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If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Latter_Day_Saint_movement" title="Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Latter Day Saint movement">the discussion</a> and see a list of open tasks.<span class="metadata wpb-metadata"><span class="wpb-project">Latter Day Saint movement</span><span class="wpb-project_link">Wikipedia:WikiProject Latter Day Saint movement</span><span class="wpb-banner_name">Template:WikiProject Latter Day Saint movement</span><span class="wpb-assessment_cat">Latter Day Saint movement articles</span></span></td><td class="mbox-empty-cell"></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Merge_Discussion" data-mw-thread-id="h-Merge_Discussion-2012-08-30T18:57:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Merge_Discussion-2012-08-30T18:57:00.000Z"></span>Merge Discussion<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Merge_Discussion-2012-08-30T18:57:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency&action=edit&section=1" title="Edit section: Merge Discussion"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <div class="boilerplate discussion-archived mw-archivedtalk" style="background-color: var(--background-color-progressive-subtle, #f5f3ef); color: var(--color-base, inherit); overflow:auto; margin: 1em 0 0 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid var(--border-color-subtle, #aaa)"> <div class="boilerplate-header"> <dl><dd><i><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-09-06T21:45:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion"></span>The following discussion is closed. <span style="color:var(--color-error, red)"><b>Please do not modify it.</b></span> Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.</i> <i>A summary of the conclusions reached follows.</i> <dl><dd>No one seems to care, so it seems to be uncontroversial, so I have done it. -- --<a href="/wiki/User:ARTEST4ECHO" title="User:ARTEST4ECHO">ARTEST4ECHO</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:ARTEST4ECHO" title="User talk:ARTEST4ECHO"><sup>talk</sup></a>/<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/ARTEST4ECHO" title="Special:Contributions/ARTEST4ECHO"><sub>contribs</sub></a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency#c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-09-06T21:45:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:45, 6 September 2012 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-09-06T21:45:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-09-06T21:45:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <hr/> </div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-08-30T18:57:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion"></span>With the exception the CoCfirstpresidency template basically has all the same info as CofCpresidents, since the Prophet Presents are members of the "first presidency". Additionally, I have added some options that remove the councilor information if desired.--<a href="/wiki/User:ARTEST4ECHO" title="User:ARTEST4ECHO">ARTEST4ECHO</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:ARTEST4ECHO" title="User talk:ARTEST4ECHO"><sup>talk</sup></a>/<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/ARTEST4ECHO" title="Special:Contributions/ARTEST4ECHO"><sub>contribs</sub></a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency#c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-08-30T18:57:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:57, 30 August 2012 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-08-30T18:57:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-08-30T18:57:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion"></span> </p> <div style="padding-left: 1.6em; font-style: italic; border-top: 1px solid #a2a9b1; margin: 0.5em 0; padding-top: 0.5em"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-09-06T21:48:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion"></span>The discussion above is closed. <b style="color: var(--color-error, red);">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.</div> </div><div style="clear:both;" class=""></div> <link rel="mw-deduplicated-inline-style" href="mw-data:TemplateStyles:r1237879475"><table class="plainlinks tmbox tmbox-notice copiednotice" role="presentation"><tbody><tr><td class="mbox-image"><span class="mw-default-size" typeof="mw:File/Frameless"><span><img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ea/Splitsection.svg/50px-Splitsection.svg.png" decoding="async" width="50" height="25" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ea/Splitsection.svg/75px-Splitsection.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ea/Splitsection.svg/100px-Splitsection.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="40" data-file-height="20"/></span></span></td><td class="mbox-text">Text and/or other creative content from <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template_talk%3ACofCpresidents&oldid=511132530">this version</a> of <span class="plainlinks"><a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template_talk%3ACofCpresidents&redirect=no">Template_talk:CofCpresidents</a></span> was copied or moved into <a class="mw-selflink selflink">Template talk:CoCfirstpresidency</a> with <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template_talk%3ACoCfirstpresidency&diff=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fw%2Findex.php%3Ftitle%3DTemplate_talk%253ACoCfirstpresidency%26diff%3D511133371%26oldid%3D509983056&oldid=509983056">this edit</a> on 21:45, 6 September 2012 (UTC). The former page's <a class="external text" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template_talk%3ACofCpresidents&action=history">history</a> now serves to <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Copying_within_Wikipedia" title="Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia">provide attribution</a> for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists.</td></tr></tbody></table> <p><span typeof="mw:File"><span title="Merge arrows"><img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/52/Merge-arrows.svg/32px-Merge-arrows.svg.png" decoding="async" width="32" height="13" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/52/Merge-arrows.svg/48px-Merge-arrows.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/52/Merge-arrows.svg/64px-Merge-arrows.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="50" data-file-height="20"/></span></span> <span typeof="mw:File"><span><img alt="check" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/f/fb/Yes_check.svg/18px-Yes_check.svg.png" decoding="async" width="18" height="18" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/f/fb/Yes_check.svg/27px-Yes_check.svg.png 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/f/fb/Yes_check.svg/36px-Yes_check.svg.png 2x" data-file-width="600" data-file-height="600"/></span></span><span style="display:none">Y</span> <b><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Merging" title="Wikipedia:Merging">Merger</a> complete.</b> --<a href="/wiki/User:ARTEST4ECHO" title="User:ARTEST4ECHO">ARTEST4ECHO</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:ARTEST4ECHO" title="User talk:ARTEST4ECHO"><sup>talk</sup></a>/<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/ARTEST4ECHO" title="Special:Contributions/ARTEST4ECHO"><sub>contribs</sub></a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency#c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-09-06T21:48:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:48, 6 September 2012 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-09-06T21:48:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-ARTEST4ECHO-2012-09-06T21:48:00.000Z-Merge_Discussion"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Community_of_Christ_template" data-mw-thread-id="h-Community_of_Christ_template-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Community_of_Christ_template-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z"></span>Community of Christ template<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Community_of_Christ_template-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency&action=edit&section=2" title="Edit section: Community of Christ template"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z-Community_of_Christ_template"></span>I've also reverted your taking <a href="/wiki/Joseph_Smith,_Jr." class="mw-redirect" title="Joseph Smith, Jr.">Joseph Smith, Jr.</a> off the lists of presidents of the Community of Christ. To do so is POV. Smith was <i>never</i> the president of <i>any</i> church except one called the <a href="/wiki/Church_of_Christ_(Latter_Day_Saints)" title="Church of Christ (Latter Day Saints)">Church of Christ</a>, which was later renamed the <a href="/wiki/Church_of_Jesus_Christ_of_Latter_Day_Saints" class="mw-redirect" title="Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints">Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints</a>. This church doesn't exist anymore, and instead we have hundreds of schismatic churches, <i>each of which</i> argues it is the original church or rightful successor to Smith's church. Thus, every single one claims Smith as its first president. So he either appears on <i>all</i> the templates, or <i>none</i> of them, and it better reflects what the churches themselves claim to have him on all of them. Thanks. <a href="/wiki/User:Good_Olfactory" title="User:Good Olfactory">Good Ol’factory</a> <sup><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Good_Olfactory" title="User talk:Good Olfactory">(talk)</a></sup> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency#c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z-Community_of_Christ_template" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">03:49, 2 June 2008 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z-Community_of_Christ_template"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z-Community_of_Christ_template"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Eustress-2008-06-02T03:55:00.000Z-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z"></span>I disagree. Joseph Smith received a revelation on April 26, 1838 indicating that the name of the church would be The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (see <a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="http://scriptures.lds.org/en/dc/115/3-4#3">http://scriptures.lds.org/en/dc/115/3-4#3</a>). --<a href="/wiki/User:Eustress" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Eustress">Eustress</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Eustress" title="User talk:Eustress">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency#c-Eustress-2008-06-02T03:55:00.000Z-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">03:55, 2 June 2008 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Eustress-2008-06-02T03:55:00.000Z-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Eustress-2008-06-02T03:55:00.000Z-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:49:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:57:00.000Z-Eustress-2008-06-02T03:55:00.000Z"></span>He did not spell it like that. The LDS Church has changed the original spelling of the revelation from "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints". It was Brigham Young that first spelled it "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints", with the capital "T" on "The" and the small "d" and hyphen on "Latter-day". This was in 1851, when the church incorporated in Utah Territory. See <a href="/wiki/Church_of_Christ_(Latter_Day_Saints)" title="Church of Christ (Latter Day Saints)">Church of Christ (Latter Day Saints)</a> for some background history on this. As I said, each church claims Smith as their own, including the LDS Church. I respect that the LDS Church does this, but you also need to respect other churches that do the same. <a href="/wiki/User:Good_Olfactory" title="User:Good Olfactory">Good Ol’factory</a> <sup><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Good_Olfactory" title="User talk:Good Olfactory">(talk)</a></sup> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency#c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:57:00.000Z-Eustress-2008-06-02T03:55:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">03:57, 2 June 2008 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:57:00.000Z-Eustress-2008-06-02T03:55:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:57:00.000Z-Eustress-2008-06-02T03:55:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Eustress-2008-06-02T04:14:00.000Z-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:57:00.000Z"></span>I still disagree. The spelling stuff is trivial, but the name reflected in the revelation is no where close to "The <i>Reorganized</i> Church of...". I think it's pretty clear that the original church Smith started was the LDS Church, then other churches branched out after his martyrdom (see <a href="/wiki/Succession_crisis" title="Succession crisis">Succession crisis</a>). The CofC may claim him to be their first prophet, but this template is for presidents of the CofC (RLDS Church), which J.S. never was. Isn't that logical? --<a href="/wiki/User:Eustress" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Eustress">Eustress</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Eustress" title="User talk:Eustress">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency#c-Eustress-2008-06-02T04:14:00.000Z-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:57:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">04:14, 2 June 2008 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Eustress-2008-06-02T04:14:00.000Z-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:57:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Eustress-2008-06-02T04:14:00.000Z-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T03:57:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><i><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T04:57:00.000Z-Eustress-2008-06-02T04:14:00.000Z"></span>I think it's pretty clear that the original church Smith started was the LDS Church</i>. That's <i>pure</i> POV; I'm sure any LDS Church member would agree with you, but neutral historians or members of other Latter Day Saint denominations would find it ridiculously biased. You need to research the RLDS Church and their beliefs. In short, they believed that after Smith died, the church fell into disorganization. In the 1850s–1860s, a number of members sought to "reorganize" the church, which they felt was disorganized. Thus, the church was <i>reorganized</i> under the name the <i>Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints</i>, but they believed and taught it was the <i>same</i> church as the one Smith organized. In reality, Smith was never the president of the RLDS Church or the LDS Church, since both were legally established well after his death. <a href="/wiki/User:Good_Olfactory" title="User:Good Olfactory">Good Ol’factory</a> <sup><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Good_Olfactory" title="User talk:Good Olfactory">(talk)</a></sup> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency#c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T04:57:00.000Z-Eustress-2008-06-02T04:14:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">04:57, 2 June 2008 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T04:57:00.000Z-Eustress-2008-06-02T04:14:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Good_Olfactory-2008-06-02T04:57:00.000Z-Eustress-2008-06-02T04:14:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl>    </div><noscript><img src="https://login.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:CentralAutoLogin/start?type=1x1&useformat=desktop" alt="" width="1" height="1" style="border: none; position: absolute;"></noscript> <div class="printfooter" data-nosnippet="">Retrieved from "<a dir="ltr" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency&oldid=1229227830">https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template_talk:CoCfirstpresidency&oldid=1229227830</a>"</div></div> <div id="catlinks" class="catlinks" data-mw="interface"><div id="mw-normal-catlinks" class="mw-normal-catlinks"><a href="/wiki/Help:Category" title="Help:Category">Categories</a>: <ul><li><a href="/wiki/Category:Template-Class_Latter_Day_Saint_movement_articles" title="Category:Template-Class Latter Day Saint movement articles">Template-Class Latter Day Saint movement articles</a></li><li><a href="/wiki/Category:NA-importance_Latter_Day_Saint_movement_articles" title="Category:NA-importance Latter Day Saint movement articles">NA-importance Latter Day Saint movement articles</a></li><li><a href="/wiki/Category:WikiProject_Latter_Day_Saint_movement_articles" title="Category:WikiProject Latter Day Saint movement articles">WikiProject Latter Day Saint movement articles</a></li></ul></div><div id="mw-hidden-catlinks" class="mw-hidden-catlinks mw-hidden-cats-hidden">Hidden category: <ul><li><a href="/wiki/Category:Wikipedia_pages_using_copied_template" title="Category:Wikipedia pages using copied template">Wikipedia pages using copied template</a></li></ul></div></div> </div> </main> </div> <div class="mw-footer-container"> <footer id="footer" class="mw-footer" > <ul id="footer-info"> <li id="footer-info-lastmod"> This page was last edited on 15 June 2024, at 16:08<span class="anonymous-show"> (UTC)</span>.</li> <li id="footer-info-copyright">Text is available under the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Text_of_the_Creative_Commons_Attribution-ShareAlike_4.0_International_License" title="Wikipedia:Text of the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 International License">Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 License</a>; additional terms may apply. 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