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id="p296758" class="post has-profile bg2"> <div class="inner"> <dl class="postprofile" id="profile296758"> <dt class="no-profile-rank no-avatar"> <div class="avatar-container"> </div> <a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=103642&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">Jozrael</a> </dt> <dd class="profile-posts"><strong>Posts:</strong> <a href="./search.php?author_id=103642&sr=posts&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9">1035</a></dd> <dd class="profile-joined"><strong>Joined:</strong> June 2nd, 2006, 1:39 pm</dd> <dd class="profile-custom-field profile-phpbb_location"><strong>Location:</strong> NJ, USA.</dd> </dl> <div class="postbody"> <div id="post_content296758"> <h3 class="first"> <a href="./viewtopic.php?p=296758&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p296758">Re: Make Heir to the Throne the top/main/default campaign?</a> </h3> <p class="author"> <a class="unread" href="./viewtopic.php?p=296758&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p296758" title="Post"> <i class="icon fa-file fa-fw icon-lightgray icon-md" aria-hidden="true"></i><span class="sr-only">Post</span> </a> <span class="responsive-hide">by <strong><a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=103642&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">Jozrael</a></strong> » </span><time datetime="2008-05-02T22:23:31+00:00">May 2nd, 2008, 10:23 pm</time> </p> <div class="content">Sorry Turin <.<. Didn't mean to offend.<br> <br> I agree Mist that the default campaign doesn't necessarily need to be the best. I think that HttT should be the 'top campaign', i.e., the default one.<br> <br> I also think that AOI should be suggested at the end of the tutorial, like you said.<br> <br> Cuz you're right, it doesn't have a story, but its the most friendly campaign for a new player. Original art isn't as important I feel for a newbie campaign, but yes, especially on the assassin level, someone needs to hardcore in what the AI is supposed to be doing. Possibly remove all but assassins as a recruit option, and just give him a handful of the other units at specific times or at the beginning.</div> </div> </div> <div class="back2top"> <a href="#top" class="top" title="Top"> <i class="icon fa-chevron-circle-up fa-fw icon-gray" aria-hidden="true"></i> <span class="sr-only">Top</span> </a> </div> </div> </div> <div id="p296811" class="post has-profile bg1"> <div class="inner"> <dl class="postprofile" id="profile296811"> <dt class="has-profile-rank no-avatar"> <div class="avatar-container"> </div> <a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=315&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" style="color: #AA4444;" class="username-coloured">torangan</a> </dt> <dd class="profile-rank">Retired Developer</dd> <dd class="profile-posts"><strong>Posts:</strong> <a href="./search.php?author_id=315&sr=posts&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9">1365</a></dd> <dd class="profile-joined"><strong>Joined:</strong> March 27th, 2004, 12:25 am</dd> <dd class="profile-custom-field profile-phpbb_location"><strong>Location:</strong> Germany</dd> </dl> <div class="postbody"> <div id="post_content296811"> <h3 > <a href="./viewtopic.php?p=296811&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p296811">Re: Make Heir to the Throne the top/main/default campaign?</a> </h3> <p class="author"> <a class="unread" href="./viewtopic.php?p=296811&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p296811" title="Post"> <i class="icon fa-file fa-fw icon-lightgray icon-md" aria-hidden="true"></i><span class="sr-only">Post</span> </a> <span class="responsive-hide">by <strong><a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=315&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" style="color: #AA4444;" class="username-coloured">torangan</a></strong> » </span><time datetime="2008-05-03T00:44:14+00:00">May 3rd, 2008, 12:44 am</time> </p> <div class="content">I guess length is the main argument against it being a beginners campaign. In a long campaign bad playing in the first levels will get you into problems later when you don't have high level recruits. I guess there are quite a few who don't like to go a few scenarios back to get a better long time situation...</div> <div id="sig296811" class="signature">WesCamp-i18n - Translations for User Campaigns:<br> <a href="http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/WesCamp" class="postlink">http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/WesCamp</a><br> <br> Translators for all languages required: contact me. No geek skills required!</div> </div> </div> <div class="back2top"> <a href="#top" class="top" title="Top"> <i class="icon fa-chevron-circle-up fa-fw icon-gray" aria-hidden="true"></i> <span class="sr-only">Top</span> </a> </div> </div> </div> <div id="p296848" class="post has-profile bg2"> <div class="inner"> <dl class="postprofile" id="profile296848"> <dt class="no-profile-rank no-avatar"> <div class="avatar-container"> </div> <a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=108162&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">vicza</a> </dt> <dd class="profile-posts"><strong>Posts:</strong> <a href="./search.php?author_id=108162&sr=posts&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9">238</a></dd> <dd class="profile-joined"><strong>Joined:</strong> January 16th, 2008, 11:40 pm</dd> <dd class="profile-custom-field profile-phpbb_location"><strong>Location:</strong> Moscow</dd> </dl> <div class="postbody"> <div id="post_content296848"> <h3 > <a href="./viewtopic.php?p=296848&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p296848">Re: Make Heir to the Throne the top/main/default campaign?</a> </h3> <p class="author"> <a class="unread" href="./viewtopic.php?p=296848&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p296848" title="Post"> <i class="icon fa-file fa-fw icon-lightgray icon-md" aria-hidden="true"></i><span class="sr-only">Post</span> </a> <span class="responsive-hide">by <strong><a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=108162&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">vicza</a></strong> » </span><time datetime="2008-05-03T03:41:17+00:00">May 3rd, 2008, 3:41 am</time> </p> <div class="content"><blockquote><div><cite>torangan wrote:</cite>I guess length is the main argument against it being a beginners campaign. In a long campaign bad playing in the first levels will get you into problems later when you don't have high level recruits.</div></blockquote> But on EASY level HTTT is quite easy. When I played it first time, I played quite bad, reached the last scenario with only few lvl2-3 units (7 units, actually, I checked the old save just now), and still could win it. <br> <br> Another thing, the Manual should not suggest new players to begin from NORMAL level at once, as it does now. Some scenarios, like Elensefar, can be very hard on normal level.<br> <blockquote><div><cite>Jozrael wrote:</cite>Cuz you're right, it doesn't have a story, but its the most friendly campaign for a new player. Original art isn't as important I feel for a newbie campaign, but yes, especially on the assassin level, someone needs to hardcore in what the AI is supposed to be doing. Possibly remove all but assassins as a recruit option, and just give him a handful of the other units at specific times or at the beginning.</div></blockquote> It can be easily regulated by creating a clone unit (Orcish Assassin2), and giving him another "usage". And give player more gold after the "villageless" scenario.</div> </div> </div> <div class="back2top"> <a href="#top" class="top" title="Top"> <i class="icon fa-chevron-circle-up fa-fw icon-gray" aria-hidden="true"></i> <span class="sr-only">Top</span> </a> </div> </div> </div> <div id="p297060" class="post has-profile bg1"> <div class="inner"> <dl class="postprofile" id="profile297060"> <dt class="no-profile-rank no-avatar"> <div class="avatar-container"> </div> <a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=103642&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">Jozrael</a> </dt> <dd class="profile-posts"><strong>Posts:</strong> <a href="./search.php?author_id=103642&sr=posts&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9">1035</a></dd> <dd class="profile-joined"><strong>Joined:</strong> June 2nd, 2006, 1:39 pm</dd> <dd class="profile-custom-field profile-phpbb_location"><strong>Location:</strong> NJ, USA.</dd> </dl> <div class="postbody"> <div id="post_content297060"> <h3 > <a href="./viewtopic.php?p=297060&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p297060">Re: Make Heir to the Throne the top/main/default campaign?</a> </h3> <p class="author"> <a class="unread" href="./viewtopic.php?p=297060&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p297060" title="Post"> <i class="icon fa-file fa-fw icon-lightgray icon-md" aria-hidden="true"></i><span class="sr-only">Post</span> </a> <span class="responsive-hide">by <strong><a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=103642&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">Jozrael</a></strong> » </span><time datetime="2008-05-03T21:08:01+00:00">May 3rd, 2008, 9:08 pm</time> </p> <div class="content">That would work better >=)~</div> </div> </div> <div class="back2top"> <a href="#top" class="top" title="Top"> <i class="icon fa-chevron-circle-up fa-fw icon-gray" aria-hidden="true"></i> <span class="sr-only">Top</span> </a> </div> </div> </div> <div id="p299390" class="post has-profile bg2"> <div class="inner"> <dl class="postprofile" id="profile299390"> <dt class="has-profile-rank no-avatar"> <div class="avatar-container"> </div> <a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=314&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" style="color: #66AA99;" class="username-coloured">Sangel</a> </dt> <dd class="profile-rank">Moderator Emeritus</dd> <dd class="profile-posts"><strong>Posts:</strong> <a href="./search.php?author_id=314&sr=posts&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9">2232</a></dd> <dd class="profile-joined"><strong>Joined:</strong> March 26th, 2004, 10:58 pm</dd> <dd class="profile-custom-field profile-phpbb_location"><strong>Location:</strong> New York, New York</dd> </dl> <div class="postbody"> <div id="post_content299390"> <h3 > <a href="./viewtopic.php?p=299390&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p299390">Re: Make Heir to the Throne the top/main/default campaign?</a> </h3> <p class="author"> <a class="unread" href="./viewtopic.php?p=299390&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p299390" title="Post"> <i class="icon fa-file fa-fw icon-lightgray icon-md" aria-hidden="true"></i><span class="sr-only">Post</span> </a> <span class="responsive-hide">by <strong><a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=314&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" style="color: #66AA99;" class="username-coloured">Sangel</a></strong> » </span><time datetime="2008-05-14T05:18:27+00:00">May 14th, 2008, 5:18 am</time> </p> <div class="content">I agree that it makes sense to move Heir to the Throne to the top of the campaign list. I'd actually suggest going one further - perhaps putting a "Recommended" tag on it, or separating it from the other campaigns with a divider, or even both. It really is the canonical Wesnoth campaign, from which the game takes its name, so it makes sense to give it special prominence.<br> <br> I'd hasten to add that this is not because it's the best campaign - I personally prefer UtBS, but honourable men can differ. I just think it's optimal for new players to play Heir to the Throne first, as it's the best campaign for teaching both gameplay and Wesnothian history/geography.</div> <div id="sig299390" class="signature">"Pure logic is the ruin of the spirit." - Antoine de Saint-Exupéry</div> </div> </div> <div class="back2top"> <a href="#top" class="top" title="Top"> <i class="icon fa-chevron-circle-up fa-fw icon-gray" aria-hidden="true"></i> <span class="sr-only">Top</span> </a> </div> </div> </div> <div id="p301184" class="post has-profile bg1"> <div class="inner"> <dl class="postprofile" id="profile301184"> <dt class="no-profile-rank no-avatar"> <div class="avatar-container"> </div> <a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=109068&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">TheArchitect</a> </dt> <dd class="profile-posts"><strong>Posts:</strong> <a href="./search.php?author_id=109068&sr=posts&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9">55</a></dd> <dd class="profile-joined"><strong>Joined:</strong> March 29th, 2008, 4:46 pm</dd> </dl> <div class="postbody"> <div id="post_content301184"> <h3 > <a href="./viewtopic.php?p=301184&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p301184">Re: Make Heir to the Throne the top/main/default campaign?</a> </h3> <p class="author"> <a class="unread" href="./viewtopic.php?p=301184&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p301184" title="Post"> <i class="icon fa-file fa-fw icon-lightgray icon-md" aria-hidden="true"></i><span class="sr-only">Post</span> </a> <span class="responsive-hide">by <strong><a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=109068&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">TheArchitect</a></strong> » </span><time datetime="2008-05-26T00:08:26+00:00">May 26th, 2008, 12:08 am</time> </p> <div class="content">As vicza pointed out earlier, HttT introduces a new player to almost every unit in the game. As far as my experience goes, this is a unique advantage it has over other wesnoth campaigns. This on top of good gameplay and an interesting story make it the best candidate for default campaign in my opinion. <br> <br> Also, I don't think the length is much of an issue because after they beat the first few levels, a new player will hopefully have decided they like wesnoth and will have begun to explore other parts of the game like multiplayer. They might even stop playing HttT (not likely <img class="smilies" src="./images/smilies/icon_wink.gif" width="15" height="15" alt=":wink:" title="Wink"> )without finishing; but by then it doesn't really matter because other campaigns and multiplayer will keep them interested without HttT.<br> (it might not always work like this, but thats how I got hooked <img class="smilies" src="./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif" width="15" height="15" alt=":D" title="Very Happy"> )</div> </div> </div> <div class="back2top"> <a href="#top" class="top" title="Top"> <i class="icon fa-chevron-circle-up fa-fw icon-gray" aria-hidden="true"></i> <span class="sr-only">Top</span> </a> </div> </div> </div> <div id="p301420" class="post has-profile bg2"> <div class="inner"> <dl class="postprofile" id="profile301420"> <dt class="no-profile-rank has-avatar"> <div class="avatar-container"> <a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=106647&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="avatar"><img class="avatar" src="./download/file.php?avatar=106647_1277139469.png" width="72" height="72" alt="User avatar" /></a> </div> <a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=106647&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">TheBladeRoden</a> </dt> <dd class="profile-posts"><strong>Posts:</strong> <a href="./search.php?author_id=106647&sr=posts&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9">168</a></dd> <dd class="profile-joined"><strong>Joined:</strong> July 16th, 2007, 8:01 am</dd> </dl> <div class="postbody"> <div id="post_content301420"> <h3 > <a href="./viewtopic.php?p=301420&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p301420">Re: Make Heir to the Throne the top/main/default campaign?</a> </h3> <p class="author"> <a class="unread" href="./viewtopic.php?p=301420&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9#p301420" title="Post"> <i class="icon fa-file fa-fw icon-lightgray icon-md" aria-hidden="true"></i><span class="sr-only">Post</span> </a> <span class="responsive-hide">by <strong><a href="./memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=106647&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="username">TheBladeRoden</a></strong> » </span><time datetime="2008-05-27T20:13:14+00:00">May 27th, 2008, 8:13 pm</time> </p> <div class="content">Hell, I found Liberty easier than HttT, even though it's listed as an intermediate campaign.</div> <div id="sig301420" class="signature">Founding Father of Columbia</div> </div> </div> <div class="back2top"> <a href="#top" class="top" title="Top"> <i class="icon fa-chevron-circle-up fa-fw icon-gray" aria-hidden="true"></i> <span class="sr-only">Top</span> </a> </div> </div> </div> <div class="action-bar bar-bottom"> <a href="./posting.php?mode=reply&t=21179&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="button" title="This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies."> <span>Locked</span> <i class="icon fa-lock fa-fw" aria-hidden="true"></i> </a> <form method="post" 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Brothers</span></a></li> <li><a href="./viewforum.php?f=41&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="jumpbox-sub-link"><span class="spacer"></span><span class="spacer"></span><span class="spacer"></span> <span>↳ An Orcish Incursion</span></a></li> <li><a href="./viewforum.php?f=42&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="jumpbox-sub-link"><span class="spacer"></span><span class="spacer"></span><span class="spacer"></span> <span>↳ The South Guard</span></a></li> <li><a href="./viewforum.php?f=39&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="jumpbox-sub-link"><span class="spacer"></span><span class="spacer"></span><span class="spacer"></span> <span>↳ Heir to the Throne</span></a></li> <li><a href="./viewforum.php?f=43&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" class="jumpbox-sub-link"><span class="spacer"></span><span class="spacer"></span><span class="spacer"></span> <span>↳ Liberty</span></a></li> <li><a href="./viewforum.php?f=51&sid=5fd45f39245d779f589496b15d3815c9" 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