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class="ext-discussiontools-init-pageframe-latestcomment">Latest comment: <a href="#c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018193000-Matrix-20241018180200">1 month ago</a> by Daniel Quinlan in topic <a href="#Custom_signature">Custom signature</a></div></div> </div> <div id="bodyContent" class="content"> <div id="mw-content-text" class="mw-body-content"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-lede-button-container"><span id='ooui-php-31' class='ext-discussiontools-init-lede-button oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-buttonWidget' data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"info","label":"Learn more about this page","classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-lede-button"]}'><a role='button' tabindex='0' rel='nofollow' class='oo-ui-buttonElement-button'><span class='oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-info'></span><span class='oo-ui-labelElement-label'>Learn more about this page</span><span 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.ambox{display:none!important}}</style><table class="plainlinks metadata ambox ambox-notice" role="presentation"><tbody><tr><td class="mbox-image"><div class="mbox-image-div"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Nuvola_apps_important_yellow.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Nuvola_apps_important_yellow.svg/60px-Nuvola_apps_important_yellow.svg.png" decoding="async" width="60" height="50" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Nuvola_apps_important_yellow.svg/90px-Nuvola_apps_important_yellow.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Nuvola_apps_important_yellow.svg/120px-Nuvola_apps_important_yellow.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="600" data-file-height="500"></a></span></div></td><td class="mbox-text"><div class="mbox-text-span"><b>This user talk page may contain one or more <a href="https://en.uncyclopedia.co/wiki/Inaccuracy_in_Uncyclopedia" 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<sub><sup class="noprint">[<a href="/wiki/Special:UserLogout" title="Special:UserLogout"><i>Citation not needed at all; thank you very much</i></a>]</sup></sub><sup class="noprint">[<a href="/wiki/Special:UserLogout" title="Special:UserLogout"><i>Citation not needed at all; thank you very much</i></a>]</sup><sup><sup class="noprint">[<a href="/wiki/Special:UserLogout" title="Special:UserLogout"><i>Citation not needed at all; thank you very much</i></a>]</sup></sup></small></small></div></div></td></tr></tbody></table> <style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1237879475">.mw-parser-output .tmbox{margin:4px 0;border-collapse:collapse;border:1px solid #c0c090;background-color:#f8eaba;box-sizing:border-box}.mw-parser-output .tmbox.mbox-small{font-size:88%;line-height:1.25em}.mw-parser-output .tmbox-speedy{border:2px solid #b32424;background-color:#fee7e6}.mw-parser-output .tmbox-delete{border:2px solid #b32424}.mw-parser-output .tmbox-content{border:2px solid #f28500}.mw-parser-output .tmbox-style{border:2px solid #fc3}.mw-parser-output .tmbox-move{border:2px solid #9932cc}.mw-parser-output .tmbox .mbox-text{border:none;padding:0.25em 0.9em;width:100%}.mw-parser-output .tmbox .mbox-image{border:none;padding:2px 0 2px 0.9em;text-align:center}.mw-parser-output .tmbox .mbox-imageright{border:none;padding:2px 0.9em 2px 0;text-align:center}.mw-parser-output .tmbox .mbox-empty-cell{border:none;padding:0;width:1px}.mw-parser-output .tmbox .mbox-invalid-type{text-align:center}@media(min-width:720px){.mw-parser-output .tmbox{margin:4px 10%}.mw-parser-output .tmbox.mbox-small{clear:right;float:right;margin:4px 0 4px 1em;width:238px}}@media screen{html.skin-theme-clientpref-night .mw-parser-output .tmbox{background-color:#2e2505}html.skin-theme-clientpref-night .mw-parser-output .tmbox-speedy{background-color:#310402}}@media screen and (prefers-color-scheme:dark){html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .tmbox{background-color:#2e2505}html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .tmbox-speedy{background-color:#310402}}body.skin--responsive .mw-parser-output table.tmbox img{max-width:none!important}</style><table class="plainlinks tmbox tmbox-notice" role="presentation"><tbody><tr><td class="mbox-image"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Busy_desk.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Busy_desk.svg/63px-Busy_desk.svg.png" decoding="async" width="63" height="50" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Busy_desk.svg/95px-Busy_desk.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Busy_desk.svg/127px-Busy_desk.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="475" data-file-height="375"></a></span></td><td class="mbox-text">This user is busy in <a href="/wiki/Real_life" title="Real life">real life</a> and may not respond swiftly to queries, however, <b>they will try to <span class="url"><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=45&v=dQw4w9WgXcQ">never let you down</a></span></b>.</td></tr></tbody></table> <link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1237879475"><style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1230750088">.mw-parser-output .talkheader{text-align:center}.mw-parser-output .talkheader-body{display:flex}.mw-parser-output .talkheader-help,.mw-parser-output .talkheader-policies,.mw-parser-output .talkheader-shortcuts{display:flex;align-items:center;padding:0.1em}.mw-parser-output .talkheader-help{flex:2 1 auto;border:1px solid #c0c090;background-color:var(--background-color-base,#ffffff);color:inherit}.mw-parser-output .talkheader-policies{flex:1 1 auto}.mw-parser-output .talkheader-policies+.talkheader-policies{border-left:1px solid #c0c090}.mw-parser-output .talkheader-shortcuts{flex:0 1 auto}.mw-parser-output .talkheader-help>*,.mw-parser-output .talkheader-policies>*,.mw-parser-output .talkheader-shortcuts>*{flex:1 1 auto}.mw-parser-output .talkheader-help ul,.mw-parser-output .talkheader-policies ul{margin:0.1em 0.8em 0 1.6em;text-align:left}@media(min-width:720px){.mw-parser-output .talkheader{min-width:80%}}</style><table role="presentation" class="tmbox tmbox-notice talkheader plainlinks" id="talkheader" style="border-collapse: separate;"><tbody><tr> <td style="border-bottom: 1px solid #c0c090; font-weight: bold;">This is <a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">Matrix</a>'s <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Talk_page_guidelines" title="Wikipedia:Talk page guidelines">talk page</a>, where you can send them messages and comments.</td> </tr> <tr> <td> <div class="talkheader-body"> <div class="talkheader-help"> <ul><li>Put new text under old text. <strong><a href="/wiki/Special:NewSection/User_talk:Matrix" title="Special:NewSection/User talk:Matrix">Click here to start a new topic.</a></strong></li> <li>New to Wikipedia? Welcome! <a href="/wiki/Help:Introduction" title="Help:Introduction">Learn to edit</a>; <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Questions" title="Wikipedia:Questions">get help</a>.</li></ul> </div> <div class="talkheader-policies"> <ul><li><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Assume_good_faith" title="Wikipedia:Assume good faith">Assume good faith</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Civility" title="Wikipedia:Civility">Be polite</a> and <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:No_personal_attacks" title="Wikipedia:No personal attacks">avoid personal attacks</a></li> <li><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Please_do_not_bite_the_newcomers" title="Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers">Be welcoming to newcomers</a></li> <li>Seek <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Dispute_resolution_requests" title="Wikipedia:Dispute resolution requests">dispute resolution</a> if needed</li></ul> </div> </div> </td> </tr><tr><td style="border-top: 1px solid #c0c090; padding: 1px 3px;"><b><a href="/wiki/Help:Archiving_a_talk_page" title="Help:Archiving a talk page">Archives</a>:</b> <a href="/wiki/User:ClueBot_III/Master_Detailed_Indices/User_talk:Matrix" title="User:ClueBot III/Master Detailed Indices/User talk:Matrix">Index</a>, <a href="/wiki/User_talk:Matrix/Archive_1" title="User talk:Matrix/Archive 1">1</a>, <a href="/wiki/User_talk:Matrix/Archive_2" title="User talk:Matrix/Archive 2">2</a><span style="position: relative; top: 2px; float: right; font-size: 90%; margin-left: 1em;"><style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1038841319">.mw-parser-output .tooltip-dotted{border-bottom:1px dotted;cursor:help}</style><span class="rt-commentedText tooltip tooltip-dotted" title="Discussions with timestamps are automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III after 90 days of inactivity when more than 3 threads are present.">Auto-archiving period</span>: <b>3 months</b> <span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/Help:Archiving_a_talk_page#Automated_archiving" title="Help:Archiving a talk page"><img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/1d/Information_icon4.svg/16px-Information_icon4.svg.png" decoding="async" width="16" height="16" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/1d/Information_icon4.svg/24px-Information_icon4.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/1d/Information_icon4.svg/32px-Information_icon4.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="620" data-file-height="620"></a></span></span></td> </tr><tr><td style="border-top: 1px solid #c0c090; padding: 0;"><div> <div class="mw-inputbox-centered" style=""><form name="searchbox" class="searchbox mw-inputbox-form-inline" action="/wiki/Special:Search"><div class="cdx-text-input"><input class="mw-searchInput searchboxInput cdx-text-input__input" name="search" placeholder="" size="50" dir="ltr"></div><input type="hidden" value="User talk:Matrix/" name="prefix"> <input type="submit" name="fulltext" value="Search archives" class="cdx-button"><input type="hidden" value="Search" name="fulltext"></form></div> </div></td> </tr> </tbody></table> <div id="toc" class="toc" role="navigation" aria-labelledby="mw-toc-heading"><input type="checkbox" role="button" id="toctogglecheckbox" class="toctogglecheckbox" style="display:none"><div class="toctitle" lang="en" dir="ltr"><h2 id="mw-toc-heading">Contents</h2><span class="toctogglespan"><label class="toctogglelabel" for="toctogglecheckbox"></label></span></div> <ul> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-1"><a href="#New_message_from_A_smart_kitten"><span class="tocnumber">1</span> <span class="toctext">New message from A smart kitten</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-2"><a href="#Riddlesdown_railway_station"><span class="tocnumber">2</span> <span class="toctext">Riddlesdown railway station</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-3"><a href="#Selective_pinging_at_RfC"><span class="tocnumber">3</span> <span class="toctext">Selective pinging at RfC</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-4"><a href="#Template_editor_granted"><span class="tocnumber">4</span> <span class="toctext">Template editor granted</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-5"><a href="#Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic"><span class="tocnumber">5</span> <span class="toctext">Wikipedia:Contributor copyright investigations/Peripatetic</span></a></li> <li class="toclevel-1 tocsection-6"><a href="#Custom_signature"><span class="tocnumber">6</span> <span class="toctext">Custom signature</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </section><div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section section-heading" onclick="mfTempOpenSection(1)"><span class="indicator mf-icon mf-icon-expand mf-icon--small"></span><h2 id="New_message_from_A_smart_kitten" data-mw-thread-id="h-New_message_from_A_smart_kitten-20240906102200"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-New_message_from_A_smart_kitten-20240906102200"></span>New message from A smart kitten<span data-mw-comment-end="h-New_message_from_A_smart_kitten-20240906102200"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"> <a role="button" href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Matrix&action=edit&section=1" title="Edit section: New message from A smart kitten" class="cdx-button cdx-button--size-large cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--icon-only cdx-button--weight-quiet "> <span class="minerva-icon minerva-icon--edit"></span> <span>edit</span> </a> </span> <span id='ooui-php-25' class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-buttonWidget' data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonMenuSelectWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"ellipsis","data":{"itemConfigs":[{"id":"edit","data":{"id":"edit"},"icon":"edit","label":"Edit"}],"resourceLoaderModules":[]},"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton"]}'><a role='button' tabindex='0' rel='nofollow' class='oo-ui-buttonElement-button'><span class='oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-ellipsis'></span><span class='oo-ui-labelElement-label'></span><span class='oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator'></span></a></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-timestampLabel'>Latest comment: <a href="#c-Matrix-20240906154100-A_smart_kitten-20240906102200">2 months ago</a></span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-commentCountLabel'>2 comments</span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-authorCountLabel'>2 people in discussion</span></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div><section class="mf-section-1 collapsible-block" id="mf-section-1"> <span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-A_smart_kitten-20240906102200-New_message_from_A_smart_kitten"></span><style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1256396942">.mw-parser-output .umbox{background-color:var(--background-color-content-added,#a3d3ff);border:1px solid var(--border-color-progressive,#36c);padding:0.5em 1em;margin:2em 0 1em;font-weight:bold;overflow:auto;vertical-align:middle}</style> <div class="umbox"><figure class="mw-halign-left" typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/MediaWiki_talk:Blockedtext#Edit_request_for_dark_mode_compatibility" title="MediaWiki talk:Blockedtext"><noscript><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Nuvola_apps_edu_languages.svg/40px-Nuvola_apps_edu_languages.svg.png" decoding="async" width="40" height="40" class="mw-file-element" data-file-width="128" data-file-height="128"></noscript><span class="lazy-image-placeholder" style="width: 40px;height: 40px;" data-src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Nuvola_apps_edu_languages.svg/40px-Nuvola_apps_edu_languages.svg.png" data-width="40" data-height="40" data-srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Nuvola_apps_edu_languages.svg/60px-Nuvola_apps_edu_languages.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Nuvola_apps_edu_languages.svg/80px-Nuvola_apps_edu_languages.svg.png 2x" data-class="mw-file-element"> </span></a><figcaption></figcaption></figure>Hello, Matrix. You have new messages at <a href="/wiki/MediaWiki_talk:Blockedtext#Edit_request_for_dark_mode_compatibility" title="MediaWiki talk:Blockedtext">MediaWiki talk:Blockedtext</a>.<br><span style="font-size: 88%; font-weight: normal;">Message added 10:22, 6 September 2024 (UTC). You can <a href="/wiki/Special:EditPage/User_talk:Matrix" title="Special:EditPage/User talk:Matrix">remove this notice</a> at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.</span></div> <p>Just in case the ping didn’t send - apologies if this is a duplicate notification :) <span class="skin-invert" style="color:#000"><span style="">‍—‍</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=User:A_smart_kitten&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:A smart kitten (page does not exist)"><span style="color:purple">a smart kitten</span></a><sub>[<a href="/wiki/User_talk:A_smart_kitten" title="User talk:A smart kitten"><span style="color:#c814c8">meow</span></a>]</sub></span> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-A_smart_kitten-20240906102200-New_message_from_A_smart_kitten" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:22, 6 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-A_smart_kitten-20240906102200-New_message_from_A_smart_kitten"><span id="ooui-php-1" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-A_smart_kitten-20240906102200-New_message_from_A_smart_kitten"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20240906154100-A_smart_kitten-20240906102200"></span>Sorry for not seeing this earlier - go ahead! —<b>Matrix(!)</b> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">user</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">talk?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>contributions</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20240906154100-A_smart_kitten-20240906102200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:41, 6 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20240906154100-A_smart_kitten-20240906102200"><span id="ooui-php-2" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20240906154100-A_smart_kitten-20240906102200"></span></dd></dl> </section><div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section section-heading" onclick="mfTempOpenSection(2)"><span class="indicator mf-icon mf-icon-expand mf-icon--small"></span><h2 id="Riddlesdown_railway_station" data-mw-thread-id="h-Riddlesdown_railway_station-20240909204600"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Riddlesdown_railway_station-20240909204600"></span>Riddlesdown railway station<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Riddlesdown_railway_station-20240909204600"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"> <a role="button" href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Matrix&action=edit&section=2" title="Edit section: Riddlesdown railway station" class="cdx-button cdx-button--size-large cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--icon-only cdx-button--weight-quiet "> <span class="minerva-icon minerva-icon--edit"></span> <span>edit</span> </a> </span> <span id='ooui-php-26' class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-buttonWidget' data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonMenuSelectWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"ellipsis","data":{"itemConfigs":[{"id":"edit","data":{"id":"edit"},"icon":"edit","label":"Edit"}],"resourceLoaderModules":[]},"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton"]}'><a role='button' tabindex='0' rel='nofollow' class='oo-ui-buttonElement-button'><span class='oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-ellipsis'></span><span class='oo-ui-labelElement-label'></span><span class='oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator'></span></a></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-timestampLabel'>Latest comment: <a href="#c-Matrix-20240910164200-Matrix-20240910155700">2 months ago</a></span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-commentCountLabel'>3 comments</span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-authorCountLabel'>2 people in discussion</span></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div><section class="mf-section-2 collapsible-block" id="mf-section-2"> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Trainsandotherthings-20240909204600-Riddlesdown_railway_station"></span>I see the train station clique has singled out your AfD for attention. They are a minority viewpoint, but since station AfDs don't attract many people they can override policy with local "consensus" and nonsense arguments. I'm sure you noticed essentially all the keep votes were knee-jerk indignant reactions that failed to make policy-based arguments. You're far from their first victim. I was the one who launched the 2022 RfC that closed with an overwhelming consensus that train stations are not inherently notable. I started that RfC because I was tired of AfDs ending exactly like this one, where the train station clique stonewalls any argument with "but don't you know all train stations are automatically notable?!" After the RfC, they can't say that out loud, but they just find other ways to imply it. Some people seem to have an issue following that consensus. I recommend a more pointed RfC aimed at defeating the "how dare you AfD a train station on the British railway network! They're all notable just by existing" arguments from this AfD. And if that doesn't work, then ANI is the next step. I've been here over three years and this problem is far older than my tenure here. <a href="/wiki/User:Trainsandotherthings" title="User:Trainsandotherthings">Trainsandotherthings</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Trainsandotherthings" title="User talk:Trainsandotherthings">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Trainsandotherthings-20240909204600-Riddlesdown_railway_station" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:46, 9 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Trainsandotherthings-20240909204600-Riddlesdown_railway_station"><span id="ooui-php-3" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Trainsandotherthings-20240909204600-Riddlesdown_railway_station"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20240910155700-Trainsandotherthings-20240909204600"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Trainsandotherthings" title="User:Trainsandotherthings">Trainsandotherthings</a>:</span> Another note, sometimes RFCs don't work! You can read <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Streetcars#RfC:_Notability_and_Tramlink_stops" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Streetcars">Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Streetcars#RfC: Notability and Tramlink stops</a> which is an RFC I started. But yeah, I will start an RfC soon. —<b>Matrix(!)</b> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">user</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">talk?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>contributions</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20240910155700-Trainsandotherthings-20240909204600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:57, 10 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20240910155700-Trainsandotherthings-20240909204600"><span id="ooui-php-4" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20240910155700-Trainsandotherthings-20240909204600"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20240910164200-Matrix-20240910155700"></span>Might want to read <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Notability#RfC:_Notability_and_British_Rail_stations" title="Wikipedia talk:Notability">Wikipedia talk:Notability#RfC: Notability and British Rail stations</a> —<b>Matrix(!)</b> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">user</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">talk?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>contributions</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20240910164200-Matrix-20240910155700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:42, 10 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20240910164200-Matrix-20240910155700"><span id="ooui-php-5" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20240910164200-Matrix-20240910155700"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> </section><div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section section-heading" onclick="mfTempOpenSection(3)"><span class="indicator mf-icon mf-icon-expand mf-icon--small"></span><h2 id="Selective_pinging_at_RfC" data-mw-thread-id="h-Selective_pinging_at_RfC-20240921165700"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Selective_pinging_at_RfC-20240921165700"></span>Selective pinging at RfC<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Selective_pinging_at_RfC-20240921165700"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"> <a role="button" href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Matrix&action=edit&section=3" title="Edit section: Selective pinging at RfC" class="cdx-button cdx-button--size-large cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--icon-only cdx-button--weight-quiet "> <span class="minerva-icon minerva-icon--edit"></span> <span>edit</span> </a> </span> <span id='ooui-php-27' class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-buttonWidget' data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonMenuSelectWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"ellipsis","data":{"itemConfigs":[{"id":"edit","data":{"id":"edit"},"icon":"edit","label":"Edit"}],"resourceLoaderModules":[]},"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton"]}'><a role='button' tabindex='0' rel='nofollow' class='oo-ui-buttonElement-button'><span class='oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-ellipsis'></span><span class='oo-ui-labelElement-label'></span><span class='oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator'></span></a></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-timestampLabel'>Latest comment: <a href="#c-Matrix-20240922171400-Vanisaac-20240922164700">2 months ago</a></span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-commentCountLabel'>8 comments</span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-authorCountLabel'>2 people in discussion</span></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div><section class="mf-section-3 collapsible-block" id="mf-section-3"> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Vanisaac-20240921165700-Selective_pinging_at_RfC"></span>At your RfC at <a href="/wiki/Template:Keep_Local" class="mw-redirect" title="Template:Keep Local">template:Keep Local</a>, you pinged some editors to join the discussion. Please take the time to review your notifications to ensure that you are properly following <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Canvassing" title="Wikipedia:Canvassing">WP:Canvassing</a> to get comments from all interested editors. <a href="/wiki/User:Vanisaac" title="User:Vanisaac">Van</a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Vanisaac" title="User talk:Vanisaac">Isaac</a>, GHTV<sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Vanisaac" title="Special:Contributions/Vanisaac">cont</a></sup><sub style="margin-left:-3.5ex"><small><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WPWR" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:WPWR">WpWS</a></small></sub> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Vanisaac-20240921165700-Selective_pinging_at_RfC" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:57, 21 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Vanisaac-20240921165700-Selective_pinging_at_RfC"><span id="ooui-php-6" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Vanisaac-20240921165700-Selective_pinging_at_RfC"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20240921170000-Vanisaac-20240921165700"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:VanIsaac" class="mw-redirect" title="User:VanIsaac">VanIsaac</a>:</span> I pinged Anomie, a user who was very much against my proposal. I pinged 2 users that were for this proposal. I simply forgot to ping you as I only looked at the bottom most discussion. Please take the time to review <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:AGF" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:AGF">WP:AGF</a> to ensure you are properly assuming good faith instead of jumping to allegations of canvassing. —<b>Matrix(!)</b> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">user</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">talk?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>contributions</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20240921170000-Vanisaac-20240921165700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:00, 21 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20240921170000-Vanisaac-20240921165700"><span id="ooui-php-7" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20240921170000-Vanisaac-20240921165700"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Vanisaac-20240921215700-Matrix-20240921170000"></span>We are NOT the only four people who have participated in discussions about this template, though. You are new around here, so the only assumption that I made is that you might not be aware of policies like WP:Canvassing, hence pointing it out and asking that you check your own actions in that light. Please read my post here objectively. Your assumption of bad faith on my part is very concerning. I didn't template you, I didn't accuse you of anything, I just asked you to review your own actions in light of a policy. But your recency bias is disconcerting. There have been three deletion discussions about this template, and discussion history going back decades. There's even more in the archives of <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:CSD" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:CSD">WP:CSD</a>. Sticking to the few participants from the last couple months is a choice that indicates you don't appreciate the history of those of us who have fought to protect this project from the real harms that this template protects us from. I don't know how to convince you that history matters here, but it does. <a href="/wiki/User:Vanisaac" title="User:Vanisaac">Van</a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Vanisaac" title="User talk:Vanisaac">Isaac</a>, GHTV<sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Vanisaac" title="Special:Contributions/Vanisaac">cont</a></sup><sub style="margin-left:-3.5ex"><small><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WPWR" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:WPWR">WpWS</a></small></sub> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Vanisaac-20240921215700-Matrix-20240921170000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:57, 21 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Vanisaac-20240921215700-Matrix-20240921170000"><span id="ooui-php-8" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Vanisaac-20240921215700-Matrix-20240921170000"></span> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20240921222000-Vanisaac-20240921215700"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:VanIsaac" class="mw-redirect" title="User:VanIsaac">VanIsaac</a>:</span> Apologies for being passive aggressive in my reply, it was unwarranted on my behalf. I wouldn't call it a recency bias. It's just that I can't be asked to trawl through old discussions and see who is still active and whatnot. Also, I think a few things have changed since 2013, there are clearly more people that have accepted Commons (looking at the proportion of files on Commons vs enwiki). I also think many discussions suffered from <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:LOCALCONSENSUS" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:LOCALCONSENSUS">WP:LOCALCONSENSUS</a>, so an RfC might help.</dd> <dd>Another important point: <b>I don't want to get rid of KeepLocal entirely</b>! That is not in my aim of this RfC. I have just seen a select group of en.wiki editors upload files they didn't create and then artificially downgrade end users' experience, because the Commons community can't maintain a file.</dd> <dd>Also, you keep saying unimaginable horrors the Commons comminity has done in maintaining files. Can you give a recent example (<3 years) of Commons ruining stuff against files, because everything I've read seems to be broad paranoia against Commons?</dd> <dd>On a completely unrelated sidenote you signed your post ending with "GHTV". Out of curiousity what does that mean?</dd> <dd>Cheers, —<b>Matrix(!)</b> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">user</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">talk?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>contributions</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20240921222000-Vanisaac-20240921215700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:20, 21 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20240921222000-Vanisaac-20240921215700"><span id="ooui-php-9" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20240921222000-Vanisaac-20240921215700"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Vanisaac-20240922020500-Matrix-20240921222000"></span>I have no idea what Commons has done recently, because I learned a decade and a half ago it isn't worth contributing anything that isn't covered by PD-text or PD-simple. As soon as something can possibly have a copyright interpretation, the processes are so opaque and unreasonable that no sane person should ever be subjected to it. I don't build article content that builds upon copyrighted images hosted on Commons for clarity or demonstration for the same reason. I contribute to Commons with BSicons and images of the basic units of writing systems, and that's about it. I take up this fight every time it comes up because I don't want anyone else to go through what I did. Curating a page to be both informative and beautiful and then to have your work gutted by bureaucratic officiousness that you didn't even know about is absolutely demoralizing, and to be treated like you are some kind of criminal when you object is dehumanizing. I've never seen anything that shows they've changed over there, and people coming in trying to undermine our independence from Commons only deepens the belief that they will never change and that we at en.wiki were always just the sacrificial lambs on building Commons to service the multi-lingual wikipedia.</dd> <dd>On the unrelated sidenote, the "GHTV" is a post-nominal for <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Service_awards#Grandmaster_Editor_(or_Grand_High_Togneme_Vicarus)" title="Wikipedia:Service awards">Grand High Togneme Vicarus</a>. It is deliberately unlinked and abbreviated beyond recognition because it is nothing more than meaningless fun and is not even remotely intended to confer a single iota of authority in any matter. <a href="/wiki/User:Vanisaac" title="User:Vanisaac">Van</a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Vanisaac" title="User talk:Vanisaac">Isaac</a>, GHTV<sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Vanisaac" title="Special:Contributions/Vanisaac">cont</a></sup><sub style="margin-left:-3.5ex"><small><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WPWR" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:WPWR">WpWS</a></small></sub> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Vanisaac-20240922020500-Matrix-20240921222000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:05, 22 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Vanisaac-20240922020500-Matrix-20240921222000"><span id="ooui-php-10" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Vanisaac-20240922020500-Matrix-20240921222000"></span> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20240922095300-Vanisaac-20240922020500"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:VanIsaac" class="mw-redirect" title="User:VanIsaac">VanIsaac</a>:</span> to be honest, I don't really care if my preferred option "!wins" the RfC. I care more about getting a definitive answer, and not getting the answer "nominate everything at FfD individually". It's clear that the RfC will not succeed anyway now. —<b>Matrix(!)</b> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">user</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">talk?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>contributions</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20240922095300-Vanisaac-20240922020500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:53, 22 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20240922095300-Vanisaac-20240922020500"><span id="ooui-php-11" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20240922095300-Vanisaac-20240922020500"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Vanisaac-20240922164700-Matrix-20240922095300"></span>Well we <i>do</i> care if your preferred option wins. But more importantly, we care about the disrespect contained in even proposing it.</dd> <dd>The definitive answer you are looking for is that it's none of your business if we have a copy of an image also found on Commons. If anyone has a legitimate issue with an image - i.e. an issue that has nothing to do with where it is hosted - then all the CSD, FfD, PROD, and other deletion processes are freely available. If the only concern is that it's hosted both here and at Commons, if given the choice, many of us would deny it from Commons rather than be forced to submit to their processes. But every time someone from Commons comes here and shits on us for protecting ourselves from their dysfunction, it adds to the mistrust and deepens the divide. <a href="/wiki/User:Vanisaac" title="User:Vanisaac">Van</a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Vanisaac" title="User talk:Vanisaac">Isaac</a>, GHTV<sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Vanisaac" title="Special:Contributions/Vanisaac">cont</a></sup><sub style="margin-left:-3.5ex"><small><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WPWR" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:WPWR">WpWS</a></small></sub> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Vanisaac-20240922164700-Matrix-20240922095300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:47, 22 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Vanisaac-20240922164700-Matrix-20240922095300"><span id="ooui-php-12" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Vanisaac-20240922164700-Matrix-20240922095300"></span> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20240922171400-Vanisaac-20240922164700"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:VanIsaac" class="mw-redirect" title="User:VanIsaac">VanIsaac</a>:</span> I don't think this discussion is productive anymore. We seem to just be going in <link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1038841319"><span class="rt-commentedText tooltip tooltip-dotted" title="defo not spheres">three-dimensional circles</span>. I don't think the mere proposal of an issue is disrespectful, but that's your thoughts. Let's let the RfC end naturally and till then, have a good one. —<b>Matrix(!)</b> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">user</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">talk?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>contributions</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20240922171400-Vanisaac-20240922164700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:14, 22 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20240922171400-Vanisaac-20240922164700"><span id="ooui-php-13" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20240922171400-Vanisaac-20240922164700"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> </section><div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section section-heading" onclick="mfTempOpenSection(4)"><span class="indicator mf-icon mf-icon-expand mf-icon--small"></span><h2 id="Template_editor_granted" data-mw-thread-id="h-Template_editor_granted-20240922171200"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Template_editor_granted-20240922171200"></span>Template editor granted<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Template_editor_granted-20240922171200"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"> <a role="button" href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Matrix&action=edit&section=4" title="Edit section: Template editor granted" class="cdx-button cdx-button--size-large cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--icon-only cdx-button--weight-quiet "> <span class="minerva-icon minerva-icon--edit"></span> <span>edit</span> </a> </span> <span id='ooui-php-28' class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-buttonWidget' data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonMenuSelectWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"ellipsis","data":{"itemConfigs":[{"id":"edit","data":{"id":"edit"},"icon":"edit","label":"Edit"}],"resourceLoaderModules":[]},"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton"]}'><a role='button' tabindex='0' rel='nofollow' class='oo-ui-buttonElement-button'><span class='oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-ellipsis'></span><span class='oo-ui-labelElement-label'></span><span class='oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator'></span></a></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-timestampLabel'>Latest comment: <a href="#c-Primefac-20240922171200-Template_editor_granted">2 months ago</a></span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-commentCountLabel'>1 comment</span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-authorCountLabel'>1 person in discussion</span></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div><section class="mf-section-4 collapsible-block" id="mf-section-4"> <span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Primefac-20240922171200-Template_editor_granted"></span><figure class="mw-halign-right" typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Wikipedia_Template_editor_icon_(1).svg" class="mw-file-description"><noscript><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/41/Wikipedia_Template_editor_icon_%281%29.svg/130px-Wikipedia_Template_editor_icon_%281%29.svg.png" decoding="async" width="130" height="130" class="mw-file-element" data-file-width="200" data-file-height="200"></noscript><span class="lazy-image-placeholder" style="width: 130px;height: 130px;" data-src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/41/Wikipedia_Template_editor_icon_%281%29.svg/130px-Wikipedia_Template_editor_icon_%281%29.svg.png" data-width="130" data-height="130" data-srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/41/Wikipedia_Template_editor_icon_%281%29.svg/195px-Wikipedia_Template_editor_icon_%281%29.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/41/Wikipedia_Template_editor_icon_%281%29.svg/260px-Wikipedia_Template_editor_icon_%281%29.svg.png 2x" data-class="mw-file-element"> </span></a><figcaption></figcaption></figure> <p>Your account has been granted the "<style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r886049734">.mw-parser-output .monospaced{font-family:monospace,monospace}</style><span class="monospaced">templateeditor</span>" user permission, allowing you to edit <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:TEMPLATE" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:TEMPLATE">templates</a> and <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:MODULE" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:MODULE">modules</a> that have been protected with <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:TEMP-P" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:TEMP-P">template protection</a>. It also allows you to bypass the <a href="/wiki/MediaWiki:Titleblacklist" title="MediaWiki:Titleblacklist">title blacklist</a>, giving you the ability to create and edit <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:EDITNOTICE" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:EDITNOTICE">editnotices</a>. Before you use this user right, please read <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Template_editor" title="Wikipedia:Template editor">Wikipedia:Template editor</a></b> and make sure you understand its contents. In particular, you should read the section on <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Template_editors#Wise_template_editing" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:Template editors">wise template editing</a> and the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Template_editor#Criteria_for_revocation" title="Wikipedia:Template editor">criteria for revocation</a>. </p><p>You can use this user right to perform maintenance, answer edit requests, and make any other simple and generally uncontroversial edits to templates, modules, and edinotices. You can also use it to enact more complex or controversial edits, <b>after</b> those edits are first made to a test sandbox, and their technical reliability as well as their <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Consensus" title="Wikipedia:Consensus">consensus</a> among other informed editors has been established. If you are willing to process <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Edit_requests" title="Wikipedia:Edit requests">edit requests</a> on templates and modules, keep in mind that you are taking responsibility to ensure the edits have consensus and are technically sound. </p><p>This user right gives you access to some of Wikipedia's most important templates and modules; it is critical that you edit them wisely and that you only make edits that are backed up by consensus. It is also very important that no one else be allowed to access your account, so you should consider taking a few moments to <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:User_account_security" title="Wikipedia:User account security">secure your password</a>. </p><p>If you do not want this user right, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time. </p><p>If you were granted the permission on a temporary basis you will need to re-apply for the permission a few days before it expires including in your request a permalink to the discussion where it was granted and a <span class="nowrap">{{</span><a href="/wiki/Template:Ping" class="mw-redirect" title="Template:Ping">ping</a><span class="nowrap">}}</span> for the administrator who granted the permission. You can find the permalink in your <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Log/rights&page=User:Matrix">rights log</a>. </p> <dl><dt>Useful links</dt></dl> <ul><li><span class="plainlinks"><a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3AProtectedPages&namespace=&type=edit&level=templateeditor">All template-protected pages</a></span></li> <li><a href="/wiki/User:AnomieBOT/TPERTable" title="User:AnomieBOT/TPERTable">User:AnomieBOT/TPERTable</a> – outstanding template-protected edit requests (bot-generated)</li> <li><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_page_protection#Current_requests_for_reduction_in_protection_level" title="Wikipedia:Requests for page protection">Request fully-protected templates or modules be downgraded to template protection</a></li></ul> <p>Happy template editing! <a href="/wiki/User:Primefac" title="User:Primefac">Primefac</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Primefac" title="User talk:Primefac">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Primefac-20240922171200-Template_editor_granted" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:12, 22 September 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Primefac-20240922171200-Template_editor_granted"><span id="ooui-php-14" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Primefac-20240922171200-Template_editor_granted"></span> </p> </section><div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section section-heading" onclick="mfTempOpenSection(5)"><span class="indicator mf-icon mf-icon-expand mf-icon--small"></span><h2 id="Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic" data-mw-thread-id="h-Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic-20241002020300"><span id="Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations.2FPeripatetic"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic-20241002020300"></span><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic" title="Wikipedia:Contributor copyright investigations/Peripatetic">Wikipedia:Contributor copyright investigations/Peripatetic</a><span data-mw-comment-end="h-Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic-20241002020300"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"> <a role="button" href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Matrix&action=edit&section=5" title="Edit section: Wikipedia:Contributor copyright investigations/Peripatetic" class="cdx-button cdx-button--size-large cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--icon-only cdx-button--weight-quiet "> <span class="minerva-icon minerva-icon--edit"></span> <span>edit</span> </a> </span> <span id='ooui-php-29' class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-buttonWidget' data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonMenuSelectWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"ellipsis","data":{"itemConfigs":[{"id":"edit","data":{"id":"edit"},"icon":"edit","label":"Edit"}],"resourceLoaderModules":[]},"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton"]}'><a role='button' tabindex='0' rel='nofollow' class='oo-ui-buttonElement-button'><span class='oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-ellipsis'></span><span class='oo-ui-labelElement-label'></span><span class='oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator'></span></a></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-timestampLabel'>Latest comment: <a href="#c-Sennecaster-20241002203800-Matrix-20241002203300">1 month ago</a></span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-commentCountLabel'>5 comments</span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-authorCountLabel'>2 people in discussion</span></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div><section class="mf-section-5 collapsible-block" id="mf-section-5"> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Sennecaster-20241002020300-Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic"></span>For future reference, you need to do the dummy edit with the link to the page that the article was translated from and stating the timestamp, as per <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:RIA" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:RIA">WP:RIA</a><span class="nowrap">{{</span><a href="/wiki/Template:Translated_page" title="Template:Translated page">Translated page</a><span class="nowrap">}}</span> is a courtesy. There's no need to redo them, although I have done some when closing the other sections, but please keep in mind for the future. <a href="/wiki/User:Sennecaster" title="User:Sennecaster"><span style="color:#066516">Sennecaster</span></a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Sennecaster" title="User talk:Sennecaster"><span style="color:#8E4106">Chat</span></a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Sennecaster-20241002020300-Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:03, 2 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Sennecaster-20241002020300-Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic"><span id="ooui-php-15" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Sennecaster-20241002020300-Wikipedia:Contributor_copyright_investigations/Peripatetic"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20241002164000-Sennecaster-20241002020300"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Sennecaster" title="User:Sennecaster">Sennecaster</a>:</span> That is not strictly necessary. <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:RIA" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:RIA">WP:RIA</a> says "you <b>may</b> use an edit summary like this" (i.e. not a requirement to follow strictly). Per <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Text_of_the_Creative_Commons_Attribution-ShareAlike_4.0_International_License" title="Wikipedia:Text of the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 International License">Wikipedia:Text of the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 International License</a>, all you really need to do is include a URL/hyperlink <i>somewhere</i> to the original source for translated articles. When you save an edit, it says "[y]ou agree that a hyperlink or URL is sufficient attribution under the Creative Commons license" at the bottom. I did that with <span class="nowrap">{{</span><a href="/wiki/Template:Translated_page" title="Template:Translated page">Translated page</a><span class="nowrap">}}</span>. —<b>Matrix(!)</b> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">user</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">talk?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>contributions</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20241002164000-Sennecaster-20241002020300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:40, 2 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20241002164000-Sennecaster-20241002020300"><span id="ooui-php-16" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20241002164000-Sennecaster-20241002020300"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Sennecaster-20241002203000-Matrix-20241002164000"></span><style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1248585704">@media screen{html.skin-theme-clientpref-night .mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk{color:#00B785}}@media screen and (prefers-color-scheme:dark){html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk{color:#00B785}}.mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk{font-family:Georgia,"DejaVu Serif",serif;color:#008560;quotes:none}.mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk-italic{font-family:inherit;font-style:italic}.mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk-marks{quotes:"\"""\""}</style><q class="inline-quote-talk">When translating material from a Wikimedia project licensed under CC BY-SA, a note identifying the Wikimedia source (such as an interlanguage link) and the page name <b>must</b> be provided in an edit summary in the translated page, ideally in its first edit</q> from <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:PATT" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:PATT">WP:PATT</a>, emphasis mine. <a href="/wiki/User:Sennecaster" title="User:Sennecaster"><span style="color:#066516">Sennecaster</span></a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Sennecaster" title="User talk:Sennecaster"><span style="color:#8E4106">Chat</span></a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Sennecaster-20241002203000-Matrix-20241002164000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:30, 2 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Sennecaster-20241002203000-Matrix-20241002164000"><span id="ooui-php-17" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Sennecaster-20241002203000-Matrix-20241002164000"></span> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20241002203300-Sennecaster-20241002203000"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Sennecaster" title="User:Sennecaster">Sennecaster</a>:</span> Thanks for clarifying. —<b>Matrix(!)</b> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">user</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">talk?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>contributions</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20241002203300-Sennecaster-20241002203000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:33, 2 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20241002203300-Sennecaster-20241002203000"><span id="ooui-php-18" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20241002203300-Sennecaster-20241002203000"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Sennecaster-20241002203800-Matrix-20241002203300"></span>No worries. I honestly blame how poorly worded a lot of the copyright policy is for CWW confusion, but it's still a good thing to point out for the future. <a href="/wiki/User:Sennecaster" title="User:Sennecaster"><span style="color:#066516">Sennecaster</span></a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Sennecaster" title="User talk:Sennecaster"><span style="color:#8E4106">Chat</span></a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Sennecaster-20241002203800-Matrix-20241002203300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:38, 2 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Sennecaster-20241002203800-Matrix-20241002203300"><span id="ooui-php-19" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Sennecaster-20241002203800-Matrix-20241002203300"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> </section><div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section section-heading" onclick="mfTempOpenSection(6)"><span class="indicator mf-icon mf-icon-expand mf-icon--small"></span><h2 id="Custom_signature" data-mw-thread-id="h-Custom_signature-20241018085700"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Custom_signature-20241018085700"></span>Custom signature<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Custom_signature-20241018085700"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"> <a role="button" href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Matrix&action=edit&section=6" title="Edit section: Custom signature" class="cdx-button cdx-button--size-large cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--icon-only cdx-button--weight-quiet "> <span class="minerva-icon minerva-icon--edit"></span> <span>edit</span> </a> </span> <span id='ooui-php-30' class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-buttonWidget' data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonMenuSelectWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"ellipsis","data":{"itemConfigs":[{"id":"edit","data":{"id":"edit"},"icon":"edit","label":"Edit"}],"resourceLoaderModules":[]},"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-section-overflowMenuButton"]}'><a role='button' tabindex='0' rel='nofollow' class='oo-ui-buttonElement-button'><span class='oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-ellipsis'></span><span class='oo-ui-labelElement-label'></span><span class='oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator'></span></a></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-timestampLabel'>Latest comment: <a href="#c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018193000-Matrix-20241018180200">1 month ago</a></span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-commentCountLabel'>5 comments</span><span class='ext-discussiontools-init-section-metaitem ext-discussiontools-init-section-authorCountLabel'>2 people in discussion</span></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div><section class="mf-section-6 collapsible-block" id="mf-section-6"> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018085700-Custom_signature"></span>Hi Matrix! Your signature is quite lengthy and elaborate. Could you please consider shortening it and starting with a link to your user page, as is standard for most signatures? This would help user scripts easily identify your signature (e.g., for replacement or modification) and keep things more straightforward. Thanks. <a href="/wiki/User:Daniel_Quinlan" title="User:Daniel Quinlan">Daniel Quinlan</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Daniel_Quinlan" title="User talk:Daniel Quinlan">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018085700-Custom_signature" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:57, 18 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018085700-Custom_signature"><span id="ooui-php-20" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018085700-Custom_signature"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20241018160400-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018085700"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Daniel_Quinlan" title="User:Daniel Quinlan">Daniel Quinlan</a>:</span> I've shortened the signature. I don't really understand why a link to the userpage at the start is required though, mind explaining? —<b>Matrix(!)</b> <sub>ping <a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">one</a></sub><sup>when replying</sup> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">u</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">t?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>c</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20241018160400-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018085700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:04, 18 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20241018160400-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018085700"><span id="ooui-php-21" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20241018160400-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018085700"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018165900-Matrix-20241018160400"></span>Thanks for considering changes, I appreciate it! The reason for having the user page link at the start is mainly for consistency and technical reasons. Until <a href="https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T27141" class="extiw" title="phabricator:T27141">T27141</a> is addressed, most user scripts in this area rely on the user page link to identify where a signature begins. In your case, your signature now looks like it starts at "u" which confuses scripts into thinking that text before that link is part of your comment. It's an unusual case. Your signature is probably 1 in 10,000 from a difficulty standpoint so making code changes to handle it would break proper recognition of more signatures than it would fix. (No joke, I've tested several user scripts that I've been working on with that many user signatures.)</dd> <dd>From a usability perspective, it also follows the <a href="/wiki/Principle_of_least_astonishment" title="Principle of least astonishment">Principle of least astonishment</a>. Users expect that clicking a username will take them to the user page, and anything else can be jarring. <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:CUSTOMSIG/P" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:CUSTOMSIG/P">WP:CUSTOMSIG/P</a> has some additional best practices although it doesn't talk about technical issues. I hope this clarifies the requests. <a href="/wiki/User:Daniel_Quinlan" title="User:Daniel Quinlan">Daniel Quinlan</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Daniel_Quinlan" title="User talk:Daniel Quinlan">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018165900-Matrix-20241018160400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:59, 18 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018165900-Matrix-20241018160400"><span id="ooui-php-22" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018165900-Matrix-20241018160400"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Matrix-20241018180200-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018165900"></span>Thanks for your detailed explanation! I have changed it to be better now. —<b><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">Matrix</a>(!)</b> <sub>ping one</sub><sup>when replying</sup> {<i><a href="/wiki/User:Matrix" title="User:Matrix">u</a> - <a class="mw-selflink selflink">t?</a> - <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Matrix" title="Special:Contributions/Matrix"><sub><small><s>useless</s></small></sub>c</a></i>} <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Matrix-20241018180200-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018165900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:02, 18 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Matrix-20241018180200-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018165900"><span id="ooui-php-23" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" class="oo-ui-buttonElement-button"><span class="oo-ui-iconElement-icon oo-ui-icon-share oo-ui-image-progressive"></span><span class="oo-ui-labelElement-label">Reply</span><span class="oo-ui-indicatorElement-indicator oo-ui-indicatorElement-noIndicator oo-ui-image-progressive"></span></a></span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Matrix-20241018180200-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018165900"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018193000-Matrix-20241018180200"></span>Thanks, that fixed it! The "u" might be unnecessary if you wanted to be more efficient with your signature (hopefully changing that won't break my code, it feels like a minor miracle that it's parsing your signature correctly now). Regards. <a href="/wiki/User:Daniel_Quinlan" title="User:Daniel Quinlan">Daniel Quinlan</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Daniel_Quinlan" title="User talk:Daniel Quinlan">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Matrix#c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018193000-Matrix-20241018180200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:30, 18 October 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20241018193000-Matrix-20241018180200"><span id="ooui-php-24" class="ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton oo-ui-widget oo-ui-widget-enabled oo-ui-buttonElement oo-ui-buttonElement-frameless oo-ui-iconElement oo-ui-labelElement oo-ui-flaggedElement-progressive oo-ui-buttonWidget" data-ooui='{"_":"OO.ui.ButtonWidget","rel":["nofollow"],"framed":false,"icon":"share","label":"Reply","flags":["progressive"],"classes":["ext-discussiontools-init-replybutton"]}'><a role="button" tabindex="0" rel="nofollow" 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