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window.googletag = window.googletag || {cmd: []}; googletag.cmd.push(function() { googletag.defineSlot('/53013535/Forum_Leaderboard_970x250_728x90', [[728, 90], [970, 250]], 'div-gpt-ad-1593609283322-0').addService(googletag.pubads()); googletag.pubads().enableSingleRequest(); googletag.enableServices(); }); </script>  <div style="margin: 0 auto; padding-top: 30px; text-align: center; margin: 0 auto; min-width: 728px; max-width: 970px;"> <div id='div-gpt-ad-1593609283322-0'> <script> googletag.cmd.push(function() { googletag.display('div-gpt-ad-1593609283322-0'); }); </script> </div> </div><div class="MessageList Discussion"> <div id="Item_0" class="PageTitle"><div class="Options"></div><h1>Apple Vision Pro 2 with M5 chip likely to arrive before budget models</h1></div> <div id="Discussion_238254" class="Item ItemDiscussion Role_administrator"> <div class="Discussion"> <div class="Item-Header DiscussionHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="AppleInsider" href="/profile/12836/AppleInsider" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/044/n2YP8S2JOU0CV.jpg" alt="AppleInsider" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/12836/AppleInsider" class="Username">AppleInsider</a> </span> </div> <div class="Meta DiscussionMeta"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> Posted: <time title="November 10, 2024 2:29PM" datetime="2024-11-10T14:29:57+00:00">November 10, 2024 2:29PM</time> </span> <br /> <span class="MItem Category"> in <a href="https://forums.appleinsider.com/categories/apple-vision-pro">Apple Vision Pro</a></span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <p>Apple is likely to launch a refreshed <a rel="nofollow" href="https://appleinsider.com/inside/apple-vision-pro?utm_medium=social&utm_source=ai_forums" title="Apple Vision Pro">Apple Vision Pro</a> headset before a cheaper version of the product arrives, according to a new report.<br /><br /></p><div style="margin: auto;"><img src="https://photos5.appleinsider.com/gallery/61695-127629-61627-127367-56131-113946-54808-110934-000-lead-Vision-Pro-demo-xl-xl-xl-xl.jpg" alt="Close-up of futuristic virtual reality headset with a reflective blue-tinted visor and sleek white design on display, surrounded by blurred people in the background." height="720" /><br /><span>An updated Apple Vision Pro could sport an M5 chip and other improvements.</span></div><p><br /><br />Apple is believed to be working on "several ideas" for its overall Apple Vision product line and its <a rel="nofollow" href="https://appleinsider.com/articles/24/09/29/apple-is-considering-multiple-paths-for-future-apple-vision-pro-hardware?utm_medium=social&utm_source=ai_forums">future intentions</a>. Currently, it is expected that an updated Apple Vision Pro will be the first, ahead of a rumored cheaper "Apple Vision" headset.<br /><br />The next Apple Vision Pro would likely sport <a rel="nofollow" href="https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2024-11-10/apple-s-expansion-plan-glasses-home-devices-mixed-reality-headsets-airpods-m3bncxeo">an M5 processor</a> and other internal changes, but would otherwise be very similar to the existing model. It's expected to arrive in late 2025, <a rel="nofollow" href="https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2024-11-10/apple-s-expansion-plan-glasses-home-devices-mixed-reality-headsets-airpods-m3bncxeo">reports</a> <em>Bloomberg</em>, or the spring of 2026.<br /><br />For those hoping for a less-expensive version, supply chain analyst <a rel="nofollow" href="https://appleinsider.com/inside/ming-chi-kuo?utm_medium=social&utm_source=ai_forums" title="Ming-Chi Kuo">Ming-Chi Kuo</a> believes that such a device has been <a rel="nofollow" href="https://appleinsider.com/articles/24/11/03/apple-vision-pro-to-get-m5-in-2025-but-lower-cost-model-is-delayed?utm_medium=social&utm_source=ai_forums">pushed back</a> to at least 2027. Kuo reasoned that simply making a cheaper model wouldn't significantly change sales expectations.<br /><br />Apple is also said to be investigating the <a rel="nofollow" href="https://appleinsider.com/articles/24/10/13/apple-smart-glasses-airpods-with-cameras-could-finally-arrive-in-2027?utm_medium=social&utm_source=ai_forums">"smart glasses" concept</a> as seen from Meta, which has already been shown off in demonstrations. <br /><br />Apple hopes to increase interest in the Apple Vision Pro by releasing a <a rel="nofollow" href="https://appleinsider.com/articles/24/11/03/apple-vision-pro-to-get-m5-in-2025-but-lower-cost-model-is-delayed?utm_medium=social&utm_source=ai_forums">second-gen headset</a> with the upgraded processor and other improvements right at the start of the M5 chip cycle. It is thought that this second-gen version would be an upgrade to the existing design, but an all-new version is forecast for some time beyond 2027. <br /><br /> <strong>Rumor Score:</strong> Possible <br /><br /> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://appleinsider.com/articles/24/11/10/apple-vision-pro-2-with-m5-chip-likely-to-arrive-before-budget-models?utm_medium=social&utm_source=ai_forums">Read on AppleInsider</a></p> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> <a id="first-reply" name="first-reply"></a></div><div class="CommentsWrap"><span class="BeforeCommentHeading"><span id="PagerBefore" class="Pager NumberedPager"><span class="Previous">«</span><a href="https://forums.appleinsider.com/discussion/238254/apple-vision-pro-2-with-m5-chip-likely-to-arrive-before-budget-models" class="Highlight p-1 FirstPage">1</a><a href="https://forums.appleinsider.com/discussion/238254/apple-vision-pro-2-with-m5-chip-likely-to-arrive-before-budget-models/p2" class=" p-2 LastPage" rel="next">2</a><a href="https://forums.appleinsider.com/discussion/238254/apple-vision-pro-2-with-m5-chip-likely-to-arrive-before-budget-models/p2" class="Next" rel="next">»</a></span></span><div class="DataBox DataBox-Comments"><h2 class="CommentHeading">Comments</h2> <ul class="MessageList DataList Comments"> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462499"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 1 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="charlesn" href="/profile/199217/charlesn" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=145723c347f2b8d872f8791d759a0cdd&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F145723c347f2b8d872f8791d759a0cdd.png" alt="charlesn" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/199217/charlesn" class="Username">charlesn</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>1,155</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462499/#Comment_3462499" class="Permalink" name="Item_1" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 10, 2024 3:23PM" datetime="2024-11-10T15:23:03+00:00">November 10, 2024 3:23PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> Sure, upgrade the hardware and fix the inevitable hardware issues from v1.0, but I don't believe this will significantly expand the Vision Pro buyer pool. In fact, with the first year surge of sales from early adopters and developers now behind it, what AVP really needs in 2025 is a larger number of compelling use cases for its unique set of capabilities. Based on Mark Gurman's reporting, it seems that Apple may be in a conundrum in that regard: it's very expensive to develop for VisionOS and the buyer pool for software remains very small, which is a very poor combination for attracting developers to the platform. (My answer to that for Apple is pretty simple: you're sitting on a mountain of cash, so make it worth their while to develop for VisionOS in the early going. Development is key to its long-term future.) <br /><br />My own experience with AVP: I went in for the demo at my Apple Store, and there's no question its capabilities seem like magic and are extraordinarily impressive. In fact, if you haven't done a demo, you really should. But then the question: would I buy this, even if it were priced much lower? No, because I simply don't see a need for it amidst my current iMac/Macbook/iPad hardware. I don't have a compelling use case for it. It may well be that AVP finds much greater success as an enterprise device rather than with average consumers--we shall see. But I remain very excited that Apple brought AVP to market and has the patience and cash necessary to sustain it through these early years. As far as a mass market headset for media consumption, I'm happy to let Meta have that so-called "business" and continue to rack up $1.5 billion in losses every single month selling hardware at a loss with no end in sight. <br /><br />Interestingly, after I posted the above 2 paragraphs, I received this week's Power On newsletter from Mark Gurman, which featured this headline: <b>The Vision Pro's First Killer App Has Arrived. </b><b></b>This is an unexpected declaration from Mark who has been more than a little critical of AVP. His article continued: <br /><strong><br />"</strong>Apple markets the Vision Pro as a standalone device (complete with powerful chips and a $3,500 price tag), but <a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="https://links.message.bloomberg.com/a/click?_t=f574328d4d0c4c359b90d8e49b10e21d&_m=2a265d41040c46fa92c234dfc6c083fb&_e=W05Hh7pqc41DQiLABa8S_glC3weSyEnVww6IakXwYOt11IQ3NHB9FKpTzme24v2SN_TQpkj3rwcrWxj_yI5TNBE9kzxkJcZgLf5J5525i581aegXaDf8M7TZvnih40cUn01aIc8GN_7Ur-9qBcbPFVT3R8_cJC9AaVbqysxZTryPjdABkOxparj5ZU6M3-UYIgOXRuq7On5aiX-Q4IxlkIfGECcpcdI34aEKuZwp_tbJLgq8mNIbFNmhsyO8zPVmj31Pf4qVFFB6gdjIW-mp5jP1bXkM27IktUgL49m66UzIqvkdbMt4OpWNP-k_Czr2hKVAe_8LbQ3y1LVjuk6uRr4SFXjHiRL9v_YhchYSUEPpUAzAiLHrtUlWdqJTDF25Uy-VeJaVCWIIqpkjRHf_TaEqKJRLvpgMjtkgX7WBrs4_7Zd1Y4FzpeXFCBgqmug3USZOBdcsIgyO-XtIppfp3fz5JPKj2av0IFSqZGNGf2OXcfnAYyqbuNnteE1HseHP" title="Link: https://links.message.bloomberg.com/a/click?_t=f574328d4d0c4c359b90d8e49b10e21d&_m=2a265d41040c46fa92c234dfc6c083fb&_e=W05Hh7pqc41DQiLABa8S_glC3weSyEnVww6IakXwYOt11IQ3NHB9FKpTzme24v2SN_TQpkj3rwcrWxj_yI5TNBE9kzxkJcZgLf5J5525i581aegXaDf8M7TZvnih40cUn01aIc8GN_7Ur-9qBcbPFVT3R8_cJC9AaVbqysxZTryPjdABkOxparj5ZU6M3-UYIgOXRuq7On5aiX-Q4IxlkIfGECcpcdI34aEKuZwp_tbJLgq8mNIbFNmhsyO8zPVmj31Pf4qVFFB6gdjIW-mp5jP1bXkM27IktUgL49m66UzIqvkdbMt4OpWNP-k_Czr2hKVAe_8LbQ3y1LVjuk6uRr4SFXjHiRL9v_YhchYSUEPpUAzAiLHrtUlWdqJTDF25Uy-VeJaVCWIIqpkjRHf_TaEqKJRLvpgMjtkgX7WBrs4_7Zd1Y4FzpeXFCBgqmug3USZOBdcsIgyO-XtIppfp3fz5JPKj2av0IFSqZGNGf2OXcfnAYyqbuNnteE1HseHP">one of its best features</a> is the ability to serve as a Mac external monitor. In June, Apple announced plans to <a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="https://links.message.bloomberg.com/a/click?_t=f574328d4d0c4c359b90d8e49b10e21d&_m=2a265d41040c46fa92c234dfc6c083fb&_e=W05Hh7pqc41DQiLABa8S_glC3weSyEnVww6IakXwYOt11IQ3NHB9FKpTzme24v2SJXgIcQqv2s6lx2DjfQnOFT8Awh1m6MhV2ujm2ZdErXF-AH0dnTILKiciZvIgkHSekRr4xGFUTFCuFAKmio_Ujw1_FdOQO-UgunzDpQKfr1_0EFAOKVngok6IAgATJaQB1levm6MJ4EF8mgIZfxExodLkIwPjBNUFEC3hV9D8ET7v6BC8nOsVMX98w0P6mAYcXYWycbu66ylTeQNMho7JkjNy9LtrY6iogWLK41uIK-7ubYu6y1gbLFecd1bTgMW1PjvYL2gaoLM6z5NoFZsif3MjwpErLpzFQKCNyR7-LyZqZNlZfuNSzHDZEl69LsYj5N7heR1LGjSBQTbG62aZNvrlwRDjfV_c6OqNuXNI4jatYX8Cv2umP4X343wDTjbD1-VUcQEIa0sUSERbKqz6RCTDqJWfb87y8dY7dVTEfYH-RwPO-NhCl18uFptYj6cK" title="Link: https://links.message.bloomberg.com/a/click?_t=f574328d4d0c4c359b90d8e49b10e21d&_m=2a265d41040c46fa92c234dfc6c083fb&_e=W05Hh7pqc41DQiLABa8S_glC3weSyEnVww6IakXwYOt11IQ3NHB9FKpTzme24v2SJXgIcQqv2s6lx2DjfQnOFT8Awh1m6MhV2ujm2ZdErXF-AH0dnTILKiciZvIgkHSekRr4xGFUTFCuFAKmio_Ujw1_FdOQO-UgunzDpQKfr1_0EFAOKVngok6IAgATJaQB1levm6MJ4EF8mgIZfxExodLkIwPjBNUFEC3hV9D8ET7v6BC8nOsVMX98w0P6mAYcXYWycbu66ylTeQNMho7JkjNy9LtrY6iogWLK41uIK-7ubYu6y1gbLFecd1bTgMW1PjvYL2gaoLM6z5NoFZsif3MjwpErLpzFQKCNyR7-LyZqZNlZfuNSzHDZEl69LsYj5N7heR1LGjSBQTbG62aZNvrlwRDjfV_c6OqNuXNI4jatYX8Cv2umP4X343wDTjbD1-VUcQEIa0sUSERbKqz6RCTDqJWfb87y8dY7dVTEfYH-RwPO-NhCl18uFptYj6cK">make that feature even better</a>, bringing a virtual curved monitor mode to the default size, as well as offering new wide and ultrawide monitor options.<p>The company released a beta version of these capabilities this past week, and they are a game changer. In my view, the features represent the first true killer app for the Vision Pro. They provide a high-resolution Mac external monitor with what feels like an infinite amount of screen real estate. Before these new modes arrived, I was only using my Vision Pro occasionally to watch movies. Now, I’m back to at least trying to use it every workday.</p><p>Apple should be marketing the new ultrawide display modes in a major way. It’s that good."</p> </div> <span class="CommentLastUpdated"> <span title="Edited November 10, 2024 4:34PM by charlesn." class="DateUpdated">edited November 10</span> </span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="191247" title="jas99 - Like on November 11, 2024."><a title="jas99" href="/profile/191247/jas99" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/590/nPQFSPEZN2LPT.png" alt="jas99" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462504"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 2 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="sroussey2" href="/profile/256429/sroussey2" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=57e0f363d82b32e38808ab5fe67a6f14&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F57e0f363d82b32e38808ab5fe67a6f14.png" alt="sroussey2" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/256429/sroussey2" class="Username">sroussey2</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>1</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462504/#Comment_3462504" class="Permalink" name="Item_2" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 10, 2024 4:27PM" datetime="2024-11-10T16:27:27+00:00">November 10, 2024 4:27PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> I just did the demo this last week. It felt like the hardware was “almost there”. I’ll skip v1 and wait for v2, thanks. </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="75019" title="williamlondon - Like on November 10, 2024."><a title="williamlondon" href="/profile/75019/williamlondon" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/288/nESO713YRQGQ0.jpg" alt="williamlondon" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="38720" title="rezwits - Like on November 10, 2024."><a title="rezwits" href="/profile/38720/rezwits" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/328/nF153AIERX9AJ.png" alt="rezwits" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><li><script async src="https://securepubads.g.doubleclick.net/tag/js/gpt.js"></script> <script> window.googletag = window.googletag || {cmd: []}; googletag.cmd.push(function() { googletag.defineSlot('/53013535/Forum_Desktop_Second_Leaderboard_728x90', [728, 90], 'div-gpt-ad-1593613199876-0').addService(googletag.pubads()); googletag.pubads().enableSingleRequest(); googletag.enableServices(); }); </script> <div style="text-align: center; margin: 0 auto; min-width:728px;">  <div style="margin: 0 auto; text-align: center; margin-bottom: 20px;"> <div id='div-gpt-ad-1593613199876-0' style='width: 728px; height: 90px; margin: 0 auto; text-align: center;'> <script> googletag.cmd.push(function() { googletag.display('div-gpt-ad-1593613199876-0'); }); </script> </div> </div> </div></li> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462508"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 3 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="lotones" href="/profile/182681/lotones" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/733/n1QCIU3OD47SL.jpg" alt="lotones" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/182681/lotones" class="Username">lotones</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>107</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462508/#Comment_3462508" class="Permalink" name="Item_3" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 10, 2024 6:49PM" datetime="2024-11-10T18:49:51+00:00">November 10, 2024 6:49PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> When AVP2 come out, AVP1 will be the "budget model". </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="38720" title="rezwits - Like on November 10, 2024."><a title="rezwits" href="/profile/38720/rezwits" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/328/nF153AIERX9AJ.png" alt="rezwits" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="192414" title="danox - Like on November 11, 2024."><a title="danox" href="/profile/192414/danox" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=fd166bfa04443fb1122c5153ad304513&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ffd166bfa04443fb1122c5153ad304513.png" alt="danox" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462510"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 4 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="charlesn" href="/profile/199217/charlesn" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=145723c347f2b8d872f8791d759a0cdd&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F145723c347f2b8d872f8791d759a0cdd.png" alt="charlesn" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/199217/charlesn" class="Username">charlesn</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>1,155</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462510/#Comment_3462510" class="Permalink" name="Item_4" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 10, 2024 7:24PM" datetime="2024-11-10T19:24:30+00:00">November 10, 2024 7:24PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/256429/sroussey2">sroussey2</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText">I just did the demo this last week. It felt like the hardware was “almost there”. I’ll skip v1 and wait for v2, thanks.</div> </blockquote> Assuming the hardware was "there" for you, what's your use case for AVP? Not suggesting you don't have one, just curious.  </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462511"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 5 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="user1" href="/profile/252365/user1" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=fde7ede28d1fac8a414fbd4649cdaa1a&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ffde7ede28d1fac8a414fbd4649cdaa1a.png" alt="user1" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/252365/user1" class="Username">user1</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>6</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462511/#Comment_3462511" class="Permalink" name="Item_5" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 10, 2024 8:24PM" datetime="2024-11-10T20:24:43+00:00">November 10, 2024 8:24PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <div>In a moment of impulsivity, I purchased the Apple Vision Pro (AVP) for my upcoming extended travel plans. To my surprise, it has proven to be an invaluable travel companion and an important part of my life now.</div><div><br /></div><div>Over the past three and a half weeks of usage, I have identified several key advantages of the AVP:</div><div><br /></div><div>1. **Enhanced Mental Well-being and Productivity:** When faced with challenging situations, I can effortlessly disconnect from the world by pairing my AirPods Pro and Vision Pro device. Initially apprehensive about this feature, I have discovered that it significantly improves my mental well-being and boosts my productivity.</div><div>2. **Contributing to Society Despite Disabilities:** I reside with severe disabilities that sometimes restrict my mobility to my bed. The Vision Pro has not only enhanced my productivity but has also provided me with a means to contribute to society, which I previously believed was beyond my reach. If you live with chronic pain, weakness, or functional limitations, I highly recommend this device.</div><div>3. **Immersive Entertainment and Gaming:** The AVP has revolutionized my entertainment experience, particularly with 3D movies, immersive environments, and fully immersive video and gaming.</div><div>4. **Enhanced Productivity with Magic Keyboard Integration:** Pairing the AVP with a Magic Keyboard significantly enhances productivity. The new Mac virtual display immerses websites, elevating the shopping experience.</div><div><br /></div><div>In the future, I envision Apple enhancing the device’s capabilities and providing compelling reasons to maintain its use. Some notable areas for improvement include:</div><div><br /></div><div>1. **Expanding Device Functionality:** The AVP currently lacks essential features such as phone calls and Apple Intelligence. Developers should explore innovative technologies and push the boundaries of what the device can achieve. User/developer feedback is crucial in driving these advancements.</div><div>2. **Integration with VisionOS:** I urge Apple to integrate VisionOS with other Apple products, such as HomePods and WatchOS. This integration would enhance the overall user experience and enable seamless connectivity.</div><div><br /></div><div>I encourage you to embrace the potential of this emerging technology. The current developers have effectively enticed users through free trials, and I am willing to invest in meaningful experiences on VisionOS.</div><div><br /></div><div>Thank you for taking the time to read my feedback.</div> </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="26280" title="stompy - Like on November 10, 2024."><a title="stompy" href="/profile/26280/stompy" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=ac3ee99178cf1de2d50f5e39496989ff&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Fac3ee99178cf1de2d50f5e39496989ff.png" alt="stompy" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="170717" title="foregoneconclusion - Informative on November 11, 2024."><a title="foregoneconclusion" href="/profile/170717/foregoneconclusion" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=1d4ee24bdbadbbe0cf3cdde364c98ef5&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F1d4ee24bdbadbbe0cf3cdde364c98ef5.png" alt="foregoneconclusion" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-4 ReactInfo"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="192414" title="danox - Like on November 11, 2024."><a title="danox" href="/profile/192414/danox" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=fd166bfa04443fb1122c5153ad304513&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ffd166bfa04443fb1122c5153ad304513.png" alt="danox" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="191247" title="jas99 - Like on November 11, 2024."><a title="jas99" href="/profile/191247/jas99" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/590/nPQFSPEZN2LPT.png" alt="jas99" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="216002" title="mattinoz - Informative on November 12, 2024."><a title="mattinoz" href="/profile/216002/mattinoz" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=65a08e0a51c0cfcd3fdf7750e0dd41e1&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F65a08e0a51c0cfcd3fdf7750e0dd41e1.png" alt="mattinoz" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-4 ReactInfo"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="204915" title="chasm - Like on November 13, 2024."><a title="chasm" href="/profile/204915/chasm" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=549b7768b550b2781efd453bc3679b38&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F549b7768b550b2781efd453bc3679b38.png" alt="chasm" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462512"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 6 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="user1" href="/profile/252365/user1" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=fde7ede28d1fac8a414fbd4649cdaa1a&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ffde7ede28d1fac8a414fbd4649cdaa1a.png" alt="user1" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/252365/user1" class="Username">user1</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>6</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462512/#Comment_3462512" class="Permalink" name="Item_6" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 10, 2024 8:27PM" datetime="2024-11-10T20:27:54+00:00">November 10, 2024 8:27PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/199217/charlesn">charlesn</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/256429/sroussey2">sroussey2</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText">I just did the demo this last week. It felt like the hardware was “almost there”. I’ll skip v1 and wait for v2, thanks.</div> </blockquote> Assuming the hardware was "there" for you, what's your use case for AVP? Not suggesting you don't have one, just curious. </div> </blockquote> If you are in education, a researcher, a project manager, or someone that needs to get a lot done, this can help you. The multitude of windows and the ability to cycle through them quickly is what I really value. I am really learning a lot with it. </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="38720" title="rezwits - Informative on November 10, 2024."><a title="rezwits" href="/profile/38720/rezwits" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/328/nF153AIERX9AJ.png" alt="rezwits" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-4 ReactInfo"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462534"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 7 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="foregoneconclusion" href="/profile/170717/foregoneconclusion" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=1d4ee24bdbadbbe0cf3cdde364c98ef5&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F1d4ee24bdbadbbe0cf3cdde364c98ef5.png" alt="foregoneconclusion" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/170717/foregoneconclusion" class="Username">foregoneconclusion</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>2,838</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462534/#Comment_3462534" class="Permalink" name="Item_7" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 11, 2024 2:29PM" datetime="2024-11-11T14:29:38+00:00">November 11, 2024 2:29PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/199217/charlesn">charlesn</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/256429/sroussey2">sroussey2</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText">I just did the demo this last week. It felt like the hardware was “almost there”. I’ll skip v1 and wait for v2, thanks.</div> </blockquote> Assuming the hardware was "there" for you, what's your use case for AVP? Not suggesting you don't have one, just curious. </div> </blockquote> Use case = anyone who wants larger screens/multiple screens for mobile computing. The primary limitation of mobile is small screens.  </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462539"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 8 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="9secondkox2" href="/profile/218831/9secondkox2" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=3849ae286b8f6d6557af38a4c6b4a278&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F3849ae286b8f6d6557af38a4c6b4a278.png" alt="9secondkox2" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/218831/9secondkox2" class="Username">9secondkox2</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>3,135</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462539/#Comment_3462539" class="Permalink" name="Item_8" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 11, 2024 2:56PM" datetime="2024-11-11T14:56:31+00:00">November 11, 2024 2:56PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> Really doubt this. <div><br /></div><div>The one thing the VP has going for it is the specs. And it still flopped. It’s not like a faster GPU or GPU is going to help. </div><div><br /></div><div>A headset with s as faster chip is still a headset and people don’t crave headsets. </div><div><br /></div><div>The only way apple launches a second Vision Pro without form changes is if incompetent people are in charge. And that’s not the apple way. </div><div><br /></div><div>Apple may launch a second headset, but it will be different materially. And the price will be better. </div><div><br /></div><div>Cook recently acknowledged the “early adopter” nature of the current VP. We won’t be getting more of the same down the road - unless Apple does an experiment so see how much they can’t tank their rep in a short time. </div><div><br /></div><div>And it will likely becxx as glasses setup before too long. Headsets just aren’t it. </div> </div> <span class="CommentLastUpdated"> <span title="Edited November 11, 2024 2:56PM by 9secondkox2." class="DateUpdated">edited November 11</span> </span> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462550"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 9 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="mpantone" href="/profile/32335/mpantone" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/890/nO7AKFOHLUK71.png" alt="mpantone" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/32335/mpantone" class="Username">mpantone</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>2,253</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462550/#Comment_3462550" class="Permalink" name="Item_9" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 11, 2024 5:39PM" datetime="2024-11-11T17:39:48+00:00">November 11, 2024 5:39PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> Easier for Apple to do a spec bump by dropping in a new SoC rather than design an entirely new device. And Apple has a very long history of using the same industrial design for multiple generations. The main thing is whether or not they can decrease COGS.<br /><br />There are obviously less expensive VR HMD prototypes in Apple's labs. Maybe they don't have adequate performance, maybe the gross margins are too low, maybe Apple is waiting for the market to develop more interest, most likely it's a combination of 8-10 factors (including the ones I mentioned) before Apple will pull the trigger on a differentiated model.<br /><br />Remember that Apple did not launch four different iPad models at the same time in 2010. They released them incrementally over years.<br /><br />Goggles-style HMDs are a dead end. Too uncomfortable, too heavy, too restrictive. (Disclaimer #1: I own an Oculus Rift S.) A VR/AR HMD really needs to approach the weight of a pair of eyeglasses and have the same comfort level. (Disclaimer #2: I am a longtime wearer of eyeglasses.)<br /><br />Even a lighter, mass market focused Apple Vision HMD would still be a stepping stone to a pair of eyeglasses.<br /><br />If Apple wants this to be accepted by Joe Consumer, they will need to find a price point much closer to Meta Quest 3 ($400) or Quest 3S ($300). While the AVP certainly has better specs and better quality components than those two Meta devices, the latter have far more available content. As we know, Content Is King... </div> <span class="CommentLastUpdated"> <span title="Edited November 11, 2024 5:45PM by mpantone." class="DateUpdated">edited November 11</span> </span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="216002" title="mattinoz - Informative on November 12, 2024."><a title="mattinoz" href="/profile/216002/mattinoz" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=65a08e0a51c0cfcd3fdf7750e0dd41e1&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F65a08e0a51c0cfcd3fdf7750e0dd41e1.png" alt="mattinoz" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-4 ReactInfo"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462552"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 10 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="mpantone" href="/profile/32335/mpantone" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/890/nO7AKFOHLUK71.png" alt="mpantone" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/32335/mpantone" class="Username">mpantone</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>2,253</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462552/#Comment_3462552" class="Permalink" name="Item_10" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 11, 2024 6:23PM" datetime="2024-11-11T18:23:17+00:00">November 11, 2024 6:23PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank">9secondkox2</a> said:</div> <div>Really doubt this. <div><br /></div><div>The one thing the VP has going for it is the specs. And it still flopped. It’s not like a faster GPU or GPU is going to help. </div></div> </blockquote> You are ignoring the fact that the M4 SoC is on a different process node (N3E) than the M2 (N5P). It takes less electricity for the M4 to do the same tasks as the M2 (the SoC in the current AVP). This is important for the AVP because it is battery powered.<br /><br />If everything else remains the same, this hypothetical AVP 2 (with M5 SoC which is expected to be on the TSMC's 2nm process node) would likely have better battery performance than the original model.<br /><br />Note that the 100 Hz refresh rate of the AVP definitely can be improved. Of course faster refresh rates require more power so saving some on the SoC is going to help. A pleasant VR experience is really going to be around the 120-160Hz refresh rate. I own an Oculus Rift S (70Hz refresh) which is pretty much at the lowest threshold.<br /><br />Part of AVP's lack of sales has to do with the discrepancy between Apple's specs and Apple's price vis-a-vis the competition. It simply isn't worth $3500. It's not ten times better than a Meta Quest 3 ($400) or Quest 3S ($300). Plus the fact that there's a lot more software and content available for the Quest HMDs. Anyone who has tried a consumer-grade product from the competition knows this.<br /><br />Hell, anyone who shoved their smartphone in a Mattel View Master VR device (about $18 in 2015) also knows this. These were Google Cardboard-compatible devices from nine years ago.<br /><br /><a href="https://www.pcmag.com/reviews/mattel-view-master-virtual-reality-viewer-starter-pack" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">https://www.pcmag.com/reviews/mattel-view-master-virtual-reality-viewer-starter-pack</a><br /><br />Sure the user experience sucked (you had to hand hold the viewer) but it was less than an Andrew Jackson. </div> <span class="CommentLastUpdated"> <span title="Edited November 11, 2024 6:32PM by mpantone." class="DateUpdated">edited November 11</span> </span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="225122" title="muthuk_vanalingam - Informative on November 11, 2024."><a title="muthuk_vanalingam" href="/profile/225122/muthuk_vanalingam" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=76bd5bd1340901c578ab35dfe3ef1449&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F76bd5bd1340901c578ab35dfe3ef1449.png" alt="muthuk_vanalingam" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-4 ReactInfo"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462557"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 11 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="tht" href="/profile/392/tht" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/404/n2VE3S8JAP94H.jpeg" alt="tht" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/392/tht" class="Username">tht</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>5,675</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462557/#Comment_3462557" class="Permalink" name="Item_11" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 11, 2024 6:45PM" datetime="2024-11-11T18:45:29+00:00">November 11, 2024 6:45PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/32335/mpantone">mpantone</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText">Easier for Apple to do a spec bump by dropping in a new SoC rather than design an entirely new device. And Apple has a very long history of using the same industrial design for multiple generations. The main thing is whether or not they can decrease COGS.<br /><br />There are obviously less expensive VR HMD prototypes in Apple's labs. Maybe they don't have adequate performance, maybe the gross margins are too low, maybe Apple is waiting for the market to develop more interest, most likely it's a combination of 8-10 factors (including the ones I mentioned) before Apple will pull the trigger on a differentiated model.<br /><br />Remember that Apple did not launch four different iPad models at the same time in 2010. They released them incrementally over years.<br /><br />Goggles-style HMDs are a dead end. Too uncomfortable, too heavy, too restrictive. (Disclaimer #1: I own an Oculus Rift S.) A VR/AR HMD really needs to approach the weight of a pair of eyeglasses and have the same comfort level. (Disclaimer #2: I am a longtime wearer of eyeglasses.)<br /><br />Even a lighter, mass market focused Apple Vision HMD would still be a stepping stone to a pair of eyeglasses.<br /><br />If Apple wants this to be accepted by Joe Consumer, they will need to find a price point much closer to Meta Quest 3 ($400) or Quest 3S ($300). While the AVP certainly has better specs and better quality components than those two Meta devices, the latter have far more available content. As we know, Content Is King...</div> </blockquote> Eye headsets (goggles, glasses) are going to take a very long time to penetrate the market, and it isn't going to be a phone sized market in any case. Maybe 50m units a year for market saturation. That's maybe about 20% of the PC market. So, everyone should be expecting very slow iterations of products as there won't be big enough revenue cycles per year to drive product development. Apple does not take a loss on hardware, so it's quite doubtful they will sell anything under $1500.<br /><br />Everyone needs to be mindful that Meta loses about $1000 for every $400 headset they sell. Could be a $1500 loss per headset. Even the game console vendors don't do that. Game consoles like the PS5 or the Xbox are sold at a small profit or they are attempting to break even as it really reduces risk for the business. Meta is waiting on that magic Facebook moment when they have captured enough viewers to so that ads can make up selling at a loss, but they aren't saying when that can't happen, how many users and how many eye-ball hours it requires. And what people will be doing while wearing it so ads can be shown. Their one attempt was Horizon Worlds.<br /><br />For Apple, do as they always do: iterate, slow and steady. The media industry cannot afford to sound reasonable as no one would read it or watch it, but they know it too, even the ones who proclaim this or that product is a failure, like Hartley Charlton from the MacRumors podcast. He knows better, but the nature of the media business is to be as dramatic as possible.<br /><br />I would rather have Apple update the VP to an M4 24GB/1TB system for $3500, including a more efficient R2 and use 12 MP main cameras for the pass-through, for 1Q25, then do an M5 update for 1Q26 or so. They can keep the M2 model around and hopefully sell it for $2500. Waiting 3 years between iterations is tough.<br /><br />There is still a ways to go. The display and lens need to provide 50% more viewing angle. They may involve using 4 microOLEDs. The wings need to fold so the unit is more transportable. Obviously, the whole thing has to go down in weight by 30%, at least. 400 grams? Wearability has to be improved: lighter on the neck, less compression on the face, easier to put on and remove, less heat, flexible bridge. So, I don't think the price point can go down, and there's lots of room to go up in price. They can sell a model for $5000, and probably will if this market grows.<br /> </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="192414" title="danox - Like on November 11, 2024."><a title="danox" href="/profile/192414/danox" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=fd166bfa04443fb1122c5153ad304513&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ffd166bfa04443fb1122c5153ad304513.png" alt="danox" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462562"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 12 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="mpantone" href="/profile/32335/mpantone" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/890/nO7AKFOHLUK71.png" alt="mpantone" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/32335/mpantone" class="Username">mpantone</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>2,253</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462562/#Comment_3462562" class="Permalink" name="Item_12" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 11, 2024 7:01PM" datetime="2024-11-11T19:01:42+00:00">November 11, 2024 7:01PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> Yup, I'm okay letting Meta subsidize VR HMDs. I'm not funding all of that. And yes, I'm an indirect shareholder of both META and AAPL (like any American with a retirement account/pension plan).<br /><br />Anyhow, VR/AR goggles are a dead end. Too many comfort issues that will never be resolved for a certain percentage of the population. I hate goggles (swimming, skiing, scuba masks). I hate headphones. They all make my head hurt. Even eyeglasses I tend to remove every hour or so for a few minutes for relief. And I most certainly am not alone.<br /><br />There are also tons of comfort issues staring at a display panel at a fixed distance from your retinas. There are also peripheral vision limitations. There's a lot of motion sickness because the images displayed don't corresponding to what your inner ear is telling you. There are latency issues. Heat, poor audio, humidity.<br /><br />None of this is new. These have all been issues since VR emerged in the Nineties (people were routinely throwing up on the Aladdin Magic Carpet ride at EPCOT Center in the mid-Nineties).<br /><br />A lot of these comfort issues will subside with VR/AR eyeglasses but the immersion will be sacrificed. Remember that eyeglasses don't provide peripheral imagery either. And you still need a separate audio device for decent sound (earbuds, whatever). How many people have earbuds they can comfortably wear for hours upon hours?<br /><br />Don't get me wrong, I believe there are some phenomenal usage cases for AR/VR technology, particularly in the commercial/enterprise/research environments. It's the consumer stuff that is still miles away from attracting general appeal. It's also not going to happen with a $3500 price tag. </div> <span class="CommentLastUpdated"> <span title="Edited November 11, 2024 7:07PM by mpantone." class="DateUpdated">edited November 11</span> </span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="225122" title="muthuk_vanalingam - Like on November 11, 2024."><a title="muthuk_vanalingam" href="/profile/225122/muthuk_vanalingam" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=76bd5bd1340901c578ab35dfe3ef1449&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F76bd5bd1340901c578ab35dfe3ef1449.png" alt="muthuk_vanalingam" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462593"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 13 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="discountopinion" href="/profile/213982/discountopinion" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=debc7549491b460d61fdafb754903024&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Fdebc7549491b460d61fdafb754903024.png" alt="discountopinion" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/213982/discountopinion" class="Username">discountopinion</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>108</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462593/#Comment_3462593" class="Permalink" name="Item_13" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 11, 2024 10:42PM" datetime="2024-11-11T22:42:46+00:00">November 11, 2024 10:42PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> For me the largest difference in use between an iPhone and AVP is that the iPhone is used casually and spontaneously whereas a pair of goggles requires focus and feels like requiring determined purpose. Many iPhone users are screen junkies and spend a lot of time every day using the phone and iPhone helped create the casual gaming segment.<br /><br />AVP will not fit into this niche at least when the iPhone fills this need. AVP needs to offer people something that is beyond the iPhone fix and this may take time to create.<br /><br />I suspect that AVP may need to come in a rugged mod as industry, engineering, construction, medicine and other fields seem to have more of a business case at this stage.<br /><br />Also AVP + Optimus may be an interesting telepresence idea for hazardous environments when Optimus comes to market and help train Optimus for specific use cases. Anyone dropping 30k on a robot will drop Xk on AVP and training infra.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /> </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462608"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 14 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="ralphbu" href="/profile/148545/ralphbu" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=fcf527f5324121069e24eb99fd0125f4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ffcf527f5324121069e24eb99fd0125f4.png" alt="ralphbu" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/148545/ralphbu" class="Username">ralphbu</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>23</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462608/#Comment_3462608" class="Permalink" name="Item_14" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 12, 2024 1:57AM" datetime="2024-11-12T01:57:46+00:00">November 12, 2024 1:57AM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <div>The killer app is the ultrawide monitor for now - it works better than any physical monitor could because it's just so much bigger! ,Everything is visible at once, it just falls into place. The new Bali beach background doesn't hurt. <br /></div><div><br /></div><div>Still needed - a camera to allow immersive video creation by anybody. When that starts to get out there, the vison pro is going to take off, every family with kids is going to want one. Of course the cost and the weight could be better but I use mine every day.  I sure feel like I'm getting my money's worth out of it. Rather have that than the $5000 monitori. <br /></div> </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="222606" title="watto_cobra - Like on November 22, 2024."><a title="watto_cobra" href="/profile/222606/watto_cobra" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=f2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Ff2fefcb8d61b2604ef797958c0758ff4.png" alt="watto_cobra" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462627"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 15 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="Stabitha_Christie" href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=4a56b1fcb46100aac5b593357475af6d&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F4a56b1fcb46100aac5b593357475af6d.png" alt="Stabitha_Christie" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie" class="Username">Stabitha_Christie</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>569</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462627/#Comment_3462627" class="Permalink" name="Item_15" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 12, 2024 9:00AM" datetime="2024-11-12T09:00:54+00:00">November 12, 2024 9:00AM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/218831/9secondkox2">9secondkox2</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText">Really doubt this. <div><br /></div><div>The one thing the VP has going for it is the specs. And it still flopped. It’s not like a faster GPU or GPU is going to help. </div><div><br /></div><div>A headset with s as faster chip is still a headset and people don’t crave headsets. </div><div><br /></div><div>The only way apple launches a second Vision Pro without form changes is if incompetent people are in charge. And that’s not the apple way. </div><div><br /></div><div>Apple may launch a second headset, but it will be different materially. And the price will be better. </div><div><br /></div><div>Cook recently acknowledged the “early adopter” nature of the current VP. We won’t be getting more of the same down the road - unless Apple does an experiment so see how much they can’t tank their rep in a short time. </div><div><br /></div><div>And it will likely becxx as glasses setup before too long. Headsets just aren’t it. </div></div> </blockquote> <div>In its first partial year, the Vision Pro has been limited to sale in 10 countries, and it has already sold better than the iPod did in its first full year. That is with the iPod having much wider availability and being 14% of the cost of AVP. So I guess you think the iPod was a flop? I assume you don't because that would be a fairly ridiculous thing to say. </div><div><br /></div><div>Yes, it's for early adopters; that was obvious from the start, and it likely will be for the first few generations. And yeah, Apple is going to make incremental improvements to weight, size, and comfort. These things are pretty obvious. </div><div><br /></div><div>As far as glasses go, that won't happen for a while. Neither processor nor battery manufacturing is close to where they need to be able to do glasses. </div><div><br /></div><div>Apple is taking the correct approach here. They are working on the software and features of the device so that when it does get smaller and more affordable, they will have a well-polished user experience. Taking your suggested approach of sitting on their hands until they can build a smaller device or glasses would just put them behind in spatial computing space. It would have been like if they waited until they could make the iPod nano to release an iPod. </div><div><br /></div><div>Apple knows exactly what it is doing. They are playing the long game like they always do. Your take is just shortsighted. </div> </div> <span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="392" title="tht - Like on November 12, 2024."><a title="tht" href="/profile/392/tht" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/404/n2VE3S8JAP94H.jpeg" alt="tht" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span><span class="UserReactionWrap" data-userid="216002" title="mattinoz - Like on November 12, 2024."><a title="mattinoz" href="/profile/216002/mattinoz" class="PhotoWrap PhotoWrapSmall"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=65a08e0a51c0cfcd3fdf7750e0dd41e1&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F65a08e0a51c0cfcd3fdf7750e0dd41e1.png" alt="mattinoz" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoSmall" /></a><span class="ReactSprite Reaction-1 ReactHeart2"></span></span> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462630"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 16 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="Pema" href="/profile/252595/Pema" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=4dfd377f81efb121312d35bc4da7025c&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F4dfd377f81efb121312d35bc4da7025c.png" alt="Pema" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/252595/Pema" class="Username">Pema</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>153</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462630/#Comment_3462630" class="Permalink" name="Item_16" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 12, 2024 10:26AM" datetime="2024-11-12T10:26:31+00:00">November 12, 2024 10:26AM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <b>Unofficially the Apple Vision Pro is dead. The company assembling the unit, Luxshare, has been advised by Tim & Co. to wind up production by the end of November. </b><br /><br /><b>Good move. </b><br /><br /><b>At least Apple didn't drag out this agony like the Apple Car for ten years. </b><br /><br /><b>Now Apple can get back to resurrecting the Apple Car as the Apple Car Management Software and sell it to every EV car manufacturer out there other than the Chinese. </b><br /><br /><b>This software will catapult Apple into a 6 Trillion company. </b><br /><br /><br /> </div> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462653"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 17 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="Stabitha_Christie" href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=4a56b1fcb46100aac5b593357475af6d&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F4a56b1fcb46100aac5b593357475af6d.png" alt="Stabitha_Christie" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie" class="Username">Stabitha_Christie</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>569</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462653/#Comment_3462653" class="Permalink" name="Item_17" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 12, 2024 3:39PM" datetime="2024-11-12T15:39:43+00:00">November 12, 2024 3:39PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/252595/Pema">Pema</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><b>Unofficially the Apple Vision Pro is dead. The company assembling the unit, Luxshare, has been advised by Tim & Co. to wind up production by the end of November. </b><br /><br /><b>Good move. </b><br /><br /><b>At least Apple didn't drag out this agony like the Apple Car for ten years. </b><br /><br /><b>Now Apple can get back to resurrecting the Apple Car as the Apple Car Management Software and sell it to every EV car manufacturer out there other than the Chinese. </b><br /><br /><b>This software will catapult Apple into a 6 Trillion company. </b><br /><br /><br /></div> </blockquote> Apple is literally launching the product in two more countries this week. So they are still spending money and doing the work required to expand availability. Seems like an odd choice for a "dead" product. <br /><br />Apple isn't going to become a software vendor for car manufacturers, that just isn't going to happen. It is completely counter to the "build the whole widget" philosophy.  </div> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462689"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 18 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="Pema" href="/profile/252595/Pema" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=4dfd377f81efb121312d35bc4da7025c&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2F4dfd377f81efb121312d35bc4da7025c.png" alt="Pema" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/252595/Pema" class="Username">Pema</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>153</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462689/#Comment_3462689" class="Permalink" name="Item_18" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 12, 2024 9:21PM" datetime="2024-11-12T21:21:47+00:00">November 12, 2024 9:21PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> Tabitha_Christie writes: <span>Apple isn't going to become a software vendor for car manufacturers, that just isn't going to happen. It is completely counter to the "build the whole widget" philosophy. <br /><br />That so? </span><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie">Stabitha_Christie</a><span> said:</span><blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteText"><blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/252595/Pema">Pema</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><b>Unofficially the Apple Vision Pro is dead. The company assembling the unit, Luxshare, has been advised by Tim & Co. to wind up production by the end of November. </b><br /><br /><b>Good move. </b><br /><br /><b>At least Apple didn't drag out this agony like the Apple Car for ten years. </b><br /><br /><b>Now Apple can get back to resurrecting the Apple Car as the Apple Car Management Software and sell it to every EV car manufacturer out there other than the Chinese. </b><br /><br /><b>This software will catapult Apple into a 6 Trillion company. </b><br /><br /><br /></div> </blockquote> Apple is literally launching the product in two more countries this week. So they are still spending money and doing the work required to expand availability. Seems like an odd choice for a "dead" product. <br /><br />Apple isn't going to become a software vendor for car manufacturers, that just isn't going to happen. It is completely counter to the "build the whole widget" philosophy. </div> </blockquote> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie">Stabitha_Christie</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/252595/Pema">Pema</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><b>Unofficially the Apple Vision Pro is dead. The company assembling the unit, Luxshare, has been advised by Tim & Co. to wind up production by the end of November. </b><br /><br /><b>Good move. </b><br /><br /><b>At least Apple didn't drag out this agony like the Apple Car for ten years. </b><br /><br /><b>Now Apple can get back to resurrecting the Apple Car as the Apple Car Management Software and sell it to every EV car manufacturer out there other than the Chinese. </b><br /><br /><b>This software will catapult Apple into a 6 Trillion company. </b><br /><br /><br /></div> </blockquote> Apple is literally launching the product in two more countries this week. So they are still spending money and doing the work required to expand availability. Seems like an odd choice for a "dead" product. <br /><br />Apple isn't going to become a software vendor for car manufacturers, that just isn't going to happen. It is completely counter to the "build the whole widget" philosophy. </div> </blockquote> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie">Stabitha_Christie</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/252595/Pema">Pema</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><b>Unofficially the Apple Vision Pro is dead. The company assembling the unit, Luxshare, has been advised by Tim & Co. to wind up production by the end of November. </b><br /><br /><b>Good move. </b><br /><br /><b>At least Apple didn't drag out this agony like the Apple Car for ten years. </b><br /><br /><b>Now Apple can get back to resurrecting the Apple Car as the Apple Car Management Software and sell it to every EV car manufacturer out there other than the Chinese. </b><br /><br /><b>This software will catapult Apple into a 6 Trillion company. </b><br /><br /><br /></div> </blockquote> Apple is literally launching the product in two more countries this week. So they are still spending money and doing the work required to expand availability. Seems like an odd choice for a "dead" product. <br /><br />Apple isn't going to become a software vendor for car manufacturers, that just isn't going to happen. It is completely counter to the "build the whole widget" philosophy. </div> </blockquote> That's so. So who writes, supports and distributes Apple Car Play which runs on a gazillion cars? Apple Car Play is a pretty lame piece of software that doesn't do much but deliver some minor functionality. Why not elevate that group of engineers to write Apple Car Management Software to actually do something useful: manage the BEV? <br /> </div> <li class="Item Alt ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462692"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 19 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="tht" href="/profile/392/tht" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://forums.appleinsider.com/uploads/userpics/404/n2VE3S8JAP94H.jpeg" alt="tht" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/392/tht" class="Username">tht</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>5,675</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462692/#Comment_3462692" class="Permalink" name="Item_19" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 12, 2024 9:55PM" datetime="2024-11-12T21:55:58+00:00">November 12, 2024 9:55PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/213982/discountopinion">discountopinion</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText">For me the largest difference in use between an iPhone and AVP is that the iPhone is used casually and spontaneously whereas a pair of goggles requires focus and feels like requiring determined purpose. Many iPhone users are screen junkies and spend a lot of time every day using the phone and iPhone helped create the casual gaming segment.<br /><br />AVP will not fit into this niche at least when the iPhone fills this need. AVP needs to offer people something that is beyond the iPhone fix and this may take time to create.<br /><br />I suspect that AVP may need to come in a rugged mod as industry, engineering, construction, medicine and other fields seem to have more of a business case at this stage.<br /><br />Also AVP + Optimus may be an interesting telepresence idea for hazardous environments when Optimus comes to market and help train Optimus for specific use cases. Anyone dropping 30k on a robot will drop Xk on AVP and training infra.<br /><br /></div> </blockquote> I think the vision for Apple’s goggles and glasses is like an iPhone, but more. They want an AR display they can appear to you any time and anywhere. It was said before, AR headsets can replace all of your screens, from watches to TVs. If you can make an AR screen appear in front of you at anytime and have it seemlessly mix with real objects, people will use it more. <div><br /></div><div>What was good about the AVP was Apple solved one of the difficult problems with eye wearables. The UI with hand and eye control looks like it works well. That was a big leap. They need to keep this, so the minimum sensor suite to do this will hopefully be on all the form factors. </div><div><br /></div><div>The other thing they are doing well is AR object permanence. The displays are fixed to their locations. The room mapping and headset tracking also requires a minimum sensor suite to do. </div><div><br /></div><div>Don’t think anyone can integrate the AVP’s sensor suite for a glass form factor, while getting the AVP’s form factor to be lighter also seems quite difficult. It’s one of the reasons everyone has to have 2 form factors. </div><div><br /></div><div>Everyone is all hyped up about glasses because of Meta’s Orion concept demo, but you need to be mindful that waveguides and see-through AR has its own set of issues. The two form factors will be moving in parallel for a long while. </div> </div> <li class="Item ItemComment Role_member" id="Comment_3462703"> <div class="Comment"> <div class="Options"> <span class="PostNum">Reply 20 of 21</span> </div> <div class="Item-Header CommentHeader"> <div class="AuthorWrap"> <span class="Author"> <a title="tiredskills" href="/profile/256316/tiredskills" class="PhotoWrap"><img src="https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar.php?gravatar_id=dbd6c03f1b993dc4d00167b27aae9fed&amp;size=50&default=https%3A%2F%2Fvanillicon.com%2Fdbd6c03f1b993dc4d00167b27aae9fed.png" alt="tiredskills" class="ProfilePhoto ProfilePhotoMedium" /></a><a href="/profile/256316/tiredskills" class="Username">tiredskills</a> </span> <span class="AuthorInfo"> <span class="MItem PostCount">Posts: <b>41</b></span><span class="MItem RoleTitle member">member</span> </span> </div> <div class="Meta CommentMeta CommentInfo"> <span class="MItem DateCreated"> <a href="/discussion/comment/3462703/#Comment_3462703" class="Permalink" name="Item_20" rel="nofollow"><time title="November 12, 2024 11:16PM" datetime="2024-11-12T23:16:33+00:00">November 12, 2024 11:16PM</time></a> </span> </div> </div> <div class="Item-BodyWrap"> <div class="Item-Body"> <div class="Message"> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/252595/Pema">Pema</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText">Tabitha_Christie writes: Apple isn't going to become a software vendor for car manufacturers, that just isn't going to happen. It is completely counter to the "build the whole widget" philosophy. <br /><br />That so? <a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie">Stabitha_Christie</a> said:<blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteText"><blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/252595/Pema">Pema</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><b>Unofficially the Apple Vision Pro is dead. The company assembling the unit, Luxshare, has been advised by Tim & Co. to wind up production by the end of November. </b><br /><br /><b>Good move. </b><br /><br /><b>At least Apple didn't drag out this agony like the Apple Car for ten years. </b><br /><br /><b>Now Apple can get back to resurrecting the Apple Car as the Apple Car Management Software and sell it to every EV car manufacturer out there other than the Chinese. </b><br /><br /><b>This software will catapult Apple into a 6 Trillion company. </b><br /><br /><br /></div> </blockquote> Apple is literally launching the product in two more countries this week. So they are still spending money and doing the work required to expand availability. Seems like an odd choice for a "dead" product. <br /><br />Apple isn't going to become a software vendor for car manufacturers, that just isn't going to happen. It is completely counter to the "build the whole widget" philosophy. </div> </blockquote> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie">Stabitha_Christie</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/252595/Pema">Pema</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><b>Unofficially the Apple Vision Pro is dead. The company assembling the unit, Luxshare, has been advised by Tim & Co. to wind up production by the end of November. </b><br /><br /><b>Good move. </b><br /><br /><b>At least Apple didn't drag out this agony like the Apple Car for ten years. </b><br /><br /><b>Now Apple can get back to resurrecting the Apple Car as the Apple Car Management Software and sell it to every EV car manufacturer out there other than the Chinese. </b><br /><br /><b>This software will catapult Apple into a 6 Trillion company. </b><br /><br /><br /></div> </blockquote> Apple is literally launching the product in two more countries this week. So they are still spending money and doing the work required to expand availability. Seems like an odd choice for a "dead" product. <br /><br />Apple isn't going to become a software vendor for car manufacturers, that just isn't going to happen. It is completely counter to the "build the whole widget" philosophy. </div> </blockquote> <blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/250922/Stabitha_Christie">Stabitha_Christie</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><blockquote class="Quote"> <div class="QuoteAuthor"><a rel="nofollow" href="/profile/252595/Pema">Pema</a> said:</div> <div class="QuoteText"><b>Unofficially the Apple Vision Pro is dead. The company assembling the unit, Luxshare, has been advised by Tim & Co. to wind up production by the end of November. </b><br /><br /><b>Good move. </b><br /><br /><b>At least Apple didn't drag out this agony like the Apple Car for ten years. </b><br /><br /><b>Now Apple can get back to resurrecting the Apple Car as the Apple Car Management Software and sell it to every EV car manufacturer out there other than the Chinese. </b><br /><br /><b>This software will catapult Apple into a 6 Trillion company. </b><br /><br /><br /></div> </blockquote> Apple is literally launching the product in two more countries this week. So they are still spending money and doing the work required to expand availability. Seems like an odd choice for a "dead" product. <br /><br />Apple isn't going to become a software vendor for car manufacturers, that just isn't going to happen. It is completely counter to the "build the whole widget" philosophy. </div> </blockquote> That's so. So who writes, supports and distributes Apple Car Play which runs on a gazillion cars? Apple Car Play is a pretty lame piece of software that doesn't do much but deliver some minor functionality. Why not elevate that group of engineers to write Apple Car Management Software to actually do something useful: manage the BEV? <br /></div> </blockquote> No customers. </div> </ul> </div><div class="P PagerWrap"><div id="PagerAfter" class="Pager NumberedPager NumberedPager"><span class="Previous">«</span><a href="https://forums.appleinsider.com/discussion/238254/apple-vision-pro-2-with-m5-chip-likely-to-arrive-before-budget-models" class="Highlight p-1 FirstPage">1</a><a href="https://forums.appleinsider.com/discussion/238254/apple-vision-pro-2-with-m5-chip-likely-to-arrive-before-budget-models/p2" class=" p-2 LastPage" rel="next">2</a><a href="https://forums.appleinsider.com/discussion/238254/apple-vision-pro-2-with-m5-chip-likely-to-arrive-before-budget-models/p2" class="Next" rel="next">»</a></div></div></div> <div class="Foot Closed"> <div class="Note Closed SignInOrRegister"><a href="/entry/signin?Target=discussion%2F238254%3F">Sign In</a> or <a href="/entry/register?Target=discussion%2F238254%3F">Register</a> to comment. </div> </div> </div> </main> </div> </section> <footer class="page-footer sticky-footer"> <div class="container"> <div class="clearfix"> <p style="position: fixed; bottom: 2em; right: 2em;"> <a class="top"> <a id="return-top" href="#top" title="Back to Top"> <strong><i class="fa fa-chevron-up"></i></strong> </a> </a> </p> <p id="page-footer-content"> Copyright © 2024 Quiller Media, Inc <br /> <br /> <a href="https://forums.appleinsider.com/discussion/184333/appleinsiders-updated-commenting-guidelines/p1">Commenting Guidelines</a> · <a href="https://appleinsider.com/privacy/">Privacy Policy</a> · <a href="mailto:aiforumhelp@gmail.com">Contact</a> </p> </div> </div> </footer> </body> </html>