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<span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">2 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Physical_attraction-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-John_Ogilby" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#John_Ogilby"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">5</span> <span>John Ogilby</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">6 comments</span> <ul id="toc-John_Ogilby-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Brexit_and_the_Irish_border"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">6</span> <span>Brexit and the Irish border</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">7 comments</span> <button aria-controls="toc-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border-sublist" class="cdx-button cdx-button--weight-quiet cdx-button--icon-only vector-toc-toggle"> <span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-expand"></span> <span>Toggle Brexit and the Irish border subsection</span> </button> <ul id="toc-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> <li id="toc-Other_UK_borders" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-2"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Other_UK_borders"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">6.1</span> <span>Other UK borders</span> </div> </a> <ul id="toc-Other_UK_borders-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_3_October_2023" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_3_October_2023"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">7</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 3 October 2023</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_3_October_2023-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Specialist_words" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Specialist_words"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">8</span> <span>Specialist words</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">3 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Specialist_words-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_24_December_2023" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_24_December_2023"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">9</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 24 December 2023</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_24_December_2023-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Season's_Greetings" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Season's_Greetings"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">10</span> <span>Season's Greetings</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-Season's_Greetings-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Club_news" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Club_news"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">11</span> <span>Club news</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">8 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Club_news-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">12</span> <span>IP editor on HS2 Talk</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">5 comments</span> <ul id="toc-IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Pythagoras" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Pythagoras"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">13</span> <span>Pythagoras</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">2 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Pythagoras-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Blackpool_article" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Blackpool_article"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">14</span> <span>The Blackpool article</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">2 comments</span> <ul id="toc-The_Blackpool_article-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Junk_currency" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Junk_currency"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">15</span> <span>Junk currency</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">4 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Junk_currency-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-New_Page_Reviewing" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#New_Page_Reviewing"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">16</span> <span>New Page Reviewing</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-New_Page_Reviewing-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">17</span> <span>Nomination of Information sign for deletion</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Just_a_reminder" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Just_a_reminder"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">18</span> <span>Just a reminder</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">4 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Just_a_reminder-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-"Harry_the_house"" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#"Harry_the_house""> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">19</span> <span>"Harry the house"</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">4 comments</span> <ul id="toc-"Harry_the_house"-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Unsourced_edits" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Unsourced_edits"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">20</span> <span>Unsourced edits</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-Unsourced_edits-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_10_January_2024" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_10_January_2024"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">21</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 10 January 2024</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_10_January_2024-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">22</span> <span>What does “Unable to fetch Parsoid HTML” mean?</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">2 comments</span> <ul id="toc-What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Poots'_v_Poots's" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Poots'_v_Poots's"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">23</span> <span>Poots' v Poots's</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">2 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Poots'_v_Poots's-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_31_January_2024" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_31_January_2024"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">24</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 31 January 2024</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_31_January_2024-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_13_February_2024" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_13_February_2024"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">25</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 13 February 2024</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_13_February_2024-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">26</span> <span>Notice of No Original Research Noticeboard discussion</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">27</span> <span>Your GA nomination of Robert Hooke</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">28</span> <span>Your GA nomination of Robert Hooke</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Tittles" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Tittles"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">29</span> <span>Tittles</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">6 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Tittles-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Infobox_demographic_statistics" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Infobox_demographic_statistics"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">30</span> <span>Infobox demographic statistics</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">11 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Infobox_demographic_statistics-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_2_March_2024" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_2_March_2024"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">31</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 2 March 2024</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_2_March_2024-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">32</span> <span>Wikipedia Library Request... support if you so wish</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Ursula_von_der_Leyen" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Ursula_von_der_Leyen"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">33</span> <span>Ursula von der Leyen</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">4 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Ursula_von_der_Leyen-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Unicode_hyphen" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Unicode_hyphen"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">34</span> <span>The Unicode hyphen</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">7 comments</span> <ul id="toc-The_Unicode_hyphen-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-DYK_for_Robert_Hooke" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#DYK_for_Robert_Hooke"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">35</span> <span>DYK for Robert Hooke</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-DYK_for_Robert_Hooke-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_29_March_2024" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_29_March_2024"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">36</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 29 March 2024</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_29_March_2024-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Re:_Jahor12345" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Re:_Jahor12345"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">37</span> <span>Re: Jahor12345</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">6 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Re:_Jahor12345-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Winslow_station" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Winslow_station"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">38</span> <span>Winslow station</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">4 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Winslow_station-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_or_TheCurrencyGuy" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_or_TheCurrencyGuy"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">39</span> <span>Evidence that the IP server that was blocked was not a sockpupet of Jahor12345 or TheCurrencyGuy</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">2 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_or_TheCurrencyGuy-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Japanese_Yen" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Japanese_Yen"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">40</span> <span>Japanese Yen</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-Japanese_Yen-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">41</span> <span>Milton Keynes University Hospital</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">4 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_25_April_2024" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_25_April_2024"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">42</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 25 April 2024</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_25_April_2024-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History"_section?" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History"_section?"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">43</span> <span>Ethnic groups in Gibraltar, are historical facts relevant outside the "History" section?</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">4 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History"_section?-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Robert_Hooke" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Robert_Hooke"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">44</span> <span>Robert Hooke</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">5 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Robert_Hooke-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-ASCII_on_36-bit_machines" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#ASCII_on_36-bit_machines"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">45</span> <span>ASCII on 36-bit machines</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">3 comments</span> <ul id="toc-ASCII_on_36-bit_machines-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_16_May_2024" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_16_May_2024"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">46</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 16 May 2024</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_16_May_2024-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Egyptian_Pound" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Egyptian_Pound"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">47</span> <span>The Egyptian Pound</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">6 comments</span> <ul id="toc-The_Egyptian_Pound-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">48</span> <span>The Main Source for the History of the Egyptian pound</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">7 comments</span> <ul id="toc-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">49</span> <span>The history of the infamous E=mc^2 equation</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">4 comments</span> <ul id="toc-The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-The_Signpost:_8_June_2024" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#The_Signpost:_8_June_2024"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">50</span> <span><i>The Signpost</i>: 8 June 2024</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-The_Signpost:_8_June_2024-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Source_of_edit" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Source_of_edit"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">51</span> <span>Source of edit</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">3 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Source_of_edit-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">52</span> <span>Regarding our 'Hazard Symbols' discussion</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">2 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Thanks" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a 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class="vector-body" aria-labelledby="firstHeading" data-mw-ve-target-container> <div class="vector-body-before-content"> <div class="mw-indicators"> </div> <div id="siteSub" class="noprint">From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia</div> </div> <div id="contentSub"><div id="mw-content-subtitle"><div class="subpages">< <bdi dir="ltr"><a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF" title="User talk:JMF">User talk:JMF</a></bdi></div></div></div> <div id="mw-content-text" class="mw-body-content"><div class="mw-content-ltr mw-parser-output" lang="en" dir="ltr"><style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1237879475">.mw-parser-output .tmbox{margin:4px 0;border-collapse:collapse;border:1px solid #c0c090;background-color:#f8eaba;box-sizing:border-box}.mw-parser-output .tmbox.mbox-small{font-size:88%;line-height:1.25em}.mw-parser-output .tmbox-speedy{border:2px solid #b32424;background-color:#fee7e6}.mw-parser-output .tmbox-delete{border:2px solid #b32424}.mw-parser-output .tmbox-content{border:2px solid 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.tmbox{background-color:#2e2505}html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .tmbox-speedy{background-color:#310402}}body.skin--responsive .mw-parser-output table.tmbox img{max-width:none!important}</style><table class="plainlinks tmbox tmbox-notice" role="presentation"><tbody><tr><td class="mbox-image"><span typeof="mw:File"><span><img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/2a/Replacement_filing_cabinet.svg/40px-Replacement_filing_cabinet.svg.png" decoding="async" width="40" height="40" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/2a/Replacement_filing_cabinet.svg/60px-Replacement_filing_cabinet.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/2a/Replacement_filing_cabinet.svg/80px-Replacement_filing_cabinet.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="200" data-file-height="200"/></span></span></td><td class="mbox-text" style="text-align:center">This is an <b><a href="/wiki/Help:Archiving_a_talk_page" title="Help:Archiving a talk page">archive</a></b> of past discussions with <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">User:JMF</a>. <b>Do not edit the contents of this page.</b> If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF" title="User talk:JMF">current talk page</a>.</td></tr></tbody></table> <table style="text-align:center;margin:0 auto 0.5em;max-width:35em;width:100%;width:-moz-available;width:-webkit-fill-available;width:stretch"><tbody><tr><td><a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_1" title="User talk:JMF/Archive 1">Archive 1</a></td><td>←</td><td><a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_3" title="User talk:JMF/Archive 3">Archive 3</a></td><td><a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_4" title="User talk:JMF/Archive 4">Archive 4</a></td><td><span style="font-size:115%;"><a class="mw-selflink selflink">Archive 5</a></span></td></tr></tbody></table> <meta property="mw:PageProp/toc"/> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="ASCII_short_description" data-mw-thread-id="h-ASCII_short_description-20230905103100"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-ASCII_short_description-20230905103100"></span>ASCII short description<span data-mw-comment-end="h-ASCII_short_description-20230905103100"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-AVDLCZ-20230905103100-ASCII_short_description"></span>Hi JMF, I see you've <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=ASCII&oldid=1173875977">reverted</a> my edit to <a href="/wiki/ASCII" title="ASCII">ASCII</a>'s short description in which I changed it from "American character encoding standard" to just "Character encoding standard". While the "A" in ASCII does stand for "American", I don't believe that's enough to justify including "American" in the shortdesc. Since the standard is used all over the world, describing it specifically as "American" might confuse people more than help them. Also, the lead sentence of the article reads "ASCII [...] is a character encoding standard for electronic communication", do you believe that should also be changed to say "American character encoding standard"? <a href="/w/index.php?title=User:AVDLCZ&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:AVDLCZ (page does not exist)">AVDLCZ</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AVDLCZ" title="User talk:AVDLCZ">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-AVDLCZ-20230905103100-ASCII_short_description" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:31, 5 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-AVDLCZ-20230905103100-ASCII_short_description"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-AVDLCZ-20230905103100-ASCII_short_description"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20230905142000-AVDLCZ-20230905103100"></span>@<a href="/w/index.php?title=User:AVDLCZ&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:AVDLCZ (page does not exist)">AVDLCZ</a>:</span> but fundamentally, it is an American standard, not an international standard. The fact that it was adopted by other countries doesn't make it any less an American standard. The major source cited in the article, <style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1238218222">.mw-parser-output cite.citation{font-style:inherit;word-wrap:break-word}.mw-parser-output .citation q{quotes:"\"""\"""'""'"}.mw-parser-output .citation:target{background-color:rgba(0,127,255,0.133)}.mw-parser-output .id-lock-free.id-lock-free a{background:url("//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/65/Lock-green.svg")right 0.1em center/9px no-repeat}.mw-parser-output .id-lock-limited.id-lock-limited a,.mw-parser-output .id-lock-registration.id-lock-registration a{background:url("//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d6/Lock-gray-alt-2.svg")right 0.1em center/9px no-repeat}.mw-parser-output .id-lock-subscription.id-lock-subscription a{background:url("//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/aa/Lock-red-alt-2.svg")right 0.1em center/9px no-repeat}.mw-parser-output .cs1-ws-icon a{background:url("//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4c/Wikisource-logo.svg")right 0.1em center/12px no-repeat}body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .id-lock-free a,body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .id-lock-limited a,body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .id-lock-registration a,body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .id-lock-subscription a,body:not(.skin-timeless):not(.skin-minerva) .mw-parser-output .cs1-ws-icon a{background-size:contain;padding:0 1em 0 0}.mw-parser-output .cs1-code{color:inherit;background:inherit;border:none;padding:inherit}.mw-parser-output .cs1-hidden-error{display:none;color:var(--color-error,#d33)}.mw-parser-output .cs1-visible-error{color:var(--color-error,#d33)}.mw-parser-output .cs1-maint{display:none;color:#085;margin-left:0.3em}.mw-parser-output .cs1-kern-left{padding-left:0.2em}.mw-parser-output .cs1-kern-right{padding-right:0.2em}.mw-parser-output .citation .mw-selflink{font-weight:inherit}@media screen{.mw-parser-output .cs1-format{font-size:95%}html.skin-theme-clientpref-night .mw-parser-output .cs1-maint{color:#18911f}}@media screen and (prefers-color-scheme:dark){html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .cs1-maint{color:#18911f}}</style><cite id="CITEREFMackenzie1980" class="citation book cs1">Mackenzie, Charles E. (1980). <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://textfiles.meulie.net/bitsaved/Books/Mackenzie_CodedCharSets.pdf"><i>Coded Character Sets, History and Development</i></a> <span class="cs1-format">(PDF)</span>. The Systems Programming Series (1 ed.). <a href="/wiki/Addison-Wesley_Publishing_Company,_Inc." class="mw-redirect" title="Addison-Wesley Publishing Company, Inc.">Addison-Wesley Publishing Company, Inc.</a> pp. 6, 66, 211, 215, 217, 220, 223, 228, 236–238, 243–245, 247–253, 423, 425–428, 435–439. <a href="/wiki/ISBN_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="ISBN (identifier)">ISBN</a> <a href="/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-0-201-14460-4" title="Special:BookSources/978-0-201-14460-4"><bdi>978-0-201-14460-4</bdi></a>. <a href="/wiki/LCCN_(identifier)" class="mw-redirect" title="LCCN (identifier)">LCCN</a> <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://lccn.loc.gov/77-90165">77-90165</a>. <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20160526172151/https://textfiles.meulie.net/bitsaved/Books/Mackenzie_CodedCharSets.pdf">Archived</a> <span class="cs1-format">(PDF)</span> from the original on May 26, 2016<span class="reference-accessdate">. Retrieved <span class="nowrap">August 25,</span> 2019</span>.</cite><span title="ctx_ver=Z39.88-2004&rft_val_fmt=info%3Aofi%2Ffmt%3Akev%3Amtx%3Abook&rft.genre=book&rft.btitle=Coded+Character+Sets%2C+History+and+Development&rft.series=The+Systems+Programming+Series&rft.pages=6%2C+66%2C+211%2C+215%2C+217%2C+220%2C+223%2C+228%2C+236-238%2C+243-245%2C+247-253%2C+423%2C+425-428%2C+435-439&rft.edition=1&rft.pub=Addison-Wesley+Publishing+Company%2C+Inc.&rft.date=1980&rft_id=info%3Alccn%2F77-90165&rft.isbn=978-0-201-14460-4&rft.aulast=Mackenzie&rft.aufirst=Charles+E.&rft_id=https%3A%2F%2Ftextfiles.meulie.net%2Fbitsaved%2FBooks%2FMackenzie_CodedCharSets.pdf&rfr_id=info%3Asid%2Fen.wikipedia.org%3AUser+talk%3AJMF%2FArchive+5" class="Z3988"></span>, specifically mentions [p 238] concurrent European (ECMA) and British (BS) standards being developed concurrently and the work that was done between standards bodies to align their code choices as far as possible, while reserving certain code positions for national use. In the ASCII standard, these are assigned to the American choices (which is why, to take the simplest case, it has a <a href="/wiki/Number_sign" title="Number sign">number sign</a> <span class="nounderlines" style="border: 1px solid var(--border-color-muted,#ddd); color: var(--color-base); background-color: var( --background-color-neutral-subtle, #fdfdfd); padding: 1px 1px;">#</span> rather than a <a href="/wiki/Pound_sign" title="Pound sign">pound sign</a> <span class="nounderlines" style="border: 1px solid var(--border-color-muted,#ddd); color: var(--color-base); background-color: var( --background-color-neutral-subtle, #fdfdfd); padding: 1px 1px;">£</span>). ASCII <i>is</i> the American national variant of <a href="/wiki/ISO/IEC_646" title="ISO/IEC 646">ISO/IEC 646</a>, it <i>is</i> an American standard. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20230905142000-AVDLCZ-20230905103100" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">14:20, 5 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20230905142000-AVDLCZ-20230905103100"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20230905142000-AVDLCZ-20230905103100"></span></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20230905142300-AVDLCZ-20230905103100"></span>I see no reason to change the lead sentence: ASCII <i>is</i> a character encoding standard for electronic communication. Just not the only one of its time. Of course the question is moot (in the en-US sense) since ASCII is technically obsolete, having been replaced by Unicode. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20230905142300-AVDLCZ-20230905103100" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">14:23, 5 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20230905142300-AVDLCZ-20230905103100"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20230905142300-AVDLCZ-20230905103100"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="DYK_for_John_Ogilby" data-mw-thread-id="h-DYK_for_John_Ogilby-20230915001600"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-DYK_for_John_Ogilby-20230915001600"></span>DYK for John Ogilby<span data-mw-comment-end="h-DYK_for_John_Ogilby-20230915001600"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Vaticidalprophet-20230915001600-DYK_for_John_Ogilby"></span><style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1256334245">.mw-parser-output .ivmbox{margin-bottom:1em;border:1px solid var(--border-color-base,#a2a9b1);background-color:var(--background-color-warning-subtle,#fdf2d5);padding:0.5em;display:flex;align-items:center}@media screen{html.skin-theme-clientpref-night .mw-parser-output .ivmbox[style*="background"]{background-color:var(--background-color-warning-subtle,ivory)!important;color:inherit}}@media screen and (prefers-color-scheme:dark){html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .ivmbox[style*="background"]{background-color:var(--background-color-warning-subtle,ivory)!important;color:inherit}}.mw-parser-output .ivmbox-image{padding-left:1px;padding-right:0.5em;max-width:100px;flex:1 0 25px}.mw-parser-output .ivmbox-text{padding:0.5em 0}.mw-parser-output .ivmbox-text>:first-child{margin-top:0}.mw-parser-output .ivmbox-text>:last-child{margin-bottom:0}</style><div class="ivmbox" style=""> <div class="ivmbox-image" style="flex-basis: 40px"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Updated_DYK_query.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/a0/Updated_DYK_query.svg/40px-Updated_DYK_query.svg.png" decoding="async" width="40" height="81" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/a0/Updated_DYK_query.svg/60px-Updated_DYK_query.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/a0/Updated_DYK_query.svg/80px-Updated_DYK_query.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="35" data-file-height="71"/></a></span></div> <div class="ivmbox-text"> <p>On <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2023/September#15_September_2023" title="Wikipedia:Recent additions/2023/September">15 September 2023</a>, <b><a href="/wiki/Template:Did_you_know" title="Template:Did you know">Did you know</a></b> was updated with a fact from the article <i><b><a href="/wiki/John_Ogilby" title="John Ogilby">John Ogilby</a></b></i>, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was <i>... that <b><a href="/wiki/John_Ogilby" title="John Ogilby">John Ogilby</a></b> saved the manuscript of his translation of the complete works of Virgil from destruction in a shipwreck by wrapping it in a waterproof cloth?</i> The nomination discussion and review may be seen at <a href="/wiki/Template:Did_you_know_nominations/John_Ogilby" title="Template:Did you know nominations/John Ogilby">Template:Did you know nominations/John Ogilby</a>. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>(<a href="/wiki/User:Rjanag/Pageview_stats" title="User:Rjanag/Pageview stats">here's how</a>, <a class="external text" href="https://pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2023-09-05&end=2023-09-25&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=John_Ogilby">John Ogilby</a>)</small>, and the hook may be added to <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Did_you_know/Statistics/Monthly_DYK_pageview_leaders" title="Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics/Monthly DYK pageview leaders">the statistics page</a> after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the <a href="/wiki/Template_talk:Did_you_know" title="Template talk:Did you know">Did you know talk page</a>. </p> </div> </div> <p><a href="/wiki/User:Vaticidalprophet" title="User:Vaticidalprophet"><b style="color:black">Vaticidal</b></a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Vaticidalprophet" title="User talk:Vaticidalprophet"><b style="color:#66023C">prophet</b></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Vaticidalprophet-20230915001600-DYK_for_John_Ogilby" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:16, 15 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Vaticidalprophet-20230915001600-DYK_for_John_Ogilby"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Vaticidalprophet-20230915001600-DYK_for_John_Ogilby"></span> </p><div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_16_September_2023" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_16_September_2023-20230916043600"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_16_September_2023-20230916043600"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 16 September 2023<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_16_September_2023-20230916043600"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20230916043600-The_Signpost:_16_September_2023"></span>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-09-16/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-09-16/News and notes">Wikimedia power sharing – just an advisory role for the volunteer community?</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-09-16/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-09-16/In the media">"Just flirting", going Dutch and Shapps for the defence?</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Obituary: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-09-16/Obituary" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-09-16/Obituary">Nosebagbear</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Serendipity: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-09-16/Serendipity" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-09-16/Serendipity">Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no paywall, for thou, Wikipedia Library, art with me</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Featured content: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-09-16/Featured_content" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-09-16/Featured content">Catching up</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Concept: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-09-16/Concept" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-09-16/Concept">Strange portal opened by CERN researchers brings Wikipedia articles from "other worlds"</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-09-16/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-09-16/Traffic report">Some of it's magic, some of it's tragic</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2023-09-16" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2023-09-16">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20230916043600-The_Signpost:_16_September_2023" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">04:36, 16 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20230916043600-The_Signpost:_16_September_2023"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20230916043600-The_Signpost:_16_September_2023"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Physical_attraction" data-mw-thread-id="h-Physical_attraction-20230917180500"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Physical_attraction-20230917180500"></span>Physical attraction<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Physical_attraction-20230917180500"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Wikiedit4444444-20230917180500-Physical_attraction"></span>Hi JMF i made some changes to a wiki page physical attraction would u like to discuss it? <a href="/w/index.php?title=User:Wikiedit4444444&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:Wikiedit4444444 (page does not exist)">Wikiedit4444444</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Wikiedit4444444" title="User talk:Wikiedit4444444">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Wikiedit4444444-20230917180500-Physical_attraction" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:05, 17 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Wikiedit4444444-20230917180500-Physical_attraction"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Wikiedit4444444-20230917180500-Physical_attraction"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20230917182500-Wikiedit4444444-20230917180500"></span>@<a href="/w/index.php?title=User:Wikiedit4444444&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:Wikiedit4444444 (page does not exist)">Wikiedit4444444</a>:</span> Not here. Any discussion needs to be at <a href="/wiki/Talk:Physical_attractiveness" title="Talk:Physical attractiveness">talk:Physical attractiveness</a> so that others can contribute. But as I said at your talk page, it is always more productive to propose such changes at the talk page first. I don't have time to engage right now, hopefully tomorrow. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20230917182500-Wikiedit4444444-20230917180500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:25, 17 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20230917182500-Wikiedit4444444-20230917180500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20230917182500-Wikiedit4444444-20230917180500"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="John_Ogilby" data-mw-thread-id="h-John_Ogilby-20230929231500"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-John_Ogilby-20230929231500"></span>John Ogilby<span data-mw-comment-end="h-John_Ogilby-20230929231500"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div style="clear:both;" class=""></div><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600-John_Ogilby"></span><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1237879475"><table class="plainlinks tmbox tmbox-style" role="presentation"><tbody><tr><td class="mbox-image"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Writing_Magnifying.PNG" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/Writing_Magnifying.PNG/70px-Writing_Magnifying.PNG" decoding="async" width="70" height="70" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/Writing_Magnifying.PNG/105px-Writing_Magnifying.PNG 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e2/Writing_Magnifying.PNG 2x" data-file-width="140" data-file-height="140"/></a></span></td><td class="mbox-text">Hello, JMF. This is a courtesy notice that the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Basic_copyediting" title="Wikipedia:Basic copyediting">copy edit</a> you requested for <b><a href="/wiki/John_Ogilby" title="John Ogilby">John Ogilby</a></b> at the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Guild_of_Copy_Editors/Requests" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors/Requests">Guild of Copy Editors requests page</a> is now complete. All <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Guild_of_Copy_Editors/Requests" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors/Requests">feedback welcome</a>! Cheers, <b><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baffle_gab1978" title="User talk:Baffle gab1978"><span style="color:#191960">Baffle☿<i>gab</i></span></a></b> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600-John_Ogilby" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">04:06, 30 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600-John_Ogilby"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600-John_Ogilby"></span></td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br/> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20230929231500-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Baffle_gab1978" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Baffle gab1978">Baffle gab1978</a>:</span>: all looking good (but depressingly extensive). Just one item caught my attention: you changed <style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1248585704">@media screen{html.skin-theme-clientpref-night .mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk{color:#00B785}}@media screen and (prefers-color-scheme:dark){html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk{color:#00B785}}.mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk{font-family:Georgia,"DejaVu Serif",serif;color:#008560;quotes:none}.mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk-italic{font-family:inherit;font-style:italic}.mw-parser-output .inline-quote-talk-marks{quotes:"\"""\""}</style><q class="inline-quote-talk">a well-to-do gentleman's tailor in Edinburgh</q> to <link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">a rich gentleman's tailor in Edinburgh</q>, which is of course valid since "well-to-do" is an en-uk colloquialism. But it highlighted an ambigiuity: neither version distinguishes between "a [rich gentleman's] tailor" v. "a rich [gentleman's tailor]". I meant the latter of course (though both would have had to be true). Is there a better way to write it? <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20230929231500-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:15, 29 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20230929231500-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20230929231500-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930010200-JMF-20230929231500"></span>No worries; thanks for asking; yes, "well-to-do" is colloquial and I noticed the ambiguity in that phrase. We could say "a rich tailor to gentlemen"; or if the former were meant, "a tailor to rich gentlemen". I thought it might be self-explanatory though; since a gentleman in historical contexts (unless used ironically) is a man of high social status (but not necessarily rich). Let me know what you think. Cheers, <b><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baffle_gab1978" title="User talk:Baffle gab1978"><span style="color:#191960">Baffle☿<i>gab</i></span></a></b> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930010200-JMF-20230929231500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">01:02, 30 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930010200-JMF-20230929231500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930010200-JMF-20230929231500"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600-Baffle_gab1978-20230930010200"></span>I've now finished the c/e, though I haven't fixed the issue above. In "Literary reputation", I've tagged "recently" (1st para) with <span class="nowrap">{{</span><a href="/wiki/Template:When" title="Template:When">when</a><span class="nowrap">}}</span> (when did this start?) and I noticed "arguably" in the third para; I think this is explained by the footnote but it seem to me like an expression of uncertainty. Anyway, good luck with the article. Cheers, <b><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baffle_gab1978" title="User talk:Baffle gab1978"><span style="color:#191960">Baffle☿<i>gab</i></span></a></b> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600-Baffle_gab1978-20230930010200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">04:06, 30 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600-Baffle_gab1978-20230930010200"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600-Baffle_gab1978-20230930010200"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20230930122800-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600"></span>Thank you for this thorough going over. The article looks quite a bit better now.</dd> <dd>I'm still struggling with the word "rich" because the citations don't support that and he certainly wasn't rich compared to his customers. The concept of "middle class" didn't exist then but if it did, he would have been classes as "comfortably-off middle class" by modern standards. So I will have to find a better word. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20230930122800-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:28, 30 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20230930122800-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20230930122800-Baffle_gab1978-20230930040600"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930193800-JMF-20230930122800"></span>No worries; it's a difficult one... I'd suggest "relatively wealthy", or maybe "of middle income" or something similar? He's an interesting subject anyway. Cheers, <b><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baffle_gab1978" title="User talk:Baffle gab1978"><span style="color:#191960">Baffle☿<i>gab</i></span></a></b> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930193800-JMF-20230930122800" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:38, 30 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930193800-JMF-20230930122800"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baffle_gab1978-20230930193800-JMF-20230930122800"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Brexit_and_the_Irish_border" data-mw-thread-id="h-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border-20230930161400"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border-20230930161400"></span>Brexit and the Irish border<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border-20230930161400"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Cosmiaou-20230930161400-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border"></span>Hello, </p><p>I've seen you <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Brexit_and_the_Irish_border&oldid=prev&diff=1177938813">reverted</a> my edit on the page "<a href="/wiki/Brexit_and_the_Irish_border" title="Brexit and the Irish border">Brexit and the Irish border</a>", stating that "<i>the UK/France border is a sea border.</i>" I do completely agree with you that this precision adds little relevance to the page, which isn't centered around <a href="/wiki/External_border_of_the_European_Union" title="External border of the European Union">all the borders of the UK and the EU</a>. But, the <a href="/wiki/France%E2%80%93United_Kingdom_border" title="France–United Kingdom border">UK/France border</a> isn't just a sea border. The <a href="/wiki/Treaty_of_Canterbury_(1986)" title="Treaty of Canterbury (1986)">Treaty of Canterbury</a> drew the land border in the Chunnel. </p><p><br/> I'm not going to revert your own revert because, first, that would be disrespectful and uncollaborative, and secondly, because I'm not a major contributor to the English Wikipedia (I'm more active on the <a href="/wiki/French_Wikipedia" title="French Wikipedia">French Wikipedia</a>). However, the page right now is incorrect in stating the Irish/UK border is the only land border between the UK and the EU <a href="/wiki/User:Cosmiaou" title="User:Cosmiaou">Cosmiaou</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Cosmiaou&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:Cosmiaou (page does not exist)">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Cosmiaou-20230930161400-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:14, 30 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Cosmiaou-20230930161400-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Cosmiaou-20230930161400-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20230930192100-Cosmiaou-20230930161400"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Cosmiaou" title="User:Cosmiaou">Cosmiaou</a>:</span> thank you for that consideration. I must continue to disagree because I believe that you have confused two closely-related ideas: a 'dry' border crossing v a 'land' crossing.</dd> <dd>Yes, technically you are correct but only because the line between England and France is logically three-dimensional, not just two: it also extends vertically from the mantle to the stratosphere. The jurisdiction (and law enforcement) of each country extends to that line but the frontier infrastructure is on land on either side: French frontier controls are physically at Dover, Folkestone, Newhaven and Portsmouth; their British counterparts are at Calais, Sangatte, Dieppe and Caen.</dd> <dd>A similar arrangement arises at the Denmark/Sweden border, which is also a sea border. The construction of the <a href="/wiki/%C3%98resund_Bridge" title="Øresund Bridge">Øresund Bridge</a> didn't change it to a land border simply because it provides a dry crossing. Whether the sea is crossed by a bridge, a tunnel or a ferry is not significant.</dd> <dd>The border in Ireland is qualitatively different: it is like the border between adjacent <span title="French-language text"><i lang="fr">Départements</i></span> in France. It has little or no significant topological differentiation. It is 500km long, crossed by over 270 public roads and who knows how many footpaths and farm tracks. The road between two <a href="/wiki/County_town" title="County town">county towns</a> in the Republic, <a href="/wiki/Cavan" title="Cavan">Cavan</a> and <a href="/wiki/Monaghan" title="Monaghan">Monaghan</a>, changes its designation repeatedly from <a href="/wiki/N54_road_(Ireland)" title="N54 road (Ireland)">N54 road (Ireland)</a> to <a href="/wiki/A3_road_(Northern_Ireland)" title="A3 road (Northern Ireland)">A3 road (Northern Ireland)</a> and back again because the border meanders back and over. In one famous case, a house has its front door in one jurisdiction and its back door in the other. Now <i>that</i> is a land border.</dd> <dd>Does that explanation satisfy you? --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20230930192100-Cosmiaou-20230930161400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:21, 30 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20230930192100-Cosmiaou-20230930161400"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20230930192100-Cosmiaou-20230930161400"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading3"><h3 id="Other_UK_borders" data-mw-thread-id="h-Other_UK_borders-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border-20230930221500"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Other_UK_borders-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border-20230930221500"></span>Other UK borders<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Other_UK_borders-Brexit_and_the_Irish_border-20230930221500"></span></h3></div> <span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20230930221500-Other_UK_borders"></span><figure class="mw-default-size" typeof="mw:File/Thumb"><a href="/wiki/File:Territorial_waters_-_United_Kingdom.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2e/Territorial_waters_-_United_Kingdom.svg/220px-Territorial_waters_-_United_Kingdom.svg.png" decoding="async" width="220" height="110" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2e/Territorial_waters_-_United_Kingdom.svg/330px-Territorial_waters_-_United_Kingdom.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2e/Territorial_waters_-_United_Kingdom.svg/440px-Territorial_waters_-_United_Kingdom.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="800" data-file-height="400"/></a><figcaption>The exclusive economic zones of the United Kingdom in blue, including the <a href="/wiki/British_Overseas_Territories" title="British Overseas Territories">British Overseas Territories</a> and the <a href="/wiki/Crown_Dependencies" title="Crown Dependencies">Crown Dependencies</a></figcaption></figure> <p>Ever since Brexit, I keep hearing that the border in the English Channel is the <i>only</i> line separating Great Britain from the European Union. This may be quite beside the point of the 𝕁𝕄𝔽/Cosmiaou debate, but it provides me with the opportunity, at last, to ask <i>"what about the border between Gibraltar and Spain?"</i> Hasn't Gibraltar been part of Great Britain since the <a href="/wiki/Treaty_of_Utrecht" class="mw-redirect" title="Treaty of Utrecht">Treaty of Utrecht</a> over two hundred years ago? And isn't Spain part of the European Union?<br/> There, I asked the question! I will sleep more soundly tonight. <a href="/wiki/User:Peter_M._Brown" title="User:Peter M. Brown">Peter Brown</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Peter_M._Brown" title="User talk:Peter M. Brown">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Peter_M._Brown-20230930221500-Other_UK_borders" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:15, 30 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20230930221500-Other_UK_borders"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Peter_M._Brown-20230930221500-Other_UK_borders"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20230930233000-Peter_M._Brown-20230930221500"></span>Hi Peter. The Anglo-French border gets all the attention but of course there is also a sea border with Belgium, Netherlands, Germany, Denmark and Ireland (wrt GB). See the EEZ map for details (Gibraltar does not have an EEZ). Yes, like the five I already mentioned, Spain is an EU member but doesn't have border with the UK as such. Norway and Iceland – which also feature on the map – are not, they are members of <a href="/wiki/EFTA" class="mw-redirect" title="EFTA">EFTA</a>.</dd> <dd>Gibraltar is a <a href="/wiki/British_Overseas_Territory" class="mw-redirect" title="British Overseas Territory">British Overseas Territory</a>, not part of the UK. Like the American Colonies (which weren't part of the Kingdom of Great Britain either), just another trophy on the wall. <a href="https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/tongue-in-cheek" class="extiw" title="wikt:tongue-in-cheek">;-^</a></dd> <dd>Terminology: in 1707, England and Scotland merged to become the <a href="/wiki/Kingdom_of_Great_Britain" title="Kingdom of Great Britain">Kingdom of Great Britain</a>. In 1801, Great Britain and Ireland merged to become the <a href="/wiki/United_Kingdom_of_Great_Britain_and_Ireland" title="United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland">United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland</a>. In 1921, about 80% of Ireland seceded, and the UK became the <a href="/wiki/United_Kingdom_of_Great_Britain_and_Northern_Ireland" class="mw-redirect" title="United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland">United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland</a>. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20230930233000-Peter_M._Brown-20230930221500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:30, 30 September 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20230930233000-Peter_M._Brown-20230930221500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20230930233000-Peter_M._Brown-20230930221500"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231001000000-JMF-20230930233000"></span>In modern usage, the term "Great Britain" just refers to the island. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231001000000-JMF-20230930233000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:00, 1 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231001000000-JMF-20230930233000"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231001000000-JMF-20230930233000"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20231001005400-JMF-20231001000000"></span>The lead section of the <a href="/wiki/Gibraltar" title="Gibraltar">Gibraltar</a> article needs clarification, then. It says "The territory was ceded to <a href="/wiki/Kingdom_of_Great_Britain" title="Kingdom of Great Britain">Great Britain</a> in perpetuity under the <a href="/wiki/Treaty_of_Utrecht" class="mw-redirect" title="Treaty of Utrecht">Treaty of Utrecht</a> in 1713." Though <a href="/wiki/Cession" title="Cession">cession</a> is not the same as incorporation, the typical reader may not be aware or the distinction. I certainly haven't been.</dd> <dd><a href="/wiki/User:Peter_M._Brown" title="User:Peter M. Brown">Peter Brown</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Peter_M._Brown" title="User talk:Peter M. Brown">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Peter_M._Brown-20231001005400-JMF-20231001000000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:54, 1 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20231001005400-JMF-20231001000000"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Peter_M._Brown-20231001005400-JMF-20231001000000"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231001093500-Peter_M._Brown-20231001005400"></span>It is explained in the <a href="/wiki/British_Overseas_Territory" class="mw-redirect" title="British Overseas Territory">British Overseas Territory</a> article. The lead of the <a href="/wiki/Puerto_Rico" title="Puerto Rico">Puerto Rico</a> article doesn't say that it is not part of the US: that information is in <a href="/wiki/Unincorporated_territory" class="mw-redirect" title="Unincorporated territory">unincorporated territory</a>. "Lead overload" is always a problem. (But compare <a href="/wiki/Overseas_department" class="mw-redirect" title="Overseas department">overseas departments</a> of France). <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231001093500-Peter_M._Brown-20231001005400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:35, 1 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231001093500-Peter_M._Brown-20231001005400"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231001093500-Peter_M._Brown-20231001005400"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_3_October_2023" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_3_October_2023-20231003203000"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_3_October_2023-20231003203000"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 3 October 2023<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_3_October_2023-20231003203000"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20231003203000-The_Signpost:_3_October_2023"></span>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-10-03/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-10-03/News and notes">Wikimedia Endowment financial statement published</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-10-03/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-10-03/In the media">History is written by whoever can harness the most editors</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Recent research: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-10-03/Recent_research" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-10-03/Recent research">Readers prefer ChatGPT over Wikipedia; concerns about limiting "anyone can edit" principle "may be overstated"</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Featured content: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-10-03/Featured_content" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-10-03/Featured content">By your logic,</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Concept: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-10-03/Concept" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-10-03/Concept">Wikipedia policies from other worlds: WP:NOANTLERS</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Poetry: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-10-03/Poetry" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-10-03/Poetry">"The Sight"</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-10-03/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-10-03/Traffic report">There shall be no slaves in the land of lands, it's a Bollywood jam</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2023-10-03" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2023-10-03">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20231003203000-The_Signpost:_3_October_2023" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:30, 3 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20231003203000-The_Signpost:_3_October_2023"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20231003203000-The_Signpost:_3_October_2023"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Specialist_words" data-mw-thread-id="h-Specialist_words-20231004185700"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Specialist_words-20231004185700"></span>Specialist words<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Specialist_words-20231004185700"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JBW-20231004185700-Specialist_words"></span>Of course "specialist words exist for a reason", but the point is very simply that what you yourself describe as "specialist words" are unlikely to be helpful to people who are not specialists. I would be willing to bet that the overwhelming majority of native speakers of English wouldn't have a clue what "voiced palatal approximant" means, but would realise that "y sound" refers to the one sound in English which is specific to the letter y, not one which is usually represented by another letter, and in a small minority of cases by y. The point is to use language in the way which is most effective in communicating the intended meaning to the target audience, not to use a form which is "correct" in some pedantic sense unrelated to effectiveness of communication. However, if you really do object to "y sound" because it could conceivably mean the wrong phoneme, then wouldn't it be more constructive to disambiguate it, rather than remove the potentially useful information altogether? <a href="/wiki/User:JBW" title="User:JBW">JBW</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JBW" title="User talk:JBW">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JBW-20231004185700-Specialist_words" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:57, 4 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JBW-20231004185700-Specialist_words"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JBW-20231004185700-Specialist_words"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231004212600-JBW-20231004185700"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:JBW" title="User:JBW">JBW</a>:</span> I agree completely with the principle of what you say.</dd> <dd>But it also important to be accurate: if we say that it is symbol used by IPA for a particular usage, then we should use the IPA terminology, not a <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:EGG" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:EGG">WP:EGG</a>.</dd> <dd>For both these reasons together, I consider the revised version to be what we need. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231004212600-JBW-20231004185700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:26, 4 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231004212600-JBW-20231004185700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231004212600-JBW-20231004185700"></span></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JBW-20231005082900-JMF-20231004212600"></span>Yes. I think the way I first did it wasn't the best; I merely reverted a change I had seen from some time ago, without considering whether a third way would be better than either. Your comments prompted think about what was best, as I should have done at first. <a href="/wiki/User:JBW" title="User:JBW">JBW</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JBW" title="User talk:JBW">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JBW-20231005082900-JMF-20231004212600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:29, 5 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JBW-20231005082900-JMF-20231004212600"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JBW-20231005082900-JMF-20231004212600"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div style="clear:both;" class=""></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_24_December_2023" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_24_December_2023-20231224095800"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_24_December_2023-20231224095800"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 24 December 2023<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_24_December_2023-20231224095800"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20231224095800-The_Signpost:_24_December_2023"></span>Special report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Special_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Special report">Did the Chinese Communist Party send astroturfers to sabotage a hacktivist's Wikipedia article?</a></li></ul> <ul><li>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/News and notes">The Italian Public Domain wars continue, Wikimedia RU set to dissolve, and a recap of WLM 2023</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/In the media">Consider the humble fork</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Discussion report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Discussion_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Discussion report">Arabic Wikipedia blackout; Wikimedians discuss SpongeBob, copyrights, and AI</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In focus: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/In_focus" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/In focus">Liquidation of Wikimedia RU</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Technology report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Technology_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Technology report">Dark mode is coming</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Recent research: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Recent_research" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Recent research">"LLMs Know More, Hallucinate Less" with Wikidata</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Gallery: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Gallery" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Gallery">A feast of holidays and carols</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Comix: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Comix" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Comix">Lollus lmaois 200C tincture</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Crossword: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Crossword" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Crossword">when the crossword is sus</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Traffic report">What's the big deal? I'm an animal!</a></li></ul> <ul><li>From the editor: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/From_the_editor" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/From the editor">A piccy iz worth OVAR 9000!!!11oneone! wordz ^_^</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Apocrypha: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Apocrypha" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Apocrypha">Local editor discovered 1,380 lost subheadings in ancient Signpost scrolls. And what he found was shocking.</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Humour: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/Humour" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/Humour">Guess the joke contest</a></li></ul> <ul><li>BJAODN: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2023-12-24/BJAODN" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2023-12-24/BJAODN">Bad jokes and other deleted nonsense</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2023-12-24" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2023-12-24">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20231224095800-The_Signpost:_24_December_2023" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:58, 24 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20231224095800-The_Signpost:_24_December_2023"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20231224095800-The_Signpost:_24_December_2023"></span> </div></div> <div style="clear:both;" class=""></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Season's_Greetings" data-mw-thread-id="h-Season's_Greetings-20231224025900"><span id="Season.27s_Greetings"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Season's_Greetings-20231224025900"></span>Season's Greetings<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Season's_Greetings-20231224025900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <table style="border:2px ; background-color: #FFF7E6;"> <tbody><tr> <td rowspan="2" valign="right"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Johnbod-20231224025900-Season's_Greetings"></span><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Pulpit_-_Baptistry_-_Pisa_2014_B.jpg" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4c/Pulpit_-_Baptistry_-_Pisa_2014_B.jpg/250px-Pulpit_-_Baptistry_-_Pisa_2014_B.jpg" decoding="async" width="250" height="179" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4c/Pulpit_-_Baptistry_-_Pisa_2014_B.jpg/375px-Pulpit_-_Baptistry_-_Pisa_2014_B.jpg 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4c/Pulpit_-_Baptistry_-_Pisa_2014_B.jpg/500px-Pulpit_-_Baptistry_-_Pisa_2014_B.jpg 2x" data-file-width="2078" data-file-height="1487"/></a></span> </td> <td rowspan="2"> </td> <td style="font-size: x-large; padding: 2; vertical-align: left; height: 1.1em;"><b>Season's Greetings</b> </td></tr> <tr> <td style="vertical-align: middle; border-top: 1px solid gray;">Wishing everybody a Happy Holiday Season, and all best wishes for the New Year! The Nativity scene on the <a href="/wiki/Pulpit_in_the_Pisa_Baptistery" title="Pulpit in the Pisa Baptistery">Pulpit in the Pisa Baptistery</a> by <a href="/wiki/Nicola_Pisano" title="Nicola Pisano">Nicola Pisano</a> is my Wiki-Christmas card to all for this year. <a href="/wiki/User:Johnbod" title="User:Johnbod">Johnbod</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Johnbod" title="User talk:Johnbod">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Johnbod-20231224025900-Season's_Greetings" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:59, 24 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Johnbod-20231224025900-Season's_Greetings"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Johnbod-20231224025900-Season's_Greetings"></span> </td></tr></tbody></table> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Club_news" data-mw-thread-id="h-Club_news-20231005190400"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Club_news-20231005190400"></span>Club news<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Club_news-20231005190400"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JBW-20231005190400-Club_news"></span>Feel free to add {{User Wikipedian TLA club}} to your user page if you like, or [[Category: Wikipedian TLA club|{{subst:PAGENAME}}]] if you are averse to userboxen. <a href="/wiki/User:JBW" title="User:JBW">JBW</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JBW" title="User talk:JBW">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JBW-20231005190400-Club_news" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:04, 5 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JBW-20231005190400-Club_news"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JBW-20231005190400-Club_news"></span></li></ul> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JBW-20231005195000-Club_news"></span>OK, intrigued, now that you have put the question into my head, I decided to investigate. I set up a spreadsheet which creates TLAs (again, not TlAs etc) at random, and got it to give me 50 of them. Of those 50, 8 of them are usernames for accounts which exist but have never edited, and 8 are usernames of accounts which have edited. If that random sample of 50 is representative, there will be about 2800 users who have edited and who qualify for club membership. However, it may be difficult to actually recruit many members, because only one of those that I found has edited in the last 5 years. If that rate of 1 in 50 is typical, there will be about 350 of us altogether, though obviously that estimate will be highly unreliable from such a small sample. <i>Hmm. Perhaps you are wondering if I have nothing better to do with my time. Well... Hmm. Maybe...</i> <a href="/wiki/User:JBW" title="User:JBW">JBW</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JBW" title="User talk:JBW">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JBW-20231005195000-Club_news" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:50, 5 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JBW-20231005195000-Club_news"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JBW-20231005195000-Club_news"></span></li> <li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JBW-20231005195800-Club_news"></span>By the way, the one TLA editor with recent edits that I found is <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/HLT" title="Special:Contributions/HLT">HLT</a>. <a href="/wiki/User:JBW" title="User:JBW">JBW</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JBW" title="User talk:JBW">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JBW-20231005195800-Club_news" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:58, 5 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JBW-20231005195800-Club_news"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JBW-20231005195800-Club_news"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231005200100-JBW-20231005195800"></span>Thank for the TLA box, I shall make an exception to my general rule.</dd> <dd>I will invite HLT. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231005200100-JBW-20231005195800" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:01, 5 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231005200100-JBW-20231005195800"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231005200100-JBW-20231005195800"></span></dd></dl></li></ul> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JBW-20231011203800-Club_news"></span>By the way, I sort of assumed you would realise, and maybe you did, but in case you didn't, the userbox automatically adds the user page to <a href="/wiki/Category:Wikipedian_TLA_club" title="Category:Wikipedian TLA club">Category:Wikipedian TLA club</a>. <a href="/wiki/User:JBW" title="User:JBW">JBW</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JBW" title="User talk:JBW">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JBW-20231011203800-Club_news" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:38, 11 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JBW-20231011203800-Club_news"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JBW-20231011203800-Club_news"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231011221300-JBW-20231011203800"></span>Yes, I had noticed. BTW, I invited HLT and TSP. Neither responded but I expressed the invitation such that only acceptance would require a reply. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231011221300-JBW-20231011203800" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:13, 11 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231011221300-JBW-20231011203800"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231011221300-JBW-20231011203800"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JBW-20231012172200-Club_news"></span>Unless you have notifications disabled, you will see that I have invited FNQ, but I thought I would let you know just to be sure. <a href="/wiki/User:JBW" title="User:JBW">JBW</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JBW" title="User talk:JBW">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JBW-20231012172200-Club_news" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:22, 12 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JBW-20231012172200-Club_news"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JBW-20231012172200-Club_news"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JBW-20231013124400-JBW-20231012172200"></span>+ JPD. <a href="/wiki/User:JBW" title="User:JBW">JBW</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JBW" title="User talk:JBW">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JBW-20231013124400-JBW-20231012172200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:44, 13 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JBW-20231013124400-JBW-20231012172200"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JBW-20231013124400-JBW-20231012172200"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk" data-mw-thread-id="h-IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk-20231011130600"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk-20231011130600"></span>IP editor on HS2 Talk<span data-mw-comment-end="h-IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk-20231011130600"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Cnbrb-20231011130600-IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk"></span>Hi - thanks for your reasoned comments on <a href="/wiki/Talk:High_Speed_2" title="Talk:High Speed 2">Talk:High Speed 2</a>. The argumentative anonymous IP editor is quite tiresome and seems to be as much concerned with attention-seeking as actual content. I am now going to try not to reply to their endless contradictions in an effort not to <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Feed_the_trolls" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:Feed the trolls">feed the trolls</a>. Interestingly, some of their various IP addresses can be geolocated to Hammersmith, West London. A couple of years ago we had some disruptive and abusive behaviour on the HS2 article, centred on a fixation with declaring Liverpool as an HS2 station; these were from a series of anonymous edits from a IP addresses also located in Hammersmith (logged <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/IncidentArchive1032#Repeated_IP_incivility_to_editors">here</a> and <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/IncidentArchive1036#User:_2A01:4B00:881D:3700:4D66:2954:F346:A75A/High_Speed_2">here</a>). I cannot be certain, but I suspect strongly this is the same problematic editor returning to cause trouble. They seem to have toned down the incivility, so it can't be seen as anything more than a content dispute, but I just thought I'd mention it, as it's one to beware of! <a href="/wiki/User:Cnbrb" title="User:Cnbrb">Cnbrb</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Cnbrb" title="User talk:Cnbrb">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Cnbrb-20231011130600-IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:06, 11 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Cnbrb-20231011130600-IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Cnbrb-20231011130600-IP_editor_on_HS2_Talk"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231011132800-Cnbrb-20231011130600"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Cnbrb" title="User:Cnbrb">Cnbrb</a>:</span> I guessed as much. In fact this morning I re-read <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:BLUDGEON" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:BLUDGEON">WP:BLUDGEON</a> and <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:ICANTHEARYOU" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:ICANTHEARYOU">WP:ICANTHEARYOU</a>. So I think you are right: no further engagement at the talk page and edits to the article that do not have consensus get reverted. I doubt that an <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:RFPP" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:RFPP">WP:RFPP</a> would be effective unless it was for a year or more but we may have to go through the escalation phases by the book. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231011132800-Cnbrb-20231011130600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:28, 11 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231011132800-Cnbrb-20231011130600"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231011132800-Cnbrb-20231011130600"></span> <dl><dd><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:BLUDGEON" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:BLUDGEON"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Cnbrb-20231011133400-JMF-20231011132800"></span>WP:BLUDGEON</a> and <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:ICANTHEARYOU" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:ICANTHEARYOU">WP:ICANTHEARYOU</a> - spot on, thank you. I knew these pages existed, I just couldn't remember what they were called. <a href="/wiki/User:Cnbrb" title="User:Cnbrb">Cnbrb</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Cnbrb" title="User talk:Cnbrb">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Cnbrb-20231011133400-JMF-20231011132800" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:34, 11 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Cnbrb-20231011133400-JMF-20231011132800"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Cnbrb-20231011133400-JMF-20231011132800"></span> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231015112700-Cnbrb-20231011133400"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Cnbrb" title="User:Cnbrb">Cnbrb</a>:</span> well, as predicted, he's back. On the talk page, we can just ignore his remarks but his contra-consensus edits to the live article are more of a problem. If it puts us into 3RR territory, we will have to do another RfPP. Which is really annoying because it blocks all IP editor contributions, good or bad. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231015112700-Cnbrb-20231011133400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:27, 15 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231015112700-Cnbrb-20231011133400"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231015112700-Cnbrb-20231011133400"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Cnbrb-20231015120600-JMF-20231015112700"></span>So I see. Our West London Correspondent can safely be ignored - he has nothing to contribute except insults. I'm uncertain about the other IP - seems to be North London, but I wonder it's the same person? The tone of comments is similar. Personally I'm really quite happy for IP editors to be blocked from editing. <a href="/wiki/User:Cnbrb" title="User:Cnbrb">Cnbrb</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Cnbrb" title="User talk:Cnbrb">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Cnbrb-20231015120600-JMF-20231015112700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:06, 15 October 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Cnbrb-20231015120600-JMF-20231015112700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Cnbrb-20231015120600-JMF-20231015112700"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Pythagoras" data-mw-thread-id="h-Pythagoras-20231110125900"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Pythagoras-20231110125900"></span>Pythagoras<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Pythagoras-20231110125900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-DuncanHill-20231110125900-Pythagoras"></span>Hi, it strikes me I may have been a bit snippy with you about the sources and further reading there, so my apologies for that. I also should have explained that one of the reasons for separating out Sources and Further reading as I did is that it makes it easier for editors with a better knowledge of the literature, like you, to trim away any excess, which is of course what you were trying to do. Best wishes, <a href="/wiki/User:DuncanHill" title="User:DuncanHill">DuncanHill</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:DuncanHill" title="User talk:DuncanHill">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-DuncanHill-20231110125900-Pythagoras" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:59, 10 November 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-DuncanHill-20231110125900-Pythagoras"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-DuncanHill-20231110125900-Pythagoras"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231110130900-DuncanHill-20231110125900"></span>No worries. I was editing on mobile and got false positives from harv.js. I suspect that, had the situation been reversed, I'd have done exactly what you did. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231110130900-DuncanHill-20231110125900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:09, 10 November 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231110130900-DuncanHill-20231110125900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231110130900-DuncanHill-20231110125900"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Blackpool_article" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Blackpool_article-20231114181200"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Blackpool_article-20231114181200"></span>The Blackpool article<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Blackpool_article-20231114181200"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-BeingObjective-20231114181200-The_Blackpool_article"></span>Greetings - I noted you likely are much more of a stakeholder in the Blackpool article - I did make many bold and strident changes - and I documented them as such in the audit trail of the edits - I do apologize - all edits made in good faith. </p><p>Sadly, the reversion by @<a href="/wiki/User:DragonofBatley" title="User:DragonofBatley">DragonofBatley</a> deleted other more conservative edits - the sizing of the images is the most notably visual loss of quality by these wholesale resets. </p><p>As with most matters there is always a civil middle ground and sure - I have no interest in edit wars and I was crystal clear that I did think my edits - pushed the 'consensus boundaries' - but no one reacted negatively - until this day. There are section in the articles talk section and there was arguably some degree of consensus. </p><p>I usually only focus on medical and science articles and there is less room for bombast and group think in such articles - </p><p>I did actually think the changes others made - size of images - should be reverted - but I am not getting directly involved. </p><p>Kind Regards, Dr. <a href="/wiki/User:BeingObjective" title="User:BeingObjective">BeingObjective</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:BeingObjective" title="User talk:BeingObjective">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-BeingObjective-20231114181200-The_Blackpool_article" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:12, 14 November 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-BeingObjective-20231114181200-The_Blackpool_article"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-BeingObjective-20231114181200-The_Blackpool_article"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231114193400-BeingObjective-20231114181200"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:BeingObjective" title="User:BeingObjective">BeingObjective</a>:</span> No, I am not a stakeholder, I know nothing about Blackpool. As no doubt you have seen, I have reversed the brute force reversion, simply because it was contrary to Wikipedia principles as I explained at the talk page. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231114193400-BeingObjective-20231114181200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:34, 14 November 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231114193400-BeingObjective-20231114181200"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231114193400-BeingObjective-20231114181200"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Junk_currency" data-mw-thread-id="h-Junk_currency-20231115183100"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Junk_currency-20231115183100"></span>Junk currency<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Junk_currency-20231115183100"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-LendingWiki-20231115183100-Junk_currency"></span>Thank you for participating in the editing. We would like to inform you that due to various circumstances, our username has been changed from Wikidate47 to LendingWiki. Now, regarding the statement that the Japanese yen has become a junk currency, we have revived it since it was reported in the Nihon Keizai Shimbun. Thank you for your correction.<a href="/w/index.php?title=User:LendingWiki&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:LendingWiki (page does not exist)">LendingWiki</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:LendingWiki" class="mw-redirect" title="User talk:LendingWiki">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-LendingWiki-20231115183100-Junk_currency" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:31, 15 November 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-LendingWiki-20231115183100-Junk_currency"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-LendingWiki-20231115183100-Junk_currency"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231115183900-LendingWiki-20231115183100"></span>More work will be needed on it, to comply with <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:LEAD" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:LEAD">WP:LEAD</a>, which says that the lead should be a summary of body content. It certainly should be mentioned in the lead now but only in one sentence. The new detail you added will need to be moved down to a new section in the body. I will do that. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231115183900-LendingWiki-20231115183100" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:39, 15 November 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231115183900-LendingWiki-20231115183100"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231115183900-LendingWiki-20231115183100"></span></dd> <dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231115201900-LendingWiki-20231115183100"></span>@<a href="/w/index.php?title=User:LendingWiki&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:LendingWiki (page does not exist)">LendingWiki</a>:</span>, I have done that transfer: there is now a short sentence in the lead and the section on exchange rates has been expanded. (Another policy we have is that <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_is_not_a_newspaper" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia is not a newspaper">wp:Wikipedia is not a newspaper</a>, so we tend to avoid covering current affairs in detail. It is better to let time pass and then look back to see whether something that seemed very important at the time actually ever turned out to be of historical significance.) --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231115201900-LendingWiki-20231115183100" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:19, 15 November 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231115201900-LendingWiki-20231115183100"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231115201900-LendingWiki-20231115183100"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-LendingWiki-20231115203700-JMF-20231115201900"></span>Thank you for doing what you have done, that this compilation has been important amidst the many changes that have taken place since the June 2023 compilation. <a href="/w/index.php?title=User:LendingWiki&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:LendingWiki (page does not exist)">LendingWiki</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:LendingWiki" class="mw-redirect" title="User talk:LendingWiki">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-LendingWiki-20231115203700-JMF-20231115201900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:37, 15 November 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-LendingWiki-20231115203700-JMF-20231115201900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-LendingWiki-20231115203700-JMF-20231115201900"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="New_Page_Reviewing" data-mw-thread-id="h-New_Page_Reviewing-20231211170900"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-New_Page_Reviewing-20231211170900"></span>New Page Reviewing<span data-mw-comment-end="h-New_Page_Reviewing-20231211170900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <table style="background:#E2E7FF; border:1px solid #000080; padding: 10px; width: auto"> <tbody><tr> <td rowspan="2" style="position:relative; right:6px"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Raydann-20231211170900-New_Page_Reviewing"></span><figure class="mw-halign-left" typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Wikipedia_New_page_reviewer.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/57/Wikipedia_New_page_reviewer.svg/110px-Wikipedia_New_page_reviewer.svg.png" decoding="async" width="110" height="110" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/57/Wikipedia_New_page_reviewer.svg/165px-Wikipedia_New_page_reviewer.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/57/Wikipedia_New_page_reviewer.svg/220px-Wikipedia_New_page_reviewer.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="200" data-file-height="200"/></a><figcaption></figcaption></figure> </td></tr> <tr> <td><span style="font-size:120%">Hello, JMF.</span> <p>I've seen you editing recently and you seem like an experienced Wikipedia editor. <br/> Would you please consider <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:PERM/NPR" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:PERM/NPR">applying</a> to become a <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:New_pages_patrol/Reviewers" title="Wikipedia:New pages patrol/Reviewers">New Page Reviewer</a>? Reviewing/patrolling a page doesn't take much time but <u>it requires a good understanding of Wikipedia policies and guidelines</u>; currently Wikipedia needs experienced users at this task. But kindly read <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:New_pages_patrol" title="Wikipedia:New pages patrol">the tutorial</a> before making your decision. Thanks. <b><span style="background:#444;padding:2px 12px;font-size:12px"><span style="color:#FC0">❯❯❯</span><a href="/wiki/User:Raydann" title="User:Raydann"><span style="color:#fff"> Raydann</span></a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Raydann" title="User talk:Raydann"><sup><i><span style="color:#D3D3D3">(Talk)</span></i></sup></a></span></b> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Raydann-20231211170900-New_Page_Reviewing" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:09, 11 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Raydann-20231211170900-New_Page_Reviewing"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Raydann-20231211170900-New_Page_Reviewing"></span> </p> </td></tr></tbody></table> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion" data-mw-thread-id="h-Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion-20231212010100"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion-20231212010100"></span>Nomination of <a href="/wiki/Information_sign" class="mw-redirect" title="Information sign">Information sign</a> for deletion<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion-20231212010100"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div class="floatleft" style="margin-bottom:0"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-SDZeroBot-20231212010100-Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion"></span><span typeof="mw:File"><span><img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5f/Ambox_warning_orange.svg/48px-Ambox_warning_orange.svg.png" decoding="async" width="48" height="41" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5f/Ambox_warning_orange.svg/72px-Ambox_warning_orange.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5f/Ambox_warning_orange.svg/96px-Ambox_warning_orange.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="378" data-file-height="326"/></span></span></div><p>A discussion is taking place as to whether the article <a href="/wiki/Information_sign" class="mw-redirect" title="Information sign">Information sign</a>, to which you have <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://xtools.wmflabs.org/authorship/en.wikipedia.org/Information_sign">significantly contributed</a>, is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:List_of_policies_and_guidelines" title="Wikipedia:List of policies and guidelines">Wikipedia's policies and guidelines</a> or if it should be <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Deletion_policy" title="Wikipedia:Deletion policy">deleted</a>. </p><p>The discussion will take place at <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Information_sign" title="Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Information sign">Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Information sign</a></b> until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. </p><p>To customise your preferences for automated AfD notifications for articles to which you've significantly contributed (or to opt-out entirely), please visit <a href="/wiki/User:SDZeroBot/AfD_notifier" title="User:SDZeroBot/AfD notifier">the configuration page</a>. Delivered by <i><a href="/wiki/User:SDZeroBot" title="User:SDZeroBot">SDZeroBot</a></i> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:SDZeroBot" title="User talk:SDZeroBot">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-SDZeroBot-20231212010100-Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">01:01, 12 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-SDZeroBot-20231212010100-Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-SDZeroBot-20231212010100-Nomination_of_Information_sign_for_deletion"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Just_a_reminder" data-mw-thread-id="h-Just_a_reminder-20231221202000"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Just_a_reminder-20231221202000"></span>Just a reminder<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Just_a_reminder-20231221202000"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-InedibleHulk-20231221202000-Just_a_reminder"></span>One needn't any special powers to see the future from an already recorded and well-documented point in history. In this case, that point <i>seems to be</i> the night of March 2, 1984. On some level, most of us know we saw the scene some time later (or not at all), though the implication is there. It's <i>almost</i> constantly relative, man, all this before and after jazz. But yeah, sometimes "subsequent', though the longer word, is the better word. A fine choice, kudos. I hope you won't mind me changing the "past" to best fit what you've done here and trust you'll still have a nice day! <a href="/wiki/User:InedibleHulk" title="User:InedibleHulk">InedibleHulk</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:InedibleHulk" title="User talk:InedibleHulk">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-InedibleHulk-20231221202000-Just_a_reminder" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:20, 21 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-InedibleHulk-20231221202000-Just_a_reminder"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-InedibleHulk-20231221202000-Just_a_reminder"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231221205700-InedibleHulk-20231221202000"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:InedibleHulk" title="User:InedibleHulk">InedibleHulk</a>:</span> a role for the <a href="/wiki/Future_perfect" title="Future perfect">Future perfect</a>? Yes, I like "Prior examples". Kudos returned. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231221205700-InedibleHulk-20231221202000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:57, 21 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231221205700-InedibleHulk-20231221202000"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231221205700-InedibleHulk-20231221202000"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-InedibleHulk-20231222001900-JMF-20231221205700"></span>I'm certainly not about to suggest the <a href="/wiki/Newfoundland_English#"After"_past" title="Newfoundland English">Newfoundland English#"After" past</a>. Those poor people. Anyway, glad you're cool with the way things went. <a href="/wiki/User:InedibleHulk" title="User:InedibleHulk">InedibleHulk</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:InedibleHulk" title="User talk:InedibleHulk">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-InedibleHulk-20231222001900-JMF-20231221205700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:19, 22 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-InedibleHulk-20231222001900-JMF-20231221205700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-InedibleHulk-20231222001900-JMF-20231221205700"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231222092400-InedibleHulk-20231222001900"></span>Interesting article! I learned an entirely new (to me) verb tense, <a href="/wiki/Habitual_aspect" title="Habitual aspect">Habitual aspect</a>. Tyvm. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231222092400-InedibleHulk-20231222001900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:24, 22 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231222092400-InedibleHulk-20231222001900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231222092400-InedibleHulk-20231222001900"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id=""Harry_the_house"" data-mw-thread-id="h-"Harry_the_house"-20231223112300"><span id=".22Harry_the_house.22"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-"Harry_the_house"-20231223112300"></span>"Harry the house"<span data-mw-comment-end="h-"Harry_the_house"-20231223112300"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223112300-"Harry_the_house""></span>Hi, </p><p>I noticed you'd reverted a couple of edits by DuncanHill at "<a href="/wiki/Claydon_House" title="Claydon House">Claydon House</a>" where he had reverted the changes made by an IP editor. The IP editor is a blocked user known as "Harry the house" (see the SPI archive <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Harry_the_house/Archive">here</a>) and is very prolific. I'd like to try to coordinate a response to his activity. Would you mind joining the discussion <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Murgatroyd49#Hailes_Abbey_-_%22Harry_the_house%22">here</a>? </p><p>Thanks, <a href="/wiki/User:Jean-de-Nivelle" title="User:Jean-de-Nivelle">Jean-de-Nivelle</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Jean-de-Nivelle" title="User talk:Jean-de-Nivelle">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223112300-"Harry_the_house"" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:23, 23 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223112300-"Harry_the_house""></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223112300-"Harry_the_house""></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231223124300-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223112300"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Jean-de-Nivelle" title="User:Jean-de-Nivelle">Jean-de-Nivelle</a>:</span>, I consciously did not actually revert <a href="/wiki/User:DuncanHill" title="User:DuncanHill">DuncanHill</a>'s edit since I inferred that it was a <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:BMB" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:BMB">WP:BMB</a> "revert all edits good or bad". So I agree completely that Duncan's reversion was valid. However, the <a href="/wiki/National_Trust" title="National Trust">National Trust</a> article is called just that, so it was reasonable to correct a redundant link to a redirect article, and BMB says as much. Which is pretty much the conclusion you reached at SPI. But I will keep a weather eye out for HtH's "fist" in other articles I watch. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231223124300-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223112300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:43, 23 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231223124300-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223112300"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231223124300-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223112300"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223131900-JMF-20231223124300"></span>Thanks, and apologies for misdescribing your actions. <a href="/wiki/User:Jean-de-Nivelle" title="User:Jean-de-Nivelle">Jean-de-Nivelle</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Jean-de-Nivelle" title="User talk:Jean-de-Nivelle">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223131900-JMF-20231223124300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:19, 23 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223131900-JMF-20231223124300"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223131900-JMF-20231223124300"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231223141700-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223131900"></span>No need whatever to apologise. It wasn't obvious. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231223141700-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223131900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">14:17, 23 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231223141700-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223131900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231223141700-Jean-de-Nivelle-20231223131900"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Unsourced_edits" data-mw-thread-id="h-Unsourced_edits-20240108224600"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Unsourced_edits-20240108224600"></span>Unsourced edits<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Unsourced_edits-20240108224600"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20240108224600-Unsourced_edits"></span>I posted about the issue you raised on <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:RFPPI" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:RFPPI">WP:RFPPI</a> over <span class="plainlinks"><a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=&diff=prev&oldid=1194407266">here</a></span>. <a href="/wiki/User:Daniel_Quinlan" title="User:Daniel Quinlan">Daniel Quinlan</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Daniel_Quinlan" title="User talk:Daniel Quinlan">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Daniel_Quinlan-20240108224600-Unsourced_edits" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:46, 8 January 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20240108224600-Unsourced_edits"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Daniel_Quinlan-20240108224600-Unsourced_edits"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_10_January_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_10_January_2024-20240112124900"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_10_January_2024-20240112124900"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 10 January 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_10_January_2024-20240112124900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240112124900-The_Signpost:_10_January_2024"></span>From the editor: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/From_the_editor" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/From the editor">NINETEEN MORE YEARS! NINETEEN MORE YEARS!</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Special report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/Special_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/Special report">Public Domain Day 2024</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Technology report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/Technology_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/Technology report">Wikipedia: A Multigenerational Pursuit</a></li></ul> <ul><li>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/News and notes">In other news ... see ya in court!</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In focus: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/In_focus" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/In focus">The long road of a featured article candidate</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/In the media">What is plagiarism? Oklahoma Disneyland? Reaching a human being at Wikipedia?</a></li></ul> <ul><li>WikiProject report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/WikiProject_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/WikiProject report">WikiProjects Israel and Palestine</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Obituary: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/Obituary" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/Obituary">Anthony Bradbury</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/Traffic report">The most viewed articles of 2023</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Crossword: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/Crossword" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/Crossword">everybody gangsta till the style sheets start cascading</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Comix: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-10/Comix" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-10/Comix">Conflict resolution</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-01-10" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-01-10">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240112124900-The_Signpost:_10_January_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:49, 12 January 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240112124900-The_Signpost:_10_January_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240112124900-The_Signpost:_10_January_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?" data-mw-thread-id="h-What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?-20240125160900"><span id="What_does_.E2.80.9CUnable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML.E2.80.9D_mean.3F"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?-20240125160900"></span>What does “Unable to fetch Parsoid HTML” mean?<span data-mw-comment-end="h-What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?-20240125160900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-90.241.131.86-20240125160900-What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?"></span>I got it whilst editing <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/90.241.131.86" title="Special:Contributions/90.241.131.86">90.241.131.86</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:90.241.131.86" title="User talk:90.241.131.86">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-90.241.131.86-20240125160900-What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:09, 25 January 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-90.241.131.86-20240125160900-What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-90.241.131.86-20240125160900-What_does_“Unable_to_fetch_Parsoid_HTML”_mean?"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240125161100-90.241.131.86-20240125160900"></span>no idea, I've never seen it. Ask at the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Teahouse" title="Wikipedia:Teahouse">Wikipedia: Teahouse</a>. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240125161100-90.241.131.86-20240125160900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:11, 25 January 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240125161100-90.241.131.86-20240125160900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240125161100-90.241.131.86-20240125160900"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Poots'_v_Poots's" data-mw-thread-id="h-Poots'_v_Poots's-20240130115400"><span id="Poots.27_v_Poots.27s"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Poots'_v_Poots's-20240130115400"></span>Poots' v Poots's<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Poots'_v_Poots's-20240130115400"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Guliolopez-20240130115400-Poots'_v_Poots's"></span>Hiya. While I don't understand the comment about Potatoes (as, other than <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Edwin_Poots&diff=prev&oldid=1200844106">your own</a>, no edit recently placed an apostrophe between the "t" and "s"), I would simply note that (following <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Edwin_Poots&diff=1200861937&oldid=1200859083">your most recent edit</a>) this sentence is now one of the few places in the article/sources/etc where <code><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">Poots's</q></code> is used. Elsewhere in the body we have "<link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">Poots' supporters</q>", "<link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">Poots' instruction</q>", etc. And in the sources we find <link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">"Poots' suspension"</q> (<i>BBC</i>), <link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">"Poots' decision"</q> (<i>Belfast Newsletter</i>), "<link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">"Poots' comments misplaced, sexist and outdated"</q> (<i>Irish News</i>). While I'm not interested in warring about it, I would note that (a) what we have now is at least inconsistent (within the body text and with the sources) and (b) <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Edwin_Poots&diff=prev&oldid=1200844106">your initial revert of MongogramForCandy's edit</a> actually reintroduced (rather than solved) a "Potato's" problem. Restoring <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Edwin_Poots&oldid=1200844106"><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">"One of Edwin Poot's sons"</q></a>. An accident undoubtedly. But be careful tossing stones from inside a glasshouse eh? :) <a href="/wiki/User:Guliolopez" title="User:Guliolopez">Guliolopez</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Guliolopez" title="User talk:Guliolopez">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Guliolopez-20240130115400-Poots'_v_Poots's" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:54, 30 January 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Guliolopez-20240130115400-Poots'_v_Poots's"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Guliolopez-20240130115400-Poots'_v_Poots's"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240130121000-Guliolopez-20240130115400"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Guliolopez" title="User:Guliolopez">Guliolopez</a>:</span> see <a href="/wiki/Greengrocer%27s_apostrophe" class="mw-redirect" title="Greengrocer's apostrophe">Greengrocer's apostrophe</a>. (tbf, "Potato's" is probably not a good example, since it is legit'te to use an apostrophe to signify abbreviation by omission of letters). I won't [sic] pursue it. Language changes. (I've been reading a lot of C17 writing recently while working on <a href="/wiki/Robert_Hooke" title="Robert Hooke">Robert Hooke</a>, so I guess I've become hypersensitised to spelling that would make <a href="/wiki/Nigel_Molesworth" title="Nigel Molesworth">Nigel Molesworth</a> blush.) --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240130121000-Guliolopez-20240130115400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:10, 30 January 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240130121000-Guliolopez-20240130115400"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240130121000-Guliolopez-20240130115400"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_31_January_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_31_January_2024-20240131151300"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_31_January_2024-20240131151300"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 31 January 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_31_January_2024-20240131151300"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240131151300-The_Signpost:_31_January_2024"></span>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-31/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-31/News and notes">Wikipedian Osama Khalid celebrated his 30th birthday in jail</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Opinion: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-31/Opinion" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-31/Opinion">Until it happens to you</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Disinformation report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-31/Disinformation_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-31/Disinformation report">How paid editors squeeze you dry</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-31/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-31/In the media">Katherine Maher new NPR CEO, go check Wikipedia, race in the race</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In focus: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-31/In_focus" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-31/In focus">The long road of a featured article candidate, part 2</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Recent research: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-31/Recent_research" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-31/Recent research">Croatian takeover was enabled by "lack of bureaucratic openness and rules constraining [admins]"</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Comix: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-31/Comix" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-31/Comix">We've all got to start somewhere</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-01-31/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-01-31/Traffic report">DJ, gonna burn this goddamn house right down</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-01-31" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-01-31">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240131151300-The_Signpost:_31_January_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:13, 31 January 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240131151300-The_Signpost:_31_January_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240131151300-The_Signpost:_31_January_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_13_February_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_13_February_2024-20240213043500"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_13_February_2024-20240213043500"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 13 February 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_13_February_2024-20240213043500"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240213043500-The_Signpost:_13_February_2024"></span>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-02-13/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-02-13/News and notes">Wikimedia Russia director declared "foreign agent" by Russian gov; EU prepares to pile on the papers</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Disinformation report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-02-13/Disinformation_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-02-13/Disinformation report">How low can the scammers go?</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Gallery: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-02-13/Gallery" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-02-13/Gallery">Before and After: Why you don't need to touch grass to dramatically improve images of flora and fauna</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-02-13/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-02-13/In the media">Speaking in tongues, toeing the line, and dressing the part</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Serendipity: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-02-13/Serendipity" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-02-13/Serendipity">Is this guy the same as the one who was a Nazi?</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-02-13/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-02-13/Traffic report">Griselda, Nikki, Carl, Jannik and two types of football</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Crossword: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-02-13/Crossword" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-02-13/Crossword">Our crossword to bear</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Comix: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-02-13/Comix" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-02-13/Comix">Strongly</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-02-13" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-02-13">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240213043500-The_Signpost:_13_February_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">04:35, 13 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240213043500-The_Signpost:_13_February_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240213043500-The_Signpost:_13_February_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion" data-mw-thread-id="h-Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion-20240214233900"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion-20240214233900"></span>Notice of No Original Research Noticeboard discussion<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion-20240214233900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Jc3s5h-20240214233900-Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion"></span><span typeof="mw:File"><span><img alt="Information icon" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/1d/Information_icon4.svg/25px-Information_icon4.svg.png" decoding="async" width="25" height="25" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/1d/Information_icon4.svg/38px-Information_icon4.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/1d/Information_icon4.svg/50px-Information_icon4.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="620" data-file-height="620"/></span></span> There is currently a discussion at <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:No_original_research/Noticeboard" title="Wikipedia:No original research/Noticeboard">Wikipedia:No original research/Noticeboard</a> regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. The thread is <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:No_original_research/Noticeboard#Plural_in_"Foot_(unit)"" title="Wikipedia:No original research/Noticeboard">Plural in "Foot (unit)"</a>.The discussion is about the topic <a href="/wiki/Topic" class="mw-disambig" title="Topic">topic</a>. Thank you. --<a href="/wiki/User:Jc3s5h" title="User:Jc3s5h">Jc3s5h</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Jc3s5h" title="User talk:Jc3s5h">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Jc3s5h-20240214233900-Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:39, 14 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Jc3s5h-20240214233900-Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Jc3s5h-20240214233900-Notice_of_No_Original_Research_Noticeboard_discussion"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke" data-mw-thread-id="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke-20240215174300"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke-20240215174300"></span>Your <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Good_articles" title="Wikipedia:Good articles">GA</a> nomination of <a href="/wiki/Robert_Hooke" title="Robert Hooke">Robert Hooke</a><span data-mw-comment-end="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke-20240215174300"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Tim_riley-20240215174300-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke"></span>Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've <a href="/wiki/Talk:Robert_Hooke/GA1" title="Talk:Robert Hooke/GA1">begun reviewing</a> the article <a href="/wiki/Robert_Hooke" title="Robert Hooke">Robert Hooke</a> you nominated for <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:GA" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:GA">GA</a>-status according to the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WIAGA" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:WIAGA">criteria</a>. <span typeof="mw:File"><span><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6c/Time2wait.svg/20px-Time2wait.svg.png" decoding="async" width="20" height="21" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6c/Time2wait.svg/30px-Time2wait.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6c/Time2wait.svg/40px-Time2wait.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="180" data-file-height="185"/></span></span> This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. <small>Message delivered by <a href="/wiki/User:ChristieBot" title="User:ChristieBot">ChristieBot</a>, on behalf of <a href="/wiki/User:Tim_riley" title="User:Tim riley">Tim riley</a></small> -- <a href="/wiki/User:Tim_riley" title="User:Tim riley">Tim riley</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Tim_riley" title="User talk:Tim riley">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Tim_riley-20240215174300-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:43, 15 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Tim_riley-20240215174300-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Tim_riley-20240215174300-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2" data-mw-thread-id="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2-20240217180200"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2-20240217180200"></span>Your <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Good_articles" title="Wikipedia:Good articles">GA</a> nomination of <a href="/wiki/Robert_Hooke" title="Robert Hooke">Robert Hooke</a><span data-mw-comment-end="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2-20240217180200"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Tim_riley-20240217180200-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2"></span>The article <a href="/wiki/Robert_Hooke" title="Robert Hooke">Robert Hooke</a> you nominated as a <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Good_article_nominations" title="Wikipedia:Good article nominations">good article</a> has passed <span typeof="mw:File"><span><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/94/Symbol_support_vote.svg/20px-Symbol_support_vote.svg.png" decoding="async" width="20" height="21" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/94/Symbol_support_vote.svg/30px-Symbol_support_vote.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/94/Symbol_support_vote.svg/40px-Symbol_support_vote.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="180" data-file-height="185"/></span></span>; see <a href="/wiki/Talk:Robert_Hooke" title="Talk:Robert Hooke">Talk:Robert Hooke</a> for comments about the article, and <a href="/wiki/Talk:Robert_Hooke/GA1" title="Talk:Robert Hooke/GA1">Talk:Robert Hooke/GA1</a> for the nomination. Well done! If the article is <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Did_you_know/Guidelines#Newness" title="Wikipedia:Did you know/Guidelines">eligible to appear</a> in the "Did you know" section of the Main Page, you can <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Did_you_know/Create_new_nomination" title="Wikipedia:Did you know/Create new nomination">nominate it</a> within the next seven days. <small>Message delivered by <a href="/wiki/User:ChristieBot" title="User:ChristieBot">ChristieBot</a>, on behalf of <a href="/wiki/User:Tim_riley" title="User:Tim riley">Tim riley</a></small> -- <a href="/wiki/User:Tim_riley" title="User:Tim riley">Tim riley</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Tim_riley" title="User talk:Tim riley">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Tim_riley-20240217180200-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:02, 17 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Tim_riley-20240217180200-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Tim_riley-20240217180200-Your_GA_nomination_of_Robert_Hooke_2"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Tittles" data-mw-thread-id="h-Tittles-20240223152400"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Tittles-20240223152400"></span>Tittles<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Tittles-20240223152400"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Mai-Sachme-20240223152400-Tittles"></span>Not a very important question, but the key problem <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=English_alphabet&oldid=prev&diff=1209769658">here</a> are the words "in English". We are both aware that the classification as "diacritic" is language-sensitive. Tittles are <i>not</i> regarded as diacritics in the English alphabet, since they don't alter the base form, but they are very much <i>diacritics</i> in the Turkish alphabet thanks to the opposition between <a href="/wiki/I" title="I">I</a> and <a href="/wiki/%C4%B0" title="İ">İ</a>. </p><p>Anyway this should'nt alter the validity of my edit. The sentence in question basically says: "Of all the diacritics in the world, these ones are sometimes used in English". What you did is narrowing down the broad category "diacritics" (which globally speaking very much includes tittles) preemptively to how it's understood in a specific language alphabet, which doesn't make sense in the context, because the entire article <i>is</i> dedicated to the specifities of that particular language. </p><p>I also include <a href="/wiki/User:Remsense" title="User:Remsense">Remsense</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Remsense" title="User talk:Remsense">talk</a> <b>·</b> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Remsense" title="Special:Contributions/Remsense">contribs</a>), since they reverted me <a class="external autonumber" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=English_terms_with_diacritical_marks&oldid=prev&diff=1209772883">[1]</a>. Cheers, <a href="/wiki/User:Mai-Sachme" title="User:Mai-Sachme">Mai-Sachme</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Mai-Sachme" title="User talk:Mai-Sachme">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Mai-Sachme-20240223152400-Tittles" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:24, 23 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Mai-Sachme-20240223152400-Tittles"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Mai-Sachme-20240223152400-Tittles"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Remsense-20240223153700-Mai-Sachme-20240223152400"></span><style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1237805129">.mw-parser-output .talkquote{color:var(--color-base,#202122);background-color:#eaf8f4;border-left:3px solid #008560;padding:0 .8em;margin:0}.mw-parser-output .talkquote-by,.mw-parser-output .talkquote-source{margin-left:1.6em}.mw-parser-output .skin-vector-2022 .talkquote>:last-child{padding-bottom:0}@media screen{html.skin-theme-clientpref-night .mw-parser-output .talkquote{background-color:#0d261f}}@media screen and (prefers-color-scheme:dark){html.skin-theme-clientpref-os .mw-parser-output .talkquote{background-color:#0d261f}}</style><blockquote class="talkquote"><p>the key problem here are the words "in English". We are both aware that the classification as "diacritic" is language-sensitive. Tittles are not regarded as diacritics in the English alphabet, since they don't alter the base form, but they are very much diacritics in the Turkish alphabet thanks to the opposition between I and İ.</p></blockquote></dd> <dd>We agree so far.</dd> <dd><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1237805129"><blockquote class="talkquote"><p>What you did is narrowing down the broad category "diacritics" (which globally speaking very much includes tittles) preemptively to how it's understood in a specific language alphabet, which doesn't make sense in the context, because the entire article is dedicated to the specifities of that particular language.</p></blockquote></dd> <dd>And now I don't understand! We agree his article is particular to English words, and that includes particular conventions—that would probably never include tittles being diacritics simply because our ingrained notion of the letter ⟨I⟩ is too particular (that's my guess, anyway). If we have a Turkish loanword in English, we may import a ⟨Ü⟩, but I doubt we would import the ⟨İ⟩. It's like saying</dd> <dd><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1237805129"><blockquote class="talkquote"><p>What you did is narrowing down the broad category "<a href="/wiki/Rhotics" class="mw-redirect" title="Rhotics">rhotics</a>" (which globally speaking very much includes <a href="/wiki/Alveolar_trill" class="mw-redirect" title="Alveolar trill">alveolar trills</a>)</p></blockquote></dd> <dd>unless I'm missing something. <a href="/wiki/User:Remsense" title="User:Remsense"><span style="border-radius:2px 0 0 2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F;color:#fff"><b>Remsense</b></span></a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Remsense" title="User talk:Remsense"><span lang="zh" style="border:1px solid #1E816F;border-radius:0 2px 2px 0;padding:1px 3px;color:#000">诉</span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Remsense-20240223153700-Mai-Sachme-20240223152400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:37, 23 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Remsense-20240223153700-Mai-Sachme-20240223152400"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Remsense-20240223153700-Mai-Sachme-20240223152400"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Mai-Sachme-20240223161300-Remsense-20240223153700"></span>Hm, that's not an analogous example. We need a sentence making use of a very broad category, but using the term in an idiosyncratic form. Consider: "There are 2 <a href="/wiki/Football" title="Football">football</a> stadiums in Los Angeles", with the intended context-sensitive reading of football as <a href="/wiki/American_football" title="American football">American football</a>, but instead using the broad umbrella term used for a multitude of very different sports. But here ends the analogy. The link <a href="/wiki/Football" title="Football">football</a> can easily be redirected to the correct article, clearing any possible misunderstanding, while - in our case - unfortunately there is no appropriate link, since <a href="/wiki/Diacritic" title="Diacritic">diacritic</a> correctly lists <a href="/wiki/Tittle" title="Tittle">tittles</a> as example for diacritics... Anyway, the chances for confusion for our readers are minimal here, I'm aware of that :-) Cheers, <a href="/wiki/User:Mai-Sachme" title="User:Mai-Sachme">Mai-Sachme</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Mai-Sachme" title="User talk:Mai-Sachme">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Mai-Sachme-20240223161300-Remsense-20240223153700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:13, 23 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Mai-Sachme-20240223161300-Remsense-20240223153700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Mai-Sachme-20240223161300-Remsense-20240223153700"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Remsense-20240223161800-Mai-Sachme-20240223161300"></span>Cheers! This may be solved for the better by specifying the relative nature of writing systems on the <a href="/wiki/Tittle" title="Tittle">Tittle</a> page, methinks. <a href="/wiki/User:Remsense" title="User:Remsense"><span style="border-radius:2px 0 0 2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F;color:#fff"><b>Remsense</b></span></a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Remsense" title="User talk:Remsense"><span lang="zh" style="border:1px solid #1E816F;border-radius:0 2px 2px 0;padding:1px 3px;color:#000">诉</span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Remsense-20240223161800-Mai-Sachme-20240223161300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:18, 23 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Remsense-20240223161800-Mai-Sachme-20240223161300"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Remsense-20240223161800-Mai-Sachme-20240223161300"></span> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240223164900-Remsense-20240223161800"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Remsense" title="User:Remsense">Remsense</a> and <a href="/wiki/User:Mai-Sachme" title="User:Mai-Sachme">Mai-Sachme</a>:</span> well I'm pleased that you guys have cleared that up while I was otherwise engaged. I'm not sure how you got there but "all's well that ends well". As for an analogy, how about <span class="nounderlines" style="border: 1px solid var(--border-color-muted,#ddd); color: var(--color-base); background-color: var( --background-color-neutral-subtle, #fdfdfd); padding: 1px 1px;">Æ</span>? In English and French, it is a ligature of A and E; in the Nordic languages, it is a distinct letter in its own right. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240223164900-Remsense-20240223161800" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:49, 23 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240223164900-Remsense-20240223161800"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240223164900-Remsense-20240223161800"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Remsense-20240223173600-JMF-20240223164900"></span>Wait until you hear about the actual madness I've coincidentally been in trying to decide whether an there should merit an article for—basically, morphology for grammatology? There's work on it, but I have no idea if there's a common name. "Smallest functional written unit" almost doesn't break down as a definition for grapheme if you don't wander too far from the banks of the Rhine, but everyone goes quiet the moment they have to consider what on Earth <span lang="und-Hani">好</span> is meant to be doing. Of course, there's <a href="/wiki/Chinese_character_classification" title="Chinese character classification">Chinese character classification</a>, but alphabetic grammatology seems to have little interest in bridging the gap, so to speak. <a href="/wiki/User:Remsense" title="User:Remsense"><span style="border-radius:2px 0 0 2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F;color:#fff"><b>Remsense</b></span></a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Remsense" title="User talk:Remsense"><span lang="zh" style="border:1px solid #1E816F;border-radius:0 2px 2px 0;padding:1px 3px;color:#000">诉</span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Remsense-20240223173600-JMF-20240223164900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:36, 23 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Remsense-20240223173600-JMF-20240223164900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Remsense-20240223173600-JMF-20240223164900"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Infobox_demographic_statistics" data-mw-thread-id="h-Infobox_demographic_statistics-20231212190400"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Infobox_demographic_statistics-20231212190400"></span>Infobox demographic statistics<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Infobox_demographic_statistics-20231212190400"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Rupples-20231212190400-Infobox_demographic_statistics"></span>Hi. Thought I'd offer further points for your consideration here rather than monopolising the template talk discussion. If I understand correctly, your view is that no demographic statistics should be included in infoboxes because of undue prominence, so I take it you would favour their removal from <a href="/wiki/Template:Infobox_UK_place" title="Template:Infobox UK place">Template:Infobox UK place</a> too. That's a big change to longstanding inclusion of demographic statistics in the infoboxes be they ethnicity or otherwise. The difference between <a href="/wiki/Template:Infobox_English_county" title="Template:Infobox English county">Template:Infobox English county</a> and UK place template is that UK Place doesn't specify a particular statistic field and it is left to editors of a particular article to decide what's included. Template counties on the other hand specifies ethnicity as the sole field, wrongly I would say. So what to do? My preference is for the following changes to the county template. a) remove ethnicity b) add two optional undefined statistical fields under both the non-metropolitan county and unitary authority sections as with UK place infobox c) let editors seek consensus on individual counties for optional statistical fields. As things stand this would remove all the ethnicity figures, but give an option to include up to two fields, which may make it easier to achieve consensus. We shouldn't assume negative connotations for ethnicity's prominence. Census ethnicity data can be utilised as a positive indication of welcomed diversity. My concern is not about the inclusion of a specific demographic but that the figures for those shown are correctly based on the latest census. Many at present are not and even worse have no source alongside. For these I agree with what you did with Beds and Bucks, i.e. blanking them, though I saw no obligation to undertake up-to-date calculations given the figures are not published for those entities and was somewhat surprised you undertook this. <a href="/wiki/User:Rupples" title="User:Rupples">Rupples</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rupples" title="User talk:Rupples">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Rupples-20231212190400-Infobox_demographic_statistics" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:04, 12 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Rupples-20231212190400-Infobox_demographic_statistics"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Rupples-20231212190400-Infobox_demographic_statistics"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231212203300-Rupples-20231212190400"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Rupples" title="User:Rupples">Rupples</a>:</span> Thank you. First, I assume you realised that population is a given, that I was talking about the other metrics.</dd> <dd>Yes, my main bugbear is that ethnicity is effectively mandatory. In UK PLACE articles, the facility is there for local consensus, which I think can probably work at such a very local level. I'm less sure that it work at county level but its not a show stopper and I won't argue about it lest it distract from my major point. So yes, I agree with your ABC: can you try to get consensus around them?</dd> <dd>On the Beds and Bucks infoboxes, I felt I had a duty to hold to the status quo first and have the debate from there because it is a general problem. But I very nearly didn't. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231212203300-Rupples-20231212190400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:33, 12 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231212203300-Rupples-20231212190400"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231212203300-Rupples-20231212190400"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Rupples-20231212222300-JMF-20231212203300"></span>Thank you. I'll see what I can do. It probably requires an invitation to the discussion placed on each county's talk page and as Keith D suggests on related wikiprojects, plus a slightly differently worded explanation and rationale. The one task I'm reticent to do is the actual change to the template, if agreed, as it affects many articles and I'm not confident of getting it right. <a href="/wiki/User:Rupples" title="User:Rupples">Rupples</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rupples" title="User talk:Rupples">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Rupples-20231212222300-JMF-20231212203300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:23, 12 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Rupples-20231212222300-JMF-20231212203300"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Rupples-20231212222300-JMF-20231212203300"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231213003100-Rupples-20231212222300"></span>Conventionally, the notice goes on the template talk page and associated project pages. I've been an editor for a very long time and never yet seen a notice in talk pages of articles that invoke that template. I've notified wpukgeo and wpengland. Is there another one with even a marginal interest?</dd> <dd>As for making the actual change, once the principle has consensus, getting help to make it happen is not too difficult. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231213003100-Rupples-20231212222300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:31, 13 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231213003100-Rupples-20231212222300"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231213003100-Rupples-20231212222300"></span></dd></dl></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-71.208.58.96-20240226100300-JMF-20231212203300"></span>Interesting dont you think <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/71.208.58.96" title="Special:Contributions/71.208.58.96">71.208.58.96</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:71.208.58.96&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:71.208.58.96 (page does not exist)">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-71.208.58.96-20240226100300-JMF-20231212203300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:03, 26 February 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-71.208.58.96-20240226100300-JMF-20231212203300"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-71.208.58.96-20240226100300-JMF-20231212203300"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Rupples-20231214091200-Infobox_demographic_statistics"></span>Hi again. I've placed a notification on <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Berkshire#Proposed_county_infobox_template_change" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Berkshire">Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Berkshire#Proposed county infobox template change</a>. You may want to take a look. May have to amend the wording for other county projects, but wanted to get your general OK/advice. Hopefully, we'll get more input and a wider consensus to the proposed change. I think notifying the county projects is what Keith is recommending. <a href="/wiki/User:Rupples" title="User:Rupples">Rupples</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rupples" title="User talk:Rupples">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Rupples-20231214091200-Infobox_demographic_statistics" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:12, 14 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Rupples-20231214091200-Infobox_demographic_statistics"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Rupples-20231214091200-Infobox_demographic_statistics"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231214125500-Rupples-20231214091200"></span>ah ok. The Bucks one has been dormant for so long that I had forgotten about the county WikiProjects. Yes, we will have to replicate your notice to the others, dormant or not. I will do some this pm. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231214125500-Rupples-20231214091200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:55, 14 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231214125500-Rupples-20231214091200"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231214125500-Rupples-20231214091200"></span></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Rupples-20231215203700-Infobox_demographic_statistics"></span>Hi JMF. For some reason, I didn't get a notification for your comment that mentions "lizardmen overlords and their human slaves"; I don't understand the comment, but no need to elaborate. I feel I've contributed more than enough to the Template Talk discussion already and don't propose to make any further points, other than respond if directly addressed. A long back and forth may deter other editors from contributing and I'd like to hear fresh voices. The number of responses so far is disappointing, but it's early days. I wonder if many active editors have the wikiprojects on watchlists? One of the reasons for the additional optional statistical infobox fields is that if we offered them it would help deflate any blowback from editors or readers after the ethnicity stats disappear. Of course, fears of a blowback may turn out to be unfounded. I don't immediately foresee much use being made of the optional fields; they wouldn't show in the article infoboxes and would be undefined in the template, unlike maybe a tendency to add data for defined fields from a sense of obligation to fill empty boxes — might be wrong though. Cheers. <a href="/wiki/User:Rupples" title="User:Rupples">Rupples</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rupples" title="User talk:Rupples">talk</a>) 20:37, 15 December 2023 (UTC) amended <a href="/wiki/User:Rupples" title="User:Rupples">Rupples</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rupples" title="User talk:Rupples">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Rupples-20231215203700-Infobox_demographic_statistics" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:17, 16 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Rupples-20231215203700-Infobox_demographic_statistics"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Rupples-20231215203700-Infobox_demographic_statistics"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231216100200-Rupples-20231215203700"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Rupples" title="User:Rupples">Rupples</a>:</span> Yes, let's let it run for a bit. I suspect we'll end up with needing to do an RFC proposing (a) no change (b) two open-ended options (c) remove it.</dd> <dd>I am reminded of the <span class="nowrap">{{</span><a href="/wiki/Template:Infobox_UK_place" title="Template:Infobox UK place">infobox UK place</a><span class="nowrap">}}</span> v <span class="nowrap">{{</span><a href="/wiki/Template:Infobox_settlement" title="Template:Infobox settlement">infobox settlement</a><span class="nowrap">}}</span> debate. One obvious difference is that UK place does not have a race or ethnicity option (but Settlement does).</dd> <dd>I am certain that your surmise is correct: evident or not, there will be at least one editor who feels compelled to find them and "complete" the infobox. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231216100200-Rupples-20231215203700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:02, 16 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231216100200-Rupples-20231215203700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231216100200-Rupples-20231215203700"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Rupples-20231216143500-JMF-20231216100200"></span>Personally, I wouldn't be changing the template based on the amount of contributions to the discussion so far, but given your "length of service" and experience on here, you can doubtless judge this better than I. One thing I'm minded to do as a test case is to remove at least one county's misleading or out of date stats, not replace and open a discussion on the county talk page with explanation and a link to the Template discussion. It may help gauge what interest there is and if reverted, how strong. What do you think? <a href="/wiki/User:Rupples" title="User:Rupples">Rupples</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rupples" title="User talk:Rupples">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Rupples-20231216143500-JMF-20231216100200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">14:35, 16 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Rupples-20231216143500-JMF-20231216100200"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Rupples-20231216143500-JMF-20231216100200"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20231216155300-Rupples-20231216143500"></span>I'll repeat what I said in the discussion: the infobox is a <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:LEAD" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:LEAD">wp:LEAD</a> in tabular form and should have the same economy of content. Every county article has the population in the lead: none breaks it down further. It is just clutter.</dd> <dd>In my experience, it appears that one of three things will happen: (a) the discussion just peters out and nothing changes (b) there is an immediate and clear consensus for change (c) a slow start, more editors pitch in, various compromise options get thrown in the mix and eventually it goes to full RFC. I think we are at version c, so let it simmer for a few more days. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20231216155300-Rupples-20231216143500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:53, 16 December 2023 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20231216155300-Rupples-20231216143500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20231216155300-Rupples-20231216143500"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_2_March_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_2_March_2024-20240302110100"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_2_March_2024-20240302110100"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 2 March 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_2_March_2024-20240302110100"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240302110100-The_Signpost:_2_March_2024"></span>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-02/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-02/News and notes">Wikimedia enters US Supreme court hearings as "the dolphin inadvertently caught in the net"</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Recent research: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-02/Recent_research" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-02/Recent research">Images on Wikipedia "amplify gender bias"</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-02/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-02/In the media">The Scottish Parliament gets involved, a wikirace on live TV, and the Foundation's CTO goes on record</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Obituary: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-02/Obituary" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-02/Obituary">Vami_IV</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-02/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-02/Traffic report">Supervalentinefilmbowlday</a></li></ul> <ul><li>WikiCup report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-02/WikiCup_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-02/WikiCup report">High-scoring WikiCup first round comes to a close</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-03-02" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-03-02">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240302110100-The_Signpost:_2_March_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:01, 2 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240302110100-The_Signpost:_2_March_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240302110100-The_Signpost:_2_March_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish" data-mw-thread-id="h-Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish-20240309024800"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish-20240309024800"></span>Wikipedia Library Request... support if you so wish<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish-20240309024800"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-EPEAviator-20240309024800-Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish"></span>Hi, </p><p>Sorry for using your talk page, but I couldn't think of a better way to access you. You have shown an interest in British (Country House) Architectural History. I have suggested that Wikipedians gain access to the Country Life Archive on The Wikipedia Library (<a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/suggest/">https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/suggest/</a>). Please feel free to support this suggestion (titled "Country Life Archive (Proquest)" on the above page) if you think this is a good idea. </p><p>Feel free to @ me here with any questions. </p><p>Cheers, <a href="/wiki/User:EPEAviator" title="User:EPEAviator">EPEAviator</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:EPEAviator" title="User talk:EPEAviator">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-EPEAviator-20240309024800-Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:48, 9 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-EPEAviator-20240309024800-Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-EPEAviator-20240309024800-Wikipedia_Library_Request..._support_if_you_so_wish"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Ursula_von_der_Leyen" data-mw-thread-id="h-Ursula_von_der_Leyen-20240309172000"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Ursula_von_der_Leyen-20240309172000"></span>Ursula von der Leyen<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Ursula_von_der_Leyen-20240309172000"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackTheSecond-20240309172000-Ursula_von_der_Leyen"></span>The relevant quote in the sections source was: </p> <style data-mw-deduplicate="TemplateStyles:r1244412712">.mw-parser-output .templatequote{overflow:hidden;margin:1em 0;padding:0 32px}.mw-parser-output .templatequotecite{line-height:1.5em;text-align:left;margin-top:0}@media(min-width:500px){.mw-parser-output .templatequotecite{padding-left:1.6em}}</style><blockquote class="templatequote"><p>"It is us, Europeans, who decide who comes to Europe and under what circumstances," she said. Her party's manifesto, unveiled on Wednesday, includes a controversial plan to outsource asylum applications to "safe" third countries based on the UK's 'Rwanda model'.</p></blockquote> <p>... But at this point I'd accept if that was factually wrong reporting as well. Pinging you just because, well, the assertion is sourced, at least. <a href="/wiki/User:JackTheSecond" title="User:JackTheSecond">JackTheSecond</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackTheSecond" title="User talk:JackTheSecond">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JackTheSecond-20240309172000-Ursula_von_der_Leyen" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:20, 9 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackTheSecond-20240309172000-Ursula_von_der_Leyen"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackTheSecond-20240309172000-Ursula_von_der_Leyen"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240309191800-JackTheSecond-20240309172000"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:JackTheSecond" title="User:JackTheSecond">JackTheSecond</a>:</span> ...</dd> <dd>First, the article is about UvdL, not about the EPP. So unless she explicitly endorses that statement, it is irrelevant to her bio.</dd> <dd>Second, it doesn't matter what the EPP policy is, since the Commission is not a government.</dd></dl> <dl><dd>Not that it matters given that it is irrelevant, but where is it sourced? Even if it is true that the plan to outsource asylum applications, I would be astonished if they would cite the British government's illegal Rwanda proposal as an exemplar. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240309191800-JackTheSecond-20240309172000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:18, 9 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240309191800-JackTheSecond-20240309172000"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240309191800-JackTheSecond-20240309172000"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackTheSecond-20240309192900-JMF-20240309191800"></span>The source was <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/2024/03/07/europes-centre-right-party-clears-path-for-von-der-leyens-re-election-despite-some-objecti">this</a> euronews article (that the section is referenced with). Not that you should bother with it overly. It was obviously the author of the article's writing. <a href="/wiki/User:JackTheSecond" title="User:JackTheSecond">JackTheSecond</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackTheSecond" title="User talk:JackTheSecond">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JackTheSecond-20240309192900-JMF-20240309191800" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:29, 9 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackTheSecond-20240309192900-JMF-20240309191800"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackTheSecond-20240309192900-JMF-20240309191800"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240309202000-JackTheSecond-20240309192900"></span>Yes, <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/2024/03/06/from-migration-crackdown-to-green-deal-overhaul-key-takeaways-from-the-epp-manifesto">here it is</a>, though it is the Euronews reporter that says "based on the UK-devised ‘Rwanda model’", not (at least explicitly) the EPP. She might have said "Italy's Albania model" or "<a href="/wiki/Australian_immigration_detention_facilities" title="Australian immigration detention facilities">Australia's Nauru model</a>" but that wouldn't get the volume of clicks. <a href="/wiki/Nazi_Party#Rise_to_power:_1925–1933" title="Nazi Party">1925 revisited</a>... sigh (sorry, <a href="/wiki/Goodwin%27s_Law" class="mw-redirect" title="Goodwin's Law">Goodwin's Law</a> violation). --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240309202000-JackTheSecond-20240309192900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:20, 9 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240309202000-JackTheSecond-20240309192900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240309202000-JackTheSecond-20240309192900"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Unicode_hyphen" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Unicode_hyphen-20240306203200"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Unicode_hyphen-20240306203200"></span>The Unicode hyphen<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Unicode_hyphen-20240306203200"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div><p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20240306203200-The_Unicode_hyphen"></span> You objected to the phrase "various types of <a href="/wiki/Hyphen" title="Hyphen">hyphen</a> including the unambiguous <i>Unicode hyphen</i> at U+2010" claiming that</p><blockquote><p> there is no such thing formally as a "Unicode hyphen", any more than there a "Unicode minus" or indeed a "Unicode plus"; these are commonly used forms of disambiguation so let's be consistent in our usages.</p></blockquote><p>Where is the inconsistency? "Unicode hyphen" is totally unambiguous, unlike your use of the term "formally". "Unicode hyphen" is used in the "name=" parameter of the infobox of the <a href="/wiki/Hyphen" title="Hyphen">Hyphen</a> article as well as in the lead of that article. Can you suggest a better term? Not "hyphen", surely, as that's wildly ambiguous. <a href="/wiki/User:Peter_M._Brown" title="User:Peter M. Brown">Peter Brown</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Peter_M._Brown" title="User talk:Peter M. Brown">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Peter_M._Brown-20240306203200-The_Unicode_hyphen" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:32, 6 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20240306203200-The_Unicode_hyphen"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Peter_M._Brown-20240306203200-The_Unicode_hyphen"></span> </p><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240306205300-Peter_M._Brown-20240306203200"></span>The problem is that it "unicode hyphen" a confection of Wikipedia's making. The name of the glyph is "hyphen", not ifs, no buts, no qualification. Unlike "hyphen-minus" in ASCII. Unlike all the other qualified hyphens and dashes. No, I can't indulge in OR to invent a term nor do I see any need for one: my aim in rewriting that bit of <a href="/wiki/Hyphen-minus" title="Hyphen-minus">hyphen-minus</a> to that it says</dd> <dd><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1244412712"><blockquote class="templatequote"><p>The current <a href="/wiki/Unicode_Standard" class="mw-redirect" title="Unicode Standard">Unicode Standard</a> specifies distinct characters for several different <a href="/wiki/Dash" title="Dash">dashes</a>, an unambiguous <a href="/wiki/Minus_sign" class="mw-redirect" title="Minus sign">minus sign</a> (sometimes called the <i>Unicode minus</i>) at <a href="/wiki/Code_point" title="Code point">code point</a> U+2212, an unambigious <a href="/wiki/Hyphen" title="Hyphen">hyphen</a> (sometimes called the <i>Unicode hyphen</i>) at U+2010, the hyphen-minus at U+002D and a <a href="/wiki/Hyphen#Unicode" title="Hyphen">variety of other hyphen symbols</a> for various uses.</p></blockquote></dd> <dd>is to formally introduce our jargon explicitly and consistently across each of the three cases. Having done so, we can write "unicode hyphen" thereafter with a clear conscience. Otherwise it would be wildly ambiguous of course. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240306205300-Peter_M._Brown-20240306203200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:53, 6 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240306205300-Peter_M._Brown-20240306203200"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240306205300-Peter_M._Brown-20240306203200"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20240306232100-JMF-20240306205300"></span>I still think that the phrases "Unicode hyphen" and "Unicode minus") are unambiguous as they stand. Googling, I find discussion of the "unicode hyphen" (with a lower-case "u") <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://network.informatica.com/s/question/0D56S0000AD6zUPSQZ/informatica-unable-to-output-unicode-hyphen-correctly-to-flat-file">here</a> but I have to admit that it's rare. Do you think that we should edit the <a href="/wiki/Hyphen" title="Hyphen">Hyphen</a> article somehow to clarify or eliminate the phrase? I don't see any harm in leaving it alone.</dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd>The statement at <a href="/wiki/Plus_and_minus_signs#Minus_sign" title="Plus and minus signs">Plus and minus signs § Minus sign</a> that <span style="padding-right:.15em;">"</span>'−' redirects here" is ambiguous, unnecessary, and potentially misleading; I suggest that it be deleted. <a href="/wiki/User:Peter_M._Brown" title="User:Peter M. Brown">Peter Brown</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Peter_M._Brown" title="User talk:Peter M. Brown">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Peter_M._Brown-20240306232100-JMF-20240306205300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:21, 6 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20240306232100-JMF-20240306205300"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Peter_M._Brown-20240306232100-JMF-20240306205300"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240307002000-Peter_M._Brown-20240306232100"></span>Just to be clear, I have no objection in principle to the term "unicode hyphen", "unicode minus" or even "unicode plus" [Caps or otherwise].. My concern is that we must introduce them before we use them because the distinction will not be obvious to many readers and the adjective unfamiliar. Yes, they are unambiguous to you and me but we are a minority.</dd> <dd>I'll have a look at <a href="/wiki/Hyphen" title="Hyphen">Hyphen</a> tomorrow: if it uses the phrase "unicode hyphen" without an introduction, then it is frightfully rude, old chap [as Lady Bridgerton probably didn't say].</dd> <dd>Yes, per the spirit of <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:NOTAMBIG" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:NOTAMBIG">WP:NOTAMBIG</a>: what else would it be? Off with its head. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240307002000-Peter_M._Brown-20240306232100" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:20, 7 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240307002000-Peter_M._Brown-20240306232100"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240307002000-Peter_M._Brown-20240306232100"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20240307013900-JMF-20240307002000"></span>Clicking "Random Article" calls up <a href="/wiki/Carex_tsaratananensis" title="Carex tsaratananensis">Carex tsaratananensis</a>. The lead says that it is a is a tussock-forming species of perennial sedge in the family Cyperaceae. Without further research, I don't know what tussocks are or what sedge is, or whether Cyperacae is a family of plants, of animals, of slime molds, or of something else. Surely, though, the article's creator could use these terms without explaining them! The same goes for "unicode". <a href="/wiki/User:Peter_M._Brown" title="User:Peter M. Brown">Peter Brown</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Peter_M._Brown" title="User talk:Peter M. Brown">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Peter_M._Brown-20240307013900-JMF-20240307002000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">01:39, 7 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Peter_M._Brown-20240307013900-JMF-20240307002000"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Peter_M._Brown-20240307013900-JMF-20240307002000"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240307104900-Peter_M._Brown-20240307013900"></span>Those are standard English words easily found in a dictionary (though I would wlink <a href="/wiki/Sedge" class="mw-redirect" title="Sedge">sedge</a>): "unicode hyphen" is a confection of our making, so we are obliged to introduce it. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240307104900-Peter_M._Brown-20240307013900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:49, 7 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240307104900-Peter_M._Brown-20240307013900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240307104900-Peter_M._Brown-20240307013900"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Imaginatorium-20240319032600-The_Unicode_hyphen"></span>Just a comment (to JMF); I just "thanked" your removal of some long list of Unicode symbols at <a href="/wiki/Tilde" title="Tilde">tilde</a>, and I was going to make a comment about it. But looking at the discussion above, hmm. Well, actually "Unicode hyphen" is a solecism. There is no such thing as a particular hyphen which is of the Unicode variety - there is only a Unicode encoding (or multiple encodings) of a hyphen. Mustn't ramble. <a href="/wiki/User:Imaginatorium" title="User:Imaginatorium">Imaginatorium</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Imaginatorium" title="User talk:Imaginatorium">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Imaginatorium-20240319032600-The_Unicode_hyphen" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">03:26, 19 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Imaginatorium-20240319032600-The_Unicode_hyphen"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Imaginatorium-20240319032600-The_Unicode_hyphen"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="DYK_for_Robert_Hooke" data-mw-thread-id="h-DYK_for_Robert_Hooke-20240327000200"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-DYK_for_Robert_Hooke-20240327000200"></span>DYK for Robert Hooke<span data-mw-comment-end="h-DYK_for_Robert_Hooke-20240327000200"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Premeditated_Chaos-20240327000200-DYK_for_Robert_Hooke"></span><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1256334245"><div class="ivmbox" style=""> <div class="ivmbox-image" style="flex-basis: 40px"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Updated_DYK_query.svg" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/a0/Updated_DYK_query.svg/40px-Updated_DYK_query.svg.png" decoding="async" width="40" height="81" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/a0/Updated_DYK_query.svg/60px-Updated_DYK_query.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/a0/Updated_DYK_query.svg/80px-Updated_DYK_query.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="35" data-file-height="71"/></a></span></div> <div class="ivmbox-text"> <p>On <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Recent_additions/2024/March#27_March_2024" title="Wikipedia:Recent additions/2024/March">27 March 2024</a>, <b><a href="/wiki/Template:Did_you_know" title="Template:Did you know">Did you know</a></b> was updated with a fact from the article <i><b><a href="/wiki/Robert_Hooke" title="Robert Hooke">Robert Hooke</a></b></i>, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was <i>... that in addition to his work as a scientist, <b><a href="/wiki/Robert_Hooke" title="Robert Hooke">Robert Hooke</a></b> was an architect who designed the <a href="/wiki/Monument_to_the_Great_Fire_of_London" title="Monument to the Great Fire of London">Monument to the Great Fire of London</a> so that it could also have <a href="/wiki/Monument_to_the_Great_Fire_of_London#As_a_scientific_instrument" title="Monument to the Great Fire of London">a practical value as a scientific instrument</a>?</i> The nomination discussion and review may be seen at <a href="/wiki/Template:Did_you_know_nominations/Robert_Hooke" title="Template:Did you know nominations/Robert Hooke">Template:Did you know nominations/Robert Hooke</a>. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page <small>(<a href="/wiki/User:Rjanag/Pageview_stats" title="User:Rjanag/Pageview stats">here's how</a>, <a class="external text" href="https://pageviews.toolforge.org/?start=2024-03-17&end=2024-04-06&project=en.wikipedia.org&pages=Robert_Hooke">Robert Hooke</a>)</small>, and the hook may be added to <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Did_you_know/Statistics/Monthly_DYK_pageview_leaders" title="Wikipedia:Did you know/Statistics/Monthly DYK pageview leaders">the statistics page</a> after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the <a href="/wiki/Template_talk:Did_you_know" title="Template talk:Did you know">Did you know talk page</a>. </p> </div> </div><p> ♠<a href="/wiki/User:Premeditated_Chaos" title="User:Premeditated Chaos">PMC</a>♠ <a href="/wiki/User_talk:Premeditated_Chaos" title="User talk:Premeditated Chaos">(talk)</a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Premeditated_Chaos-20240327000200-DYK_for_Robert_Hooke" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:02, 27 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Premeditated_Chaos-20240327000200-DYK_for_Robert_Hooke"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Premeditated_Chaos-20240327000200-DYK_for_Robert_Hooke"></span> </p><div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_29_March_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_29_March_2024-20240329223900"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_29_March_2024-20240329223900"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 29 March 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_29_March_2024-20240329223900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240329223900-The_Signpost:_29_March_2024"></span>Technology report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/Technology_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/Technology report">Millions of readers still seeing broken pages as "temporary" disabling of graph extension nears its second year</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Interview: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/Interview" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/Interview">Interview on Wikimedia Foundation fundraising and finance strategy</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Special report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/Special_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/Special report">19-page PDF accuses Wikipedia of bias against Israel, suggests editors be forced to reveal their real names, and demands a new feature allowing people to view the history of Wikipedia articles</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Op-Ed: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/Op-Ed" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/Op-Ed">Wikipedia in the age of personality-driven knowledge</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Recent research: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/Recent_research" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/Recent research">"Newcomer Homepage" feature mostly fails to boost new editors</a></li></ul> <ul><li>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/News and notes">Universal Code of Conduct Coordinating Committee Charter ratified</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/In the media">"For me it’s the autism": AARoad editors on the fork more traveled</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/Traffic report">He rules over everything, on the land called planet Dune</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Humour: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/Humour" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/Humour">Letters from the editors</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Comix: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-03-29/Comix" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-03-29/Comix">Layout issue</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-03-29" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-03-29">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240329223900-The_Signpost:_29_March_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:39, 29 March 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240329223900-The_Signpost:_29_March_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240329223900-The_Signpost:_29_March_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Re:_Jahor12345" data-mw-thread-id="h-Re:_Jahor12345-20240412225700"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Re:_Jahor12345-20240412225700"></span>Re: Jahor12345<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Re:_Jahor12345-20240412225700"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Classicwiki-20240412225700-Re:_Jahor12345"></span>Turns out your <a href="/wiki/User_talk:Classicwiki/Archive_2#Jahor12345" title="User talk:Classicwiki/Archive 2">suspicions</a> were correct. I noticed a pattern of edits to <a href="/wiki/British_currency_in_the_Middle_East" title="British currency in the Middle East">British currency in the Middle East</a> by a range of IP addresses as well. So I <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/TheCurrencyGuy" title="Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/TheCurrencyGuy">reported both</a> to SPI to be safe. <a href="/wiki/User:Jahor12345" title="User:Jahor12345">Jahor12345</a> is a sock of <a href="/wiki/User:TheCurrencyGuy" title="User:TheCurrencyGuy">TheCurrencyGuy</a>. </p><p>Now I am trying to untangle the web a little. I have <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Numismatics#TheCurrencyGuy_Sock_Edits" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Numismatics">started a discussion at WikiProject Numismatics</a> if you wanted to join. Thanks for your help. Regards, <a href="/wiki/User:Classicwiki" title="User:Classicwiki">Classicwiki</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Classicwiki" title="User talk:Classicwiki">talk</a>)<span style="font-size:85%;"> If you reply here, please <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:ECHO" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:ECHO">ping me</a>.</span> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Classicwiki-20240412225700-Re:_Jahor12345" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:57, 12 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Classicwiki-20240412225700-Re:_Jahor12345"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Classicwiki-20240412225700-Re:_Jahor12345"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240413000900-Classicwiki-20240412225700"></span>I have just block-reverted the lot. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240413000900-Classicwiki-20240412225700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:09, 13 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240413000900-Classicwiki-20240412225700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240413000900-Classicwiki-20240412225700"></span></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-77.99.242.50-20240413170000-Re:_Jahor12345"></span>The IP server who was blocked yesterday for editing at "British currency in the Middle East" is not the editor called TheCurrencyGuy, doesn't know who he is, and has never interacted with him. Please double check the style of the edits. The IP server who you blocked yesterday also happens to have an interest in currency history and was trying to improve some articles. The in-line sourcing was yet to come, but the editor at the IP server hasn't yet figured out how to format the references. But much of the material and dates came from "All Monies of the World" by Franz Pick & Rene Sedillot, "Dictionary of the World's Currencies and Foreign Exchange", WF Spalding, and "Standard Catalog of World Coins", Krause , Mishier, and Bruce. <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/77.99.242.50" title="Special:Contributions/77.99.242.50">77.99.242.50</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:77.99.242.50&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:77.99.242.50 (page does not exist)">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-77.99.242.50-20240413170000-Re:_Jahor12345" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:00, 13 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-77.99.242.50-20240413170000-Re:_Jahor12345"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-77.99.242.50-20240413170000-Re:_Jahor12345"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240413182600-77.99.242.50-20240413170000"></span>The article had become a complete mess, structurally as well as the many uncited assertions, contrary to policy <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:No_original_research" title="Wikipedia:No original research">WP:no original research</a>. At least some of the content was added by a sock puppet of TCG. Please ask for help at <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Numismatics" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Numismatics">Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Numismatics</a> to have the desired changes done p There is already a discussion open on this topic or you can start a new one. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240413182600-77.99.242.50-20240413170000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:26, 13 April 2024 (UTC)</a>roperly.<span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240413182600-77.99.242.50-20240413170000"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240413182600-77.99.242.50-20240413170000"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-77.99.242.50-20240413192500-JMF-20240413182600"></span>I'm speaking on the directions of the editor whose IP server has been blocked, and who is definitely not TheCurrencyGuy. If the IP range is unblocked then you can discuss the matter with that editor directly, and you can point out the edits that you thought were problematic. The editor was about to mention that in 1928, it was still the Hejaz and the Nejd when that silver riyal was introduced, and that Saudi Arabia didn't come into existence until 1932. But the main point is, that this editor is definitely not TheCurrencyGuy. Not a single edit from that IP range was done by TheCurrencyGuy. The editor has got nothing to do with TheCurrencyGuy and doesn't know who TheCurrencyGuy is. For start, take a look at the talk page on "British currency in the Middle East". The sources were coming, and there was more to come. It just required some help to get them formatted correctly. <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/77.99.242.50" title="Special:Contributions/77.99.242.50">77.99.242.50</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:77.99.242.50&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:77.99.242.50 (page does not exist)">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-77.99.242.50-20240413192500-JMF-20240413182600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:25, 13 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-77.99.242.50-20240413192500-JMF-20240413182600"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-77.99.242.50-20240413192500-JMF-20240413182600"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240413212200-77.99.242.50-20240413192500"></span>If the contributor chooses to create an account, then the IP range block does not apply – see <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Why_create_an_account%3F" title="Wikipedia:Why create an account?">Why create an account?</a>. Among the other benefits, a personal sign-on will also give them a test page (called the sandbox) where they can chop and change the text at will, until they have a version that is ready to go live. They don't need to (indeed <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:REALNAME" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:REALNAME">probably should not</a>) use their real name – <a href="/wiki/User:JMF#My_user-name" title="User:JMF">I don't</a>. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240413212200-77.99.242.50-20240413192500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:22, 13 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240413212200-77.99.242.50-20240413192500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240413212200-77.99.242.50-20240413192500"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Winslow_station" data-mw-thread-id="h-Winslow_station-20240418162700"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Winslow_station-20240418162700"></span>Winslow station<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Winslow_station-20240418162700"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Steamybrian2-20240418162700-Winslow_station"></span>You have reverted my amendment in regard to amended the station had 2 platforms instead of one. I will state that the station was on double track and my amendment stands that it had two platforms. <a href="/wiki/User:Steamybrian2" title="User:Steamybrian2">Steamybrian2</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Steamybrian2" title="User talk:Steamybrian2">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Steamybrian2-20240418162700-Winslow_station" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:27, 18 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Steamybrian2-20240418162700-Winslow_station"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Steamybrian2-20240418162700-Winslow_station"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240418163500-Steamybrian2-20240418162700"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Steamybrian2" title="User:Steamybrian2">Steamybrian2</a>:</span>: I thought you were jumping the gun to the new station but even so, the <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://maps.nls.uk/view/101449363">1952 OS map</a> and the picture in the article suggest otherwise. Do you have a source that says it had two? if so, reduction to one would be a "significant date" that should be listed. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240418163500-Steamybrian2-20240418162700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:35, 18 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240418163500-Steamybrian2-20240418162700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240418163500-Steamybrian2-20240418162700"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Steamybrian2-20240419115400-JMF-20240418163500"></span>The website - Disused Stations: Winslow Station (disused-stations.org.uk) has good photographs of the station showing both platforms. I have added this website as a reference in the history box of the wikipedia article. The photograph illustrated in the wikipedia article shows only one platform because it was taken from a train on the other track with the other platform hidden. When in passenger use the line was double track and was singled many years after the passenger service finished which the aforementioned "Disused Stations" article mentions. I have no reference to a 1952 OS map but a 1930 OS map in my collection shows similar symbols for double or single track for which you may have misread. <a href="/wiki/User:Steamybrian2" title="User:Steamybrian2">Steamybrian2</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Steamybrian2" title="User talk:Steamybrian2">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Steamybrian2-20240419115400-JMF-20240418163500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:54, 19 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Steamybrian2-20240419115400-JMF-20240418163500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Steamybrian2-20240419115400-JMF-20240418163500"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240419122500-Steamybrian2-20240419115400"></span>Great work. It is also shown more clearly on <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://maps.nls.uk/view/104181443">this 1880 map</a> (1:2500 "25 inch" scale).--<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240419122500-Steamybrian2-20240419115400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:25, 19 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240419122500-Steamybrian2-20240419115400"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240419122500-Steamybrian2-20240419115400"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_or_TheCurrencyGuy" data-mw-thread-id="h-Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_o-20240419135000"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_o-20240419135000"></span>Evidence that the IP server that was blocked was not a sockpupet of Jahor12345 or TheCurrencyGuy<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_o-20240419135000"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-81.134.217.27-20240419135000-Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_o"></span>The IP server that was blocked at the same time as <a class="external free" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jahor12345">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jahor12345</a> is not connected. Both were editing simultaneously on different articles during the morning of 3rd April 2024.The IP server began with detailed edits about the Egyptian pound, and then around noon, switched over to British currency in the Middle East. Meanwhile, editor Jahor12345 was editing across a wide range of currency topics, mainly reformatting. The editing styles are completely different. The IP server carried out edits at 1204hrs and 1206hrs, while Jahor12345 carried out an edit in the middle of that two minute period at 1205hrs. They couldn't possibly be the same person.<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/81.134.217.27" title="Special:Contributions/81.134.217.27">81.134.217.27</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:81.134.217.27&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:81.134.217.27 (page does not exist)">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-81.134.217.27-20240419135000-Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_o" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:50, 19 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-81.134.217.27-20240419135000-Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_o"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-81.134.217.27-20240419135000-Evidence_that_the_IP_server_that_was_blocked_was_not_a_sockpupet_of_Jahor12345_o"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240419184100-81.134.217.27-20240419135000"></span>It was not I who blocked that IP range, indeed it could be a coincidence, that the cause was concurrent abuse by another IP on the same network.</dd> <dd>Again, if the contributor creates an account, the version that they were working on can be copied to their sandbox. They can finish it there, then ask for it to be reviewed and made live when ok. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240419184100-81.134.217.27-20240419135000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:41, 19 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240419184100-81.134.217.27-20240419135000"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240419184100-81.134.217.27-20240419135000"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Japanese_Yen" data-mw-thread-id="h-Japanese_Yen-20240419205900"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Japanese_Yen-20240419205900"></span>Japanese Yen<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Japanese_Yen-20240419205900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-LendingNext-20240419205900-Japanese_Yen"></span>Hello. We would like to inform you that for various reasons our user name has changed to LendingNext. Now, in this edition of the <a href="/wiki/Japanese_yen" title="Japanese yen">Japanese yen</a> page, we have included real effective exchange rate figures from 1970 to 2024, so that they can be compared with the nominal effective exchange rate. We apologise for the inconvenience.<a href="/wiki/User:LendingNext" title="User:LendingNext">LendingNext</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:LendingNext" title="User talk:LendingNext">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-LendingNext-20240419205900-Japanese_Yen" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:59, 19 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-LendingNext-20240419205900-Japanese_Yen"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-LendingNext-20240419205900-Japanese_Yen"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital" data-mw-thread-id="h-Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital-20240424184500"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital-20240424184500"></span><a href="/wiki/Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital" title="Milton Keynes University Hospital">Milton Keynes University Hospital</a><span data-mw-comment-end="h-Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital-20240424184500"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Millstream3-20240424184500-Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital"></span>Please don't make unhelpful citation template changes as you did at <a href="/wiki/Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital" title="Milton Keynes University Hospital">Milton Keynes University Hospital</a>. You might prefer a particular citation template but in making a change from 'publisher' to 'work', you also removed the 'website' parameter, which is very useful. If you'd like to make a substantial change like that in future, I suggest you use the article talk page. <a href="/wiki/User:Millstream3" title="User:Millstream3">Millstream3</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Millstream3" title="User talk:Millstream3">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Millstream3-20240424184500-Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:45, 24 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Millstream3-20240424184500-Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Millstream3-20240424184500-Milton_Keynes_University_Hospital"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Millstream3-20240424192600-Millstream3-20240424184500"></span>If you must change these, please do not remove the website parameter - that is vandalism. I have reverted again. If you wish to edit, please do so more carefully. <a href="/wiki/User:Millstream3" title="User:Millstream3">Millstream3</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Millstream3" title="User talk:Millstream3">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Millstream3-20240424192600-Millstream3-20240424184500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:26, 24 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Millstream3-20240424192600-Millstream3-20240424184500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Millstream3-20240424192600-Millstream3-20240424184500"></span></dd></dl> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Millstream3-20240424193600-Millstream3-20240424184500"></span>Apologies - I see you can't have both work and website - there is a bug in the template. I have therefore reverted to the article as it was. <a href="/wiki/User:Millstream3" title="User:Millstream3">Millstream3</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Millstream3" title="User talk:Millstream3">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Millstream3-20240424193600-Millstream3-20240424184500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:36, 24 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Millstream3-20240424193600-Millstream3-20240424184500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Millstream3-20240424193600-Millstream3-20240424184500"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240424200500-Millstream3-20240424193600"></span>That'll remind us both to use the article talk page to resolve differences: while you were writing that here, I was writing the other side of the coin on your talk page. <abbr title="Smiling face" style="border-bottom: none;"><span typeof="mw:File"><span><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Face-smile.svg/18px-Face-smile.svg.png" decoding="async" width="18" height="18" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Face-smile.svg/27px-Face-smile.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Face-smile.svg/36px-Face-smile.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="48" data-file-height="48"/></span></span></abbr> But all's well that ends well. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240424200500-Millstream3-20240424193600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:05, 24 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240424200500-Millstream3-20240424193600"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240424200500-Millstream3-20240424193600"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_25_April_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_25_April_2024-20240425114800"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_25_April_2024-20240425114800"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 25 April 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_25_April_2024-20240425114800"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240425114800-The_Signpost:_25_April_2024"></span>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-04-25/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-04-25/In the media">Censorship and wikiwashing looming over RuWiki, edit wars over San Francisco politics, and another wikirace on live TV</a></li></ul> <ul><li>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-04-25/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-04-25/News and notes">A sigh of relief for open access as Italy makes a slight U-turn on their cultural heritage reproduction law</a></li></ul> <ul><li>WikiConference report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-04-25/WikiConference_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-04-25/WikiConference report">WikiConference North America 2023 in Toronto recap</a></li></ul> <ul><li>WikiProject report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-04-25/WikiProject_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-04-25/WikiProject report">WikiProject Newspapers (Not WP:NOTNEWS)</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Recent research: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-04-25/Recent_research" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-04-25/Recent research">New survey of over 100,000 Wikipedia users</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-04-25/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-04-25/Traffic report">O.J., cricket and a three body problem</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-04-25" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-04-25">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240425114800-The_Signpost:_25_April_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:48, 25 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240425114800-The_Signpost:_25_April_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240425114800-The_Signpost:_25_April_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History"_section?" data-mw-thread-id="h-Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History"-20240424175900"><span id="Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar.2C_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_.22History.22_section.3F"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History"-20240424175900"></span>Ethnic groups in Gibraltar, are historical facts relevant outside the "History" section?<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History"-20240424175900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Imalbornoz-20240424175900-Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History""></span>Hello! I don't know if we have exchanged any comments before, but if it is the first time, let me say it's a pleasure to meet you. </p><p>You have left a warning in may talk page about edit warring and the <a href="/wiki/3RR" class="mw-disambig" title="3RR">3RR</a>. Please let me explain the situation: I have added information to the Demographics section of the article, and my edit has been reverted, it has not been the other way around. I understood that the 3RR mainly applies to users who reverted editions, not to the ones who add information and ask reverters to discuss in the talk page (which I have). </p><p>The two users that have repeatedly reverted the edit are Wee Curry Monster (two times) and Kahastok (two times). This is not the first time that they have coordinated to revert edits. I hope you understand now that it would only be fair to post a warning in their talk pages before (or at least at the same time) that you have posted in mine. Would you please do that, or for the sake of consistency remove your warning from mine? </p><p>Regarding the specific information in the edit, you have reverted it saying "That was then, this is now - the section is about Gibraltar today". The fact is that there is a sentence in the introduction to the Gibraltar ethnic groups that explains their diversity "now" (as you say in your comment) as the product of history over 300 hundred years ("then" as you might say). It explains one source of diversity: "migration". I have only added the other source of diversity accepted in a wide multitude of reliable sources (the flight of the native population at the start of those 300 years). </p><p>You also say "Try History of Gibraltar". Many sections outside of "History of Gibraltar" include historical facts as an explanation or context of the current situation. That is only logical, I hope you agree with me. I don't think you want to delete the "then" in all of them. </p><p>That is why I have added the information. It is relevant, and it is consistent with other sections of the article. </p><p>If you have any comment, I will be glad to read you. Best regards! -- <a href="/w/index.php?title=User:Imalbornoz&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:Imalbornoz (page does not exist)">Imalbornoz</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Imalbornoz" title="User talk:Imalbornoz">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Imalbornoz-20240424175900-Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History"" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:59, 24 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Imalbornoz-20240424175900-Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History""></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Imalbornoz-20240424175900-Ethnic_groups_in_Gibraltar,_are_historical_facts_relevant_outside_the_"History""></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240424190100-Imalbornoz-20240424175900"></span>The caution is about edit warring, not 3RR (as it says clearly).</dd> <dd>The section in the article is about the 21st century demographics, not the 18th or the 11th. Two, now three, editors have told you that the content you want to add is undue for <i>this</i> article. However it would be entirely due in the History article. If you persist, well you know the rest.--<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240424190100-Imalbornoz-20240424175900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:01, 24 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240424190100-Imalbornoz-20240424175900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240424190100-Imalbornoz-20240424175900"></span></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Imalbornoz-20240425143000-JMF-20240424190100"></span>I agree almost totally with you: most of the section in the article is about the present situation in the 21st century (like % of ethnic groups nowadays, etc.), but a small part of the section gives a brief historical explanation (like in many other "present day" sections). I know what the section is about because I was the one who created it in 2009<a class="external autonumber" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Gibraltar&diff=next&oldid=331808376#Ethnic_origins">[2]</a> and have included much of the data about present ("today") Gibraltarian demography and ethnic groups (as well as other data in the Economy, Culture, Politics, lede and -yes- History sections).</dd> <dd>If you look at the diff, you will see that this explanation, including the flight of the native population and the diverse origins in the last 300 years was there in the subsection in 2009. For 15 years many users have edited and added (and removed) information to the section, and no one thought it was redundant. And this, mind you, in an article that touches very sensitive points for British and Spanish nationalisms. I would say that passing the 15 years test is proof of consensus (and a sensistive one, I would add). That is, until Wee Curry Monster, who has been previously topic banned for being aggresive and edit warring about Gibraltar (and specifically for trying to aliminate references about the flight of the native population after the capture, specifically in the History section) decided it was redundant.</dd> <dd>Please don't delete sensitive information that has endured a 15 year consensus in an article this complicated. Thank you. --<a href="/w/index.php?title=User:Imalbornoz&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:Imalbornoz (page does not exist)">Imalbornoz</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Imalbornoz" title="User talk:Imalbornoz">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Imalbornoz-20240425143000-JMF-20240424190100" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">14:30, 25 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Imalbornoz-20240425143000-JMF-20240424190100"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Imalbornoz-20240425143000-JMF-20240424190100"></span></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Imalbornoz-20240425143400-JMF-20240424190100"></span>I will add the information. And if you want, we can talk about it in the article talk page. Thank you again for your time and understanding.--<a href="/w/index.php?title=User:Imalbornoz&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:Imalbornoz (page does not exist)">Imalbornoz</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Imalbornoz" title="User talk:Imalbornoz">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Imalbornoz-20240425143400-JMF-20240424190100" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">14:34, 25 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Imalbornoz-20240425143400-JMF-20240424190100"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Imalbornoz-20240425143400-JMF-20240424190100"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Robert_Hooke" data-mw-thread-id="h-Robert_Hooke-20240424204300"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Robert_Hooke-20240424204300"></span>Robert Hooke<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Robert_Hooke-20240424204300"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div style="clear:both;" class=""></div><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900-Robert_Hooke"></span><link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1237879475"><table class="plainlinks tmbox tmbox-style" role="presentation"><tbody><tr><td class="mbox-image"><span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:Writing_Magnifying.PNG" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/Writing_Magnifying.PNG/70px-Writing_Magnifying.PNG" decoding="async" width="70" height="70" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/Writing_Magnifying.PNG/105px-Writing_Magnifying.PNG 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e2/Writing_Magnifying.PNG 2x" data-file-width="140" data-file-height="140"/></a></span></td><td class="mbox-text">Hello, JMF. This is a courtesy notice that the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Basic_copyediting" title="Wikipedia:Basic copyediting">copy edit</a> you requested for <b><a href="/wiki/Robert_Hooke" title="Robert Hooke">Robert Hooke</a></b> at the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Guild_of_Copy_Editors/Requests" title="Wikipedia:WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors/Requests">Guild of Copy Editors requests page</a> is now complete. All <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Guild_of_Copy_Editors/Requests" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors/Requests">feedback welcome</a>! Cheers, <b><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baffle_gab1978" title="User talk:Baffle gab1978"><span style="color:#191960">Baffle☿<i>gab</i></span></a></b> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900-Robert_Hooke" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:19, 27 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900-Robert_Hooke"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900-Robert_Hooke"></span></td></tr></tbody></table> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20240424204300-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900"></span>Thank you, all good so far (apart from spitting teeth that I missed that prolix <link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">Hooke approximated experimental confirmation that <a href="/wiki/Gravity" title="Gravity">gravity</a> heeds an <a href="/wiki/Inverse_square_law" class="mw-redirect" title="Inverse square law">inverse square law</a></q> when I did the heavy copyedit and re-sourcing. (It now reads <link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1248585704"><q class="inline-quote-talk">Hooke inferred that gravity obeys an <a href="/wiki/Inverse_square_law" class="mw-redirect" title="Inverse square law">inverse square law</a></q></dd> <dd>Just one thing though: were you not aware of <a href="/wiki/Template:Snd" class="mw-redirect" title="Template:Snd">template:snd</a>? It does the same thing as, and is a lot easier to use (and read in the edit page), than your raw html <code class="mw-highlight mw-highlight-lang-text mw-content-ltr" style="" dir="ltr">&nbsp;–&#32;</code> syntax, IMO. <dl><dd>No worries, thanks for fixing that sentence, it didn't make sense to me – how does one "approximate confirmation"? Yes, I'm aware of <span class="nowrap">{{</span><a href="/wiki/Template:Snd" class="mw-redirect" title="Template:Snd">snd</a><span class="nowrap">}}</span> but I try to avoid using templates for punctuation in article text so I subst-in dashes, except in citation templates where it doesn't work. I'm using {{subst:spd}}, which gives the actual en-dash rather than the html code, but I can use <span class="nowrap">{{</span><a href="/wiki/Template:Snd" class="mw-redirect" title="Template:Snd">snd</a><span class="nowrap">}}</span> if you prefer. Cheers, <b><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baffle_gab1978" title="User talk:Baffle gab1978"><span style="color:#191960">Baffle☿<i>gab</i></span></a></b> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Baffle_gab1978-20240424204300-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:43, 24 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20240424204300-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baffle_gab1978-20240424204300-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900"></span></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240424230900-Baffle_gab1978-20240424204300"></span>It didn't make sense full stop. Please feel free to use your regular tool-set. I can easily do a find/replace scan afterwards. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240424230900-Baffle_gab1978-20240424204300" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:09, 24 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240424230900-Baffle_gab1978-20240424204300"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240424230900-Baffle_gab1978-20240424204300"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <p><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240427154600-Robert_Hooke"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Baffle_gab1978" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Baffle gab1978">Baffle gab1978</a>:</span> I assume you have finished unless you want to review my changes to your changes? <abbr title="Smiling face" style="border-bottom: none;"><span typeof="mw:File"><span><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Face-smile.svg/18px-Face-smile.svg.png" decoding="async" width="18" height="18" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Face-smile.svg/27px-Face-smile.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Face-smile.svg/36px-Face-smile.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="48" data-file-height="48"/></span></span></abbr>. Thank you for your thorough copy edit. While waiting in the queue, I did a <a href="/wiki/Flesch%E2%80%93Kincaid_readability_tests" title="Flesch–Kincaid readability tests">Flesch–Kincaid readability analysis</a> using the tool in Microsoft Word and found the result depressing. I convinced myself that it must be the scientific terms but your work dispelled that notion. Thank you again. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240427154600-Robert_Hooke" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:46, 27 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240427154600-Robert_Hooke"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240427154600-Robert_Hooke"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900-JMF-20240427154600"></span>Hi JMF, yes I've finished now... I was tired yesterday and forgot to close the request. I'm glad my c/e has made the article more readable; some subjects can be a little dry but Hooke sounds like an interesting character to write about and I enjoyed doing the c/e. I see you've dealt with the tags I added so there's no need to inform you of them. :) Good luck with the article and cheers, <b><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baffle_gab1978" title="User talk:Baffle gab1978"><span style="color:#191960">Baffle☿<i>gab</i></span></a></b> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900-JMF-20240427154600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:19, 27 April 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900-JMF-20240427154600"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baffle_gab1978-20240427231900-JMF-20240427154600"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="ASCII_on_36-bit_machines" data-mw-thread-id="h-ASCII_on_36-bit_machines-20240511193200"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-ASCII_on_36-bit_machines-20240511193200"></span>ASCII on 36-bit machines<span data-mw-comment-end="h-ASCII_on_36-bit_machines-20240511193200"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Guy_Harris-20240511193200-ASCII_on_36-bit_machines"></span>The <a href="/wiki/Multics" title="Multics">Multics</a> operating system ran on 36-bit machines (<a href="/wiki/GE_645" title="GE 645">GE 645</a>, <a href="/wiki/Honeywell_6000_series" title="Honeywell 6000 series">Honeywell 6180</a>, etc.) and stored ASCII text as 4 9-bit bytes per word, rather than as 5 7-bit bytes per word as in <a href="/wiki/TOPS-10" title="TOPS-10">TOPS-10</a> (<a href="/wiki/PDP-6" title="PDP-6">PDP-6</a>, <a href="/wiki/PDP-10" title="PDP-10">PDP-10</a>). (Both lines of machines has special mechanisms for addressing bytes, and neither had a single fixed byte size.) </p><p>But this doesn't make ASCII a 9-bit code, any more than storing ASCII text in 8-bit bytes makes ASCII an 8-bit code. <a href="/wiki/User:Guy_Harris" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Guy Harris">Guy Harris</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Guy_Harris" title="User talk:Guy Harris">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Guy_Harris-20240511193200-ASCII_on_36-bit_machines" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:32, 11 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Guy_Harris-20240511193200-ASCII_on_36-bit_machines"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Guy_Harris-20240511193200-ASCII_on_36-bit_machines"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240511200500-Guy_Harris-20240511193200"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Guy_Harris" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Guy Harris">Guy Harris</a>:</span> yes, I agree. That is as I have explained in more detail at the new editor's talk page. Note of course that way back then, programmers did anything to save storage. Using only the first 64 codepoints for example gets you six characters per 36bit word. Lowercase? Who needs it? (Xref the Belgian bank at <a href="/wiki/Talk:EBCDIC" title="Talk:EBCDIC">talk:EBCDIC</a> ). Who cares what the vendors say, they <i>want</i> you buy a nonessential upgrade. <abbr title="Smiling face" style="border-bottom: none;"><span typeof="mw:File"><span><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Face-smile.svg/18px-Face-smile.svg.png" decoding="async" width="18" height="18" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Face-smile.svg/27px-Face-smile.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Face-smile.svg/36px-Face-smile.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="48" data-file-height="48"/></span></span></abbr> <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240511200500-Guy_Harris-20240511193200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:05, 11 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240511200500-Guy_Harris-20240511193200"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240511200500-Guy_Harris-20240511193200"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Guy_Harris-20240511210100-JMF-20240511200500"></span>Yes, the GE/Honeywell 64-bit machines also supported 6-bit bytes. A 6-bit character set was defined; see page A-8 of <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://bitsavers.org/pdf/ge/GE-6xx/CPB-371A_GE-635_System_Man_196407.pdf">the GE-635 System Manual</a>. That manual seems to indicate that the hardware only supported 6-bit characters with the "sequence character" Indirect then Tally address modifier; <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://bitsavers.org/pdf/ge/GE-645/LSB0468_GE-645_System_Manual_Jan1968.pdf">the GE-645 System Manual</a> indicates that both 6-bit and 9-bit characters were supported, so perhaps that was added to the 645 for Multics. (I seem to remember that the Multics PL/I compiler and library didn't use that for character manipulation, although with the Honeywell 6180, they used the Extended Instruction Set, which I think also supported both 6-bit and 9-bit characters.)</dd> <dd>I'm not sure what the Belgian bank meant by "It is for this reason that all our customer names are stored in capital letters" - perhaps very early EBCDIC didn't have lower-case letters, leaving those code points as unassigned, and they were added later. EBCDIC was an 8-bit encoding from Day One, as far as I know, and if you use 8-bit bytes to store text but don't use capital letters, you're not saving any space. <a href="/wiki/User:Guy_Harris" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Guy Harris">Guy Harris</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Guy_Harris" title="User talk:Guy Harris">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Guy_Harris-20240511210100-JMF-20240511200500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:01, 11 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Guy_Harris-20240511210100-JMF-20240511200500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Guy_Harris-20240511210100-JMF-20240511200500"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_16_May_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_16_May_2024-20240516105700"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_16_May_2024-20240516105700"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 16 May 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_16_May_2024-20240516105700"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240516105700-The_Signpost:_16_May_2024"></span>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-05-16/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-05-16/News and notes">Democracy in action: multiple elections</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Special report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-05-16/Special_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-05-16/Special report">Will the new RfA reform come to the rescue of administrators?</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Arbitration report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-05-16/Arbitration_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-05-16/Arbitration report">Ruined temples for posterity to ponder over – arbitration from '22 to '24</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-05-16/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-05-16/In the media">Deadnames on the French Wikipedia, and a duel between Russian wikis</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Op-Ed: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-05-16/Op-Ed" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-05-16/Op-Ed">Wikidata to split as sheer volume of information overloads infrastructure</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Comix: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-05-16/Comix" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-05-16/Comix">Generations</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-05-16/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-05-16/Traffic report">Crawl out through the fallout, baby</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-05-16" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-05-16">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240516105700-The_Signpost:_16_May_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:57, 16 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240516105700-The_Signpost:_16_May_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240516105700-The_Signpost:_16_May_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Egyptian_Pound" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Egyptian_Pound-20240523105200"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Egyptian_Pound-20240523105200"></span>The Egyptian Pound<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Egyptian_Pound-20240523105200"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240523105200-The_Egyptian_Pound"></span>JMF, I'm the IP server that was blocked in April while editing at <a href="/wiki/Egyptian_pound" title="Egyptian pound">Egyptian pound</a> and <a href="/wiki/British_currency_in_the_Middle_East" title="British currency in the Middle East">British currency in the Middle East</a> on suspicion of being TheCurrencyGuy. Now that the matter seems to have been resolved, I'm considering returning to where I left off. And if I do I will either continue using the IP address or I will open a new account with a more suitable name. Meanwhile, before I decide whether or not to return to editing these topics, I ought to provide some background. My interest in April began with the issue of why and when the Egyptian piastre split from the Turkish piastre in 1844. Then as regards Arabia and the Middle East in the mid-19th century, the story begins with Turkish piastres circulating in tandem with <a href="/wiki/Maria_Theresa_thaler" title="Maria Theresa thaler">Maria Theresa thalers</a> at 20 piastres each. Indian rupees then started to circulate in the coastal areas and on the east coast of Africa, and then in the twentieth century, pound sterling units started to replace the Indian rupees. I put a lot of well sourced detail into the amendments that I made to these articles. You, meanwhile, based on your belief that I was the blocked editor TheCurrencyGuy, wiped out every single edit that I made, hence restoring these articles to their former inaccurate states. But before I get involved again, I need to be sure that there is no acrimony arising from that episode. If that matter is cleared up, I can then point out to you all the errors that exist in those articles as they now stand, and hopefully, bit by bit we can get the articles restored in a manner that everybody is agreed with. Do you have an interest in these topics?<a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Specialrequestaccount" title="User talk:Specialrequestaccount">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Specialrequestaccount-20240523105200-The_Egyptian_Pound" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:52, 23 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240523105200-The_Egyptian_Pound"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240523105200-The_Egyptian_Pound"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240523110700-Specialrequestaccount-20240523105200"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a>:</span> I'm afraid that you stood on a sleeping dog. I strongly advise that you create an account: see <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Why_create_an_account%3F" title="Wikipedia:Why create an account?">Wikipedia:Why create an account?</a> for the long version but the short version is that it will make editing a lot easier and less likely to lead to misunderstandings. There is no acrimony on my part in your direction: if I let my reserve slip, it was because I had tried very hard to get TCG to work cooperatively because they could have been a very valuable editor had they ever appreciated that nobody is perfect and we can all learn from our colleagues. It was such a waste.</dd> <dd>All your changes are still available from the history of the article and can easily be recovered. May I suggest that you ask the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Teahouse" title="Wikipedia:Teahouse">WP:Teahouse</a> for help to do so, as I'm afraid I don't have time right now. If they decline, please ask me again. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240523110700-Specialrequestaccount-20240523105200" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:07, 23 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240523110700-Specialrequestaccount-20240523105200"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240523110700-Specialrequestaccount-20240523105200"></span></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240523112500-The_Egyptian_Pound"></span>OK, thanks very much for your help. I'll contact <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Teahouse" title="Wikipedia:Teahouse">WP:Teahouse</a>. <a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Specialrequestaccount" title="User talk:Specialrequestaccount">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Specialrequestaccount-20240523112500-The_Egyptian_Pound" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:25, 23 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240523112500-The_Egyptian_Pound"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240523112500-The_Egyptian_Pound"></span> </p> <dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524105600-Specialrequestaccount-20240523112500"></span>I've just been to the tea house, but if you know how to re-revert this single revert <a class="external free" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=British_currency_in_the_Middle_East&diff=prev&oldid=1218650667">https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=British_currency_in_the_Middle_East&diff=prev&oldid=1218650667</a> it would probably save any trouble. The other things will probably just have to lie because I don't have a way of going through all the edits that I did in early April. The one above is the most important because it gets the chronology, the dates, and the exchange rates correct. I'd be grateful if you could help. <a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Specialrequestaccount" title="User talk:Specialrequestaccount">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524105600-Specialrequestaccount-20240523112500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:56, 24 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524105600-Specialrequestaccount-20240523112500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524105600-Specialrequestaccount-20240523112500"></span> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240524125100-Specialrequestaccount-20240524105600"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a>:</span> Do you still need this? or have you already resolved it yourself? --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240524125100-Specialrequestaccount-20240524105600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:51, 24 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240524125100-Specialrequestaccount-20240524105600"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240524125100-Specialrequestaccount-20240524105600"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524161800-The_Egyptian_Pound"></span>I think I know a way of resolving it myself. If I put it back to exactly how it was on 12th April, then you can tell me where I need to put the references in, and I should have them available here.<a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Specialrequestaccount" title="User talk:Specialrequestaccount">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524161800-The_Egyptian_Pound" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:18, 24 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524161800-The_Egyptian_Pound"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524161800-The_Egyptian_Pound"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound-20240524160500"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound-20240524160500"></span>The Main Source for the History of the Egyptian pound<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound-20240524160500"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524160500-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span>JMF, if you can do me a favour and insert this source, then I will be able to see how it is formatted, and I should be able to do the follow up sourcing myself. Meanwhile, I've copied and pasted the abstract from the source here, <a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="https://www.taylorfrancis.com/books/mono/10.4324/9781315253664/handbook-world-exchange-rates-1590%E2%80%931914-markus-denzel">https://www.taylorfrancis.com/books/mono/10.4324/9781315253664/handbook-world-exchange-rates-1590%E2%80%931914-markus-denzel</a> Chapter 32|8 pages Egypt (1869–1914)1 Abstract Sources: The Economist, London (1869-1890); Egyptian Gazette, Alexandria & Cairo (1884, 18931914). Concordance: WdW VIII, pp. 135-167 </p><p>Currency: The basis of the Egyptian currency in the 19th century was the piastre (kurus) of 40 para. After the Turkish-Egyptian treaty of 1840, the piastre of both Turkish and Egyptian strikes should be equal by value, but the piastre of the Egyptian currency was commonly regarded as being of higher value than the Turkish one (see Chapter 13). Therefore 10 Egyptian piastres were equal to 11 Turkish piastres in Alexandria around the mid-19th century, whereas 10 Egyptian piastres were equal to 11.71 (since 1839) and later on to 11.27 Turkish piastres. In 1834 Egypt adopted the bimetallic standard on the basis of the Marie Theresa thaler, the famous Austrian trade coin for the Levant which was called abu taqa in Egypt, as the main coin unit equal to 20 piastre (confirmed by the Coin Act of 1842 and the government tariff of February 15th 1859). The piastre of 1839 contained 1.146 grammes of fine silver, the piastre of 1801 approximately 4.6 grammes of fine silver. The most important Egyptian coins, the bedidlik in gold (= 100 piastres; 7.487 grammes of fine gold) and the rial in silver (20 piastres; 23.294 grammes of fine silver), were minted since 1836/39 in the wake of the currency reform of December 1835, in force from May 1836. In addition, official money rates were fixed for these foreign coins whose circulation was allowed, but all these coins were undervalued, such as the British sovereign with 97½ piastres. This reform brought little improvement, because “foreign coins circulated much above the tariff rate, their value often fluctuating greatly from one part of the country to another” (OWEN [1969], p. 384). To make the quoting of the exchange rates independent of the devaluations of the Egyptian government, during this decade and those that followed the quotation was either done in Marie Theresa thalers or in piastres Egyptian money, as Egyptian money, both the actually minted Egyptian silver coins and the internationally accepted trade coins were understood, each at their daily price. Due to the pressure imposed by the British occupying power, the fall in silver prices from the end of the 1860s and the unsuccessful coin policy of the Egyptian government led to a currency reform in 1885. So bimetallism was superseded by the gold standard. Based on the model of the British sovereign and the Turkish lira, the Egyptian pound or lira (guinée el maes; 7.4375 grammes of fine gold) of 100 piastres became the basic monetary unit. Pieces of 10 piastres, the so-called Parisi, were minted in silver (11.25 grammes of fine silver) and 20 Egyptian piastres were equal to the 5-francs piece (the so-called real franca) or 1 piastre (1 1/8 grammes of fine silver) was equal to ¼ franc. Therefore the Marie Theresa thaler was fixed at 21 piastres and the sovereign at 97½ piastres as was done since 1835 (cf. ISSAWI [ed.] [1966], p. 523). This decree of November 14th 1885 remained in force even after the period documented here: “On the outbreak of the First World War Egypt shifted to a sterling exchange standard, and the link between the Egyptian pound and sterling was maintained until 1947” (ibid., p. 524).<a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Specialrequestaccount" title="User talk:Specialrequestaccount">talk</a>) 16:05, 24 May 2024 (UTC) <a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Specialrequestaccount" title="User talk:Specialrequestaccount">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524160500-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:09, 24 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524160500-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524160500-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240524165800-Specialrequestaccount-20240524160500"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a>:</span> Would you copy/paste this request at <a href="/wiki/Talk:Egyptian_pound" title="Talk:Egyptian pound">talk:Egyptian pound</a> with an open call for help, since it is something that any editor can do. It is unlikely that I will have time to do it anytime soon. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240524165800-Specialrequestaccount-20240524160500" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:58, 24 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240524165800-Specialrequestaccount-20240524160500"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240524165800-Specialrequestaccount-20240524160500"></span></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524221700-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span>JMF, OK, I'll do that. Meanwhile, I think I know a way of reverting the British currency in the Middle East. I'd be most grateful if you could then point out where I need to put the sources. I guarantee that I will have them at hand here.<a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Specialrequestaccount" title="User talk:Specialrequestaccount">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524221700-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:17, 24 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524221700-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524221700-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240524223800-Specialrequestaccount-20240524221700"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a>:</span> As a general principle, any assertion or statement of historical fact needs supporting evidence. In the one section I looked at, I attached multiple <span class="nowrap">{{</span><a href="/wiki/Template:Citation_needed" title="Template:Citation needed">citation needed</a><span class="nowrap">}}</span> tags. I assume that these will provide sufficient examples of what I mean. You could start by resolving those. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240524223800-Specialrequestaccount-20240524221700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:38, 24 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240524223800-Specialrequestaccount-20240524221700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240524223800-Specialrequestaccount-20240524221700"></span></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524230400-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span>It's OK. It's all sorted. The reference/source that I have supplied answers every single one of your citation requests. It's all in the abstract of the source. The source was actually already there before you reverted on 12th April. But meanwhile, I've found a direct link to the abstract, so as you can read the full abstract. Can you help me to add this link to ref number 10 in the article. You'll find it here, if you scroll down to chapter 32 (Egypt) and then click on abstract, <a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="https://www.taylorfrancis.com/books/mono/10.4324/9781315253664/handbook-world-exchange-rates-1590%E2%80%931914-markus-denzel">https://www.taylorfrancis.com/books/mono/10.4324/9781315253664/handbook-world-exchange-rates-1590%E2%80%931914-markus-denzel</a> <a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Specialrequestaccount" title="User talk:Specialrequestaccount">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524230400-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:04, 24 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524230400-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240524230400-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240527154300-Specialrequestaccount-20240524230400"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a>:</span>, can you ask for help at <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Numismatics" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Numismatics">Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Numismatics</a>. I'm not willing to do this without taking time first to understand its significance, which as I said I don't have time to do. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240527154300-Specialrequestaccount-20240524230400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:43, 27 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240527154300-Specialrequestaccount-20240524230400"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240527154300-Specialrequestaccount-20240524230400"></span></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240527163300-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span>It's OK. There is no urgency. Meanwhile, if you read my updated profile, you will understand the inspiration behind it all. <a class="external free" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount</a> <a href="/wiki/User:Specialrequestaccount" title="User:Specialrequestaccount">Specialrequestaccount</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Specialrequestaccount" title="User talk:Specialrequestaccount">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Specialrequestaccount-20240527163300-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:33, 27 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240527163300-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Specialrequestaccount-20240527163300-The_Main_Source_for_the_History_of_the_Egyptian_pound"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation-20240531134100"><span id="The_history_of_the_infamous_E.3Dmc.5E2_equation"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation-20240531134100"></span>The history of the infamous E=mc^2 equation<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation-20240531134100"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-K00la1dx-20240531134100-The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation"></span>If you are so convinced that Einstein was the first to discover E=mc^2... </p><p>Why don't you post in the <a href="/wiki/Samuel_Tolver_Preston" title="Samuel Tolver Preston">Samuel Tolver Preston</a> article that sites this? </p><p>And do not forget to use <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:RS" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:RS">reliable sources</a>. I must have a <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:RS" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:RS">reliable source</a> that mentions Dr. Preston but still insist Einstein as the discoverer of the relationship between mass and energy. <a href="/wiki/User:K00la1dx" title="User:K00la1dx">K00la1dx</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:K00la1dx" title="User talk:K00la1dx">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-K00la1dx-20240531134100-The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:41, 31 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-K00la1dx-20240531134100-The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-K00la1dx-20240531134100-The_history_of_the_infamous_E=mc^2_equation"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240531141900-K00la1dx-20240531134100"></span>Compare and contrast Hooke and Newton on the inverse square law (see <a href="/wiki/Robert_Hooke#Gravitation" title="Robert Hooke">Robert Hooke#Gravitation</a>). Hooke (and others) conjectured it but it was Newton that derived the mathematical proof. You won't find the citation you are looking for because nobody of basic scientific competence has takns the aether theory seriously in over 100 years.]) <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240531141900-K00la1dx-20240531134100" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">14:19, 31 May 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240531141900-K00la1dx-20240531134100"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240531141900-K00la1dx-20240531134100"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-K00la1dx-20240601034900-JMF-20240531141900"></span>Maxwell assumes an ether. We do not write him out as the creator of Maxwells equations just because of it. Take displacement current.</dd> <dd>I am just posting this to let you know I looked into your ether theories section on Wikipedia. Dr. Preston is not mentioned in the article.</dd> <dd>I do not want to debate ether theory. Just want to state that regardless if the ether theory is true or not, Einstein was not the first person to come up with the relationship between mass and energy. In fact, Dr. Preston's ground breaking book "Physics of The Ether" contains descriptions of both Relativity and Special Relativity.</dd> <dd>I just cannot post it on wiki because posting primary sources is "original research" and when I try to post using well researched publications it also gets rejected by editors on wiki that have little understanding of science... <a href="/wiki/User:K00la1dx" title="User:K00la1dx">K00la1dx</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:K00la1dx" title="User talk:K00la1dx">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-K00la1dx-20240601034900-JMF-20240531141900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">03:49, 1 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-K00la1dx-20240601034900-JMF-20240531141900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-K00la1dx-20240601034900-JMF-20240531141900"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240601143200-K00la1dx-20240601034900"></span>No, you cannot post it because it is <i>your</i> assessment of the PSs and is thus a <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:OR" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:OR">WP:OR</a> violation. You would need to find a good number of reliable sources that take your view and it could then be given as a significant alternative viewpoint. Good luck with that, because you won't find them for one obvious reason: if in the past 120 years (but especially in the first half of the 20th century), if there had been <i>any</i> reasonable basis to prefer an Anglo-Saxon Protestant over a German Jew, it would certainly have been done. That it wasn't should tell you that you are wasting your own time as well as that of others.</dd> <dd>This correspondence is now closed. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240601143200-K00la1dx-20240601034900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">14:32, 1 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240601143200-K00la1dx-20240601034900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240601143200-K00la1dx-20240601034900"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_8_June_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_8_June_2024-20240608122600"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_8_June_2024-20240608122600"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 8 June 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_8_June_2024-20240608122600"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240608122600-The_Signpost:_8_June_2024"></span>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/News and notes">Wikimedia Foundation publishes its Form 990 for fiscal year 2022-2023</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Technology report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Technology_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Technology report">New Page Patrol receives a much-needed software upgrade</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Deletion report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Deletion_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Deletion report">The lore of Kalloor</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/In the media">National cable networks get in on the action arguing about what the first sentence of a Wikipedia article ought to say</a></li></ul> <ul><li>News from the WMF: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/News_from_the_WMF" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/News from the WMF">Progress on the plan — how the Wikimedia Foundation advanced on its Annual Plan goals during the first half of fiscal year 2023-2024</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Opinion: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Opinion" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Opinion">Public response to the editors of <i>Settler Colonial Studies</i></a></li></ul> <ul><li>Recent research: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Recent_research" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Recent research">ChatGPT did not kill Wikipedia, but might have reduced its growth</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Featured content: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Featured_content" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Featured content">We didn't start the wiki</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Essay: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Essay" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Essay">No queerphobia</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Special report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Special_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Special report">RetractionBot is back to life!</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Traffic report">Chimps, Eurovision, and the return of the Baby Reindeer</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Comix: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Comix" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Comix">The Wikipediholic Family</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Humour: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Humour" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Humour">Wikipedia rattled by sophisticated cyberattack of schoolboy typing "balls" in infobox</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Concept: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-06-08/Concept" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-06-08/Concept">Palimpsestuous</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-06-08" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-06-08">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240608122600-The_Signpost:_8_June_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:26, 8 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240608122600-The_Signpost:_8_June_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240608122600-The_Signpost:_8_June_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Source_of_edit" data-mw-thread-id="h-Source_of_edit-20240614072700"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Source_of_edit-20240614072700"></span>Source of edit<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Source_of_edit-20240614072700"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-41.62.55.98-20240614072700-Source_of_edit"></span>Hi. I noticed that you reverted one of my edits. The <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hn109b5MZAA&t=51s">video promotion</a> and <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://www.prolintas.com.my/dash/">its website</a> prove its abbreviation/acronym and it is how citizens there refer to it. Can I have my edit restored please?<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/41.62.55.98" title="Special:Contributions/41.62.55.98">41.62.55.98</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:41.62.55.98" title="User talk:41.62.55.98">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-41.62.55.98-20240614072700-Source_of_edit" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">07:27, 14 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-41.62.55.98-20240614072700-Source_of_edit"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-41.62.55.98-20240614072700-Source_of_edit"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240614084900-41.62.55.98-20240614072700"></span>For future reference, please give the name of the article concerned and give a response to the edit summary that gave the reason for the reversion. I should not have had to search out that info and won't do so again. Other editors likely would not. --<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240614084900-41.62.55.98-20240614072700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:49, 14 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240614084900-41.62.55.98-20240614072700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240614084900-41.62.55.98-20240614072700"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-41.62.55.98-20240614085800-JMF-20240614084900"></span>I should have known better. Sorry for disturbing you.<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/41.62.55.98" title="Special:Contributions/41.62.55.98">41.62.55.98</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:41.62.55.98" title="User talk:41.62.55.98">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-41.62.55.98-20240614085800-JMF-20240614084900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:58, 14 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-41.62.55.98-20240614085800-JMF-20240614084900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-41.62.55.98-20240614085800-JMF-20240614084900"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion" data-mw-thread-id="h-Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion-20240615160700"><span id="Regarding_our_.27Hazard_Symbols.27_discussion"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion-20240615160700"></span>Regarding our 'Hazard Symbols' discussion<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion-20240615160700"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span class="template-ping"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-The_Navigators-20240615160700-Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion"></span>@<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">JMF</a>:</span> Realistically, there isn't a lot of traffic on the <a href="/wiki/Talk:Hazard_symbol" title="Talk:Hazard symbol">Talk:Hazard symbol</a> page, so we'll be waiting a while for other editors to weigh in, so I'm going to see if we can get a third opinion via the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Third_opinion" title="Wikipedia:Third opinion">Wikipedia:Third opinion</a> system. I'll put the request in later (like ~9 hours from, around 01:00 16 June UTC, after I get home from work and eat dinner), so you have some time to respond to the reply that I made today, before anyone would look at it. </p><p>It's non-binding, basically another editor just looks at what we've discussed and give feedback when there's a two person stalemate. I don't think either of us are moving from our positions, and I don't have anything further to say that won't turn into a circular argument on the issue, so I'm fine with saying that we've stalemated. </p><p>I'll leave another message here when I've made the request, so you're aware it has been made.-- <a href="/wiki/User:The_Navigators" title="User:The Navigators">The Navigators</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:The_Navigators" title="User talk:The Navigators">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-The_Navigators-20240615160700-Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:07, 15 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-The_Navigators-20240615160700-Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-The_Navigators-20240615160700-Regarding_our_'Hazard_Symbols'_discussion"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-The_Navigators-20240616013700-The_Navigators-20240615160700"></span>I just put in the request in the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Third_opinion" title="Wikipedia:Third opinion">Wikipedia:Third opinion</a> system.-- <a href="/wiki/User:The_Navigators" title="User:The Navigators">The Navigators</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:The_Navigators" title="User talk:The Navigators">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-The_Navigators-20240616013700-The_Navigators-20240615160700" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">01:37, 16 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-The_Navigators-20240616013700-The_Navigators-20240615160700"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-The_Navigators-20240616013700-The_Navigators-20240615160700"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Thanks" data-mw-thread-id="h-Thanks-20240617065900"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Thanks-20240617065900"></span>Thanks<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Thanks-20240617065900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-24.10.15.212-20240617065900-Thanks"></span>Your edit <a class="external free" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ordinal_indicator&oldid=1229353797">https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ordinal_indicator&oldid=1229353797</a> taught me something. Somehow I'd never come across that template before in my 20+ years of editing here. </p><p>Not entirely incidentally, I see above evidence of some difficulties that came from giving less credence to IP editors. I think Wikipedia would be a better place if all editors and most admins could not tell who made each edit, forcing edits to stand on their own merits. So I edit only as an IP as a matter of policy. </p><p>And entirely incidentally, I used to use FIELDATA on a Univac 1106. :-) <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/24.10.15.212" title="Special:Contributions/24.10.15.212">24.10.15.212</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:24.10.15.212&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:24.10.15.212 (page does not exist)">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-24.10.15.212-20240617065900-Thanks" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">06:59, 17 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-24.10.15.212-20240617065900-Thanks"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-24.10.15.212-20240617065900-Thanks"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240617070900-24.10.15.212-20240617065900"></span>The html code is certainly valid but my immediate reaction was "there must be a template for that", as raw html is a bit, well, raw. It was a new one to me too. <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240617070900-24.10.15.212-20240617065900" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">07:09, 17 June 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240617070900-24.10.15.212-20240617065900"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240617070900-24.10.15.212-20240617065900"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_4_July_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_4_July_2024-20240704133900"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_4_July_2024-20240704133900"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 4 July 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_4_July_2024-20240704133900"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240704133900-The_Signpost:_4_July_2024"></span>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/News and notes">WMF board elections and fundraising updates</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Special report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Special_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Special report">Wikimedia Movement Charter ratification vote underway, new Council may surpass power of Board</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In focus: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/In_focus" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/In focus">How the Russian Wikipedia keeps it clean despite having just a couple dozen administrators</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Discussion report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Discussion_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Discussion report">Wikipedians are hung up on the meaning of Madonna</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/In the media">War and information in war and politics</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Sister projects: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Sister_projects" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Sister projects">On editing Wikisource</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Obituary: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Obituary" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Obituary">Hanif Al Husaini, Salazarov, Hyacinth, and PirjanovNurlan</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Opinion: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Opinion" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Opinion">Etika: a Pop Culture Champion</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Gallery: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Gallery" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Gallery">Spokane Willy's photos</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Op-Ed: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Op-Ed" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Op-Ed">Why you should not vote in the 2024 WMF BoT elections</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Crossword: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Crossword" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Crossword">On a day of independence, beat crosswords into crossploughshares</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Humour: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Humour" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Humour">A joke</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Cobwebs: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Cobwebs" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Cobwebs">Counting to a billion — manuscripts don't burn</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Recent research: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Recent_research" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Recent research">Is Wikipedia Politically Biased? Perhaps</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-04/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-04/Traffic report">Talking about you and me, and the games people play</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-07-04" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-07-04">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240704133900-The_Signpost:_4_July_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:39, 4 July 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240704133900-The_Signpost:_4_July_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240704133900-The_Signpost:_4_July_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Suspected_sockpuppetry" data-mw-thread-id="h-Suspected_sockpuppetry-20240719164300"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Suspected_sockpuppetry-20240719164300"></span>Suspected sockpuppetry<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Suspected_sockpuppetry-20240719164300"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-10mmsocket-20240719164300-Suspected_sockpuppetry"></span>FYI I have reported an IP address that you have reverted. It seems clear to me that this user has carried on editing for months after being blocked - <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Wisdom-inc" title="Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Wisdom-inc">Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Wisdom-inc</a> <a href="/wiki/User:10mmsocket" title="User:10mmsocket">10mmsocket</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:10mmsocket" title="User talk:10mmsocket">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-10mmsocket-20240719164300-Suspected_sockpuppetry" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:43, 19 July 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-10mmsocket-20240719164300-Suspected_sockpuppetry"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-10mmsocket-20240719164300-Suspected_sockpuppetry"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_22_July_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_22_July_2024-20240722093100"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_22_July_2024-20240722093100"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 22 July 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_22_July_2024-20240722093100"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240722093100-The_Signpost:_22_July_2024"></span>Discussion report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-22/Discussion_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-22/Discussion report">Internet users flock to Wikipedia to debate its image policy over Trump raised-fist photo</a></li></ul> <ul><li>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-22/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-22/News and notes">Wikimedia community votes to ratify Movement Charter; Wikimedia Foundation opposes ratification</a></li></ul> <ul><li>News from the WMF: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-22/News_from_the_WMF" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-22/News from the WMF">Wikimedia Foundation Board resolution and vote on the proposed Movement Charter</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Essay: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-22/Essay" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-22/Essay">Reflections on editing and obsession</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-22/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-22/In the media">What's on Putin's fork, the court's docket, and in Harrison's book?</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Obituary: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-22/Obituary" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-22/Obituary">JamesR</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Crossword: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-22/Crossword" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-22/Crossword">Vaguely bird-shaped crossword</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Humour: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-07-22/Humour" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-07-22/Humour">Joe Biden withdraws RfA, Donald Trump selects co-nom</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-07-22" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-07-22">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240722093100-The_Signpost:_22_July_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:31, 22 July 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240722093100-The_Signpost:_22_July_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240722093100-The_Signpost:_22_July_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism" data-mw-thread-id="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism-20240730114400"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism-20240730114400"></span>Your <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Good_articles" title="Wikipedia:Good articles">GA</a> nomination of <a href="/wiki/Neoplasticism" title="Neoplasticism">Neoplasticism</a><span data-mw-comment-end="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism-20240730114400"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Rollinginhisgrave-20240730114400-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism"></span>Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've <a href="/wiki/Talk:Neoplasticism/GA1" title="Talk:Neoplasticism/GA1">begun reviewing</a> the article <a href="/wiki/Neoplasticism" title="Neoplasticism">Neoplasticism</a> you nominated for <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:GA" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:GA">GA</a>-status according to the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:WIAGA" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:WIAGA">criteria</a>. <span typeof="mw:File"><span><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6c/Time2wait.svg/20px-Time2wait.svg.png" decoding="async" width="20" height="21" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6c/Time2wait.svg/30px-Time2wait.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6c/Time2wait.svg/40px-Time2wait.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="180" data-file-height="185"/></span></span> This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. <small>Message delivered by <a href="/wiki/User:ChristieBot" title="User:ChristieBot">ChristieBot</a>, on behalf of <a href="/wiki/User:Rollinginhisgrave" title="User:Rollinginhisgrave">Rollinginhisgrave</a></small> -- <a href="/wiki/User:Rollinginhisgrave" title="User:Rollinginhisgrave">Rollinginhisgrave</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rollinginhisgrave" title="User talk:Rollinginhisgrave">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Rollinginhisgrave-20240730114400-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:44, 30 July 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Rollinginhisgrave-20240730114400-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Rollinginhisgrave-20240730114400-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240730185700-Rollinginhisgrave-20240730114400"></span>Thank you. I have notified <a href="/wiki/User:Egrabczewski" title="User:Egrabczewski">user:Egrabczewski</a>, who to be fair has done most of the work to bring the article up to GA standard.--<a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240730185700-Rollinginhisgrave-20240730114400" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:57, 30 July 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240730185700-Rollinginhisgrave-20240730114400"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240730185700-Rollinginhisgrave-20240730114400"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Roade_Bypass." data-mw-thread-id="h-Roade_Bypass.-20240803062600"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Roade_Bypass.-20240803062600"></span>Roade Bypass.<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Roade_Bypass.-20240803062600"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Roads4117-20240803062600-Roade_Bypass."></span>Hello <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">JMF</a>, I hope that you are well.</dd> <dd>I was just wondering if you knew approximately when the Roade Bypass opened; I am currently working on the <a href="/wiki/A508_road#History" title="A508 road">History section</a> of the 'A508 road' page, but I can't find any good/reliable sources. If you don't know, then no worries.</dd> <dd>Kind regards, <a href="/wiki/User:Roads4117" title="User:Roads4117">Roads4117</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Roads4117" title="User talk:Roads4117">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Roads4117-20240803062600-Roade_Bypass." class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">06:26, 3 August 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Roads4117-20240803062600-Roade_Bypass."></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Roads4117-20240803062600-Roade_Bypass."></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JMF-20240803075000-Roads4117-20240803062600"></span>No idea. Roade Parish Council site? <a href="/wiki/User:JMF" title="User:JMF">𝕁𝕄𝔽</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:JMF#top" title="User talk:JMF">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-JMF-20240803075000-Roads4117-20240803062600" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">07:50, 3 August 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JMF-20240803075000-Roads4117-20240803062600"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JMF-20240803075000-Roads4117-20240803062600"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Roads4117-20240803080500-JMF-20240803075000"></span>Ok no worries. I will check that website out now. <a href="/wiki/User:Roads4117" title="User:Roads4117">Roads4117</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Roads4117" title="User talk:Roads4117">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Roads4117-20240803080500-JMF-20240803075000" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:05, 3 August 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Roads4117-20240803080500-JMF-20240803075000"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Roads4117-20240803080500-JMF-20240803075000"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism_2" data-mw-thread-id="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism_2-20240806134300"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism_2-20240806134300"></span>Your <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Good_articles" title="Wikipedia:Good articles">GA</a> nomination of <a href="/wiki/Neoplasticism" title="Neoplasticism">Neoplasticism</a><span data-mw-comment-end="h-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism_2-20240806134300"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Rollinginhisgrave-20240806134300-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism_2"></span>The article <a href="/wiki/Neoplasticism" title="Neoplasticism">Neoplasticism</a> you nominated as a <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Good_article_nominations" title="Wikipedia:Good article nominations">good article</a> has failed <span typeof="mw:File"><span><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7f/Symbol_oppose_vote.svg/20px-Symbol_oppose_vote.svg.png" decoding="async" width="20" height="21" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7f/Symbol_oppose_vote.svg/30px-Symbol_oppose_vote.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7f/Symbol_oppose_vote.svg/40px-Symbol_oppose_vote.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="180" data-file-height="185"/></span></span>; see <a href="/wiki/Talk:Neoplasticism" title="Talk:Neoplasticism">Talk:Neoplasticism</a> for reasons why <a href="/wiki/Talk:Neoplasticism/GA1" title="Talk:Neoplasticism/GA1">the nomination</a> failed. If or when these points have been taken care of, you may apply for a new nomination of the article. <small>Message delivered by <a href="/wiki/User:ChristieBot" title="User:ChristieBot">ChristieBot</a>, on behalf of <a href="/wiki/User:Rollinginhisgrave" title="User:Rollinginhisgrave">Rollinginhisgrave</a></small> -- <a href="/wiki/User:Rollinginhisgrave" title="User:Rollinginhisgrave">Rollinginhisgrave</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rollinginhisgrave" title="User talk:Rollinginhisgrave">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-Rollinginhisgrave-20240806134300-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism_2" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:43, 6 August 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Rollinginhisgrave-20240806134300-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism_2"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Rollinginhisgrave-20240806134300-Your_GA_nomination_of_Neoplasticism_2"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="The_Signpost:_14_August_2024" data-mw-thread-id="h-The_Signpost:_14_August_2024-20240814224800"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-The_Signpost:_14_August_2024-20240814224800"></span><i>The Signpost</i>: 14 August 2024<span data-mw-comment-end="h-The_Signpost:_14_August_2024-20240814224800"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> <ul><li><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240814224800-The_Signpost:_14_August_2024"></span>In the media: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-08-14/In_the_media" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-08-14/In the media">Portland pol profile paid for from public purse</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Recent research: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-08-14/Recent_research" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-08-14/Recent research">STORM: AI agents role-play as "Wikipedia editors" and "experts" to create Wikipedia-like articles, a more sophisticated effort than previous auto-generation systems</a></li></ul> <ul><li>In focus: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-08-14/In_focus" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-08-14/In focus">Twitter marks the spot</a></li></ul> <ul><li>News and notes: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-08-14/News_and_notes" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-08-14/News and notes">Another Wikimania has concluded.</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Special report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-08-14/Special_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-08-14/Special report">Nano or just nothing: Will nano go nuclear?</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Opinion: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-08-14/Opinion" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-08-14/Opinion">HouseBlaster's RfA debriefing</a></li></ul> <ul><li>Traffic report: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-08-14/Traffic_report" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-08-14/Traffic report">Ball games, movies, elections, but nothing really <i>weird</i></a></li></ul> <ul><li>Humour: <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2024-08-14/Humour" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2024-08-14/Humour">I'm proud to be a template</a> </li></ul></div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost">Read this Signpost in full</a></b> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2024-08-14" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Single/2024-08-14">Single-page</a> * <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/Subscribe" title="Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Subscribe">Unsubscribe</a> * <a href="/wiki/User:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User:MediaWiki message delivery">MediaWiki message delivery</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:MediaWiki_message_delivery" title="User talk:MediaWiki message delivery">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240814224800-The_Signpost:_14_August_2024" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:48, 14 August 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240814224800-The_Signpost:_14_August_2024"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-MediaWiki_message_delivery-20240814224800-The_Signpost:_14_August_2024"></span> </div></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Nomination_of_A508_road_for_deletion" data-mw-thread-id="h-Nomination_of_A508_road_for_deletion-20240819092400"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Nomination_of_A508_road_for_deletion-20240819092400"></span>Nomination of <a href="/wiki/A508_road" title="A508 road">A508 road</a> for deletion<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Nomination_of_A508_road_for_deletion-20240819092400"></span></h2><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div class="afd-notice"> <div class="floatleft" style="margin-bottom:0"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-10mmsocket-20240819092400-Nomination_of_A508_road_for_deletion"></span><span typeof="mw:File"><span><img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5f/Ambox_warning_orange.svg/48px-Ambox_warning_orange.svg.png" decoding="async" width="48" height="41" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5f/Ambox_warning_orange.svg/72px-Ambox_warning_orange.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5f/Ambox_warning_orange.svg/96px-Ambox_warning_orange.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="378" data-file-height="326"/></span></span></div>A discussion is taking place as to whether the article <a href="/wiki/A508_road" title="A508 road">A508 road</a> is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:List_of_policies_and_guidelines" title="Wikipedia:List of policies and guidelines">Wikipedia's policies and guidelines</a> or whether it should be <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Deletion_policy" title="Wikipedia:Deletion policy">deleted</a>. <p>The article will be discussed at <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/A508_road" title="Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/A508 road">Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/A508 road</a></b> until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines. </p> Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article until the discussion has finished.</div> <p><a href="/wiki/User:10mmsocket" title="User:10mmsocket">10mmsocket</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:10mmsocket" title="User talk:10mmsocket">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:JMF/Archive_5#c-10mmsocket-20240819092400-Nomination_of_A508_road_for_deletion" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:24, 19 August 2024 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-10mmsocket-20240819092400-Nomination_of_A508_road_for_deletion"></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-10mmsocket-20240819092400-Nomination_of_A508_road_for_deletion"></span></p>    </div><noscript><img src="https://login.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:CentralAutoLogin/start?type=1x1" alt="" width="1" height="1" style="border: none; position: absolute;"></noscript> <div class="printfooter" data-nosnippet="">Retrieved from "<a dir="ltr" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:JMF/Archive_5&oldid=1257981511">https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:JMF/Archive_5&oldid=1257981511</a>"</div></div> <div id="catlinks" class="catlinks catlinks-allhidden" data-mw="interface"></div> </div> </main> </div> <div class="mw-footer-container"> <footer id="footer" class="mw-footer" > <ul id="footer-info"> <li id="footer-info-lastmod"> This page was last edited on 17 November 2024, at 14:35<span class="anonymous-show"> (UTC)</span>.</li> <li id="footer-info-copyright">Text is available under the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Text_of_the_Creative_Commons_Attribution-ShareAlike_4.0_International_License" title="Wikipedia:Text of the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 International License">Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 License</a>; additional terms may apply. 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