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.mw-parser-output .wpbs .banner-shell-inner{background-color:#2e2505}}@media screen and (prefers-color-scheme:dark){html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .wpb-category-box{background-color:#0a0a0a}html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .wpbs .wpb .wpb-main,html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .wpbs .wpb-header{background-color:#302f2d}html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .wpbs .banner-shell-inner{background-color:#2e2505}}</style><table class="tmbox tmbox-notice mw-collapsible innercollapse wpb wpb-table"><tbody><tr class="wpb-header"><td class="wpb-header-icon"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Crystal_personal.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="WikiProject icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/24/Crystal_personal.svg/25px-Crystal_personal.svg.png" decoding="async" width="25" height="25" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/24/Crystal_personal.svg/38px-Crystal_personal.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/24/Crystal_personal.svg/50px-Crystal_personal.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="70" data-file-height="70"/></a></span></td><td class="wpb-header-combined"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Biography" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Biography">Biography</a><span class="wpb-nested-task-force">: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Biography/Sports_and_games" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Biography/Sports and games">Sports and Games</a></span> </td></tr><tr><td class="mbox-text wpb-main" colspan="2"><table><tbody><tr><td class="mbox-image wpb-image"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Crystal_personal.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="WikiProject icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/24/Crystal_personal.svg/60px-Crystal_personal.svg.png" decoding="async" width="60" height="60" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/24/Crystal_personal.svg/90px-Crystal_personal.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/24/Crystal_personal.svg/120px-Crystal_personal.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="70" data-file-height="70"/></a></span></td><td class="mbox-text"><style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1239009302">.mw-parser-output .portalbox{padding:0;margin:0.5em 0;display:table;box-sizing:border-box;max-width:175px;list-style:none}.mw-parser-output .portalborder{border:1px solid var(--border-color-base,#a2a9b1);padding:0.1em;background:var(--background-color-neutral-subtle,#f8f9fa)}.mw-parser-output .portalbox-entry{display:table-row;font-size:85%;line-height:110%;height:1.9em;font-style:italic;font-weight:bold}.mw-parser-output .portalbox-image{display:table-cell;padding:0.2em;vertical-align:middle;text-align:center}.mw-parser-output .portalbox-link{display:table-cell;padding:0.2em 0.2em 0.2em 0.3em;vertical-align:middle}@media(min-width:720px){.mw-parser-output .portalleft{clear:left;float:left;margin:0.5em 1em 0.5em 0}.mw-parser-output .portalright{clear:right;float:right;margin:0.5em 0 0.5em 1em}}</style><ul role="navigation" aria-label="Portals" class="noprint portalbox portalborder portalright"> <li class="portalbox-entry"><span class="portalbox-image"><span class="noviewer" typeof="mw:File"><span><img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/69/P_vip.svg/28px-P_vip.svg.png" decoding="async" width="28" height="28" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/69/P_vip.svg/41px-P_vip.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/69/P_vip.svg/55px-P_vip.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="1911" data-file-height="1944"/></span></span></span><span class="portalbox-link"><a href="/wiki/Portal:Biography" title="Portal:Biography">Biography portal</a></span></li></ul>This article is within the scope of <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Biography" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Biography">WikiProject Biography</a></b>, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Biography/Members" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Biography/Members">join the project</a> and <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Biography" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Biography">contribute to the discussion</a>. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the <a href="/wiki/Template:WikiProject_Biography/doc" title="Template:WikiProject Biography/doc">documentation</a>.<span class="metadata wpb-metadata"><span class="wpb-project">Biography</span><span class="wpb-project_link">Wikipedia:WikiProject Biography</span><span class="wpb-banner_name">Template:WikiProject Biography</span><span class="wpb-assessment_cat">biography articles</span></span></td><td class="mbox-empty-cell"></td></tr><tr><td><figure class="mw-default-size mw-halign-center" typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Sports_and_games.png" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="Taskforce icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/3/34/Sports_and_games.png/27px-Sports_and_games.png" decoding="async" width="27" height="25" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/3/34/Sports_and_games.png/41px-Sports_and_games.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/3/34/Sports_and_games.png/54px-Sports_and_games.png 2x" data-file-width="136" data-file-height="125"/></a><figcaption></figcaption></figure></td><td class="mbox-text" colspan="2"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1239009302"><ul role="navigation" aria-label="Portals" class="noprint portalbox portalborder portalright" style="margin:0"> <li class="portalbox-entry"><span class="portalbox-image"><span class="noviewer" typeof="mw:File"><span><img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/95/Sports_icon.png/31px-Sports_icon.png" decoding="async" width="31" height="28" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/95/Sports_icon.png/47px-Sports_icon.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/95/Sports_icon.png/62px-Sports_icon.png 2x" data-file-width="251" data-file-height="226"/></span></span></span><span class="portalbox-link"><a href="/wiki/Portal:Sports" title="Portal:Sports">Sports portal</a></span></li></ul>This article is supported by <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Biography/Sports_and_games" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Biography/Sports and games">the sports and games work group</a></b> (assessed as <a href="/wiki/Category:Mid-importance_biography_(sports_and_games)_articles" title="Category:Mid-importance biography (sports and games) articles">Mid-importance</a>).</td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table> <link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1237879475"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1256394742"><table class="tmbox tmbox-notice mw-collapsible innercollapse wpb wpb-table"><tbody><tr class="wpb-header"><td class="wpb-header-icon"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Soccer_ball.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="WikiProject icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ec/Soccer_ball.svg/25px-Soccer_ball.svg.png" decoding="async" width="25" height="25" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ec/Soccer_ball.svg/38px-Soccer_ball.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ec/Soccer_ball.svg/50px-Soccer_ball.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="800" data-file-height="800"/></a></span></td><td class="wpb-header-combined"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football">Football</a><span class="wpb-nested-task-force">: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/England_task_force" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/England task force">England</a> / <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/Scotland_task_force" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Scotland task force">Scotland</a> / <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/Wales_task_force" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Wales task force">Wales</a> / <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/Arsenal_F.C._task_force" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Arsenal F.C. task force">Arsenal</a> / <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/Celtic_F.C._task_force" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Celtic F.C. task force">Celtic</a></span> <span class="wpb-header-bubbles import-mid">Mid‑importance</span></td></tr><tr><td class="mbox-text wpb-main" colspan="2"><table><tbody><tr><td class="mbox-image wpb-image"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Soccer_ball.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="WikiProject icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ec/Soccer_ball.svg/60px-Soccer_ball.svg.png" decoding="async" width="60" height="60" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ec/Soccer_ball.svg/90px-Soccer_ball.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ec/Soccer_ball.svg/120px-Soccer_ball.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="800" data-file-height="800"/></a></span></td><td class="mbox-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1239009302"><ul role="navigation" aria-label="Portals" class="noprint portalbox portalborder portalright"> <li class="portalbox-entry"><span class="portalbox-image"><span class="noviewer" typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Soccer_ball.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ec/Soccer_ball.svg/28px-Soccer_ball.svg.png" decoding="async" width="28" height="28" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ec/Soccer_ball.svg/42px-Soccer_ball.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/ec/Soccer_ball.svg/56px-Soccer_ball.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="800" data-file-height="800"/></a></span></span><span class="portalbox-link"><a href="/wiki/Portal:Association_football" title="Portal:Association football">Association football portal</a></span></li></ul>This article is within the scope of <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football">WikiProject Football</a></b>, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of <a href="/wiki/Association_football" title="Association football">Association football</a> on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Football" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football">the discussion</a> and see a list of open tasks.<span class="metadata wpb-metadata"><span class="wpb-project">Football</span><span class="wpb-project_link">Wikipedia:WikiProject Football</span><span class="wpb-banner_name">Template:WikiProject Football</span><span class="wpb-assessment_cat">football articles</span></span></td><td class="mbox-empty-cell"></td></tr><tr><td class="assess import-mid"><a href="/wiki/Category:Mid-importance_football_articles" title="Category:Mid-importance football articles">Mid</a></td><td class="mbox-text" colspan="2">This article has been rated as <b>Mid-importance</b> on the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/Assessment#Importance_scale" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Assessment">project's importance scale</a>.</td></tr><tr><td><figure class="mw-halign-center" typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Flag_of_England.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="Taskforce icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/be/Flag_of_England.svg/40px-Flag_of_England.svg.png" decoding="async" width="40" height="24" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/be/Flag_of_England.svg/60px-Flag_of_England.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/be/Flag_of_England.svg/80px-Flag_of_England.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="800" data-file-height="480"/></a><figcaption></figcaption></figure></td><td class="mbox-text" colspan="2"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1239009302"><ul role="navigation" aria-label="Portals" class="noprint portalbox portalborder portalright" style="margin:0"> <li class="portalbox-entry"><span class="portalbox-image"><span class="noviewer" typeof="mw:File"><span><img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/Soccerball_England.svg/28px-Soccerball_England.svg.png" decoding="async" width="28" height="28" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/Soccerball_England.svg/42px-Soccerball_England.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/Soccerball_England.svg/56px-Soccerball_England.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="313" data-file-height="313"/></span></span></span><span class="portalbox-link"><a href="/wiki/Portal:English_football" title="Portal:English football">English football portal</a></span></li></ul>This article is supported by <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/England_task_force" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/England task force">the English football task force</a></b> (assessed as <a href="/wiki/Category:Mid-importance_football_in_England_articles" title="Category:Mid-importance football in England articles">Mid-importance</a>).</td></tr><tr><td><figure class="mw-halign-center" typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Flag_of_Scotland.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="Taskforce icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/Flag_of_Scotland.svg/40px-Flag_of_Scotland.svg.png" decoding="async" width="40" height="24" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/Flag_of_Scotland.svg/60px-Flag_of_Scotland.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/Flag_of_Scotland.svg/80px-Flag_of_Scotland.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="1000" data-file-height="600"/></a><figcaption></figcaption></figure></td><td class="mbox-text" colspan="2">This article is supported by <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/Scotland_task_force" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Scotland task force">the Scottish football task force</a></b> (assessed as <a href="/wiki/Category:Mid-importance_football_in_Scotland_articles" title="Category:Mid-importance football in Scotland articles">Mid-importance</a>).</td></tr><tr><td><figure class="mw-halign-center" typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Flag_of_Wales.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="Taskforce icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/40px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png" decoding="async" width="40" height="24" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/60px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/80px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="800" data-file-height="480"/></a><figcaption></figcaption></figure></td><td class="mbox-text" colspan="2">This article is supported by <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/Wales_task_force" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Wales task force">the Welsh football task force</a></b> (assessed as <a href="/wiki/Category:Mid-importance_football_in_Wales_articles" title="Category:Mid-importance football in Wales articles">Mid-importance</a>).</td></tr><tr><td><figure class="mw-halign-center" typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Emirates-stadionin_etupuoli.jpg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="Taskforce icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/Emirates-stadionin_etupuoli.jpg/40px-Emirates-stadionin_etupuoli.jpg" decoding="async" width="40" height="29" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/Emirates-stadionin_etupuoli.jpg/60px-Emirates-stadionin_etupuoli.jpg 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/Emirates-stadionin_etupuoli.jpg/80px-Emirates-stadionin_etupuoli.jpg 2x" data-file-width="2208" data-file-height="1608"/></a><figcaption></figcaption></figure></td><td class="mbox-text" colspan="2">This article is supported by <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Football/Arsenal_F.C._task_force" 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srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/53px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/70px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="800" data-file-height="480"/></a></span></td><td class="wpb-header-combined"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Wales" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Wales">Wales</a> <span class="wpb-header-bubbles import-mid">Mid‑importance</span></td></tr><tr><td class="mbox-text wpb-main" colspan="2"><table><tbody><tr><td class="mbox-image wpb-image"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Flag_of_Wales.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img alt="WikiProject icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/70px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png" decoding="async" width="70" height="42" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/105px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/140px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="800" data-file-height="480"/></a></span></td><td class="mbox-text"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1239009302"><ul role="navigation" aria-label="Portals" class="noprint portalbox portalborder portalright"> <li class="portalbox-entry"><span class="portalbox-image"><span class="mw-image-border noviewer" typeof="mw:File"><span><img alt="flag" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/32px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png" decoding="async" width="32" height="19" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/48px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Flag_of_Wales.svg/64px-Flag_of_Wales.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="800" data-file-height="480"/></span></span></span><span class="portalbox-link"><a href="/wiki/Portal:Wales" title="Portal:Wales">Wales portal</a></span></li></ul>This article is within the scope of <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Wales" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Wales">WikiProject Wales</a></b>, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of <a href="/wiki/Wales" title="Wales">Wales</a> on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Wales" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Wales">the discussion</a> and see a list of open tasks.<span class="metadata wpb-metadata"><span class="wpb-project">Wales</span><span class="wpb-project_link">Wikipedia:WikiProject Wales</span><span class="wpb-banner_name">Template:WikiProject Wales</span><span class="wpb-assessment_cat">Wales articles</span></span></td><td class="mbox-empty-cell"></td></tr><tr><td class="assess import-mid"><a href="/wiki/Category:Mid-importance_Wales_articles" title="Category:Mid-importance Wales articles">Mid</a></td><td class="mbox-text" colspan="2">This article has been rated as <b>Mid-importance</b> on the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Wales/Assessment#Importance_scale" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Wales/Assessment">project's importance scale</a>.</td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table> <meta property="mw:PageProp/toc"/> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="'Most_feared'" data-mw-thread-id="h-'Most_feared'"><span id=".27Most_feared.27"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-'Most_feared'"></span>'Most feared'<span data-mw-comment-end="h-'Most_feared'"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Talk:John_Hartson&action=edit&section=1" title="Edit section: 'Most feared'"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></div> <p>Is "most feared" a polite way of saying "ugliest"? I think this article is a bit POV. If he is "feared", do you think you could find some people expressing that opinion (not Celtic fans, you understand)? I'd certainly be more worried at facing Henry, van Nistelrooy or any of a dozen others than Hartson.<a href="/wiki/User:Dr_Zen" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Dr Zen">Dr Zen</a> 05:48, 13 Nov 2004 (UTC) </p> <dl><dd>No, more a way of saying that people are a little scared of defending against him. I figure that if at least the <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/southwest/halloffame/sport/johnhartson.shtml">BBC</a> can use the phrase, then the evidence must be there to back it up. <a href="/wiki/User:Chriscf" title="User:Chriscf">Chris</a> 14:51, 12 Mar 2005 (UTC)</dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Citations_needed?" data-mw-thread-id="h-Citations_needed?"><span id="Citations_needed.3F"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Citations_needed?"></span>Citations needed?<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Citations_needed?"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Talk:John_Hartson&action=edit&section=2" title="Edit section: Citations needed?"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></div> <p>Why are there so many "Citation's" needed for the opening paragraph? Surely this is something that any person who watches more then 3 games can deduce. </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Norwich_loan" data-mw-thread-id="h-Norwich_loan-2007-10-12T18:12:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Norwich_loan-2007-10-12T18:12:00.000Z"></span>Norwich loan<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Norwich_loan-2007-10-12T18:12:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Talk:John_Hartson&action=edit&section=3" title="Edit section: Norwich loan"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Jameboy-2007-10-12T18:12:00.000Z-Norwich_loan"></span>The story as reported by the two clubs involved - may be useful for additional citations: </p> <ul><li><a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="http://www.canaries.premiumtv.co.uk/page/NewsDetails/0,,10355~1133642,00.html">http://www.canaries.premiumtv.co.uk/page/NewsDetails/0,,10355~1133642,00.html</a></li> <li><a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="http://www.wba.premiumtv.co.uk/page/News/0,,10366~1133341,00.html">http://www.wba.premiumtv.co.uk/page/News/0,,10366~1133341,00.html</a></li></ul> <p>Interesting that they each put a slightly different spin on the actual length of the loan. --<a href="/wiki/User:Jameboy" title="User:Jameboy">Jameboy</a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-Jameboy-2007-10-12T18:12:00.000Z-Norwich_loan" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:12, 12 October 2007 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Jameboy-2007-10-12T18:12:00.000Z-Norwich_loan"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Jameboy-2007-10-12T18:12:00.000Z-Norwich_loan"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Cancer" data-mw-thread-id="h-Cancer-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Cancer-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"></span>Cancer<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Cancer-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Talk:John_Hartson&action=edit&section=4" title="Edit section: Cancer"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z-Cancer"></span>The words used are more alarming than necessary. Testicular cancer is one of the easiest to treat -whether a primary or a secondary tumour -which is what the brain cancer appears to be. I won't alter it again but I believe the best description is still "testicular cancer which has spread to his brain". The words used suggest incorrectly these are both primaries. Perhaps someone more medically qualified would confirm. Good luck to John. <a href="/wiki/User:JRPG" title="User:JRPG">JRPG</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JRPG" title="User talk:JRPG">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z-Cancer" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:11, 14 July 2009 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z-Cancer"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z-Cancer"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Biographies_2-2009-07-14T18:30:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"></span>I have corrected the wording. Hartson has testicular cancer metastasised to his brain. To state brain cancer is saying he has cancer originating in his brain, which is not the case. Whilst the vast majority of those who contract testicular cancer recover, the survival rate is much lower when it is stage 4. <a href="/w/index.php?title=User:Biographies_2&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:Biographies 2 (page does not exist)">Biographies 2</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Biographies_2" title="User talk:Biographies 2">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-Biographies_2-2009-07-14T18:30:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:30, 14 July 2009 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Biographies_2-2009-07-14T18:30:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Biographies_2-2009-07-14T18:30:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JRPG-2009-07-14T21:02:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"></span>Thanks, I think it's so important to get it right, even if some newpapers don't make the effort. The last thing he wants is people writing him off. <a href="/wiki/User:JRPG" title="User:JRPG">JRPG</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JRPG" title="User talk:JRPG">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-JRPG-2009-07-14T21:02:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:02, 14 July 2009 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JRPG-2009-07-14T21:02:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JRPG-2009-07-14T21:02:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-85.144.160.189-2009-07-15T13:49:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"></span>I am a TC survivor and can confirm your wording is the best. Talk of "lung cancer" and "brain cancer" would be incorrect. The tumor type, as you have described, is more important than even the site of the tumor. <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/85.144.160.189" title="Special:Contributions/85.144.160.189">85.144.160.189</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:85.144.160.189&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:85.144.160.189 (page does not exist)">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-85.144.160.189-2009-07-15T13:49:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:49, 15 July 2009 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-85.144.160.189-2009-07-15T13:49:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-85.144.160.189-2009-07-15T13:49:00.000Z-JRPG-2009-07-14T10:11:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JRPG-2009-07-18T16:19:00.000Z-Cancer"></span>Following your comment, specifically to encourage those newly diagnosed, I added the BBC reference to the <a href="/wiki/Everyman_Campaign" class="mw-redirect" title="Everyman Campaign">Everyman Campaign</a>. If you're new to Wikipedia, the Everyman campaign might be a good starting point and I'm sure others, including myself would help. <br/> <a href="/wiki/User:JRPG" title="User:JRPG">JRPG</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JRPG" title="User talk:JRPG">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-JRPG-2009-07-18T16:19:00.000Z-Cancer" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:19, 18 July 2009 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JRPG-2009-07-18T16:19:00.000Z-Cancer"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JRPG-2009-07-18T16:19:00.000Z-Cancer"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Celtic_Stats" data-mw-thread-id="h-Celtic_Stats-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Celtic_Stats-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z"></span>Celtic Stats<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Celtic_Stats-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Talk:John_Hartson&action=edit&section=5" title="Edit section: Celtic Stats"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-BRFC98-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z-Celtic_Stats"></span>Hartson's figures for goals scored and games played for Celtic are wrong. On this webpage <a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/c/celtic/4412184.stm">http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/c/celtic/4412184.stm</a> it quite clearly says he has played 182 games and scored 100 goals and he played for Celtic for 7 months after it was written. Making the figures here very wrong. --<a href="/w/index.php?title=User:BRFC98&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:BRFC98 (page does not exist)">BRFC98</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:BRFC98" title="User talk:BRFC98">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-BRFC98-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z-Celtic_Stats" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:45, 21 October 2009 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-BRFC98-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z-Celtic_Stats"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-BRFC98-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z-Celtic_Stats"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Terrencethetractor-2009-11-06T13:47:00.000Z-BRFC98-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z"></span>The stats boxes for footballers only include League goals and appearances. This is the convention used throughout Wikipedia. --<a href="/wiki/User:Terrencethetractor" title="User:Terrencethetractor">Terrencethetractor</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Terrencethetractor" title="User talk:Terrencethetractor">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-Terrencethetractor-2009-11-06T13:47:00.000Z-BRFC98-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:47, 6 November 2009 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Terrencethetractor-2009-11-06T13:47:00.000Z-BRFC98-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Terrencethetractor-2009-11-06T13:47:00.000Z-BRFC98-2009-10-21T18:45:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency" data-mw-thread-id="h-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z"></span>Number of senior games played: arithmetic inconsistency<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Talk:John_Hartson&action=edit&section=6" title="Edit section: Number of senior games played: arithmetic inconsistency"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-PMOne-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency"></span>The number of games played for Arsenal displayed in the playing career box top right is 54 but the season-by-season count in the Career Statistics section towards the bottom adds up to 53, and the total for games in England adds up to 253 not 254 as shown, which would make the total 399 games not 400 as shown in both boxes. So either one of his Arsenal seasons is missing a game or the 54/254/400 numbers are wrong.<a href="/w/index.php?title=User:PMOne&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:PMOne (page does not exist)">PMOne</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:PMOne" title="User talk:PMOne">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-PMOne-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">05:58, 28 December 2016 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-PMOne-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-PMOne-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Kosack-2016-12-28T06:44:00.000Z-PMOne-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z"></span>It seems that there is a slight difference between some of the major sources which has resulted in some counting 53 games and some counting 54. The <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.premierleague.com/players/844/John-Hartson/overview">Premier League website</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.arsenal.com/history/profiles/296/john-hartson">The Arsenal website</a>, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.neilbrown.newcastlefans.com/player3/johnhartson.html">Neil Brown</a> and <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://hugmansfootballers.com/player/8486">Barry Hugman</a> all go for 53 while <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.soccerbase.com/players/player.sd?player_id=3315">Soccerbase</a> and <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://thearsenalhistory.com/stat/aftlu.htm">The Arsenal history</a> go for 54. Judging by the season tallies in the sources, the 1996–97 season seems to be the source of the issue. <a href="/wiki/User:Kosack" title="User:Kosack">Kosack</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Kosack" title="User talk:Kosack">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-Kosack-2016-12-28T06:44:00.000Z-PMOne-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">06:44, 28 December 2016 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Kosack-2016-12-28T06:44:00.000Z-PMOne-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Kosack-2016-12-28T06:44:00.000Z-PMOne-2016-12-28T05:58:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-PMOne-2016-12-28T15:08:00.000Z-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency"></span>Most helpful list of sources. I have gone through the team sheets on the Arsenal History site and they agree with the 15+19+19 for 53 total tally. The Soccerbase data appears to be missing the Leeds away appearance in 1996-97 and is showing no league data for 1994-95 season, so seems the least reliable source. I am gaining increasing confidence that 53 not 54 is correct. <a href="/w/index.php?title=User:PMOne&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:PMOne (page does not exist)">PMOne</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:PMOne" title="User talk:PMOne">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:John_Hartson#c-PMOne-2016-12-28T15:08:00.000Z-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:08, 28 December 2016 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-PMOne-2016-12-28T15:08:00.000Z-Number_of_senior_games_played:_arithmetic_inconsistency"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span 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