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LKML: Horst von Brand: Re: RFC: Starting a stable kernel series off the 2.6 kernel
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Merkey"</a><ul><li><a href="/lkml/2005/12/4/22">Matthias Andree</a><ul><li><a href="/lkml/2005/12/4/24">Arjan van de Ven</a><ul><li><a href="/lkml/2005/12/4/34">Matthias Andree</a></li></ul></li></ul></li><li class="origin"><a href="">Horst von Brand</a></li><li><a href="/lkml/2005/12/4/114">Bernd Petrovitsch</a><ul><li><a href="/lkml/2005/12/4/144">"Jeff V. Merkey"</a><ul><li><a href="/lkml/2005/12/5/23">Bernd Petrovitsch</a></li></ul></li></ul></li></ul></li></ul></li></ul></td><td width="32" rowspan="2" class="c" valign="top"><img src="/images/icornerl.gif" width="32" height="32" alt="/" /></td><td class="c" rowspan="2" valign="top" style="padding-top: 1em"><table><tr><td><table><tr><td class="lp">Subject</td><td class="rp" itemprop="name">Re: RFC: Starting a stable kernel series off the 2.6 kernel</td></tr><tr><td class="lp">Date</td><td class="rp" itemprop="datePublished">Sun, 04 Dec 2005 16:57:04 -0300</td></tr><tr><td class="lp">From</td><td class="rp" itemprop="author">Horst von Brand <></td></tr></table></td><td></td></tr></table><pre itemprop="articleBody">Jeff V. Merkey <jmerkey@wolfmountaingroup.com> wrote:<br />> Matthias Andree wrote:<br />> >On Sat, 03 Dec 2005, Arjan van de Ven wrote:<br /><br />[...]<br /><br />> These folks have nothing new to innovate here. The memory manager and<br />> VM gets revamped every other release.<br /><br />That is a sign of movement. Sure, one can argue if it is random movement of<br />definite progress, but change /is/ a part of innovation.<br /><br />> Exports get broken, binary only<br />> module compatibility busted every rev of the kernel.<br /><br />In-kernel API was /never/ guaranteed, so you have nothing to complain here.<br /><br />> I spend weeks on<br />> each kernel fixing the breakage. These people don't get it,<br /><br />They do get it, and have their reasons to act this way. Reasons you don't<br />get, it seems.<br /><br />> don't care,<br /><br />They do care. But not about the same thing you care about.<br /><br />> and to be honest, you are wasting your time here trying to convince<br />> them.<br /><br />It is /their/ code, with which they are free to do as they wish. If you<br />contribute enough, you get a say in it too; until that time, just be<br />grateful for what you get given freely.<br /><br />> It's never stable because they don't want it to be. This is how<br />> they maintain control of this code.<br /><br />Licensing under GPL while "maintaining control" is a contradiction in<br />terms. If you don't like where the development is going, you are free to<br />fork it. Just the developers won't follow you, as the consensus between<br />them is against your wishes.<br /><br />> I have apps written for Windows in<br />> 1990 and 1998 that still run on Windows XP today.<br /><br />I have programs written in the early 80s that still can be compiled and run<br />on Linux. And AFAIK the very first a.out binaries for Linux still work (I'd<br />assume that setting up the shared libraries for them is a royal pain).<br /><br />I have programs by /Microsoft/ which don't run after Win98, even though<br />they are supposed to run on later versions. <br /><br />Besides, this backward compatibility is exactly one of the major reasons<br />for Windows breakage, they just can't get a clean cut from the past.<br /><br />> Linux has no such<br />> concept of backwards compatiblity.<br /><br />For user programs? Sure is.<br /><br />> Every company who has embraced it<br />> outside of hardware based solutions is dying or has died.<br /><br />So?<br /><br />> IBM is secretly<br />> forking it as we speak and using it to get out of paying for Unix<br />> licenses.<br /><br />Could you please give some kind of evidence for this misbehaviour by IBM?<br /><br />> As annoying as it is, accept it and live with it. These people have no<br />> sense of loyalty to you or your customers. They don't even care about<br />> each other.<br /><br />Right. Their only loyalty is to a better kernel (system). Nothing<br />else. Nobody /ever/ promised anything else, in fact, they have /always/<br />stated that that is their only objective. You definitely haven't gotten<br />shafted.<br /><br />[...]<br /><br />> You are standing on a battlefield. Quietly fork each release, make your<br />> mods, post patches somewhere for the poor civilians who are "collateral<br />> damage" in the war with constantly busted software, and you might help<br />> some folks.<br /><br />This is what distributions do routinely... and the current development<br />model is precisely to /disminish/ the cost of keeping up to date by third<br />parties. In that sense the kernel community /does/ care for them, just that<br />they don't make any promises. Take it or leave it. There are alternatives,<br />like the various BSD flavors. Or even Solaris, or closed Unix variants.<br />-- <br />Dr. Horst H. von Brand User #22616 counter.li.org<br />Departamento de Informatica Fono: +56 32 654431<br />Universidad Tecnica Federico Santa Maria +56 32 654239<br />Casilla 110-V, Valparaiso, Chile Fax: +56 32 797513<br /><br />-<br />To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in<br />the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org<br />More majordomo info at <a href="http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html">http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html</a><br />Please read the FAQ at <a href="http://www.tux.org/lkml/">http://www.tux.org/lkml/</a><br /><br /></pre></td><td width="32" rowspan="2" class="c" valign="top"><img src="/images/icornerr.gif" width="32" height="32" alt="\" /></td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="bottom"> 聽 </td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="bottom">聽</td><td class="c" valign="bottom" style="padding-bottom: 0px"><img src="/images/bcornerl.gif" width="32" height="32" alt="\" /></td><td class="c">聽</td><td class="c" valign="bottom" style="padding-bottom: 0px"><img src="/images/bcornerr.gif" width="32" height="32" alt="/" /></td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top" colspan="2"> 聽 </td><td class="lm">Last update: 2005-12-04 21:47 聽聽 [from the cache]<br />漏2003-2020 <a href="http://blog.jasper.es/"><span itemprop="editor">Jasper Spaans</span></a>|hosted at <a href="https://www.digitalocean.com/?refcode=9a8e99d24cf9">Digital Ocean</a> and my Meterkast|<a href="http://blog.jasper.es/categories.html#lkml-ref">Read the blog</a></td><td>聽</td></tr></table><script language="javascript" src="/js/styleswitcher.js" type="text/javascript"></script></body></html>