that for a small and near sun? </p><p>The experiment was <b>not</b> about the <b>shape</b> of the Earth. Earth was suspected to be spherical because of Earth's circular shadow on the Moon, and because ships were observed disappearing hull first. The experiment was about measuring the <b>radius</b> of the Earth assuming it was spherical. Eratosthenes calculated the Earth's circumference to be 250,000 stadia, or, 40,000 km, which is extremely close to the modern value of 40,070km. From that, he calculated the radius to be 6366 km, when the modern value is 6378km.<sup id="cite_ref-82" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-82">[75]</a></sup> </p> <h3><span id="But_the_moon_landing!"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="But_the_moon_landing.21">But the moon landing!</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=65" title="Edit section: But the moon landing!">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p><a href="/wiki/Moon_landing_hoax" title="Moon landing hoax">*cough*</a> </p> <h3><span id="Gravity_would_pull_a_disk_that_big_into_a_spherical_shape!"></span><span class="mw-headline" id="Gravity_would_pull_a_disk_that_big_into_a_spherical_shape.21">Gravity would pull a disk that big into a spherical shape!</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=66" title="Edit section: Gravity would pull a disk that big into a spherical shape!">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>If someone is dumb enough to deny a fact as basic and demonstrable as the shape of the Earth, then do you really think they're going to accept a concept as advanced as an intangible cosmic force that even <i>scientists</i> don't fully understand yet? People knew that things fell long before Newton, and those who thought to ask why came up with their own explanations. As it is, the most popular flathead explanation (that actually makes sense anyway) for spilled milk not hovering midair is that the Earth is constantly accelerating upward at 9.8m/s^2. </p> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Proof_by_humor">Proof by humor</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=67" title="Edit section: Proof by humor">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span><b>Me</b>: The Earth is 71% water<br /> <p><b>Scientist</b>: Yes. True.<br /> <b>Me</b>: And practically all of that water is uncarbonated<br /> <b>Scientist</b>: Okay, sure. Not sure where you're going with this but<br /> <b>Me</b>: So the Earth is flat<br /> <b>Scientist</b>: ...<br /> <b>Me</b>: ...<br /> <b>Scientist</b>: Listen here you little shit<sup id="cite_ref-83" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-83">[76]</a></sup> </p> </div> </td></tr> </tbody></table> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Reverse_Flat_Earth_conspiracy_theory">Reverse Flat Earth conspiracy theory</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=68" title="Edit section: Reverse Flat Earth conspiracy theory">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <p>Another crank belief that is gaining just as much, if not more, momentum in the tubes as the flat Earth itself is its mirror image conspiracy: the Reverse Flat Earth Conspiracy Theory (lame title, but we'll think of something else later). As you may have guessed, the idea here is that the flat Earth theory isn't merely false, it's actually a fake conspiracy that was made up by the powers that be to make "genuine" truth seekers look bad.<sup id="cite_ref-84" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-84">[77]</a></sup> Unsurprisingly, however, said clowns who make this unfounded claim often believe in other sorts of crankery that are almost as moronic as the flat Earth itself. Actually, if you haven't guessed, this is the whole <i>point</i>. The point is to <a href="/wiki/Straw_man" title="Straw man">knock down the flat Earth as "obviously" wrong</a> to give their own form of crankery credibility. At least one conspiracy loon who rejects the flat Earth even says <b>space itself</b> is a hoax!<sup id="cite_ref-85" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-85">[78]</a></sup> </p><p>In short: no, you do <i>not</i> get any bonus points for rejecting the flat Earth if you regurgitate other sorts of crankery and conspiracy bullshit. Looking cute like the kitten near the dinner table doesn't cut it, so don't try it. </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Helping_Flerfs">Helping Flerfs</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=69" title="Edit section: Helping Flerfs">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <table style="margin: auto; border-collapse:collapse; border-style:none; background-color:transparent;" class="cquote"> <tbody><tr> <td><div style="padding:4px 50px;position:relative;"><span style="position:absolute;left:10px;top:-6px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">“</span><span style="position:absolute;right:10px;bottom:-20px;z-index:1;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif;font-weight:bold;color:#B2B7F2;font-size:36px">”</span>I have a mental illness that makes me think that people will change their minds if I present the correct arguments with the appropriate facts and data.</div> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="padding:4px 10px 8px;font-size:smaller;line-height:1.6em;text-align:right;"><cite style="font-style:normal;position:relative;z-index:2">—@Dialectiks <sup id="cite_ref-86" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-86">[79]</a></sup></cite> </td></tr></tbody></table> <p>As with all grifts with a cult-like structure, there are two parties. Those making the T-shirts, and those buying them. The grifters selling the T-shirts can not be convinced to stop. Like Upton Sinclair said: "<i>It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it</i>." The grifters lack the skill set, job experience, and connections to maintain their current lavish lifestyle in honest jobs. They would also be giving up their <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_supply" class="extiw" title="wp:Narcissistic supply" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Narcissistic_supply">narcissistic supply</span></a>.<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> They've already lost the only thing they stood to lose: their reputation. Thus, they have zero incentive to look for something better out there. </p><p>Similarly, the marks, almost never wish to learn the truth. What is actually happening is something comparable to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiritual_bypass" class="extiw" title="wp:Spiritual bypass" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Spiritual_bypass">spiritual bypass</span></a>,<sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup> where the flerf is actively avoiding their mental health issues, difficult life situation, or dissatisfaction in life, by escaping into a fantasy world where they are <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://lastplacecomics.com/conspiracy-confidence/">the protagonist fighting "the real powers that be".</a> In this case, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/4okBkJUlMiI?feature=shared&t=2599">according to flerfs</a>, the ones that have hidden <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rckrnYw5sOA">free energy</a> <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/viewer?ll=24.202382317253253%2C13.551327710160194&z=2&mid=1PNd_sJagci84PyKmGC6M5VJtaLMEWxg&entry=yt">the Christian God</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2023/12/07/spirituality-among-americans/">spirituality</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://academic.oup.com/journals/pages/journals_a_to_z">scientific knowledge</a>, and <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/ET9nv1jpghY?feature=shared&t=10">easy</a> <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/OrVnWJ1iAlg?feature=shared&t=9">access</a> to <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.geologyforinvestors.com/mineral-resources-of-antarctica-its-only-a-matter-of-time/">hidden</a> natural resources that any average Joe can <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/xwsL3sPdmNU?feature=shared&t=7">just pick like dandelions</a>. Or <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0y4zYMYOrQ">not</a>.<sup id="cite_ref-87" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-87">[note 8]</a></sup> </p><p>The cult group has usually long since replaced any real friends and family, and led to loss of job and the place in the normal society. With nothing to go back to, majority of the flerfs would rather die, than accept their entire identity is based on a lie, and return to their void of objective reality. Thus, the marks are almost never available to be convinced. Especially via internet feuds. This is evident from when flerfs are asked "What would convince you that you're wrong?", their most common answer is "Nothing". This shows their belief is unfalsifiable both from the viewpoint of arguments (impossible requests and endless goal post shifting), and from the viewpoint of faith ("Flat Earth is Gods truth, and I choose to believe, and refuse the overwhelming counter-evidence"). Scammers have known since the late 19th century, that once the mark sees the scam as something that's going to make them better off, they can not be convinced by <i>knockers</i> (=debunkers). They refer to this state of mind the mark has, as <i>the fever</i>.<sup id="cite_ref-88" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-88">[80]</a></sup> </p><p>As the flat-earther Mark Sargent said, "<i>flat Earth is the last conspiracy people will believe</i>". This has some truth to it, in that were it true, everyone would have to be in on it against the flat-earthers. Flat Earth is also the boundary between "harmless" crankery, and political radicalization: For many, the next step was <a href="/wiki/QAnon" title="QAnon">QAnon</a>.<sup id="cite_ref-Olson_6-1" class="reference"><a href="#cite_note-Olson-6">[5]</a></sup> There are <a href="/wiki/Fractal_wrongness" title="Fractal wrongness">no woke flat-earthers</a>, and dedicating resources to help flerfs sends an awful message to every not-awful person that could use the help. </p><p>Flerf marks are the symptom of a failed education, social work, and mental healthcare systems, and thus at the root, the only solution starts with corrective public spending policy. </p> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="See_also">See also</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=70" title="Edit section: See also">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <div class="div-col columns column-count column-count-2" style="-moz-column-count: 2; -webkit-column-count: 2; column-count: 2;"> <ul><li><a href="/wiki/Bedford_Level_experiment" title="Bedford Level experiment">Bedford Level experiment</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Owen_Benjamin" title="Owen Benjamin">Owen Benjamin</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Cellular_cosmogony" title="Cellular cosmogony">Cellular cosmogony</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Fixedearth.com" title="Fixedearth.com">Fixedearth.com</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Flat_Earth_Society_(website)" title="Flat Earth Society (website)">Flat Earth Society (website)</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Geocentrism" title="Geocentrism">Geocentrism</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Hollow_Earth_Theory" class="mw-redirect" title="Hollow Earth Theory">Hollow Earth Theory</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Michael_Hughes" title="Michael Hughes">Michael Hughes</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/New_Swabia" title="New Swabia">New Swabia</a> — the part of Antarctica explored by Nazis</li> <li><a href="/wiki/Peter_Sweden" title="Peter Sweden">Peter Sweden</a></li> <li><i><a href="/wiki/Science_of_Discworld" class="mw-redirect" title="Science of Discworld">Science of Discworld</a></i></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Fun:Scientific_Geoterrapinism" title="Fun:Scientific Geoterrapinism">Fun:Scientific Geoterrapinism</a></li></ul></div> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Further_reading">Further reading</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=71" title="Edit section: Further reading">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Rebuttals_of_flat_Earth_conspiracies">Rebuttals of flat Earth conspiracies</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=72" title="Edit section: Rebuttals of flat Earth conspiracies">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <ul><li><i>The Globe: How the Earth Became Round</i>, James Hannam (Reaktion books, 2023) <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-178914758-2" title="Special:BookSources/978-178914758-2">ISBN 9781789147582</a></li> <li><i>Off the Edge: Flat Earthers, Conspiracy Culture, and Why People Will Believe Anything</i>, Kelly Weill (2022, Algonquin Books) <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/9781643752198" title="Special:BookSources/9781643752198">ISBN 9781643752198</a></li> <li><i>How to Talk to a Science Denier: Conversations with Flat Earthers, Climate Deniers, and Others Who Defy Reason</i>, Lee McIntyre (2022, MIT Press) <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/9780262545051" title="Special:BookSources/9780262545051">ISBN 9780262545051</a></li> <li><i>Weird Earth: Debunking Strange Ideas about Our Planet</i>, Donald R. Prothero and <a href="/wiki/Michael_Shermer" title="Michael Shermer">Michael Shermer</a> (2020, Red Lightning) <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-1684350612" title="Special:BookSources/978-1684350612">ISBN 978-1684350612</a></li> <li><i>When the Earth Was Flat. Studies in Ancient Greek and Chinese Cosmology</i>, Dirk L. Couprie (Springer, 2018) <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-3-319-97052-3" title="Special:BookSources/978-3-319-97052-3">ISBN 978-3-319-97052-3</a></li> <li><i>The Earth Is Not Flat</i>, Gordon S. Brooks (2016, Createspace) ‎<a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-1530207923" title="Special:BookSources/978-1530207923">ISBN 978-1530207923</a></li> <li><i>Flat Earth: The History of an Infamous Idea</i>, Christine Garwood (2008, Thomas Dunne books) ‎<a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-0312382087" title="Special:BookSources/978-0312382087">ISBN 978-0312382087</a></li> <li><i>Inventing the Flat Earth: Columbus and Modern Historians</i>, Jeffrey Burton Russell (1997) <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-0-275-95904-3" title="Special:BookSources/978-0-275-95904-3">ISBN 978-0-275-95904-3</a></li></ul> <h3><span class="mw-headline" id="Scientific_papers_against_a_flat_Earth">Scientific papers against a flat Earth</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=73" title="Edit section: Scientific papers against a flat Earth">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h3> <p>Yes. They do exist... Real scientist did in their free time what flat-earthers should have done in the first place: making predictions with their models. (Spoilers: they all fail). </p> <ul><li><style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r2708880">/* Errors processing stylesheet [[:Module:Citation/CS1/styles.css]] (rev 2708880): • Invalid or unsupported value for property ⧼code⧽background⧼/code⧽ at line 44 character 14. • Invalid or unsupported value for property ⧼code⧽background⧼/code⧽ at line 50 character 14. • Invalid or unsupported value for property ⧼code⧽background⧼/code⧽ at line 55 character 14. • Invalid or unsupported value for property ⧼code⧽background⧼/code⧽ at line 64 character 14. • Invalid or unsupported value for property ⧼code⧽color⧼/code⧽ at line 96 character 9. • Invalid or unsupported value for property ⧼code⧽color⧼/code⧽ at line 100 character 9. • Invalid media query at line 138 character 8. */ .mw-parser-output cite.citation{font-style:inherit;word-wrap:break-word}.mw-parser-output .citation q{quotes:"\"""\"""'""'"}.mw-parser-output .citation:target{background-color:rgba(0,127,255,0.133)}.mw-parser-output .id-lock-free.id-lock-free a{}.mw-parser-output .id-lock-limited.id-lock-limited a,.mw-parser-output .id-lock-registration.id-lock-registration a{}.mw-parser-output .id-lock-subscription.id-lock-subscription a{}.mw-parser-output .cs1-ws-icon a{}body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .id-lock-free a,body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .id-lock-limited a,body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .id-lock-registration a,body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .id-lock-subscription a,body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .cs1-ws-icon a{background-size:contain;padding:0 1em 0 0}.mw-parser-output .cs1-code{color:inherit;background:inherit;border:none;padding:inherit}.mw-parser-output .cs1-hidden-error{display:none}.mw-parser-output .cs1-visible-error{}.mw-parser-output .cs1-maint{display:none;color:#085;margin-left:0.3em}.mw-parser-output .cs1-kern-left{padding-left:0.2em}.mw-parser-output .cs1-kern-right{padding-right:0.2em}.mw-parser-output .citation .mw-selflink{font-weight:inherit}@media screen{.mw-parser-output .cs1-format{font-size:95%}html.skin-theme-clientpref-night .mw-parser-output .cs1-maint{color:#18911f}}</style><cite id="CITEREFBoyd2020" class="citation journal cs1">Boyd, John P. (2020-03-27). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://arxiv.org/pdf/2003.08541.pdf">"Meteorology and Oceanography on a Flat Earth"</a> <span class="cs1-format">(PDF)</span>. <i>arXiv:2003.08541 [physics]</i>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.jtitle=arXiv%3A2003.08541+%5Bphysics%5D&rft.atitle=Meteorology+and+Oceanography+on+a+Flat+Earth&rft.date=2020-03-27&rft.aulast=Boyd&rft.aufirst=John+P.&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Farxiv.org%2Fpdf%2F2003.08541.pdf&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></li> <li><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFBoyd2022" class="citation journal cs1">Boyd, John P. (2022-05-20). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://arxiv.org/pdf/2206.07491.pdf">"Polaris: The Mathematics of Navigation and the Shape of the Earth"</a> <span class="cs1-format">(PDF)</span>. <i>arXiv:2206.07491 [physics]</i>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.jtitle=arXiv%3A2206.07491+%5Bphysics%5D&rft.atitle=Polaris%3A+The+Mathematics+of+Navigation+and+the+Shape+of+the+Earth&rft.date=2022-05-20&rft.aulast=Boyd&rft.aufirst=John+P.&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Farxiv.org%2Fpdf%2F2206.07491.pdf&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></li> <li><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFde_MarezCorre2020" class="citation journal cs1">de Marez, Charly; Corre, Mathieu Le (2020-01-06). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://arxiv.org/abs/2001.01521">"Can the Earth be flat ? A physical oceanographer's perspective"</a>. <i>arXiv:2001.01521 [physics]</i>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.jtitle=arXiv%3A2001.01521+%5Bphysics%5D&rft.atitle=Can+the+Earth+be+flat+%3F+A+physical+oceanographer%27s+perspective&rft.date=2020-01-06&rft.aulast=de+Marez&rft.aufirst=Charly&rft.au=Corre%2C+Mathieu+Le&rft_id=http%3A%2F%2Farxiv.org%2Fabs%2F2001.01521&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></li> <li><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFTort2014" class="citation journal cs1">Tort, A. C. (2014). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://arxiv.org/abs/1305.0393">"An exercise on Gauss' law for gravitation: The Flat Earth model"</a>. <i>Physics Education</i>. <b>49</b> (6): <span class="nowrap">629–</span>631. <a href="/wiki/Doi_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="Doi (identifier)">doi</a>:<a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://doi.org/10.1088%2F0031-9120%2F49%2F6%2F629">10.1088/0031-9120/49/6/629</a>. <a href="/wiki/ISSN_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="ISSN (identifier)">ISSN</a> <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://search.worldcat.org/issn/0031-9120">0031-9120</a>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.jtitle=Physics+Education&rft.atitle=An+exercise+on+Gauss%27+law+for+gravitation%3A+The+Flat+Earth+model&rft.volume=49&rft.issue=6&rft.pages=%3Cspan+class%3D%22nowrap%22%3E629-%3C%2Fspan%3E631&rft.date=2014&rft_id=info%3Adoi%2F10.1088%2F0031-9120%2F49%2F6%2F629&rft.issn=0031-9120&rft.aulast=Tort&rft.aufirst=A.+C.&rft_id=http%3A%2F%2Farxiv.org%2Fabs%2F1305.0393&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></li> <li><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFKuziiRovenchak2019" class="citation journal cs1">Kuzii, Olena; Rovenchak, Andrij (2019-05-01). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1361-6404/ab0bba">"What the gravitation of a flat Earth would look like and why thus the Earth is not actually flat"</a>. <i>European Journal of Physics</i>. <b>40</b> (3): 035008. <a href="/wiki/Doi_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="Doi (identifier)">doi</a>:<a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://doi.org/10.1088%2F1361-6404%2Fab0bba">10.1088/1361-6404/ab0bba</a>. <a href="/wiki/ISSN_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="ISSN (identifier)">ISSN</a> <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://search.worldcat.org/issn/0143-0807">0143-0807</a>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.jtitle=European+Journal+of+Physics&rft.atitle=What+the+gravitation+of+a+flat+Earth+would+look+like+and+why+thus+the+Earth+is+not+actually+flat&rft.volume=40&rft.issue=3&rft.pages=035008&rft.date=2019-05-01&rft_id=info%3Adoi%2F10.1088%2F1361-6404%2Fab0bba&rft.issn=0143-0807&rft.aulast=Kuzii&rft.aufirst=Olena&rft.au=Rovenchak%2C+Andrij&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fiopscience.iop.org%2Farticle%2F10.1088%2F1361-6404%2Fab0bba&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></li></ul> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="External_links">External links</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=74" title="Edit section: External links">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <div class="div-col columns column-count column-count-2" style="-moz-column-count: 2; -webkit-column-count: 2; column-count: 2;"> <ul><li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern_flat_Earth_beliefs" class="extiw" title="wp:Modern flat Earth beliefs" rel="nofollow"><span style="color:#477979 !important;" title="Wikipedia: Modern flat Earth beliefs">Modern flat Earth beliefs</span></a><sup><img alt="" src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png" decoding="async" width="12" height="12" srcset="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/18px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 1.5x, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/24px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128" /></sup></li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://flatearthconference.com/">Flat Earth International Conference</a> <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://fe2017.com/">2017</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://fe2018.com/">2018</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://fe2019.com/">2019</a></li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20171024152120/http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/febible.htm">The Flat-Earth Bible</a> (archived copy)</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20241216060033/https://www.flatearthlunacy.com/">Flat Earth Lunacy</a> — a flat Earth debunking blog (archived copy)</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://flatearth.ws">FlatEarth.ws</a> — another flat Earth debunking blog</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.tfes.org/">The Flat Earth Society</a></li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://wiki.tfes.org/">The Flat Earth Wiki</a></li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.rogermwilcox.com/square_earth.html">The International Square Earth Society</a> (Note: This page is a deadpan parody)</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20190929134732/http://sonarz.com/is-the-earth-flat-we-think-so-and-heres-why-2/">Is the Earth flat?</a> (archived copy)</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/VNqNnUJVcVs">Vsauce</a> does a piece on the subject</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/2gFsOoKAHZg">hbomberguy</a> also did one</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.sacred-texts.com/earth/za/"><i>Zetetic Astronomy. Earth not a Globe</i></a> by Samuel Rowbotham, full text at the Internet Sacred Text Archive</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.mezzacotta.net/100proofs/">100 Proofs that the Earth is a Globe</a></li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/H110vCGvTmM">Flat Earth convention sketch</a></li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/JTfhYyTuT44&t">Folding Ideas, <i>In Search of A Flat Earth</i></a></li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://apollo.sese.asu.edu/ABOUT_SCANS/index.html">Apollo Image Archive</a></li> <li>Wikipedia archive of photos of <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Earth_from_space">Earth from space</a></li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/@ProfessorDaveExplains">Dave Farina</a> - See the 'Flat Earth Debunks' playlist</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/@The-Final-Experiment">TFE Expedition</a> - See 'The Final Experiments' playlist</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/@DaveMcKeegan">Dave McKeegan</a> - flat Earth debunker</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/@ConspiracyToonz">Michael Toon</a> - flat Earth debunker</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/@SciManDan">SciManDan</a> - flat Earth debunker</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/@RedsRhetoric">RedsRhetoric</a> - flat Earth debunker</li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/@Wolfie6020">Wolfie6020</a> - flat Earth debunker</li></ul></div> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="Notes">Notes</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=75" title="Edit section: Notes">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <div class="references-small" style="font-size:90%;"> <div class="mw-references-wrap"><ol class="references"> <li id="cite_note-3"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-3">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Flat-earthers are often referred to as <i>flerfs</i>, or <i>flatties</i>.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-7"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-7">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">To a newcomer the video will appear overreaching, but it ages like fine wine as you get familiar with the rabbit hole, that is, as you learn to understand the cult.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-8"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-8">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Each of us has 13.8 billion years more experience about being unalive, so, what's so special about death anyway?</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-9"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-9">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">This is similar to how QAnon's drops were "decoded" by the hivemind on imageboards to maintain engagement, and to come up with suitable evidence of the conspiracy.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-11"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-11">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">The flat Earth model is <a href="/wiki/Wronger_than_wrong" title="Wronger than wrong">wronger than wrong</a>, but still useful if you want to extract wealth from suckers.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-50"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-50">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Call us when NASA starts taking a position favorable to <i><a href="/wiki/Deutsche_Physik" title="Deutsche Physik">Deutsche Physik</a></i>, then we'll hear you out on this one.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-79"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-79">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">It seems that for many flat-earthers the problem with nazis is that they worked for NASA rather than they are nazis.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-87"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-87">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">To any flerf reading this thinking all of this is crazy: Try taking 30 days off the flat Earth world completely, and be alone with your thoughts about the state of your life and mental health. When you realize how uncomfortable you are, realize it proves the point: flat Earth is an escape and an excuse to procrastinate fixing all the things actually wrong with your life.</span> </li> </ol></div></div> <h2><span class="mw-headline" id="References">References</span><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Flat_Earth&action=edit&section=76" title="Edit section: References">edit</a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></h2> <div class="references-small" style="-moz-column-count:2; -webkit-column-count:2; column-count:2; font-size:80%;"> <div class="mw-references-wrap mw-references-columns"><ol class="references"> <li id="cite_note-1"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-1">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://dlisted.com/2016/01/25/rapper-b-o-b-is-a-flat-earth-truther/#more-202474">"Rapper B.o.B Is A Flat Earth Truther"</a>, DListed 1.15.16.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-2"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-2">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.scientificamerican.com/podcast/episode/flat-earthers-what-they-believe-and-why/">"Flat Earthers: What They Believe and Why"</a>. <i>Scientific American</i>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=Scientific+American&rft.atitle=Flat+Earthers%3A+What+They+Believe+and+Why&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.scientificamerican.com%2Fpodcast%2Fepisode%2Fflat-earthers-what-they-believe-and-why%2F&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-4"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-4">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.universetoday.com/95959/awesome-map-of-space-agencies-around-the-world/">Awesome Map of Space Agencies Around the World</a> by Nancy Atkinson (June 26, 2012) <i>Universe Today</i>.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-5"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-5">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFDolan2023" class="citation web cs1">Dolan, Eric W. (2023-06-14). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.psypost.org/2023/06/flat-earthers-are-overconfident-about-their-own-scientific-knowledge-but-exhibit-low-scientific-literacy-study-finds-165795">"Flat-earthers are overconfident about their own scientific knowledge but exhibit low scientific literacy, study finds"</a>. <i>PsyPost</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-06-14</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=PsyPost&rft.atitle=Flat-earthers+are+overconfident+about+their+own+scientific+knowledge+but+exhibit+low+scientific+literacy%2C+study+finds&rft.date=2023-06-14&rft.aulast=Dolan&rft.aufirst=Eric+W.&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.psypost.org%2F2023%2F06%2Fflat-earthers-are-overconfident-about-their-own-scientific-knowledge-but-exhibit-low-scientific-literacy-study-finds-165795&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-Olson-6"><span class="mw-cite-backlink">↑ <sup><a href="#cite_ref-Olson_6-0">5.0</a></sup> <sup><a href="#cite_ref-Olson_6-1">5.1</a></sup></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFOlson2020" class="citation web cs1">Olson, Dan (September 11, 2020). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTfhYyTuT44">"In Search Of A Flat Earth"</a>. Folding Ideas.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=unknown&rft.btitle=In+Search+Of+A+Flat+Earth&rft.pub=Folding+Ideas&rft.date=2020-09-11&rft.aulast=Olson&rft.aufirst=Dan&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DJTfhYyTuT44&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-10"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-10">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Answers in Science on <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://chem.tufts.edu/answersinscience/relativityofwrong.htm/">The Relativity of Wrong</a></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-12"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-12">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Jesse Kozlowski, Surveyor (2016) <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://jessekozlowski.wordpress.com/2016/11/05/looks-perfectly-flat-and-level-to-me/">"Flat Earth Proof? – Perfectly Flat Level Lake"</a></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-13"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-13">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Wolfie6020 (Sept. 22, 2016). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avXJqA3w7qk">"Do aircraft change attitude to follow the curvature of the Earth?"</a>. Via YouTube.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-14"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-14">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Doubek, James (Feb. 23, 2020). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.npr.org/2020/02/23/808645524/daredevil-mad-mike-hughes-killed-in-crash-of-homemade-rocket">"Daredevil 'Mad' Mike Hughes Killed In Crash Of Homemade Rocket"</a>. Via npr.org</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-15"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-15">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"> Campanella, Jeran (Jan. 7, 2025).<a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://t.me/jerants/104">"I’m exiting the cult."</a>. Via Telegram.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-16"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-16">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Steere, Patricia (February 2025). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/live/1DHQ9xj71-M?t=1078s">"Steere's letter read by Jeran Campanella"</a>. Via youtube.com</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-17"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-17">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Davidson, Robbie (Feb. 23, 2025). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://youtube.com/post/UgkxD0muFNf0-GgBgycx5R-bAvuFjEv6eDVl?si=te8-sUSnA-b482ER">"I've come to a new conclusion about the shape of the earth. I was wrong."</a>. Via youtube.com</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-auto-18"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-auto_18-0">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFDiaz_RuizNilsson2022" class="citation journal cs1">Diaz Ruiz, Carlos; Nilsson, Tomas (16 May 2022). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/07439156221103852">"Disinformation and Echo Chambers: How Disinformation Circulates in Social Media Through Identity-Driven Controversies"</a>. <i>Journal of Public Policy & Marketing</i>. <b>42</b>: <span class="nowrap">18–</span>35. <a href="/wiki/Doi_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="Doi (identifier)">doi</a>:<a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://doi.org/10.1177%2F07439156221103852">10.1177/07439156221103852</a>. <a href="/wiki/S2CID_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="S2CID (identifier)">S2CID</a> <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://api.semanticscholar.org/CorpusID:248934562">248934562</a>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.jtitle=Journal+of+Public+Policy+%26+Marketing&rft.atitle=Disinformation+and+Echo+Chambers%3A+How+Disinformation+Circulates+in+Social+Media+Through+Identity-Driven+Controversies&rft.volume=42&rft.pages=%3Cspan+class%3D%22nowrap%22%3E18-%3C%2Fspan%3E35&rft.date=2022-05-16&rft_id=info%3Adoi%2F10.1177%2F07439156221103852&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fapi.semanticscholar.org%2FCorpusID%3A248934562%23id-name%3DS2CID&rft.aulast=Diaz+Ruiz&rft.aufirst=Carlos&rft.au=Nilsson%2C+Tomas&rft_id=http%3A%2F%2Fjournals.sagepub.com%2Fdoi%2F10.1177%2F07439156221103852&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-conversation-19"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-conversation_19-0">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Carlos Diaz Ruiz, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://theconversation.com/i-watched-hundreds-of-flat-earth-videos-to-learn-how-conspiracy-theories-spread-and-what-it-could-mean-for-fighting-disinformation-184589/">I watched hundreds of flat-Earth videos to learn how conspiracy theories spread – and what it could mean for fighting disinformation</a>. theconversation.com, 27 June 2022.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-bellingcat17-20"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-bellingcat17_20-0">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Aric Toler, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.bellingcat.com/resources/articles/2017/06/07/flat-earth-online-communities/">“No Safe Spaces on the Flat Earth” – Emergent Alt-Right Inspired Flat Earth Online Communities</a>. bellingcat.com, 7 June 2017.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-21"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-21">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://answersingenesis.org/astronomy/earth/they-think-earth-is-flat/">They Think the Earth is Flat?</a> <a href="/wiki/Answers_in_Genesis" title="Answers in Genesis">Answers in Genesis</a>, 9 August 2008. <blockquote class="letter" style="width:auto; background:#f8f8ff; border:1px solid #C9C9CF;"> <p>Unlike young-earth creationism, flat-earthism is not scriptural and has no profound theological implications. There are (mostly poetic) passages that could be cited by flat-earthers, such as Revelation 7:1, which refers to the 'four corners of the earth' — but these are most clearly interpreted as figurative. </p> </blockquote></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-22"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-22">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">For example, consider the apocalyptic end times <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.worldslastchance.com/">World's Last Chance</a> group, that provides a <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.worldslastchance.com/biblical-christian-beliefs/flat-earth-bible-truth-in-an-unstable-world.html">pile of steaming flat Earth bullshit</a> wrapped in weird evangelical terminology.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-23"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-23">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Robert J. Schadewald, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://archive.is/0YhL2">The Flat-out Truth: Earth Orbits? Moon Landings? A Fraud! Says This Prophet.</a> Science Digest, July 1980. Archived from the original at lhup.edu.<blockquote class="letter" style="width:auto; background:#f8f8ff; border:1px solid #C9C9CF;"> <p>Johnson's beliefs are firmly grounded in the Bible. Many verses of the Old Testament imply that the Earth is flat, but there's more to it than that. According to the New Testament, Jesus ascended up into heaven. </p> </blockquote></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-24"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-24">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://time.com/4197726/flat-earth-tyson-bob-twitter-feud/">Watch Neil deGrasse Tyson Drop the Mic in His B.o.B Rap Battle</a></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-25"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-25">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2016/01/29/why_rapper_b_o_b_s_belief_in_a_flat_earth_can_be_useful.html">How a Celebrity’s Silly Belief in Flat Earth Can Be Useful</a> by Lawrence Krauss</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-26"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-26">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://sports.yahoo.com/news/so-apparently-shaquille-oneal-is-a-flat-earther-too-035813782.html">"So, apparently Shaquille O'Neal is a flat-Earther, too"</a>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=unknown&rft.btitle=So%2C+apparently+Shaquille+O%27Neal+is+a+flat-Earther%2C+too&rft_id=http%3A%2F%2Fsports.yahoo.com%2Fnews%2Fso-apparently-shaquille-oneal-is-a-flat-earther-too-035813782.html&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-celebs-27"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-celebs_27-0">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/01/26/464474518/neil-degrasse-tyson-gets-into-a-rap-battle-with-b-o-b-over-flat-earth-theory">"Neil DeGrasse Tyson Gets Into A Rap Battle With B.o.B Over Flat Earth Theory"</a>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=unknown&rft.btitle=Neil+DeGrasse+Tyson+Gets+Into+A+Rap+Battle+With+B.o.B+Over+Flat+Earth+Theory&rft_id=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.npr.org%2Fsections%2Fthetwo-way%2F2016%2F01%2F26%2F464474518%2Fneil-degrasse-tyson-gets-into-a-rap-battle-with-b-o-b-over-flat-earth-theory&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-celebs2-28"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-celebs2_28-0">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.tvguide.com/news/tila-tequila-removed-celebrity-big-brother-pro-nazi-views/">"Yikes! Tila Tequila Was Removed From Celebrity Big Brother for Pro-Nazi Views"</a>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=unknown&rft.btitle=Yikes%21+Tila+Tequila+Was+Removed+From+Celebrity+Big+Brother+for+Pro-Nazi+Views&rft_id=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tvguide.com%2Fnews%2Ftila-tequila-removed-celebrity-big-brother-pro-nazi-views%2F&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-29"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-29">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">In Godfrey We Trust Podcast (Oct. 7, 2024). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEW52tgAFMM">"Lord Jamar Proves Flat Earth To Godfrey | Offers To Debate Neil deGrasse Tyson"</a>. Via YouTube.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-30"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-30">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Farina, Dave (Jan. 11, 2025). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/guWSyD5d8tA?feature=shared&t=162">"Crapping All Over Flat-earther Lord Jamar Live on Godfrey's Podcast"</a>. Via YouTube.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-31"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-31">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Mark Looy, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://answersingenesis.org/creationism/arguments-to-avoid/getting-to-be-as-flat-as-the-flat-earth-argument/">Getting To Be as Flat as the “Flat Earth” Argument</a>. Answers in Genesis, 19 April 2005.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-32"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-32">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Robert J. Schadewald, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://archive.ph/TsIwv">The Flat-Earth Bible.</a> Archived from lockhaven.edu, 2020.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-33"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-33">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFGardner1957" class="citation book cs1"><a href="/wiki/Martin_Gardner" title="Martin Gardner">Gardner, Martin</a> (1957). "Flat and Hollow". <i>Fads and Fallacies in the Name of Science</i>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=bookitem&rft.atitle=Flat+and+Hollow&rft.btitle=Fads+and+Fallacies+in+the+Name+of+Science&rft.date=1957&rft.aulast=Gardner&rft.aufirst=Martin&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-34"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-34">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://edition.cnn.com/2004/EDUCATION/01/30/georgia.evolution/">Carter slams Georgia's 'evolution' proposal</a></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-35"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-35">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><i>In His Name</i> by E. Christopher Reyes, p. 568</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-36"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-36">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.astronomycenter.net/pdf/tarabishyqiblah_2014.pdf">Jurisprudence of Qibla</a> by Mohamed Nabeel Tarabishy (c. 2003) <i>International Astronomical Center</i> (Abu Dhabi).</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-37"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-37">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Ragep, F. Jamil: "Astronomy", in: Krämer, Gudrun (ed.) et al.: <i>Encyclopaedia of Islam</i>, THREE, Brill 2010.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-38"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-38">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">"<a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.britannica.com/topic/Measuring-the-Earth-Classical-and-Arabic-1673315">Measuring the Earth, Classical and Arabic</a>". Encyclopedia Britannica. Retrieved 2021-02-25.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-39"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-39">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/africa/8172270.stm">Nigeria's 'Taliban' enigma</a></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-40"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-40">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://boingboing.net/2008/03/27/iraqi-astronomer-goe.html">Iraqi astronomer goes on TV to explain why Earth is flat</a></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-41"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-41">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://robscholtemuseum.nl/chemtrailsplanet-nasa-hoax-mars-rovers-discovered-staged-at-devon-island-canada-video/">NASA Hoax: Mars Rovers Discovered Staged at Devon Island, Canada (Video)</a>. robscholtemuseum.nl, 26 August 2016.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-42"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-42">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://truestrange.com/2017/08/20/images-show-mars-rover-photos-shot-on-earth-no-heres-proof/">Images Show Mars Rover Photos Shot on Earth? No, Here’s Proof.</a> <i>True Strange Library</i> website, 23 August 2017.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-43"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-43">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://flatearth.ws/tesla-realm">The “Earth is a Realm” Quote Misattributed to Nikola Tesla</a> Flatearth.ws</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-44"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-44">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Micahel Toon (Oct. 15, 2024). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71FRE9cZczw">"Flat Earth Dave's App Massive Security Breach"</a>. Via YouTube.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-45"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-45">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">McKeegan, Dave (Oct. 31, 2024). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVAMbRujaAU">"Exposing Flat Earth Dave's Sales Pitch"</a>. Via YouTube.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-46"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-46">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFJB_Aerospace2024" class="citation audio-visual cs1">JB Aerospace (2024-03-02). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?si=xDysfzqAGUqYR59u&v=mFbbs8MlWpc&feature=youtu.be"><i>Do the Flat Earthers Finally have a Working Model?</i></a><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2025-02-02</span></span> – via YouTube.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=unknown&rft.btitle=Do+the+Flat+Earthers+Finally+have+a+Working+Model%3F&rft.date=2024-03-02&rft.au=JB+Aerospace&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fsi%3DxDysfzqAGUqYR59u%26v%3DmFbbs8MlWpc%26feature%3Dyoutu.be&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-47"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-47">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFJB_Aerospace2024" class="citation audio-visual cs1">JB Aerospace (2024-03-06). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?si=pkkCq51j0XbUfFQ3&v=VtzjHua2rDE&feature=youtu.be"><i>Do the Flat Earthers Finally have a Working Model? Part 2</i></a><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2025-02-02</span></span> – via YouTube.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=unknown&rft.btitle=Do+the+Flat+Earthers+Finally+have+a+Working+Model%3F+Part+2&rft.date=2024-03-06&rft.au=JB+Aerospace&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fsi%3DpkkCq51j0XbUfFQ3%26v%3DVtzjHua2rDE%26feature%3Dyoutu.be&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-48"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-48">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">Toon, Michael (Feb. 7, 2025). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grjDlOIdf5Q">"Scam App Leaks All Users Data: 90 Day Disclosure"</a>. Via YouTube.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-49"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-49">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFFauzia" class="citation web cs1">Fauzia, Miriam. <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/09/16/fact-check-nazi-scientists-brought-u-s-operation-paperclip/5690870002/">"Fact check: Nazi scientists were brought to work for U.S. through Operation Paperclip"</a>. <i>USA TODAY</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-03-18</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=USA+TODAY&rft.atitle=Fact+check%3A+Nazi+scientists+were+brought+to+work+for+U.S.+through+Operation+Paperclip&rft.aulast=Fauzia&rft.aufirst=Miriam&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.usatoday.com%2Fstory%2Fnews%2Ffactcheck%2F2020%2F09%2F16%2Ffact-check-nazi-scientists-brought-u-s-operation-paperclip%2F5690870002%2F&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-51"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-51">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20181118033443/https://www.thedailybeast.com/inside-the-flat-earth-conference-where-the-worlds-oldest-conspiracy-theory-is-hot-again">"Inside the Flat Earth Conference, Where the World's Oldest Conspiracy Theory Is Hot Again"</a>. <i>web.archive.org</i>. 2018-11-18<span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-03-18</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=web.archive.org&rft.atitle=Inside+the+Flat+Earth+Conference%2C+Where+the+World%27s+Oldest+Conspiracy+Theory+Is+Hot+Again&rft.date=2018-11-18&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fweb.archive.org%2Fweb%2F20181118033443%2Fhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.thedailybeast.com%2Finside-the-flat-earth-conference-where-the-worlds-oldest-conspiracy-theory-is-hot-again&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-:11-52"><span class="mw-cite-backlink">↑ <sup><a href="#cite_ref-:11_52-0">46.0</a></sup> <sup><a href="#cite_ref-:11_52-1">46.1</a></sup></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://answersingenesis.org/blogs/danny-faulkner/2019/08/09/modern-flat-earth-movement-anti-semitism/">"The Modern Flat-Earth Movement and Anti-Semitism"</a>. <i>Answers in Genesis</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-03-18</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=Answers+in+Genesis&rft.atitle=The+Modern+Flat-Earth+Movement+and+Anti-Semitism&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fanswersingenesis.org%2Fblogs%2Fdanny-faulkner%2F2019%2F08%2F09%2Fmodern-flat-earth-movement-anti-semitism%2F&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-53"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-53">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFHendrie2012" class="citation book cs1">Hendrie, Edward (2012). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://books.google.es/books?id=x5QL4aWSLJYC&dq"><i>Bloody Zion</i></a>. Edward Hendrie. <a href="/wiki/ISBN_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="ISBN (identifier)">ISBN</a> <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-0-9832627-6-3" title="Special:BookSources/978-0-9832627-6-3"><bdi>978-0-9832627-6-3</bdi></a>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=book&rft.btitle=Bloody+Zion&rft.pub=Edward+Hendrie&rft.date=2012&rft.isbn=978-0-9832627-6-3&rft.aulast=Hendrie&rft.aufirst=Edward&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fbooks.google.es%2Fbooks%3Fid%3Dx5QL4aWSLJYC%26dq&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-54"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-54">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFHendrie2011" class="citation book cs1">Hendrie, Edward (2011). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://books.google.es/books?id=UIha0iJu-20C&dq"><i>9/11-Enemies Foreign and Domestic</i></a>. Great Mountain Publishing. <a href="/wiki/ISBN_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="ISBN (identifier)">ISBN</a> <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-0-9832627-3-2" title="Special:BookSources/978-0-9832627-3-2"><bdi>978-0-9832627-3-2</bdi></a>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=book&rft.btitle=9%2F11-Enemies+Foreign+and+Domestic&rft.pub=Great+Mountain+Publishing&rft.date=2011&rft.isbn=978-0-9832627-3-2&rft.aulast=Hendrie&rft.aufirst=Edward&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fbooks.google.es%2Fbooks%3Fid%3DUIha0iJu-20C%26dq&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-55"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-55">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.abebooks.com/Vaccine-Danger-Quackery-Paperback-Softback-Hendrie/31460813167/bd">"Vaccine Danger: Quackery and Sin (Paperback or Softback) by Hendrie, Edward: New Paperback or Softback (2023) | BargainBookStores"</a>. <i>www.abebooks.com</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-12-24</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=www.abebooks.com&rft.atitle=Vaccine+Danger%3A+Quackery+and+Sin+%28Paperback+or+Softback%29+by+Hendrie%2C+Edward%3A+New+Paperback+or+Softback+%282023%29+%7C+BargainBookStores&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.abebooks.com%2FVaccine-Danger-Quackery-Paperback-Softback-Hendrie%2F31460813167%2Fbd&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-56"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-56">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://flatearth.ws/eric-dubay#philosophy_conspiracy_theories_197-200">Rebuttals to Eric Dubay’s "200 Proofs Earth is not a Spinning Ball"</a> <i>FlatEarth.we</i>.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-57"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-57">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://youtu.be/-Ax_YpQsy88?t=6991">"Eric Dubay: 200 Proofs Earth is Not a Spinning Ball (1:56:31)"</a><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-03-18</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=unknown&rft.btitle=Eric+Dubay%3A+200+Proofs+Earth+is+Not+a+Spinning+Ball+%281%3A56%3A31%29&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2F-Ax_YpQsy88%3Ft%3D6991&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-58"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-58">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://ericdubay.wordpress.com/2018/07/08/why-the-holocaust-denial/">Why the Holocaust denial</a> (July 8, 2018) <i>Eric Dubay</i>.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-59"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-59">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFDubay" class="citation web cs1">Dubay, Eric. <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.atlanteanconspiracy.com/2015/07/adolf-hitler-vs-jew-world-order.html">"Adolf Hitler vs. The Jew World Order"</a>. <i>AtlanteanConspiracy</i>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=AtlanteanConspiracy&rft.atitle=Adolf+Hitler+vs.+The+Jew+World+Order&rft.aulast=Dubay&rft.aufirst=Eric&rft_id=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.atlanteanconspiracy.com%2F2015%2F07%2Fadolf-hitler-vs-jew-world-order.html&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-60"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-60">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.inverse.com/article/30763-joe-rogan-flat-earth-anti-semitism-conspiracy-globalist">"Joe Rogan's 'Globalist' Flat Earth Debate Hints at Anti-Semitism"</a>. <i>Inverse</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-03-18</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=Inverse&rft.atitle=Joe+Rogan%27s+%27Globalist%27+Flat+Earth+Debate+Hints+at+Anti-Semitism&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.inverse.com%2Farticle%2F30763-joe-rogan-flat-earth-anti-semitism-conspiracy-globalist&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-61"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-61">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://observer.com/2016/01/tila-tequila-truly-believes-the-earth-is-flat-and-wont-stop-yelling-about-it-on-twitter/">"Tila Tequila Truly Believes the Earth Is Flat and Won't Stop Yelling About It on Twitter"</a>. <i><a href="/w/index.php?title=The_New_York_Observer&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="The New York Observer (page does not exist)">The New York Observer</a></i>. January 7, 2016<span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">September 14,</span> 2017</span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=The+New+York+Observer&rft.atitle=Tila+Tequila+Truly+Believes+the+Earth+Is+Flat+and+Won%27t+Stop+Yelling+About+It+on+Twitter&rft.date=2016-01-07&rft_id=http%3A%2F%2Fobserver.com%2F2016%2F01%2Ftila-tequila-truly-believes-the-earth-is-flat-and-wont-stop-yelling-about-it-on-twitter%2F&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-62"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-62">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/155544/tila-tequila-jew-converts-to-sexy-hitler">Tila Tequila, Jew(?), Converts to Sexy Hitler</a> Tablet Magazine. December 9, 2013.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-63"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-63">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFHerron2016" class="citation web cs1">Herron, Antwan (2016-06-08). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20211001214907/https://www.wearyourvoicemag.com/tila-tequila-racist-celeb-thinks-theyre-relevant-never-really/">"Tila Tequila Is The Racist Celeb Who Thinks They're Relevant But Never Really Was"</a>. <i>Wear Your Voice</i>. Archived from <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://wearyourvoicemag.com/tila-tequila-racist-celeb-thinks-theyre-relevant-never-really/">the original</a> on October 1, 2021<span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2021-10-01</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=Wear+Your+Voice&rft.atitle=Tila+Tequila+Is+The+Racist+Celeb+Who+Thinks+They%27re+Relevant+But+Never+Really+Was&rft.date=2016-06-08&rft.aulast=Herron&rft.aufirst=Antwan&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwearyourvoicemag.com%2Ftila-tequila-racist-celeb-thinks-theyre-relevant-never-really%2F&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-64"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-64">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://archive.today/20161120055855/https://twitter.com/AngelTilaLove/status/799809348755161088">"Seig heil! ("✋")"</a>. <i>Twitter</i>. 2016-11-19. Archived from <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://twitter.com/AngelTilaLove/status/799809348755161088">the original</a> on 2016-11-20<span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2016-11-20</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=Twitter&rft.atitle=Seig+heil%21+%28%22%E2%9C%8B%22%29&rft.date=2016-11-19&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FAngelTilaLove%2Fstatus%2F799809348755161088&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-65"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-65">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.skeptic.org.uk/2021/02/why-we-should-have-listened-to-flat-earth-believers-even-though-they-were-completely-wrong/">"Why we should have listened to Flat Earth believers (even though they were completely wrong)"</a>. <i>The Skeptic</i>. 2021-02-05<span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-03-18</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=The+Skeptic&rft.atitle=Why+we+should+have+listened+to+Flat+Earth+believers+%28even+though+they+were+completely+wrong%29&rft.date=2021-02-05&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.skeptic.org.uk%2F2021%2F02%2Fwhy-we-should-have-listened-to-flat-earth-believers-even-though-they-were-completely-wrong%2F&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-66"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-66">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://archive.ph/xyYWj">Just had my main TikTok with all of my videos banned indefinitely. I’d like to note I was in good standing and had 0 violations.</a> by @Kaleb5D (7:07 PM · Nov 28, 2023) <i>Twitter</i> (archived from 4 Dec 2023 02:54:07 UTC).</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-67"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-67">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.flatearthlunacy.com/index.php/2-uncategorised/1645-kaleb-fe-tiktok-flat-earth-advocate-fail">"Kaleb.fe, [[TikTok]] - flat Earth advocate FAIL"</a><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-12-04</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=unknown&rft.btitle=Kaleb.fe%2C+TikTok+-+flat+Earth+advocate+FAIL&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.flatearthlunacy.com%2Findex.php%2F2-uncategorised%2F1645-kaleb-fe-tiktok-flat-earth-advocate-fail&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span> <span class="cs1-visible-error citation-comment"><code class="cs1-code">{{<a href="/wiki/Template:Cite_web" title="Template:Cite web">cite web</a>}}</code>: </span><span class="cs1-visible-error citation-comment">URL–wikilink conflict (<a href="/wiki/Help:CS1_errors#wikilink_in_url" title="Help:CS1 errors">help</a>)</span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-68"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-68">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@miniminuteman/video/7112123994811436334?_t=8htAsh4aunZ&_r=1">"Miniminuteman on Kaleb"</a>. <i>TikTok</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-12-04</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=TikTok&rft.atitle=Miniminuteman+on+Kaleb&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tiktok.com%2F%40miniminuteman%2Fvideo%2F7112123994811436334%3F_t%3D8htAsh4aunZ%26_r%3D1&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-69"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-69">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@charliekeelingover/video/7229757307838532910?_t=8ht9p8zZqUL&_r=1">"Charlie Keeling Over on Kaleb"</a>. <i>TikTok</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-12-04</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=TikTok&rft.atitle=Charlie+Keeling+Over+on+Kaleb&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tiktok.com%2F%40charliekeelingover%2Fvideo%2F7229757307838532910%3F_t%3D8ht9p8zZqUL%26_r%3D1&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-70"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-70">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@charliekeelingover/video/7229814261969784110">"Charlie Keeling Over on Kaleb part 2"</a>. <i>TikTok</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-12-04</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=TikTok&rft.atitle=Charlie+Keeling+Over+on+Kaleb+part+2&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tiktok.com%2F%40charliekeelingover%2Fvideo%2F7229814261969784110&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-71"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-71">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@globemann/video/7291069407571299626">"AverageGlober on Kaleb"</a>. <i>TikTok</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-12-04</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=TikTok&rft.atitle=AverageGlober+on+Kaleb&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tiktok.com%2F%40globemann%2Fvideo%2F7291069407571299626&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-72"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-72">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://archive.ph/aToij">First I will wake up my fellow brothers and sisters to flat earth, after I will wake them up to the evil that is Jewry. This religious sect literally admits that if we understood what they taught about anyone outside their religion that we would openly kill them. It’s time for us to study what they teach about those who are outside the confines of their religious teachings. Any person with a soul that reads the Talmud should publicly support antisemitism, in my opinion it is our duty to not only support antisemitism but to normalize it.</a> by @Kaleb5D (12:40 PM · Dec 2, 2023) <i>Twitter</i> (archived from 4 Dec 2023 02:59:22 UTC).</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-73"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-73">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://archive.ph/D5UBJ">Sure bud. You wanna try and defend Jewry after seeing this? Be my guest.</a> by @Kaleb5D (9:51 AM · Dec 2, 2023) <i>Twitter</i> (archived from 4 Dec 2023 03:03:25 UTC).</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-74"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-74">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://archive.ph/wip/Lw1ud">Repost to trigger jew sympathizers. If you respect me and what I’ve done as far as exposing truth, I demand you sit and watch “Europa the last battle”. Go to http://Odysee.com and search for the documentary, and you will not only understand why I hold antisemitic views, but I guarantee you will stand in my corner of anti Jewry.</a> by Kaleb5D (1:36 AM · Dec 3, 2023) <i>Twitter</i> (archived from 4 Dec 2023 03:06:07 UTC).</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-75"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-75">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.tiktok.com/@k2cobra/video/7308454073529797930?_t=8ht9ekL80Q5&_r=1">"Patriot12bravo on Kaleb"</a>. <i>TikTok</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-12-04</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=TikTok&rft.atitle=Patriot12bravo+on+Kaleb&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tiktok.com%2F%40k2cobra%2Fvideo%2F7308454073529797930%3F_t%3D8ht9ekL80Q5%26_r%3D1&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-76"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-76">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation news cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.haaretz.com/us-news/2022-04-28/ty-article-magazine/.premium/in-the-conspiracy-world-judaism-is-always-suspect/00000180-7ee0-d609-a1ef-feea826a0000">"<span class="cs1-kern-left"></span>'In the Conspiracy World, Judaism Is Always Suspect'<span class="cs1-kern-right"></span>"</a>. <i>Haaretz</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-03-18</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=article&rft.jtitle=Haaretz&rft.atitle=%27In+the+Conspiracy+World%2C+Judaism+Is+Always+Suspect%27&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.haaretz.com%2Fus-news%2F2022-04-28%2Fty-article-magazine%2F.premium%2Fin-the-conspiracy-world-judaism-is-always-suspect%2F00000180-7ee0-d609-a1ef-feea826a0000&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-77"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-77">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFRead2016" class="citation web cs1">Read, Max (2016-01-26). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2016/01/rapper-drops-flat-earth-diss-track-on-physics.html">"B.o.B Just Dropped an Anti-Semitic Flat-Earth Diss Track on Neil deGrasse Tyson"</a>. <i>Intelligencer</i><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-03-18</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=Intelligencer&rft.atitle=B.o.B+Just+Dropped+an+Anti-Semitic+Flat-Earth+Diss+Track+on+Neil+deGrasse+Tyson&rft.date=2016-01-26&rft.aulast=Read&rft.aufirst=Max&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fnymag.com%2Fintelligencer%2F2016%2F01%2Frapper-drops-flat-earth-diss-track-on-physics.html&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-78"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-78">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://soundcloud.com/bobatl/bob-flatline-feat-neil-tyson">"B.o.B - Flatline"</a><span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-03-18</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=unknown&rft.btitle=B.o.B+-+Flatline&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fsoundcloud.com%2Fbobatl%2Fbob-flatline-feat-neil-tyson&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-80"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-80">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><i><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://sacred-texts.com/cla/ari/oth/oth26.htm">On the Heavens</a></i> by Aristotle (350 BCE). Translated by J. L. Stocks. book 2, part 14.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-81"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-81">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite class="citation web cs1"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20230825211248/https://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=16331.0">"Aristotle's most famous proof for the rotundity of the Earth"</a>. <i>Flat Earth Society forum</i>. 2020-05-09<span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">2023-08-25</span></span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Ajournal&rft.genre=unknown&rft.jtitle=Flat+Earth+Society+forum&rft.atitle=Aristotle%27s+most+famous+proof+for+the+rotundity+of+the+Earth&rft.date=2020-05-09&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fweb.archive.org%2Fweb%2F20230825211248%2Fhttps%3A%2F%2Fforum.tfes.org%2Findex.php%3Ftopic%3D16331.0&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-82"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-82">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov/features/cosmic/earth_info.html">"Imagine The Universe - The Earth"</a>. Via nasa.gov.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-83"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-83">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://archive.ph/mOfBv"><b>Me</b>: The Earth is 71% water…</a> by @LadyDragonfly@universeodon.com (Aug 04, 2023, 05:29) <i>Univsersodon</i> (archived from 14 Oct 2023 16:31:51 UTC).</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-84"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-84">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://freetofindtruth.blogspot.com/2016/12/74-in-2017-lets-put-flat-earth-theory.html">In 2017, let's put the flat Earth theory to bed</a></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-85"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-85">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://freetofindtruth.blogspot.com/2015/12/44-super-earth-discovered-14-light.html">44 | 'Super Earth' Discovered, 14 Light-Years Away (Fitting Day for Bullshit Space News)</a></span> </li> <li id="cite_note-86"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-86">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text">@Dialectiks (July 8, 2024). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://x.com/Dialectiks/status/1810392510277235013">"I have a mental illness that makes me think that people will change their minds if I present the correct arguments with the appropriate facts and data."</a>. Via Twitter.</span> </li> <li id="cite_note-88"><span class="mw-cite-backlink"><a href="#cite_ref-88">↑</a></span> <span class="reference-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r2708880"/><cite id="CITEREFMaurer1999" class="citation book cs1">Maurer, David W. (1999) [1940]. <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://books.google.com/books?id=jxbbV5x66usC&pg=PA297"><i>The Big Con: The Story of the Confidence Man and the Confidence Game (reprinted)</i></a>. New York: Bobbs Merrill / Anchor Books. p. 297. <a href="/wiki/ISBN_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="ISBN (identifier)">ISBN</a> <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/0-385-49538-2" title="Special:BookSources/0-385-49538-2"><bdi>0-385-49538-2</bdi></a>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=book&rft.btitle=The+Big+Con%3A+The+Story+of+the+Confidence+Man+and+the+Confidence+Game+%28reprinted%29&rft.place=New+York&rft.pages=297&rft.pub=Bobbs+Merrill+%2F+Anchor+Books&rft.date=1999&rft.isbn=0-385-49538-2&rft.aulast=Maurer&rft.aufirst=David+W.&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Fbooks.google.com%2Fbooks%3Fid%3DjxbbV5x66usC%26pg%3DPA297&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Frationalwiki.org%3AFlat+Earth" class="Z3988"></span></span> </li> </ol></div></div>    </div></div><div class="printfooter">Retrieved from "<a dir="ltr" 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