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What is fascism? A Yale philosopher explains how it works | Vox
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A Yale philosopher explains how it works | Vox</title><meta name="robots" content="index,follow,max-image-preview:large"/><meta name="description" content="“Part of what fascist politics does is get people to disassociate from reality.”"/><meta property="og:title" content="How fascism works"/><meta property="og:description" content="A Yale philosopher on fascism, truth, and Donald Trump."/><meta property="og:url" content="https://www.vox.com/2018/9/19/17847110/how-fascism-works-donald-trump-jason-stanley"/><meta property="og:type" content="article"/><meta property="article:published_time" content="2018-09-19T12:10:01+00:00"/><meta property="article:modified_time" content="2018-12-15T16:06:45+00:00"/><meta property="og:image" 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Donald Trump."/><meta name="twitter:image" content="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0,15.094555546019,99.111111111111,63.799959946213"/><meta name="twitter:image:alt" content="Nearly 100,000 Nazi storm troopers are gathered at Luitpold arena to listen to a 1933 speech by Adolf Hitler on ‘Brown Shirt Day.’"/><meta name="parsely-type" content="post"/><meta name="parsely-title" content="How fascism works"/><meta name="parsely-link" content="https://www.vox.com/2018/9/19/17847110/how-fascism-works-donald-trump-jason-stanley"/><meta name="parsely-image-url" content="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0,15.094555546019,99.111111111111,63.799959946213"/><meta 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reality.”","datePublished":"2018-09-19T12:10:01+00:00","dateModified":"2018-12-15T16:06:45+00:00","url":"https://www.vox.com/2018/9/19/17847110/how-fascism-works-donald-trump-jason-stanley","mainEntityOfPage":"https://www.vox.com/2018/9/19/17847110/how-fascism-works-donald-trump-jason-stanley","publisher":{"@type":"Organization","name":"Vox","logo":{"@type":"ImageObject","url":"https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/04/default-og-image.png?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0,0.13712291199202,100,99.725754176016","width":"1200","height":"628"}},"articleSection":"Politics","keywords":["Donald Trump","Policy","Politics","Trump Administration","World Politics"],"author":[{"@type":"Person","name":"Sean Illing","url":"https://www.vox.com/authors/sean-illing"}],"image":[{"@type":"ImageObject","url":"https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0,15.094555546019,99.111111111111,63.799959946213","height":"233","width":"446"},{"@type":"ImageObject","url":"https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0,6.3752276867031,99.111111111111,81.238615664845","height":"297","width":"446"},{"@type":"ImageObject","url":"https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=11.333333333333,0,76.444444444444,93.989071038251","height":"344","width":"344"}],"speakable":{"@type":"SpeakableSpecification","xpath":["/html/head/title","/html/head/meta[@name='description']/@content"]},"articleBody":"“Fascism” is a word that gets tossed around pretty loosely these days, usually as an epithet to discredit someone else’s politics.\nOne consequence is that no one really knows what the term means anymore. Liberals see fascism as the culmination of conservative thinking: an authoritarian, nationalist, and racist system of government organized around corporate power. For conservatives, fascism is totalitarianism masquerading as the nanny state.\nA new book by Yale philosopher Jason Stanley is the latest attempt to clarify what fascism is and how it functions in the modern world. Stanley focuses on propaganda and rhetoric, so his book is largely about the tropes and narratives that drive fascist politics.\nI spoke with him recently about what fascism looks like today, why the destruction of truth is so essential to fascist movements, and whether he thinks it’s accurate to call President Donald Trump a fascist, as some have.\nA lightly edited transcript of our conversation follows.\nSean Illing\nAlmost everyone means something different when they use the word “fascism.” What do you mean by it?\nJason Stanley\nI think of fascism as a method of politics. It’s a rhetoric, a way of running for power. Of course, that’s connected to fascist ideology, because fascist ideology centers on power. But I really see fascism as a technique to gain power.\nPeople are always asking, “Is such-and-such politician really a fascist?” Which is really just another way of asking if this person has a particular set of beliefs or an ideology, but again, I don’t really think of a fascist as someone who holds a set of beliefs. They’re using a certain technique to acquire and retain power.\nSean Illing\nSo fascism isn’t a discrete category — it’s a spectrum? Or a sliding scale?\nJason Stanley\nRight. And my book identifies the various techniques that fascists tend to adopt, and shows how someone can be more fascist or less fascist in their politics. The key thing is that fascist politics is about identifying enemies, appealing to the in-group (usually the majority group), and smashing truth and replacing it with power.\nSean Illing\nWe’ll get into some more of those techniques, but I’m curious why you think fascism is so hard to pin down as an ideology. People on the left see fascism as the endpoint of right-wing reactionary thinking, and people on the right see fascism as nanny-state totalitarianism. Obviously, it can’t be both of these things.\nJason Stanley\nI think it’s clearly right-wing. Part of the problem is that “right” and “left” are tricky to talk about, and it’s true that there are dangerous forms of extremism on both sides, but fascism tilts pretty heavily to the right in my view.\nIf you think about fascism as a sliding scale, ordinary conservative politics is going to find itself somewhere on that scale — which is not to say that it’s fascist at all, any more than ordinary Democratic politics is communist. But just as extreme versions of communism suppress liberty on behalf of radical equality, so too do extreme versions of right-wing politics, namely fascism, suppress liberty in favor of tradition and dominance and power.\nSean Illing\nYour specialty is propaganda and rhetoric, and in the book you describe fascism as a collection of tropes and narratives. So what, exactly, is the story fascists are spinning?\nJason Stanley\nIn the past, fascist politics would focus on the dominant cultural group. The goal is to make them feel like victims, to make them feel like they’ve lost something and that the thing they’ve lost has been taken from them by a specific enemy, usually some minority out-group or some opposing nation.\nThis is why fascism flourishes in moments of great anxiety, because you can connect that anxiety with fake loss. The story is typically that a once-great society has been destroyed by liberalism or feminism or cultural Marxism or whatever, and you make the dominant group feel angry and resentful about the loss of their status and power. Almost every manifestation of fascism mirrors this general narrative. \nSean Illing\nWhy is the destruction of truth, as a shared ideal, so critical to the fascist project?\nJason Stanley\nIt’s important because truth is the heart of liberal democracy. The two ideals of liberal democracy are liberty and equality. If your belief system is shot through with lies, you’re not free. Nobody thinks of the citizens of North Korea as free, because their actions are controlled by lies.\nTruth is required to act freely. Freedom requires knowledge, and in order to act freely in the world, you need to know what the world is and know what you’re doing. You only know what you’re doing if you have access to the truth. So freedom requires truth, and so to smash freedom you must smash truth.\nSean Illing\nThere’s a great line from the philosopher Hannah Arendt, I think in her book about totalitarianism, where she says that fascists are never content to merely lie; they must transform their lie into a new reality, and they must persuade people to believe in the unreality they’ve created. And if you get people to do that, you can convince them to do anything.\nJason Stanley\nI think that’s right. Part of what fascist politics does is get people to disassociate from reality. You get them to sign on to this fantasy version of reality, usually a nationalist narrative about the decline of the country and the need for a strong leader to return it to greatness, and from then on their anchor isn’t the world around them — it’s the leader.\nSean Illing\nThis is partly why I think of fascism as a kind of anti-politics. I remember reading a quote from Joseph Goebbels, who was the chief propagandist for the Nazis, and he said that what he was doing was more like art than politics. By which he meant their task was to create an alternative mythical reality for Germans that was more exciting and purposeful than the humdrum reality of liberal democratic politics, and that’s why mass media was so essential the rise of Nazism.\nJason Stanley\nThat’s so interesting. The thing is, people willingly adopt the mythical past. Fascists are always telling a story about a glorious past that’s been lost, and they tap into this nostalgia. So when you fight back against fascism, you’ve got one hand tied behind your back, because the truth is messy and complex and the mythical story is always clear and compelling and entertaining. It’s hard to undercut that with facts.\nSean Illing\nThis is probably a good time to pivot to the glittering elephant in the room: Donald Trump. Is he a fascist?\nJason Stanley\nI make the case in my book that he practices fascist politics. Now, that doesn’t mean his government is a fascist government. For one thing, I think it’s very difficult to say what a fascist government is.\nFor another thing, I think the current movement of leaders who use these techniques (Vladimir Putin in Russia, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan in Turkey, Viktor Orbán in Hungary, to name a few) all seek to keep the trappings of democratic institutions, but their goal is to reorient them around their own cult of personality.\nAgain, I wouldn’t claim — not yet, at least — that Trump is presiding over a fascist government, but he is very clearly using fascist techniques to excite his base and erode liberal democratic institutions, and that’s very troubling.\nBut the blame there is as much on the Republican Party as it is on Trump, because none of this would matter if they were willing to check Trump. So far, they’ve chosen loyalty to Trump over loyalty to rule of law.\nSean Illing\nIn the book, you imply that there’s something inherently fascist about American politics, or at the very least that fascism has always been a latent force in America. Can you elaborate on that?\nJason Stanley\nWell, the Ku Klux Klan deeply affected Adolf Hitler. He explicitly praised the 1924 Immigration Act, which severely limited the number of immigrants allowed to enter the US, as a useful model.\nThe 1920s and the 1930s was a very fascist time in the United States. You’ve got very patriarchal family values and a politics of resentment aimed at black Americans and other groups as internal threats, and this gets exported to Europe.\nSo we have a long history of genocide against native peoples and anti-black racism and anti-immigration hysteria, and at the same time there’s a strain of American exceptionalism, which manifests as a kind of mythological history and encourages Americans to think of their own country as a unique force for good.\nThis doesn’t make America a fascist country, but all of these ingredients are easily channeled into a fascist politics.\nSean Illing\nAnd yet at the same time there are countervailing forces that push us in the opposite direction, and so America exists in this perpetual tension between liberal democracy and reactionary fascism.\nJason Stanley\nAbsolutely. America is exceptional in good ways as well.\nWe have an exceptional devotion to liberty and equality, as embodied in our struggle for civil rights and our fight against fascism in World War II. I’m corny about these things, and I believe America has had truly great moments and has made a lot of progress.\nBut, as you said, the fascist threat is always lurking, and we just have to be aware of it. \nSean Illing\nWhat does your book have to say about the way forward? If we are indeed threatened by fascist movements, both here and abroad, what can citizens and governments do about it?\nJason Stanley\nWe should heed the warning of the poem on the side of the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum, which says, “First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out because I was not Jewish. Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak for me.” At a certain point it’s too late.\nWe learned first from that poem who the targets are. The targets are leftists, minorities, labor unions, and anyone or any institution that isn’t glorified in the fascist narrative. And even if you’re not in any of those groups, you have to protect those who are, and you have to protect them from the very beginning. Simple acts of courage early on will save you impossible acts of courage later.\nTo be clear, this isn’t alarmist. We’re not on the brink of some fascist takeover. But there are reasons to be concerned, and we should always be on guard — that’s the lesson of history. Our weapons are our high ideals of liberty and equality, and we have to fight to keep those American ideals.\nWe’re fortunate enough to have liberty and equality baked into our founding ideals. We have a long history of people appealing to those ideals and saying, “We might disagree on a number of things but we agree that truth, liberty, equality are things we stand up for.” So whatever happens, we have to continually double down on those ideals — that’s what will save us.\nThis article was originally published on September 19, 2018."},{"@context":"https://schema.org","@type":"BreadcrumbList","itemListElement":[{"@type":"ListItem","position":1,"name":"Politics","item":"https://www.vox.com/politics"}]}]</script><link rel="preload" as="image" imageSrcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=376 376w, 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7.5-.4-4-3.1-6.5-6.6-6.5-4 0-6.7 3.8-6.7 7 0 3.6 2.5 6 5.8 6 6.9 0 8.8-6.5 13.1-12.3C92.9 51.9 96 58 101.3 58c6.3 0 12.1-5.4 15.1-9.2l-.6-.9c-1.9 1.9-3.8 3.1-6 3.1-3.9 0-6.7-8.4-8.8-18.6 1.3-1.7 3.3-6.1 4.7-7.7.9 1.8 2.9 5.2 7.5 5.2zm133.7-13.4h2.1l.2-1h-26l-.2 1h3.8c3.3 0 6 2.3 6 6.8 0 2.6-1.1 5.8-2.9 9.8L213 70.4 208.7 22c-.4-3.8 1.6-5.5 5.8-5.5h2.4l.2-1h-36.7l-.4 1h2.3c2.9 0 4 1.8 4.3 5.2l6.6 62.7h15.4l25.9-54.8c4.2-8.1 8.3-13.1 12.4-13.1z"></path></svg></a><div class="_1bn7g9f7">How fascism works</div><div class="_1bn7g9f9"><button aria-controls="drawer_:Rb6:" aria-label="Open Drawer" class="_1bn7g9fg"><svg width="23" height="17" class="_1bn7g9fb" viewBox="0 0 23 17" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2000/svg"><line x1="0.867188" y1="1.53857" x2="22.8672" y2="1.53857" stroke="currentColor" stroke-width="2"></line><line x1="0.867188" y1="8.53857" x2="22.8672" y2="8.53857" stroke="currentColor" stroke-width="2"></line><line x1="0.867188" y1="15.5386" x2="22.8672" y2="15.5386" 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class="duet--article--lede duet--page-layout--standard-article"><div class="duet--ledes--standard-lede _135mano0 _1agbrix3"><div class="_135mano1"><div class="dz06u40"><div class="dz06u42"><span class="_160ma52s"><ul class="_1g6d7eud"><li class=""><a href="/politics" class="_1g6d7eu3 xkp0cg4">Politics</a></li></ul></span></div><div class=""><h1 class="h74scy1 h74scy0 xkp0cg9 xkp0cg8">How fascism works</h1><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup h74scy9 h74scy8 xkp0cg9">A Yale philosopher on fascism, truth, and Donald Trump.</p></div></div></div><div class=""><div class="_135mano3"><div class="_160ma521 _160ma520"><div class="_160ma527 _160ma52d"><div class="duet--article--article-byline xkp0cg9 _15r56j10"><p class=""><span>by</span> <span><span></span> <span class="_15r56j12 _15r56j13"><a href="/authors/sean-illing">Sean Illing</a></span></span></p></div><span class="duet--article--timestamp _1rf9w8o3 _1rf9w8o1 _1rf9w8o0 xkp0cg4 xkp0cg9">Updated <time 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srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=376 376w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=384 384w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=415 415w, 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https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=750 750w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=828 828w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=1080 1080w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=1200 1200w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=1440 1440w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=1920 1920w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C6.3752276867031%2C99.111111111111%2C81.238615664845&w=2400"/></div></div><div class="duet--media--caption xptnl10"><figcaption class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup xkp0cg1 xptnl12">Nearly 100,000 Nazi storm troopers are gathered to listen to a 1933 speech by Adolf Hitler on “Brown Shirt Day.”</figcaption> <cite class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup xkp0cg1 xptnl11">Shutterstock</cite></div></div></div></div><div class="_135mano5"><div class="_1jvzqea0"></div></div></div><div id="zephr-anchor" class="_1agbrixy"><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">“Fascism” is a word that gets tossed around pretty loosely these days, usually as an epithet to discredit someone else’s politics.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">One consequence is that no one really knows what the term means anymore. Liberals see fascism as the culmination of conservative thinking: an authoritarian, nationalist, and racist system of government organized around corporate power. For conservatives, fascism is totalitarianism masquerading as the nanny state.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">A new book by Yale philosopher <a href="https://www.amazon.com/How-Fascism-Works-Politics-Them/dp/0525511830">Jason Stanley</a> is the latest attempt to clarify what fascism is and how it functions in the modern world. Stanley focuses on propaganda and rhetoric, so his book is largely about the tropes and narratives that drive fascist politics.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">I spoke with him recently about what fascism looks like today, why the destruction of truth is so essential to fascist movements, and whether he thinks it’s accurate to <a href="https://newrepublic.com/minutes/124205/yes-donald-trump-fascist">call</a> President Donald Trump a <a href="https://www.salon.com/2015/07/25/donald_trump_is_an_actual_fascist_what_his_surging_popularity_says_about_the_gop_base/">fascist</a>, as <a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/this-is-how-fascism-comes-to-america/2016/05/17/c4e32c58-1c47-11e6-8c7b-6931e66333e7_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.0f7d1dede9ce">some have</a>.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">A lightly edited transcript of our conversation follows.</p></div><div class="duet--article--block-placement _80slsf1 _80slsf0 duet--article--article-body-component"><hr class="duet--article--divider _1agbrixi w7vpv0"/></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">Almost everyone means something different when they use the word “fascism.” What do you mean by it?</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">I think of fascism as a method of politics. It’s a rhetoric, a way of running for power. Of course, that’s connected to fascist ideology, because fascist ideology centers on power. But I really see fascism as a technique to gain power.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">People are always asking, “Is such-and-such politician really a fascist?” Which is really just another way of asking if this person has a particular set of beliefs or an ideology, but again, I don’t really think of a fascist as someone who holds a set of beliefs. They’re using a certain technique to acquire and retain power.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">So fascism isn’t a discrete category — it’s a spectrum? Or a sliding scale?</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">Right. And my book identifies the various techniques that fascists tend to adopt, and shows how someone can be more fascist or less fascist in their politics. The key thing is that fascist politics is about identifying enemies, appealing to the in-group (usually the majority group), and smashing truth and replacing it with power.</p></div><div class="duet--article--block-placement _80slsf2 _80slsf0 duet--article--article-body-component"><div class="duet--article--article-pullquote _1iohv3z0"><div class="_1iohv3z1"></div><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup _1iohv3z2 xkp0cg8">“Freedom requires truth, and so to smash freedom you must smash truth”</p></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">We’ll get into some more of those techniques, but I’m curious why you think fascism is so hard to pin down as an ideology. People on the left see fascism as the endpoint of right-wing reactionary thinking, and people on the right see fascism as nanny-state totalitarianism. Obviously, it can’t be both of these things.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">I think it’s clearly right-wing. Part of the problem is that “right” and “left” are tricky to talk about, and it’s true that there are dangerous forms of extremism on both sides, but fascism tilts pretty heavily to the right in my view.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">If you think about fascism as a sliding scale, ordinary conservative politics is going to find itself somewhere on that scale — which is not to say that it’s fascist at all, any more than ordinary Democratic politics is communist. But just as extreme versions of communism suppress liberty on behalf of radical equality, so too do extreme versions of right-wing politics, namely fascism, suppress liberty in favor of tradition and dominance and power.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">Your specialty is propaganda and rhetoric, and in the book you describe fascism as a collection of tropes and narratives. So what, exactly, is the story fascists are spinning?</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">In the past, fascist politics would focus on the dominant cultural group. The goal is to make them feel like victims, to make them feel like they’ve lost something and that the thing they’ve lost has been taken from them by a specific enemy, usually some minority out-group or some opposing nation.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">This is why fascism flourishes in moments of great anxiety, because you can connect that anxiety with fake loss. The story is typically that a once-great society has been destroyed by liberalism or feminism or cultural Marxism or whatever, and you make the dominant group feel angry and resentful about the loss of their status and power. Almost every manifestation of fascism mirrors this general narrative. </p></div><div class="duet--article--block-placement _80slsf2 _80slsf0 duet--article--article-body-component"><div class="duet--article--article-pullquote _1iohv3z0"><div class="_1iohv3z1"></div><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup _1iohv3z2 xkp0cg8">“We’re not on the brink of some fascist takeover. But there are reasons to be concerned, and we should always be on guard — that’s the lesson of history.”</p></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">Why is the destruction of truth, as a shared ideal, so critical to the fascist project?</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">It’s important because truth is the heart of liberal democracy. The two ideals of liberal democracy are liberty and equality. If your belief system is shot through with lies, you’re not free. Nobody thinks of the citizens of North Korea as free, because their actions are controlled by lies.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">Truth is required to act freely. Freedom requires knowledge, and in order to act freely in the world, you need to know what the world is and know what you’re doing. You only know what you’re doing if you have access to the truth. So freedom requires truth, and so to smash freedom you must smash truth.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">There’s a great line from the philosopher Hannah Arendt, I think in her <a href="https://www.amazon.com/Origins-Totalitarianism-Hannah-Arendt/dp/0156701537">book about totalitarianism</a>, where she says that fascists are never content to merely lie; they must transform their lie into a new reality, and they must persuade people to believe in the unreality they’ve created. And if you get people to do that, you can convince them to do anything.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">I think that’s right. Part of what fascist politics does is get people to disassociate from reality. You get them to sign on to this fantasy version of reality, usually a nationalist narrative about the decline of the country and the need for a strong leader to return it to greatness, and from then on their anchor isn’t the world around them — it’s the leader.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">This is partly why I think of fascism as a kind of anti-politics. I remember reading a quote from <a href="https://www.nybooks.com/articles/1975/02/06/fascinating-fascism/">Joseph Goebbels</a>, who was the chief propagandist for the Nazis, and he said that what he was doing was more like art than politics. By which he meant their task was to create an alternative mythical reality for Germans that was more exciting and purposeful than the humdrum reality of liberal democratic politics, and that’s why mass media was so essential the rise of Nazism.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">That’s so interesting. The thing is, people willingly adopt the mythical past. Fascists are always telling a story about a glorious past that’s been lost, and they tap into this nostalgia. So when you fight back against fascism, you’ve got one hand tied behind your back, because the truth is messy and complex and the mythical story is always clear and compelling and entertaining. It’s hard to undercut that with facts.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">This is probably a good time to pivot to the glittering elephant in the room: Donald Trump. Is he a fascist?</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">I make the case in my book that he practices fascist politics. Now, that doesn’t mean his government is a fascist government. For one thing, I think it’s very difficult to say what a fascist government is.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">For another thing, I think the current movement of leaders who use these techniques (Vladimir Putin in Russia, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan in Turkey, <a href="/policy-and-politics/2018/9/13/17823488/hungary-democracy-authoritarianism-trump">Viktor Orbán in Hungary</a>, to name a few) all seek to keep the trappings of democratic institutions, but their goal is to reorient them around their own cult of personality.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">Again, I wouldn’t claim — not yet, at least — that Trump is presiding over a fascist government, but he is very clearly using fascist techniques to excite his base and erode liberal democratic institutions, and that’s very troubling.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">But the blame there is as much on the Republican Party as it is on Trump, because none of this would matter if they were willing to check Trump. So far, they’ve chosen loyalty to Trump over loyalty to rule of law.</p></div><div class="duet--article--block-placement _80slsf2 _80slsf0 duet--article--article-body-component"><div class="duet--article--article-pullquote _1iohv3z0"><div class="_1iohv3z1"></div><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup _1iohv3z2 xkp0cg8">“Part of what fascist politics does is get people to disassociate from reality”</p></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">In the book, you imply that there’s something inherently fascist about American politics, or at the very least that fascism has always been a latent force in America. Can you elaborate on that?</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">Well, the Ku Klux Klan deeply affected Adolf Hitler. He <a href="https://www.amazon.com/dp/0691172420/ref=as_at?creativeASIN=0691172420&linkCode=w61&imprToken=IuoxjWUEhv0sZQeQwkgOOg&slotNum=1&tag=thneyo0f-20">explicitly praised</a> the <a href="https://history.state.gov/milestones/1921-1936/immigration-act">1924 Immigration Act</a>, which severely limited the number of immigrants allowed to enter the US, as a useful model.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">The 1920s and the 1930s was a very fascist time in the United States. You’ve got very patriarchal family values and a politics of resentment aimed at black Americans and other groups as internal threats, and this gets exported to Europe.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">So we have a long history of genocide against native peoples and anti-black racism and anti-immigration hysteria, and at the same time there’s a strain of American exceptionalism, which manifests as a kind of mythological history and encourages Americans to think of their own country as a unique force for good.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">This doesn’t make America a fascist country, but all of these ingredients are easily channeled into a fascist politics.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">And yet at the same time there are countervailing forces that push us in the opposite direction, and so America exists in this perpetual tension between liberal democracy and reactionary fascism.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">Absolutely. America is exceptional in good ways as well.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">We have an exceptional devotion to liberty and equality, as embodied in our struggle for civil rights and our fight against fascism in World War II. I’m corny about these things, and I believe America has had truly great moments and has made a lot of progress.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">But, as you said, the fascist threat is always lurking, and we just have to be aware of it. </p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="sean-illing" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Sean Illing</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">What does your book have to say about the way forward? If we are indeed threatened by fascist movements, both here and abroad, what can citizens and governments do about it?</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><div id="jason-stanley" class="_7ka5u2 _7ka5u0 duet--article--standard-heading xkp0cg0"><h3 class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup">Jason Stanley</h3></div></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">We should heed the warning of the poem on the side of <a href="https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/martin-niemoeller-first-they-came-for-the-socialists">the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum</a>, which says, “First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out because I was not Jewish. Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak for me.” At a certain point it’s too late.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">We learned first from that poem who the targets are. The targets are leftists, minorities, labor unions, and anyone or any institution that isn’t glorified in the fascist narrative. And even if you’re not in any of those groups, you have to protect those who are, and you have to protect them from the very beginning. Simple acts of courage early on will save you impossible acts of courage later.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">To be clear, this isn’t alarmist. We’re not on the brink of some fascist takeover. But there are reasons to be concerned, and we should always be on guard — that’s the lesson of history. Our weapons are our high ideals of liberty and equality, and we have to fight to keep those American ideals.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0">We’re fortunate enough to have liberty and equality baked into our founding ideals. We have a long history of people appealing to those ideals and saying, “We might disagree on a number of things but we agree that truth, liberty, equality are things we stand up for.” So whatever happens, we have to continually double down on those ideals — that’s what will save us.</p></div><div class="duet--article--article-body-component"><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup duet--article--standard-paragraph _1agbrixh lg8ac51 lg8ac50 xkp0cg0"><em>This article was originally published on September 19, 2018.</em></p></div><aside class="_1tzd3in0 _1agbrixx"><p class="_1tzd3in1">You’ve read <!-- -->1<!-- --> article<!-- --> in the last month</p><div class="_1tzd3in2"><div class="_1tzd3in3"><p class="_1tzd3in4">Here at Vox, we're unwavering in our commitment to covering the issues that matter most to you — threats to democracy, immigration, reproductive rights, the environment, and the rising polarization across this country.</p><p class="_1tzd3in4">Our mission is to provide clear, accessible journalism that empowers you to stay informed and engaged in shaping our world. 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_1k0rii0"></div><div class="ap1uvv2"><img alt="The not-so-subtle message of Trump's disturbing Cabinet picks" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="221px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=32 32w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=48 48w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=64 64w, 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https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=2400"/></div><div class="ap1uvv1"><div class=""><div class=""><div><div class="xkp0cg8 _1neefee9 _1neefee2"><a class="qcd9z1" href="/culture/387404/trump-cabinet-nominations-matt-gaetz-pete-hegseth-rfk-elon-musk-linda-mcmahon">The not-so-subtle message of Trump's disturbing Cabinet picks</a></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><div class=""><div class="ap1uvv0 qcd9z0"><div class="_1k0rii3 _1k0rii0"></div><div class="ap1uvv2"><img alt="International arrest warrants are out for Netanyahu and Gallant. What happens next?" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="221px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=32 32w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=48 48w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=64 64w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=96 96w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=128 128w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=256 256w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=376 376w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=384 384w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=415 415w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=480 480w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=540 540w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=640 640w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=750 750w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=828 828w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=1080 1080w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=1200 1200w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=1440 1440w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=1920 1920w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=2400"/></div><div class="ap1uvv1"><div class=""><div class=""><div><div class="xkp0cg8 _1neefee9 _1neefee2"><a class="qcd9z1" href="/israel/387191/icc-arrest-warrants-netanyahu">International arrest warrants are out for Netanyahu and Gallant. What happens next?</a></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><div class=""><div class="ap1uvv0 qcd9z0"><div class="_1k0rii3 _1k0rii0"></div><div class="ap1uvv2"><img alt="The myth that could cost Democrats the next election" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="221px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=32 32w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=48 48w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=64 64w, 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https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=415 415w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=480 480w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=540 540w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=640 640w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=750 750w, 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https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=2400"/></div><div class="ap1uvv1"><div class=""><div class=""><div><div class="xkp0cg8 _1neefee9 _1neefee2"><a class="qcd9z1" href="/politics/387155/kamala-harris-2024-election-democratic-turnout-swing-voters">The myth that could cost Democrats the next election</a></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><div class="a0d76n2"><div class="duet--content-cards--content-card _1agz5xb3 _1agz5xb0 qcd9z0 _1agz5xbj"><div class="_1agz5xb9 _1agz5xb6 _1agz5xbc _1agz5xbh"><img alt="Why 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href="/policy/387382/musk-trump-balance-budget-doge">Why Elon Musk can never balance the budget, in one chart</a></div></div><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup _1neefeej _1neefeee _1neefeef">Elon Musk wants to slash trillions in “waste.” Good luck, buddy!</p><div class="_1k0riid _1k0rii0"><span class="u2goo40">By </span><span class="u2goo41 xkp0cg4"><span><span>Dylan Matthews</span></span></span></div></div></div></div></div><div class="duet--content-cards--content-card _1agz5xb3 _1agz5xb0 qcd9z0"><div class="_1agz5xb9 _1agz5xb6 _1agz5xbc _1agz5xbh"><img alt="The unexpected place that could become an immigration flashpoint under Trump" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="_1agz5xbf mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg 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384w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=415 415w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=480 480w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=540 540w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=640 640w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=750 750w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=828 828w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=1080 1080w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=1200 1200w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=1440 1440w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=1920 1920w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-969781380.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.060886507549924%2C0%2C99.8782269849%2C100&w=2400"/></div><div class="_1agz5xbi"><div class=""><div class=""><div class="_1k0rii3 _1k0rii0"><span class="xkp0cg6 xkp0cg4 _1k0riia">Trump 2.0, explained</span><span class="duet--article--timestamp _1rf9w8o2 _1rf9w8o0 xkp0cg4 _1agbrixq"><time dateTime="2024-11-23T11:00:00+00:00">Nov 23</time></span></div><div><div class="xkp0cg8 _1neefee5 _1neefee2"><a class="qcd9z1" href="/politics/387525/trump-canada-immigration-border">The unexpected place that could become an immigration flashpoint under Trump</a></div></div><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup _1neefeej _1neefeee _1neefeef">Trump’s immigration crackdown could extend to the US-Canada border.</p><div class="_1k0riid _1k0rii0"><span class="u2goo40">By </span><span class="u2goo41 xkp0cg4"><span><span>Nicole Narea</span></span></span></div></div></div></div></div><div class="duet--content-cards--content-card _1agz5xb3 _1agz5xb0 qcd9z0"><div class="_1agz5xb9 _1agz5xb6 _1agz5xbc _1agz5xbh"><img alt="Biden wants to free you from all those subscriptions you meant to cancel but didn’t" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="_1agz5xbf mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="100px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=32 32w, 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https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=640 640w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=750 750w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=828 828w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=1080 1080w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=1200 1200w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=1440 1440w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=1920 1920w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.666666666667%2C0%2C66.666666666667%2C100&w=2400"/><img alt="Biden wants to free you from all those subscriptions you meant to cancel but didn’t" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="_1agz5xbg mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="195px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=32 32w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=48 48w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=64 64w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=96 96w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=128 128w, 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https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=640 640w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=750 750w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=828 828w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=1080 1080w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=1200 1200w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=1440 1440w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=1920 1920w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/08/gettyimages-1258715466_300203.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0%2C100%2C100&w=2400"/></div><div class="_1agz5xbi"><div class=""><div class=""><div class="_1k0rii3 _1k0rii0"><span class="_1g6d7eu0 xkp0cg6 xkp0cg4">Policy</span><span class="duet--article--timestamp _1rf9w8o2 _1rf9w8o0 xkp0cg4 _1agbrixq"><time dateTime="2024-11-22T21:38:54+00:00">Nov 22</time></span></div><div><div class="xkp0cg8 _1neefee5 _1neefee2"><a class="qcd9z1" href="/policy/366838/biden-subscription-membership-junk-fees">Biden wants to free you from all those subscriptions you meant to cancel but didn’t</a></div></div><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup _1neefeej _1neefeee _1neefeef">It’s the latest way Biden is trying to combat pesky “junk fees” driving up prices.</p><div class="_1k0riid _1k0rii0"><span class="u2goo40">By </span><span class="u2goo41 xkp0cg4"><span><span>Nicole Narea</span></span></span></div></div></div></div></div><div class="duet--content-cards--content-card _1agz5xb3 _1agz5xb0 qcd9z0"><div class="_1agz5xb9 _1agz5xb6 _1agz5xbc _1agz5xbh"><img alt="The not-so-subtle message of Trump's disturbing Cabinet picks" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="_1agz5xbf mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="100px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=16 16w, 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256w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=376 376w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=384 384w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=415 415w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=480 480w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=540 540w, 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https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=1440 1440w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=1920 1920w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.662941439428%2C0%2C66.674117121144%2C100&w=2400"/><img alt="The not-so-subtle message of Trump's disturbing Cabinet picks" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="_1agz5xbg mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="195px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=32 32w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=48 48w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=64 64w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=96 96w, 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https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=1080 1080w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=1200 1200w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=1440 1440w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=1920 1920w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/GettyImages-2185934538.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0%2C0.0055872164487667%2C100%2C99.988825567102&w=2400"/></div><div class="_1agz5xbi"><div class=""><div class=""><div class="_1k0rii3 _1k0rii0"><span class="_1g6d7eu0 xkp0cg6 xkp0cg4">Culture</span><span class="duet--article--timestamp _1rf9w8o2 _1rf9w8o0 xkp0cg4 _1agbrixq"><time dateTime="2024-11-22T20:50:00+00:00">Nov 22</time></span></div><div><div class="xkp0cg8 _1neefee5 _1neefee2"><a class="qcd9z1" href="/culture/387404/trump-cabinet-nominations-matt-gaetz-pete-hegseth-rfk-elon-musk-linda-mcmahon">The not-so-subtle message of Trump's disturbing Cabinet picks</a></div></div><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup _1neefeej _1neefeee _1neefeef">An alarming number of those poised to be in the president-elect’s inner circle are accused of sexual misconduct.</p><div class="_1k0riid _1k0rii0"><span class="u2goo40">By </span><span class="u2goo41 xkp0cg4"><span><span>Constance Grady</span></span></span></div></div></div></div></div><div class="duet--content-cards--content-card _1agz5xb3 _1agz5xb0 qcd9z0"><div class="_1agz5xb9 _1agz5xb6 _1agz5xbc _1agz5xbh"><img alt="International arrest warrants are out for Netanyahu and Gallant. What happens next?" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="_1agz5xbf mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="100px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=32 32w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=48 48w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=64 64w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=96 96w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=128 128w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=256 256w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=376 376w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=384 384w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=415 415w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=480 480w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=540 540w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=640 640w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=750 750w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=828 828w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=1080 1080w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=1200 1200w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=1440 1440w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=1920 1920w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.675%2C0%2C66.65%2C100&w=2400"/><img alt="International arrest warrants are out for Netanyahu and Gallant. What happens next?" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="_1agz5xbg mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="195px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=32 32w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=48 48w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=64 64w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=96 96w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=128 128w, 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https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=640 640w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=750 750w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=828 828w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=1080 1080w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=1200 1200w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=1440 1440w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=1920 1920w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=2048 2048w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=2400 2400w" src="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2180882096.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.012500000000003%2C0%2C99.975%2C100&w=2400"/></div><div class="_1agz5xbi"><div class=""><div class=""><div class="_1k0rii3 _1k0rii0"><span class="_1g6d7eu0 xkp0cg6 xkp0cg4">Israel</span><span class="duet--article--timestamp _1rf9w8o2 _1rf9w8o0 xkp0cg4 _1agbrixq"><time dateTime="2024-11-22T15:00:00+00:00">Nov 22</time></span></div><div><div class="xkp0cg8 _1neefee5 _1neefee2"><a class="qcd9z1" href="/israel/387191/icc-arrest-warrants-netanyahu">International arrest warrants are out for Netanyahu and Gallant. What happens next?</a></div></div><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup _1neefeej _1neefeee _1neefeef">The International Criminal Court issued warrants over allegations of war crimes in Gaza.</p><div class="_1k0riid _1k0rii0"><span class="u2goo40">By </span><span class="u2goo41 xkp0cg4"><span><span>Ellen Ioanes</span></span></span></div></div></div></div></div><div class="duet--content-cards--content-card _1agz5xb3 _1agz5xb0 qcd9z0 _1agz5xbk"><div class="_1agz5xb9 _1agz5xb6 _1agz5xbc _1agz5xbh"><img alt="The myth that could cost Democrats the next election" data-chromatic="ignore" loading="lazy" decoding="async" data-nimg="fill" class="_1agz5xbf mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="100px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.671166306695%2C0%2C66.657667386609%2C100&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=16.671166306695%2C0%2C66.657667386609%2C100&w=32 32w, 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class="_1agz5xbg mvmjsc0" style="position:absolute;height:100%;width:100%;left:0;top:0;right:0;bottom:0;color:transparent;background-size:cover;background-position:50% 50%;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-image:url("data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2000/svg' %3E%3Cfilter id='b' color-interpolation-filters='sRGB'%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3CfeColorMatrix values='1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 100 -1' result='s'/%3E%3CfeFlood x='0' y='0' width='100%25' height='100%25'/%3E%3CfeComposite operator='out' in='s'/%3E%3CfeComposite in2='SourceGraphic'/%3E%3CfeGaussianBlur stdDeviation='20'/%3E%3C/filter%3E%3Cimage width='100%25' height='100%25' x='0' y='0' preserveAspectRatio='none' style='filter: url(%23b);' href='data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAQAAAC1HAwCAAAAC0lEQVR42mN8+R8AAtcB6oaHtZcAAAAASUVORK5CYII='/%3E%3C/svg%3E")" sizes="195px" srcSet="https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=16 16w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=32 32w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=48 48w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=64 64w, https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/11/gettyimages-2182557090.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&crop=0.0067494600431957%2C0%2C99.986501079914%2C100&w=96 96w, 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class="xkp0cg8 _1neefee5 _1neefee2"><a class="qcd9z1" href="/politics/387155/kamala-harris-2024-election-democratic-turnout-swing-voters">The myth that could cost Democrats the next election</a></div></div><p class="duet--article--dangerously-set-cms-markup _1neefeej _1neefeee _1neefeef">Progressives staying home (almost certainly) didn’t cost Kamala Harris the election.</p><div class="_1k0riid _1k0rii0"><span class="u2goo40">By </span><span class="u2goo41 xkp0cg4"><span><span>Eric Levitz</span></span></span></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><div class="duet--ad--native-ad-linkset _1yq350v2 _1yq350v3 _1yq350v8 hidden" data-native-ad-id="container"><div><div class="hidden"><div class="dynamic-native-ad-native_ad_linkset_link"></div></div><a href="/" aria-label="Advertisement"><div class=""><div class="_1yq350v5"><span data-native-ad-id="preamble" class="_1yq350v6 _1yq350v7">Advertiser Content From</span><div><img data-native-ad-id="logo" src="" alt="Sponsor Logo" 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Liberals see fascism as the culmination of conservative thinking: an authoritarian, nationalist, and racist system of government organized around corporate power. For conservatives, fascism is totalitarianism masquerading as the nanny state."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"A new book by Yale philosopher \u003ca href=\"https://www.amazon.com/How-Fascism-Works-Politics-Them/dp/0525511830\"\u003eJason Stanley\u003c/a\u003e is the latest attempt to clarify what fascism is and how it functions in the modern world. Stanley focuses on propaganda and rhetoric, so his book is largely about the tropes and narratives that drive fascist politics."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"I spoke with him recently about what fascism looks like today, why the destruction of truth is so essential to fascist movements, and whether he thinks it\u0026rsquo;s accurate to \u003ca href=\"https://newrepublic.com/minutes/124205/yes-donald-trump-fascist\"\u003ecall\u003c/a\u003e President Donald Trump a \u003ca href=\"https://www.salon.com/2015/07/25/donald_trump_is_an_actual_fascist_what_his_surging_popularity_says_about_the_gop_base/\"\u003efascist\u003c/a\u003e, as \u003ca href=\"https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/this-is-how-fascism-comes-to-america/2016/05/17/c4e32c58-1c47-11e6-8c7b-6931e66333e7_story.html?noredirect=on\u0026utm_term=.0f7d1dede9ce\"\u003esome have\u003c/a\u003e."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"A lightly edited transcript of our conversation follows."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreSeparatorBlockType","__typename":"CoreSeparatorBlockType","blockName":"coreSeparator","placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"Almost everyone means something different when they use the word \u0026ldquo;fascism.\u0026rdquo; What do you mean by it?"},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"I think of fascism as a method of politics. It\u0026rsquo;s a rhetoric, a way of running for power. Of course, that\u0026rsquo;s connected to fascist ideology, because fascist ideology centers on power. But I really see fascism as a technique to gain power."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"People are always asking, \u0026ldquo;Is such-and-such politician really a fascist?\u0026rdquo; Which is really just another way of asking if this person has a particular set of beliefs or an ideology, but again, I don\u0026rsquo;t really think of a fascist as someone who holds a set of beliefs. They\u0026rsquo;re using a certain technique to acquire and retain power."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"So fascism isn\u0026rsquo;t a discrete category \u0026mdash; it\u0026rsquo;s a spectrum? Or a sliding scale?"},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"Right. And my book identifies the various techniques that fascists tend to adopt, and shows how someone can be more fascist or less fascist in their politics. The key thing is that fascist politics is about identifying enemies, appealing to the in-group (usually the majority group), and smashing truth and replacing it with power."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CorePullquoteBlockType","__typename":"CorePullquoteBlockType","contents":{"html":"“Freedom requires truth, and so to smash freedom you must smash truth”"},"citation":{"html":""},"placement":"left"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"We\u0026rsquo;ll get into some more of those techniques, but I\u0026rsquo;m curious why you think fascism is so hard to pin down as an ideology. People on the left see fascism as the endpoint of right-wing reactionary thinking, and people on the right see fascism as nanny-state totalitarianism. Obviously, it can\u0026rsquo;t be both of these things."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"I think it\u0026rsquo;s clearly right-wing. Part of the problem is that \u0026ldquo;right\u0026rdquo; and \u0026ldquo;left\u0026rdquo; are tricky to talk about, and it\u0026rsquo;s true that there are dangerous forms of extremism on both sides, but fascism tilts pretty heavily to the right in my view."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"If you think about fascism as a sliding scale, ordinary conservative politics is going to find itself somewhere on that scale \u0026mdash; which is not to say that it\u0026rsquo;s fascist at all, any more than ordinary Democratic politics is communist. But just as extreme versions of communism suppress liberty on behalf of radical equality, so too do extreme versions of right-wing politics, namely fascism, suppress liberty in favor of tradition and dominance and power."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"Your specialty is propaganda and rhetoric, and in the book you describe fascism as a collection of tropes and narratives. So what, exactly, is the story fascists are spinning?"},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"In the past, fascist politics would focus on the dominant cultural group. The goal is to make them feel like victims, to make them feel like they\u0026rsquo;ve lost something and that the thing they\u0026rsquo;ve lost has been taken from them by a specific enemy, usually some minority out-group or some opposing nation."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"This is why fascism flourishes in moments of great anxiety, because you can connect that anxiety with fake loss. The story is typically that a once-great society has been destroyed by liberalism or feminism or cultural Marxism or whatever, and you make the dominant group feel angry and resentful about the loss of their status and power. Almost every manifestation of fascism mirrors this general narrative. "},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CorePullquoteBlockType","__typename":"CorePullquoteBlockType","contents":{"html":"“We’re not on the brink of some fascist takeover. But there are reasons to be concerned, and we should always be on guard — that’s the lesson of history.”"},"citation":{"html":""},"placement":"left"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"Why is the destruction of truth, as a shared ideal, so critical to the fascist project?"},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"It\u0026rsquo;s important because truth is the heart of liberal democracy. The two ideals of liberal democracy are liberty and equality. If your belief system is shot through with lies, you\u0026rsquo;re not free. Nobody thinks of the citizens of North Korea as free, because their actions are controlled by lies."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"Truth is required to act freely. Freedom requires knowledge, and in order to act freely in the world, you need to know what the world is and know what you\u0026rsquo;re doing. You only know what you\u0026rsquo;re doing if you have access to the truth. So freedom requires truth, and so to smash freedom you must smash truth."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"There\u0026rsquo;s a great line from the philosopher Hannah Arendt, I think in her \u003ca href=\"https://www.amazon.com/Origins-Totalitarianism-Hannah-Arendt/dp/0156701537\"\u003ebook about totalitarianism\u003c/a\u003e, where she says that fascists are never content to merely lie; they must transform their lie into a new reality, and they must persuade people to believe in the unreality they\u0026rsquo;ve created. And if you get people to do that, you can convince them to do anything."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"I think that\u0026rsquo;s right. Part of what fascist politics does is get people to disassociate from reality. You get them to sign on to this fantasy version of reality, usually a nationalist narrative about the decline of the country and the need for a strong leader to return it to greatness, and from then on their anchor isn\u0026rsquo;t the world around them \u0026mdash; it\u0026rsquo;s the leader."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"This is partly why I think of fascism as a kind of anti-politics. I remember reading a quote from \u003ca href=\"https://www.nybooks.com/articles/1975/02/06/fascinating-fascism/\"\u003eJoseph Goebbels\u003c/a\u003e, who was the chief propagandist for the Nazis, and he said that what he was doing was more like art than politics. By which he meant their task was to create an alternative mythical reality for Germans that was more exciting and purposeful than the humdrum reality of liberal democratic politics, and that\u0026rsquo;s why mass media was so essential the rise of Nazism."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"That\u0026rsquo;s so interesting. The thing is, people willingly adopt the mythical past. Fascists are always telling a story about a glorious past that\u0026rsquo;s been lost, and they tap into this nostalgia. So when you fight back against fascism, you\u0026rsquo;ve got one hand tied behind your back, because the truth is messy and complex and the mythical story is always clear and compelling and entertaining. It\u0026rsquo;s hard to undercut that with facts."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"This is probably a good time to pivot to the glittering elephant in the room: Donald Trump. Is he a fascist?"},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"I make the case in my book that he practices fascist politics. Now, that doesn\u0026rsquo;t mean his government is a fascist government. For one thing, I think it\u0026rsquo;s very difficult to say what a fascist government is."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"For another thing, I think the current movement of leaders who use these techniques (Vladimir Putin in Russia, Recep Tayyip Erdo\u0026#287;an in Turkey, \u003ca href=\"https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/9/13/17823488/hungary-democracy-authoritarianism-trump\"\u003eViktor Orb\u0026aacute;n in Hungary\u003c/a\u003e, to name a few) all seek to keep the trappings of democratic institutions, but their goal is to reorient them around their own cult of personality."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"Again, I wouldn\u0026rsquo;t claim \u0026mdash; not yet, at least \u0026mdash; that Trump is presiding over a fascist government, but he is very clearly using fascist techniques to excite his base and erode liberal democratic institutions, and that\u0026rsquo;s very troubling."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"But the blame there is as much on the Republican Party as it is on Trump, because none of this would matter if they were willing to check Trump. So far, they\u0026rsquo;ve chosen loyalty to Trump over loyalty to rule of law."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CorePullquoteBlockType","__typename":"CorePullquoteBlockType","contents":{"html":"“Part of what fascist politics does is get people to disassociate from reality”"},"citation":{"html":""},"placement":"left"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"In the book, you imply that there\u0026rsquo;s something inherently fascist about American politics, or at the very least that fascism has always been a latent force in America. Can you elaborate on that?"},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"Well, the Ku Klux Klan deeply affected Adolf Hitler. He \u003ca href=\"https://www.amazon.com/dp/0691172420/ref=as_at?creativeASIN=0691172420\u0026linkCode=w61\u0026imprToken=IuoxjWUEhv0sZQeQwkgOOg\u0026slotNum=1\u0026tag=thneyo0f-20\"\u003eexplicitly praised\u003c/a\u003e the \u003ca href=\"https://history.state.gov/milestones/1921-1936/immigration-act\"\u003e1924 Immigration Act\u003c/a\u003e, which severely limited the number of immigrants allowed to enter the US, as a useful model."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"The 1920s and the 1930s was a very fascist time in the United States. You\u0026rsquo;ve got very patriarchal family values and a politics of resentment aimed at black Americans and other groups as internal threats, and this gets exported to Europe."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"So we have a long history of genocide against native peoples and anti-black racism and anti-immigration hysteria, and at the same time there\u0026rsquo;s a strain of American exceptionalism, which manifests as a kind of mythological history and encourages Americans to think of their own country as a unique force for good."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"This doesn\u0026rsquo;t make America a fascist country, but all of these ingredients are easily channeled into a fascist politics."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"And yet at the same time there are countervailing forces that push us in the opposite direction, and so America exists in this perpetual tension between liberal democracy and reactionary fascism."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"Absolutely. America is exceptional in good ways as well."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"We have an exceptional devotion to liberty and equality, as embodied in our struggle for civil rights and our fight against fascism in World War II. I\u0026rsquo;m corny about these things, and I believe America has had truly great moments and has made a lot of progress."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"But, as you said, the fascist threat is always lurking, and we just have to be aware of it. "},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Sean Illing"},"headingId":"sean-illing","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"What does your book have to say about the way forward? If we are indeed threatened by fascist movements, both here and abroad, what can citizens and governments do about it?"},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreHeadingBlockType","__typename":"CoreHeadingBlockType","contents":{"html":"Jason Stanley"},"headingId":"jason-stanley","level":3,"placement":"default"},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"We should heed the warning of the poem on the side of \u003ca href=\"https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/martin-niemoeller-first-they-came-for-the-socialists\"\u003ethe United States Holocaust Memorial Museum\u003c/a\u003e, which says, \u0026ldquo;First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out because I was not Jewish. Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak for me.\u0026rdquo; At a certain point it\u0026rsquo;s too late."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"We learned first from that poem who the targets are. The targets are leftists, minorities, labor unions, and anyone or any institution that isn\u0026rsquo;t glorified in the fascist narrative. And even if you\u0026rsquo;re not in any of those groups, you have to protect those who are, and you have to protect them from the very beginning. Simple acts of courage early on will save you impossible acts of courage later."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"To be clear, this isn\u0026rsquo;t alarmist. We\u0026rsquo;re not on the brink of some fascist takeover. But there are reasons to be concerned, and we should always be on guard \u0026mdash; that\u0026rsquo;s the lesson of history. Our weapons are our high ideals of liberty and equality, and we have to fight to keep those American ideals."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"We\u0026rsquo;re fortunate enough to have liberty and equality baked into our founding ideals. We have a long history of people appealing to those ideals and saying, \u0026ldquo;We might disagree on a number of things but we agree that truth, liberty, equality are things we stand up for.\u0026rdquo; So whatever happens, we have to continually double down on those ideals \u0026mdash; that\u0026rsquo;s what will save us."},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false},{"__isBlockType":"CoreParagraphBlockType","__typename":"CoreParagraphBlockType","contents":{"html":"\u003cem\u003eThis article was originally published on September 19, 2018.\u003c/em\u003e"},"dropcap":false,"endmark":false,"lead":false}],"__isResolvedResourceInterface":"PostResourceType","wpId":106238,"featuredImage":{"image":{"originalUrl":"https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90\u0026strip=all","wpId":106235,"id":"dngyOmltYWdlOjEwNjIzNQ==","title":"Nearly 100,000 Nazi storm troopers are gathered at Luitpold arena to listen to a 1933 speech by Adolf Hitler on ‘Brown Shirt Day.’","alt":"Nearly 100,000 Nazi storm troopers are gathered at Luitpold arena to listen to a 1933 speech by Adolf Hitler on ‘Brown Shirt Day.’","originalHeight":366,"originalWidth":450,"thumbnails":{"social":{"url":"https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90\u0026strip=all\u0026crop=0,15.094555546019,99.111111111111,63.799959946213","mimeType":"imageJpg","normalizedRatio":1.91,"cropCoordinates":{"height":63.79995994621349,"width":99.11111111111111}}}}},"__isContentResourceInterface":"PostResourceType","dek":{"plaintext":"A Yale philosopher on fascism, truth, and Donald Trump.","html":"A Yale philosopher on fascism, truth, and Donald Trump."},"robots":{"index":true,"follow":true},"canonicalUrlOverride":"","originalPublishedAt":"2018-09-19T12:10:01+00:00","publishedAt":"2018-12-15T16:06:45+00:00","__isFeedContentResourceInterface":"PostResourceType","seo":{"headline":"What is fascism? A Yale philosopher explains how it works","description":"“Part of what fascist politics does is get people to disassociate from reality.”"},"social":{"headline":"How fascism works","description":"A Yale philosopher on fascism, truth, and Donald Trump.","image":null},"promo":{"headline":"How fascism works"},"ledeMedia":{"__typename":"LedeMediaImageType","image":{"title":"Nearly 100,000 Nazi storm troopers are gathered at Luitpold arena to listen to a 1933 speech by Adolf Hitler on ‘Brown Shirt Day.’","alt":"Nearly 100,000 Nazi storm troopers are gathered at Luitpold arena to listen to a 1933 speech by Adolf Hitler on ‘Brown Shirt Day.’","originalHeight":366,"originalWidth":450,"thumbnails":{"social":{"url":"https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90\u0026strip=all\u0026crop=0,15.094555546019,99.111111111111,63.799959946213","mimeType":"imageJpg","normalizedRatio":1.91,"cropCoordinates":{"height":63.79995994621349,"width":99.11111111111111}},"horizontal":{"url":"https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90\u0026strip=all\u0026crop=0,6.3752276867031,99.111111111111,81.238615664845","cropCoordinates":{"height":81.23861566484518,"width":99.11111111111111}},"square":{"url":"https://platform.vox.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/chorus/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13110813/stock_photo_nazi_german_soldiers_at_the_nuremberg_rally_september_251930365.jpg?quality=90\u0026strip=all\u0026crop=11.333333333333,0,76.444444444444,93.989071038251","cropCoordinates":{"height":93.98907103825137,"width":76.44444444444446}}},"id":"dngyOmltYWdlOjEwNjIzNQ=="}},"updatedAt":"2018-12-15T16:08:28+00:00","createdAt":"2018-12-15T16:06:45+00:00","hasAffiliateLinks":false,"additionalBylines":"","status":"publish","wordCount":1956,"package":null,"streams":{"nodes":[]},"liveStatus":{"startAt":null,"status":false,"endAt":null},"seoArticleBody":"\u0026ldquo;Fascism\u0026rdquo; is a word that gets tossed around pretty loosely these days, usually as an epithet to discredit someone else\u0026rsquo;s politics.\nOne consequence is that no one really knows what the term means anymore. Liberals see fascism as the culmination of conservative thinking: an authoritarian, nationalist, and racist system of government organized around corporate power. For conservatives, fascism is totalitarianism masquerading as the nanny state.\nA new book by Yale philosopher Jason Stanley is the latest attempt to clarify what fascism is and how it functions in the modern world. Stanley focuses on propaganda and rhetoric, so his book is largely about the tropes and narratives that drive fascist politics.\nI spoke with him recently about what fascism looks like today, why the destruction of truth is so essential to fascist movements, and whether he thinks it\u0026rsquo;s accurate to call President Donald Trump a fascist, as some have.\nA lightly edited transcript of our conversation follows.\nSean Illing\nAlmost everyone means something different when they use the word \u0026ldquo;fascism.\u0026rdquo; What do you mean by it?\nJason Stanley\nI think of fascism as a method of politics. It\u0026rsquo;s a rhetoric, a way of running for power. Of course, that\u0026rsquo;s connected to fascist ideology, because fascist ideology centers on power. But I really see fascism as a technique to gain power.\nPeople are always asking, \u0026ldquo;Is such-and-such politician really a fascist?\u0026rdquo; Which is really just another way of asking if this person has a particular set of beliefs or an ideology, but again, I don\u0026rsquo;t really think of a fascist as someone who holds a set of beliefs. They\u0026rsquo;re using a certain technique to acquire and retain power.\nSean Illing\nSo fascism isn\u0026rsquo;t a discrete category \u0026mdash; it\u0026rsquo;s a spectrum? Or a sliding scale?\nJason Stanley\nRight. And my book identifies the various techniques that fascists tend to adopt, and shows how someone can be more fascist or less fascist in their politics. The key thing is that fascist politics is about identifying enemies, appealing to the in-group (usually the majority group), and smashing truth and replacing it with power.\nSean Illing\nWe\u0026rsquo;ll get into some more of those techniques, but I\u0026rsquo;m curious why you think fascism is so hard to pin down as an ideology. People on the left see fascism as the endpoint of right-wing reactionary thinking, and people on the right see fascism as nanny-state totalitarianism. Obviously, it can\u0026rsquo;t be both of these things.\nJason Stanley\nI think it\u0026rsquo;s clearly right-wing. Part of the problem is that \u0026ldquo;right\u0026rdquo; and \u0026ldquo;left\u0026rdquo; are tricky to talk about, and it\u0026rsquo;s true that there are dangerous forms of extremism on both sides, but fascism tilts pretty heavily to the right in my view.\nIf you think about fascism as a sliding scale, ordinary conservative politics is going to find itself somewhere on that scale \u0026mdash; which is not to say that it\u0026rsquo;s fascist at all, any more than ordinary Democratic politics is communist. But just as extreme versions of communism suppress liberty on behalf of radical equality, so too do extreme versions of right-wing politics, namely fascism, suppress liberty in favor of tradition and dominance and power.\nSean Illing\nYour specialty is propaganda and rhetoric, and in the book you describe fascism as a collection of tropes and narratives. So what, exactly, is the story fascists are spinning?\nJason Stanley\nIn the past, fascist politics would focus on the dominant cultural group. The goal is to make them feel like victims, to make them feel like they\u0026rsquo;ve lost something and that the thing they\u0026rsquo;ve lost has been taken from them by a specific enemy, usually some minority out-group or some opposing nation.\nThis is why fascism flourishes in moments of great anxiety, because you can connect that anxiety with fake loss. The story is typically that a once-great society has been destroyed by liberalism or feminism or cultural Marxism or whatever, and you make the dominant group feel angry and resentful about the loss of their status and power. Almost every manifestation of fascism mirrors this general narrative. \u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\nSean Illing\nWhy is the destruction of truth, as a shared ideal, so critical to the fascist project?\nJason Stanley\nIt\u0026rsquo;s important because truth is the heart of liberal democracy. The two ideals of liberal democracy are liberty and equality. If your belief system is shot through with lies, you\u0026rsquo;re not free. Nobody thinks of the citizens of North Korea as free, because their actions are controlled by lies.\nTruth is required to act freely. Freedom requires knowledge, and in order to act freely in the world, you need to know what the world is and know what you\u0026rsquo;re doing. You only know what you\u0026rsquo;re doing if you have access to the truth. So freedom requires truth, and so to smash freedom you must smash truth.\nSean Illing\nThere\u0026rsquo;s a great line from the philosopher Hannah Arendt, I think in her book about totalitarianism, where she says that fascists are never content to merely lie; they must transform their lie into a new reality, and they must persuade people to believe in the unreality they\u0026rsquo;ve created. And if you get people to do that, you can convince them to do anything.\nJason Stanley\nI think that\u0026rsquo;s right. Part of what fascist politics does is get people to disassociate from reality. You get them to sign on to this fantasy version of reality, usually a nationalist narrative about the decline of the country and the need for a strong leader to return it to greatness, and from then on their anchor isn\u0026rsquo;t the world around them \u0026mdash; it\u0026rsquo;s the leader.\nSean Illing\nThis is partly why I think of fascism as a kind of anti-politics. I remember reading a quote from Joseph Goebbels, who was the chief propagandist for the Nazis, and he said that what he was doing was more like art than politics. By which he meant their task was to create an alternative mythical reality for Germans that was more exciting and purposeful than the humdrum reality of liberal democratic politics, and that\u0026rsquo;s why mass media was so essential the rise of Nazism.\nJason Stanley\nThat\u0026rsquo;s so interesting. The thing is, people willingly adopt the mythical past. Fascists are always telling a story about a glorious past that\u0026rsquo;s been lost, and they tap into this nostalgia. So when you fight back against fascism, you\u0026rsquo;ve got one hand tied behind your back, because the truth is messy and complex and the mythical story is always clear and compelling and entertaining. It\u0026rsquo;s hard to undercut that with facts.\nSean Illing\nThis is probably a good time to pivot to the glittering elephant in the room: Donald Trump. Is he a fascist?\nJason Stanley\nI make the case in my book that he practices fascist politics. Now, that doesn\u0026rsquo;t mean his government is a fascist government. For one thing, I think it\u0026rsquo;s very difficult to say what a fascist government is.\nFor another thing, I think the current movement of leaders who use these techniques (Vladimir Putin in Russia, Recep Tayyip Erdo\u0026#287;an in Turkey, Viktor Orb\u0026aacute;n in Hungary, to name a few) all seek to keep the trappings of democratic institutions, but their goal is to reorient them around their own cult of personality.\nAgain, I wouldn\u0026rsquo;t claim \u0026mdash; not yet, at least \u0026mdash; that Trump is presiding over a fascist government, but he is very clearly using fascist techniques to excite his base and erode liberal democratic institutions, and that\u0026rsquo;s very troubling.\nBut the blame there is as much on the Republican Party as it is on Trump, because none of this would matter if they were willing to check Trump. So far, they\u0026rsquo;ve chosen loyalty to Trump over loyalty to rule of law.\nSean Illing\nIn the book, you imply that there\u0026rsquo;s something inherently fascist about American politics, or at the very least that fascism has always been a latent force in America. Can you elaborate on that?\nJason Stanley\nWell, the Ku Klux Klan deeply affected Adolf Hitler. He explicitly praised the 1924 Immigration Act, which severely limited the number of immigrants allowed to enter the US, as a useful model.\nThe 1920s and the 1930s was a very fascist time in the United States. You\u0026rsquo;ve got very patriarchal family values and a politics of resentment aimed at black Americans and other groups as internal threats, and this gets exported to Europe.\nSo we have a long history of genocide against native peoples and anti-black racism and anti-immigration hysteria, and at the same time there\u0026rsquo;s a strain of American exceptionalism, which manifests as a kind of mythological history and encourages Americans to think of their own country as a unique force for good.\nThis doesn\u0026rsquo;t make America a fascist country, but all of these ingredients are easily channeled into a fascist politics.\nSean Illing\nAnd yet at the same time there are countervailing forces that push us in the opposite direction, and so America exists in this perpetual tension between liberal democracy and reactionary fascism.\nJason Stanley\nAbsolutely. America is exceptional in good ways as well.\nWe have an exceptional devotion to liberty and equality, as embodied in our struggle for civil rights and our fight against fascism in World War II. I\u0026rsquo;m corny about these things, and I believe America has had truly great moments and has made a lot of progress.\nBut, as you said, the fascist threat is always lurking, and we just have to be aware of it. \u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\u0026nbsp;\nSean Illing\nWhat does your book have to say about the way forward? If we are indeed threatened by fascist movements, both here and abroad, what can citizens and governments do about it?\nJason Stanley\nWe should heed the warning of the poem on the side of the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum, which says, \u0026ldquo;First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out because I was not Jewish. Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak for me.\u0026rdquo; At a certain point it\u0026rsquo;s too late.\nWe learned first from that poem who the targets are. The targets are leftists, minorities, labor unions, and anyone or any institution that isn\u0026rsquo;t glorified in the fascist narrative. And even if you\u0026rsquo;re not in any of those groups, you have to protect those who are, and you have to protect them from the very beginning. Simple acts of courage early on will save you impossible acts of courage later.\nTo be clear, this isn\u0026rsquo;t alarmist. We\u0026rsquo;re not on the brink of some fascist takeover. But there are reasons to be concerned, and we should always be on guard \u0026mdash; that\u0026rsquo;s the lesson of history. Our weapons are our high ideals of liberty and equality, and we have to fight to keep those American ideals.\nWe\u0026rsquo;re fortunate enough to have liberty and equality baked into our founding ideals. We have a long history of people appealing to those ideals and saying, \u0026ldquo;We might disagree on a number of things but we agree that truth, liberty, equality are things we stand up for.\u0026rdquo; So whatever happens, we have to continually double down on those ideals \u0026mdash; that\u0026rsquo;s what will save us.\nThis article was originally published on September 19, 2018.","excludedFromHomepage":false,"packages":{"nodes":[]},"ledeMediaData":{"__typename":"LedeMediaImageType","caption":{"html":"Nearly 100,000 Nazi storm troopers are gathered to listen to a 1933 speech by Adolf Hitler on “Brown Shirt Day.”","plaintext":"Nearly 100,000 Nazi storm troopers are gathered to listen to a 1933 speech by Adolf Hitler on “Brown Shirt 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