CINXE.COM

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd"> <html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xml:lang="en" lang="en"> <head><script type="text/javascript" src="/_static/js/bundle-playback.js?v=HxkREWBo" charset="utf-8"></script> <script type="text/javascript" src="/_static/js/wombat.js?v=txqj7nKC" charset="utf-8"></script> <script>window.RufflePlayer=window.RufflePlayer||{};window.RufflePlayer.config={"autoplay":"on","unmuteOverlay":"hidden"};</script> <script type="text/javascript" src="/_static/js/ruffle/ruffle.js"></script> <script type="text/javascript"> __wm.init("https://web.archive.org/web"); __wm.wombat("http://scienceblogs.com:80/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php?utm_source=mostactive&utm_medium=link","20120113103059","https://web.archive.org/","web","/_static/", "1326450659"); </script> <link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="/_static/css/banner-styles.css?v=S1zqJCYt" /> <link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="/_static/css/iconochive.css?v=3PDvdIFv" />  <script type="text/javascript">var _sf_startpt=(new Date()).getTime()</script> <title>ID's Demise, Revisited : EvolutionBlog</title> <meta name="description" content="I have a general policy of not blogging when I'm on the road, but I couldn't resist poking my head up to call your attention to this article, by Paul Wallace, over at HuffPo. Follow the link to see why......"> <meta name="keywords" content=""/> <link rel="EditURI" type="application/rsd+xml" title="RSD" href="http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/rsd.xml"/> <link rel="alternate" type="application/rss+xml" title="RSS 2.0" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/index.xml"/> <style type="text/css"> /* Prefix all your new classes with div.blogMain to prevent clobbering the global styles; for example: div.blogMain p {font-size: 14px;} */ </style>  <script type="text/javascript" src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059js_/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/mt-site.js"></script> <script type="text/javascript"> window.onload = individualArchivesOnLoad(commenter_name); </script> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"/> <meta http-equiv="Content-Language" content="en-us"/> <meta name="robots" content="NOODP"/> <meta name="MSSmartTagsPreventParsing" content="true"/> <meta http-equiv="imagetoolbar" content="false"/> <link rel="stylesheet" href="/web/20120113103059cs_/http://scienceblogs.com/-/css/screen/main.css" type="text/css" media="screen, projection"/>    <link rel="stylesheet" href="/web/20120113103059cs_/http://scienceblogs.com/-/css/print/main.css" type="text/css" media="print"/> <script type="text/javascript" src="/web/20120113103059js_/http://scienceblogs.com/-/js/global.js"></script> <script type="text/javascript" src="/web/20120113103059js_/http://scienceblogs.com/-/js/jquery.js"></script> <script type="text/javascript" src="/web/20120113103059js_/http://scienceblogs.com/-/js/jquery-functions.js"></script> <script type="text/javascript"> /* RANDOM NUMBER GENERATOR FOR DART */ var axel = Math.random() + ""; var ord = axel * 1000000000000000000; </script>   </head> <body id="blog"> <div class="seedBanner"> <p class="left">Now on ScienceBlogs: <a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/startswithabang/2012/01/did_this_supernova_leave_nothi.php?utm_source=networkbanner&utm_medium=link">Did this Supernova Leave <i>Nothing</i> Behind?</a> </p>  </div> <div id="sbMainContainer"> <div id="topPromoContainer"> <div id="leaderboard">   <script language="JavaScript1.1"> var bust; if (typeof bust == 'undefined') { bust = Math.floor(1000000*Math.random()); } if ((!document.images && navigator.userAgent.indexOf('Mozilla/2.') >= 0) || navigator.userAgent.indexOf("WebTV")>= 0) { document.write('<a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/jump/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_index;sz=728x90;tile=1;ord='+bust+'">'); document.write('<img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/ad/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_index;sz=728x90;tile=1;ord='+bust+'" border="0" height="90" width="728"></a>'); } else { document.write('<scr' + 'ipt language="JavaScript1.1" SRC="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/adj/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_index;dcopt=ist;sz=728x90;tile=1;ord='+bust+'">'); document.write('<a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/jump/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_index;sz=728x90;tile=1;ord='+bust+'">'); document.write('<img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/ad/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_index;sz=728x90;tile=1;ord='+bust+'" border="0" height="90" width="728"></a>'); document.write('</scr' + 'ipt>'); } </script> <noscript> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/jump/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_index;sz=728x90;tile=1;ord=20021017123955"> <img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://ad.doubleclick.net/ad/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_index;sz=728x90;tile=1;ord=20021017123955" border="0" height="90" width="728"></a> </noscript>  </div> <div id="topPromo"> <a class="singleImage" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/bookclub/inside_the_outbreaks/"><img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://scienceblogs.com/promos/bkclb_outbreaks_222x90.gif" alt="ScienceBlogs Book Club: Inside the Outbreaks"/></a> </div>  </div> <div class="globalNav"> <ul id="mainNav"> <li id="hoursNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/24-hours/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Last 24 Hrs</a></li> <li id="lifeNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/life-science/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Life Science</a></li> <li id="physicalNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/physical-science/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Physical Science</a></li> <li id="environmentNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/environment/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Environment</a></li> <li id="humanitiesNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/humanities/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Humanities</a></li> <li id="educationNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/education/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Education</a></li> <li id="politicsNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/politics/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Politics</a></li> <li id="medicineNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/medicine/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Medicine</a></li> <li id="brainNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/brain-and-behavior/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Brain & Behavior</a></li> <li id="technologyNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/technology/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Technology</a></li> <li id="informationNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/information-science/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Information Science</a></li> <li id="jobsNav"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/jobs/?utm_source=globalChannel&utm_medium=link">Jobs</a></li> </ul></div> <div class="blogContainer"> <div class="mainCol"> <div class="blogTop"> <div class="masthead"> <h1><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/" accesskey="1">EvolutionBlog</a></h1> <p>Commentary on the Endless Dispute Between Evolution and Creationism</p> </div> <div class="nav"> <ul> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/">Latest Posts</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/archives.php">Archives</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/about.php">About</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/rss.php">RSS</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/contact.php">Contact</a></li> </ul> </div> </div> <div class="blogLeft"> <h3><span>Profile</span></h3> <p class="profile"> <img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://educ.jmu.edu/~rosenhjd/Photos/dsc_0087.jpg" height="96" width="73"> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.math.jmu.edu/~rosenhjd">Jason Rosenhouse</a> received his PhD in mathematics from <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.math.dartmouth.edu/">Dartmouth College</a> in 2000. He subsequently spent three years as a post-doc at <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.math.ksu.edu/">Kansas State University</a>. Observing the machinations of the Kansas Board of Education led to his unhealthy obsession with issues related to evolution and creationism. Currently he is an Associate Professor of Mathematics at <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.math.jmu.edu/">James Madison University</a>, in Harrisonburg, VA. </p> <br>  <h3><span>Search</span></h3> <form action="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.google.com/cse" onsubmit="document.getElementById('qbox').value=document.getElementById('qbox').value + ' site:http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/';" id="searchbox_017254414699180528062:uyrcvn__yd0" class="blogSearch"> <p><input type="hidden" name="cx" value="017254414699180528062:uyrcvn__yd0"/> <input type="text" name="q" id="qbox"/> <input type="submit" name="sa" value="Search"/></p> </form>  <h3><span>Recent Posts</span><br class="clear"/></h3> <ul class="linkList"> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/a_solution_to_the_17-clue_prob.php">A Solution to the 17-Clue Problem?</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php">ID's Demise, Revisited</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/to_boston.php">To Boston!</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/another_round_on_morality.php">Another Round on Morality</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/eulers_identity_part_two.php">Euler's Identity, Part Two</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/eulers_identity.php">Euler's Identity, Part One</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/a_follow-up_post_about_scienti.php">A Follow-Up Post About Scientism</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/now_available.php">Now Available!</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/emilys_big_day.php">Emily's Big Day</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/pierce_spanks_douthat.php">Pierce Spanks Douthat</a></li> </ul>  <h3><span>Recent Comments</span></h3> <ul class="linkList altLinks"> <li>Owlmirror on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php#c6211023">ID's Demise, Revisited</a></li> <li>Kevin on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php#c6210995">ID's Demise, Revisited</a></li> <li>mikel on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php#c6210972">ID's Demise, Revisited</a></li> <li>Owlmirror on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php#c6210950">ID's Demise, Revisited</a></li> <li>chas on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php#c6210941">ID's Demise, Revisited</a></li> <li>chas on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php#c6210923">ID's Demise, Revisited</a></li> <li>Owlmirror on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/another_round_on_morality.php#c6210887">Another Round on Morality</a></li> <li>Anton Mates on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/another_round_on_morality.php#c6210863">Another Round on Morality</a></li> <li>Owlmirror on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php#c6210859">ID's Demise, Revisited</a></li> <li>Anton Mates on <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/another_round_on_morality.php#c6210848">Another Round on Morality</a></li> </ul>  <h3><span>Archives</span></h3> <ul class="linkList"> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/" target="_main">January 2012</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/" target="_main">December 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/11/" target="_main">November 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/10/" target="_main">October 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/09/" target="_main">September 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/08/" target="_main">August 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/07/" target="_main">July 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/06/" target="_main">June 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/05/" target="_main">May 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/04/" target="_main">April 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/03/" target="_main">March 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/02/" target="_main">February 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/01/" target="_main">January 2011</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/12/" target="_main">December 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/11/" target="_main">November 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/10/" target="_main">October 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/09/" target="_main">September 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/08/" target="_main">August 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/07/" target="_main">July 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/06/" target="_main">June 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/05/" target="_main">May 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/04/" target="_main">April 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/03/" target="_main">March 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/02/" target="_main">February 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2010/01/" target="_main">January 2010</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/12/" target="_main">December 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/11/" target="_main">November 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/10/" target="_main">October 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/09/" target="_main">September 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/08/" target="_main">August 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/07/" target="_main">July 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/06/" target="_main">June 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/05/" target="_main">May 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/04/" target="_main">April 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/03/" target="_main">March 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/02/" target="_main">February 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2009/01/" target="_main">January 2009</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/12/" target="_main">December 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/11/" target="_main">November 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/10/" target="_main">October 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/09/" target="_main">September 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/08/" target="_main">August 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/07/" target="_main">July 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/06/" target="_main">June 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/05/" target="_main">May 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/04/" target="_main">April 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/03/" target="_main">March 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/02/" target="_main">February 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2008/01/" target="_main">January 2008</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/12/" target="_main">December 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/11/" target="_main">November 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/10/" target="_main">October 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/09/" target="_main">September 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/08/" target="_main">August 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/07/" target="_main">July 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/06/" target="_main">June 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/05/" target="_main">May 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/04/" target="_main">April 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/03/" target="_main">March 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/02/" target="_main">February 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2007/01/" target="_main">January 2007</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2006/12/" target="_main">December 2006</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2006/11/" target="_main">November 2006</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2006/10/" target="_main">October 2006</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2006/09/" target="_main">September 2006</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2006/08/" target="_main">August 2006</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2006/07/" target="_main">July 2006</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2006/06/" target="_main">June 2006</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2006/05/" target="_main">May 2006</a></li> </ul> <h3><span>Sites I Like</span></h3> <ul class="linkList"> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.scienceblogs.com/">Science Blogs</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.pandasthumb.org/">Panda's Thumb</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/">P. Z. Myers</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://richarddawkins.net/">Richard Dawkins</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ncseweb.org/">NCSE</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.huffingtonpost.com/">Huffington Post</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://metamagician3000.blogspot.com/">Russell Blackford</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.butterfliesandwheels.org/">Ophelia Benson</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/dispatches/">Ed Brayton</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/">Andrew Sullivan</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://jeffreygoldberg.theatlantic.com/">Jeffrey Goldberg</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/">Jerry Coyne</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/tfk/?utm_source=bloglist&utm_medium=dropdown">Josh Rosenau</a> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/erv/?utm_source=bloglist&utm_medium=dropdown"> Abbie Smith</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://thinkprogress.org/">Think Progress</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/">Paul Krugman</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum">Kevin Drum</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://prospect.org/csnc/blogs/tapped">Tapped</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.tnr.com/blog/theplank">The New Republic</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.nytimes.com/">New York Times</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.politico.com/">Politico</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/www.jpost.com/">Jerusalem Post</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.haaretz.com/">Ha'aretz</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.chesscenter.com/twic/twic.html">The Week in Chess</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.chessninja.com/dailydirt/">Chess Ninja</a> </ul> <h3><span>Science Periodicals</span></h3> <ul class="linkList"> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.seedmediagroup.com/">Seed Magazine</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.sciam.com/">Scientific American</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.sciencemag.org/">Science</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.nature.com/index.html">Nature</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.pnas.org/">Proc. of the Nat. Acad. of Sci.</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.sciencenews.org/">Science News</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.journals.uchicago.edu/QRB/home.html">Quarterly Review of Biology</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.discover.com/">Discover</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.astronomy.com/asy/default.aspx?c=ci&id=24">Astronomy</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.popsci.com/popsci/">Popular Science</a></li> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.naturalhistorymag.com/">Natural History</a></li> </ul> <h3><span>Other Links</span></h3> <p class="profile">  <script type="text/javascript" src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059js_/http://s23.sitemeter.com/js/counter.js?site=s23rosenhouse"> </script>  <br><br><br> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/mt/admin">Log In</a> </p> </div> <div class="blogMain"> <p class="contentNav"> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2011/12/to_boston.php">« To Boston!</a> | <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/">Main</a> | <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/a_solution_to_the_17-clue_prob.php">A Solution to the 17-Clue Problem? »</a> </p> <h2><a id="a181352" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php">ID's Demise, Revisited</a></h2> <p class="categories"> Category: <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/anticreationism/">Anti-Creationism</a><br/> Posted on: January 2, 2012 3:00 PM, by <a href="scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/">Jason Rosenhouse</a> </p> <div class="entry" id="entry-181352"> <p>I have a general policy of not blogging when I'm on the road, but I couldn't resist poking my head up to call your attention <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.huffingtonpost.com/paul-wallace/intelligent-design-is-dea_b_1175049.html?ref=religion">to this article</a>, by Paul Wallace, over at <i>HuffPo</i>. Follow the link to see why...</p> <div id="more"></div> </div> <style>.pm_tools_small .pm_tool {display:block;float:left;height:20px;margin:0 0.5em 8px;}</style> <div class="pm_tools" style="margin-bottom:40px"> <div class="pm_tools_expanded"> <div class="pm_tools_large"> <iframe src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059if_/http://www.facebook.com/plugins/like.php?href=http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php&layout=standard&show_faces=false&width=516&action=like&colorscheme=light&height=35" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" style="border:none; overflow:hidden; width:516px; height:35px;" allowtransparency="true"></iframe> </div> </div> <div class="pm_tools_small" style="margin:0 2px 0 -4px;float:left;width:100%;"> <div class="pm_tool twitter"> <iframe allowtransparency="true" frameborder="0" role="presentation" scrolling="no" src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059if_/http://platform.twitter.com/widgets/tweet_button.html?url=http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php&count=horizontal&text=ID's Demise, Revisited&via=scienceblogs" style="width: 100px; height: 20px;"></iframe> </div> <div class="pm_tool digg"> <script type="text/javascript"> (function() { var s = document.createElement('SCRIPT'), s1 = document.getElementsByTagName('SCRIPT')[0]; s.type = 'text/javascript'; s.async = true; s.src = 'https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://widgets.digg.com/buttons.js'; s1.parentNode.insertBefore(s, s1); })(); </script> <a class="DiggThisButton DiggIcon"></a> </div> <div class="pm_tool reddit"> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://reddit.com/submit?url=http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php&ID's Demise, Revisited=ID's Demise, Revisited" onclick="window.open(this.href,'sharer','toolbar=0,status=0,width=626,height=436');return false;" target="_new"><img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://scienceblogs.com/-/img/icon_reddit.gif" alt="Share on Facebook" id's demise, revisited="Share on Facebook"/></a> </div> <div class="pm_tool stumbleupon"> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.stumbleupon.com/submit?url=http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php&ID's Demise, Revisited=ID's Demise, Revisited" onclick="window.open(this.href,'sharer','toolbar=0,status=0,width=626,height=436');return false;" target="_new"><img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://scienceblogs.com/-/img/icon_stumbleupon.gif" alt="Share on StumbleUpon" id's demise, revisited="Share on StumbleUpon"/></a> </div> <div class="pm_tool fbshare"> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.facebook.com/sharer.php?u=http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/ids_demise_revisited.php&t=ID's Demise, Revisited" onclick="window.open(this.href,'sharer','toolbar=0,status=0,width=626,height=436');return false;" target="_new"><img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://scienceblogs.com/-/img/icon_facebook.gif" alt="Share on Facebook" id's demise, revisited="Share on Facebook"/></a> </div> </div> </div> <div id="flairBar"><span class="channelLinks">Find more posts in: <a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/life_science/?utm_source=channelLink&utm_medium=virallink" class="life_science"><img src="/web/20120113103059im_/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/img/channelLinks/icon_life_science.gif" alt=""/>Life Science</a></span></div>  <div id="comments" class="comments"> <div class="comments-content"> <h3 class="metaHeader">Comments</h3> <a id="c6205677"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6205677"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">1</span> <p>From the article: <i>The universe has been designed; therefore it must be comprehensible.</i></p> <p>Really, it's far more parsimonious to assign <i>comprehension</i> as an ability of a brain than to assign <i>comprehensibility</i> as an intrinsic property of the entire universe.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: AL | <a href="#comment-6205677">January 2, 2012 11:14 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6205700"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6205700"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">2</span> <p>Can't resist... lull of materialism... have... no... strong bulwark!</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: pough | <a href="#comment-6205700">January 3, 2012 12:13 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6205702"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6205702"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">3</span> <blockquote>Really, it's far more parsimonious to assign <i>comprehension</i> as an ability of a brain than to assign <i>comprehensibility</i> as an intrinsic property of the entire universe.</blockquote> <p>That reminds me of something I've seen posted about the argument from design, in its most general form:</p> <blockquote><i>Because matter has no goals or intentions of its own, the logical explanation for the fact that matter seems to behave "as if" it is being driven to an end, is that this apparent teleology is an artifact of the human mind which is doing the interpreting. This is the simplest solution to the disconnect. The goals and intentions are being </i>read into<i> a situation. What you are seeing at work is not the Mind of God -- it's the mind of man. Your own mind. Both you, and Aquinas, are anthropomorphizing nature, and have mistaken yourselves, for God.</i></blockquote> -- <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2010/03/episode_xliv_oooh_look_sniny_n.php#comment-2390250" rel="nofollow">Sastra</a> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6205702">January 3, 2012 12:15 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6206029"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6206029"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">4</span> <p>So no more silly self adaptive mutation designing either, right?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: cwfong | <a href="#comment-6206029">January 3, 2012 12:45 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6206156"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6206156"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">5</span> <p>One has to wonder (well, at least I do), if it wasn't really reason and evidence rather than religious faith which led Kepler to reject special acts of creation as an explanation (regardless of how he stated his opinion in socially acceptable terms). I can see the worthlessness of "god did it" as an explanation, and Kepler was smarter than I am. On the other hand, I have the benefit of knowing a lot more about all the natural mechanisms which explain things like novas. Still, I don't see a lot of merit in (to paraphrase), "The universe is comprehensible, therefore god." Who says the universe is comprehensible? It isn't to a chimpanzee, and there, but for the grace of evolution, go I. </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: JimV | <a href="#comment-6206156">January 3, 2012 5:32 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6206426"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6206426"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">6</span> <p>Accommodationism vs. fundamentalism: the semi-rational position vs. the completely irrational position.</p> <p>Wallace says that religious people (have) a context that allows them to take science seriously but not too seriously. My view is that he takes science seriously but not seriously enough. </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Dr. I. Needtob Athe | <a href="#comment-6206426">January 4, 2012 7:56 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6209371"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6209371"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">7</span> <p>@JimV:</p> <p>"Who says the universe is comprehensible? It isn't to a chimpanzee, and there, but for the grace of evolution, go I."<br/> Although the universe may not be comprehensible to a chimpanzee, we must accept that it is comprehensible by at least humans - otherwise, what good is our rational thinking? I would say that every scientist implicitly says that the universe is comprehensible.</p> <p>FF</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: <a title="http://formicidafantasy.wordpress.com" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://formicidafantasy.wordpress.com/" rel="nofollow">formicidaefantasy</a> | <a href="#comment-6209371">January 9, 2012 10:11 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6209408"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6209408"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">8</span> <p>Jason, keep up the good fight, we need you.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: dsdquilts | <a href="#comment-6209408">January 9, 2012 11:39 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6209878"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6209878"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">9</span> <p>Just trying to catch up on evolution --------</p> <p>Been wondering how did evolution start? Put a little differently, what did we evolve from?</p> <p>Anybody know?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6209878">January 10, 2012 6:41 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6209961"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6209961"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">10</span> <p>Evolution began when the chemistry of the early Earth produced entities that could replicate themselves but not always perfectly. Variants that were better at replicating had more "offspring" than those that were less adept. Continue for 3+ billion years and here we are. (Some details omitted for concision.) As for the second question it matters who the we in the question are. If human is meant then <i>Homo sapiens</i> evolved from something <i>H. erectus</i>-ish which in turn evolved from something <i>H. habilus</i>-y etc.. If all modern life is meant then the Last Universal Common Ancestor (LUCA) was a prokaryote (a population of prokaryotes actually) that lived more than 2 billion years ago.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: mikel | <a href="#comment-6209961">January 10, 2012 10:48 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6209970"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6209970"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">11</span> <p>But, I meant do we know how we evolved from nonliving to living beings. Because I assume we have not always been living things.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6209970">January 10, 2012 11:28 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6209989"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6209989"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">12</span> <p>Your vocabulary word for the day is <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abiogenesis" rel="nofollow">abiogenesis</a>. That link should be enough to get you started. Briefly, we don't know a whole lot about it. It is an event that occurred about 3.5 billion years ago plus or minus a few hundred million years under conditions that are poorly understood and that left little or no trace of its occurrence in today's rocks (no fossils obviously). That doesn't mean it's insoluble, just very challenging. Personally, I expect enough progress in my lifetime (I'm 53) to cause creationists to shift from bringing up the subject whenever they can to changing the subject whenever it's brought up. We'll see. </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: mikel | <a href="#comment-6209989">January 11, 2012 12:19 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6209999"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6209999"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">13</span> <p>Sounds like nobody knows what we evolved from or how evolution started.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6209999">January 11, 2012 1:22 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210008"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210008"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">14</span> <p>It is possible that we will never decisively and specifically know the earliest history of life on Earth. Too much evidence may have been purged. This however would not prove creationism true in any way. </p> <p>"We don't know" therefore "God" is no kind of proof.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: MobiusKlein | <a href="#comment-6210008">January 11, 2012 2:06 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210114"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210114"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">15</span> <p>"Sounds like nobody knows what we evolved from or how evolution started."</p> <p>Nobody knows how the sun got started either.</p> <p>Doesn't mean that hot burny thing doesn't exist.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Wow | <a href="#comment-6210114">January 11, 2012 7:47 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210145"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210145"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">16</span> <p>Chas: "Sounds like nobody knows what we evolved from or how evolution started."</p> <p>In some ways yes, in some ways, no. Pretty much every non-creationist scientist is going to agree we evolved from more basic organic molecules, since organic molecules make up an overwhelming amount of what life is, and because they have been shown to form in nature. AFAIK, nobody is claiming the first replicators were silicon-based or anything else.</p> <p>And "how evolution started" is a wierd question. The process of descent with modification via natural selection didn't need anything to invent it per se - its a consequence of having imperfect replicators competing over resources. Asking how that started is like asking how falling started - its a consequence of mass and gravity. How did the first replicators arise out of nonreplicating precursors, and what did those replicators look like - those are better questions.<br/> </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: eric | <a href="#comment-6210145">January 11, 2012 9:51 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210236"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210236"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">17</span> <blockquote>Nobody knows how the sun got started either.</blockquote> <p>Actually we have very good theories and models for stellar evolution and stellar lifecycle. You are only pedantically correct that we don't "know" it.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: heddle | <a href="#comment-6210236">January 11, 2012 2:08 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210303"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210303"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">18</span> <p>"Nobody knows how the sun got started either."</p> <p>Ever heard of the "Big Bang"?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210303">January 11, 2012 4:26 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210310"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210310"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">19</span> <p>"And "how evolution started" is a wierd question"</p> <p>But if you don't know how Evolution started how do you know Evolution is not really Creation?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210310">January 11, 2012 4:48 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210327"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210327"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">20</span> <p>Also, nobody knows what Julius Caesar had for breakfast on the Ides of March. Therefore, how do we know that Rome really existed? {/snark}</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: NJ | <a href="#comment-6210327">January 11, 2012 5:20 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210372"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210372"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">21</span> <p>"before we come to [special] creation, which puts an end to all discussion, I think we should try everything else." (Wallace quoting Kepler)</p> <p>Behe's theory of irreducible complexity did not put an end to all discussion. On the contrary, it prompted arguments against it. The best argument against it would be evidence of the evolution of the human eye. In the absence of such evidence, what is wrong with offering an alternative, falsifiable hypothesis?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Kevin | <a href="#comment-6210372">January 11, 2012 7:44 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210381"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210381"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">22</span> <p>"Also, nobody knows what Julius Caesar had for breakfast on the Ides of March. Therefore, how do we know that Rome really existed? {/snark"</p> <p>Does this mean that you can prove that what you call Evolution is in fact not really Creation?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210381">January 11, 2012 8:00 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210414"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210414"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">23</span> <blockquote>Behe's theory of irreducible complexity did not put an end to all discussion. On the contrary, it prompted arguments against it. The best argument against it would be evidence of the evolution of the human eye. In the absence of such evidence, what is wrong with offering an alternative, falsifiable hypothesis?</blockquote> <p>I may be misreading you, but it sounds like you're trying to suggest that "ID" is falsifiable, and a scientific hypothesis.</p> <p>This is, quite simply, false.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210414">January 11, 2012 9:31 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210416"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210416"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">24</span> <p>Chas: <i>But if you don't know how Evolution started how do you know Evolution is not really Creation?</i></p> <p>Because, as I said, the process of evolution is a consequence of imperfect replicators competing for resources. </p> <p>To put it another way: evolution started the moment organisms started replicating imperfectly, competing for resources, and reproducing at different rates, because that is what evolution is.<br/> </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: eric | <a href="#comment-6210416">January 11, 2012 9:32 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210422"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210422"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">25</span> <blockquote>But if you don't know how Evolution started how do you know Evolution is not really Creation?</blockquote> <p>It helps if you understand what words <i>mean</i>.</p> <p>This is what evolution means, roughly:</p> <p> — Individual organisms vary in character, one from another.</p> <p> — Some of that variation can be inherited by offspring of the individuals</p> <p> — More offspring are produced than survive.</p> <p> — The organisms that do survive, and reproduce themselves in turn, have inherited variation(s) that give them an advantage.</p> <p>That's the basics, more or less. It leaves out huge amounts of details of genetics, and the differences in environment that make survival contingent on different variation, and different strategies than can give different advantages, and so on. But one of the above would have to be false in order to falsify evolution.</p> <p>So, how does not knowing exactly how it all got started magically change the above into "Creation"?</p> <p>What does "Creation" even mean?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210422">January 11, 2012 9:45 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210437"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210437"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">26</span> <p>eric --- "To put it another way: evolution started the moment organisms started replicating imperfectly, competing for resources, and reproducing at different rates, because that is what evolution is."</p> <p>What organism's? Where did they come from? Was it magic that one moment they were not living & the next moment they were living? To have evolution requires living matter. Yet at one point in time there was no living matter on Earth. <br/> </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210437">January 11, 2012 10:23 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210439"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210439"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">27</span> <blockquote>What organism's? Where did they come from?</blockquote> <p>Did you follow the link at comment number 12 above?</p> <blockquote>Was it magic that one moment they were not living & the next moment they were living?</blockquote> <p>Is it magic when plants grow in the sun? Is it magic when you eat the plants, and grow yourself?</p> <blockquote>Yet at one point in time there was no living matter on Earth. </blockquote> <p>This is true. But living matter is made of non-living matter.<br/> </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210439">January 11, 2012 10:33 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210443"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210443"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">28</span> <p><br/> "So, how does not knowing exactly how it all got started magically change the above into "Creation"?</p> <p>What does "Creation" even mean?"</p> <p>So what does Evolution really mean? That living things have & are changing? But, it has not answered the only real question - evolved from what? If we have evolved we must have evolved from something. What?</p> <p>Creation means a Creator. And until you are able to prove what we evolved from you cannot scientifically rule out a Creator. <br/> </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210443">January 11, 2012 10:47 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210445"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210445"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">29</span> <blockquote>If we have evolved we must have evolved from something. What?</blockquote> <p>How far back do you want to go, anyway?</p> <p>There's a book called <i>The Ancestor's Tale</i>, by Richard Dawkins, which discusses what humans "evolved from", going back pretty far. It's a very thick book, though, and very involved. I'm not sure that it's for you.</p> <p>Did you follow the link at number 12 yet?</p> <blockquote>Creation means a Creator.</blockquote> <p>And what's a Creator? Can you give an example? Where did it come from?</p> <blockquote>And until you are able to prove what we evolved from you cannot scientifically rule out a Creator. </blockquote> <p>You need to to define it a little more rigorously, and explain what it even is, before you get to even suggesting that this whatever-it-is be ruled in. <br/> </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210445">January 11, 2012 10:57 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210485"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210485"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">30</span> <p>Seems to me that you are going to have to be able to explain how living things evolved from nonliving matter before you can rule out a Creator. </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210485">January 12, 2012 1:21 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210491"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210491"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">31</span> <p>Seems to me that you are going to have to define what a Creator is and where it comes from, and why it's even relevant at all.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210491">January 12, 2012 1:42 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210562"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210562"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">32</span> <p>What does my ability to define the Creator have to do with your ability to rule The Creator, any Creator out? What if the Creator is simply beyond human comprehension?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210562">January 12, 2012 8:06 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210580"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210580"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">33</span> <p>> What if the Creator is simply beyond human comprehension?</p> <p>What if it doesn't exist?</p> <p>Far more likely, isn't it.</p> <p>After all, you can't see nothing, you can't test the effect of nothing and can't see nothing's null effect on anything, therefore a nonexistent God would be completely impossible to detect by science or inquiry and would likewise never be caught making miracles happen.</p> <p>I therefore propose that God is nonexistent, since this is completely in accord with NOMA.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Wow | <a href="#comment-6210580">January 12, 2012 8:45 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210586"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210586"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">34</span> <p>"But if you don't know how Evolution started how do you know Evolution is not really Creation?"</p> <p>If you don't know what your creator is, how do you know that your Creator isn't really potato salad?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Wow | <a href="#comment-6210586">January 12, 2012 9:02 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210588"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210588"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">35</span> <p><i>And until you are able to prove what we evolved from you cannot scientifically rule out a Creator.</i></p> <p>This is sounding extremely familiar.</p> <p>Well, first, science rarely 'rules out' anything. It reaches tentative conclusions about the best explanation for observations. Science's current best explanation is always subject to change based on future evidence. Right now the best explanation we have is terrestrial abiogenesis. However, science will replace that hypothesis with another one when someone collects more solid evidence for some other hypothesis. If you have an alternative hypothesis and evidence supporting it, please, share it with us.</p> <p>Secondly, while you are right that science does not rule out a creator, there is no scientific reason to prefer one over any other. Therefore Zeus, therefore Visnu, therefore Yahweh, they are all "not ruled out" in exactly the same manner. When you come to understand why 'not ruled out' is not a good enough reason for you to believe in Vedic creationism, you may understand why the rest of us find it not a good enough reason to believe in Biblical creationism.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: eric | <a href="#comment-6210588">January 12, 2012 9:03 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210591"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210591"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">36</span> <p>"18</p> <p>"Nobody knows how the sun got started either."</p> <p>Ever heard of the "Big Bang"?"</p> <p>Yes.</p> <p>And, unlike you, I know that the sun wasn't started in the Big Bang, it's a population I star, formed billions of years AFTER the decoupling era which itself was long after the Big Bang.</p> <p>And Big Bangs don't produce suns. They produce space-time (universes).</p> <p>I guess you need to know what a word means, not just have heard it, hmm?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Wow | <a href="#comment-6210591">January 12, 2012 9:06 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210595"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210595"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">37</span> <p>"Actually we have very good theories and models for stellar evolution and stellar lifecycle."</p> <p>Actually, we've never seen one happen.</p> <p>We have very good theories and models for the evolution of life and, unlike stars, we can actually get hold of one and examine it closely, and record many lifetimes of such organisms.</p> <p>We haven't even known that the stars were suns long enough to see one evolve.</p> <p>Hence, to someone who proclaims their ignorance about evolution as being poorly understood, Stellar evolution is practically unknown in comparison.</p> <p>PS I note you didn't bother correcting your fellow godbotherer re: Big Bang/Stellar creation.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Wow | <a href="#comment-6210595">January 12, 2012 9:10 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210596"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210596"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">38</span> <p>"Secondly, while you are right that science does not rule out a creator, there is no scientific reason to prefer one over any other"</p> <p>There's absolutely no need to rule one in, either.</p> <p>As Laplace (?) said: I had no need for that hypothesis.</p> <p>What, exactly, does a Creator do that you need to invent one for?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Wow | <a href="#comment-6210596">January 12, 2012 9:13 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210629"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210629"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">39</span> <p><i>Just trying to catch up on evolution</i></p> <p>That's pretty much all chas needs to say. He doesn't know squat, he's asking lazy incoherent questions, ignoring the answers, and spouting non-sequiturs and pretending he's the smartest guy on the thread, even after admitting he's "trying to catch up." Seriously, dude, read some books, and stop insisting every gap in your understanding means "God."</p> <p>Serioously, how do you balance your checkbook? If you see a discrepancy in the numbers, do you automatically conclude it's "God?"</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: <a title="http://motherwell.livejournal.com/" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://motherwell.livejournal.com/" rel="nofollow">Raging Bee</a> | <a href="#comment-6210629">January 12, 2012 10:32 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210631"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210631"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">40</span> <p>Seriously, I'm using the word "seriously" way too much. I seriously apologize.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: <a title="http://motherwell.livejournal.com/" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://motherwell.livejournal.com/" rel="nofollow">Raging Bee</a> | <a href="#comment-6210631">January 12, 2012 10:35 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210672"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210672"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">41</span> <p>Wow,</p> <blockquote>PS I note you didn't bother correcting your fellow godbotherer re: Big Bang/Stellar creation.</blockquote> <p>Well, correcting your scientific illiteracy is sorta full-time.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: heddle | <a href="#comment-6210672">January 12, 2012 12:13 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210674"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210674"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">42</span> <blockquote>What does my ability to define the Creator have to do with your ability to rule The Creator, any Creator out?</blockquote> <p>Science is based on what we <i>do</i> know about reality. It seeks answers in what is <i>well-defined</i>, and for which there is empirical evidence.</p> <p>Scientists studying the origin of life know that life is made of chemicals, and are looking at scenarios in which chemicals reactions that lead to the chemicals of life can occur.</p> <blockquote>What if the Creator is simply beyond human comprehension?</blockquote> <p>If you don't know what it is, and posit that no-one can know what it is, then why are you even bringing it up?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210674">January 12, 2012 12:13 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210703"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210703"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">43</span> <p>"Well, correcting your scientific illiteracy is sorta full-time."</p> <p>Hah! Since you're completely incompetent to do that, I suppose, for you, it IS a "full time" job.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Wow | <a href="#comment-6210703">January 12, 2012 1:06 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210720"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210720"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">44</span> <p>I amazed at all the self proclaimed intelligence on this thread, yet no one knows how life was created. </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210720">January 12, 2012 1:48 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210736"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210736"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">45</span> <blockquote>I amazed at all the self proclaimed intelligence on this thread, yet no one knows how life was created.</blockquote> <p>I guess you're conceding that you have no interest in discussing the issue with any intellectual honesty at all.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210736">January 12, 2012 2:19 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210751"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210751"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">46</span> <p>Is chas completing his assignment for Liberty University? What is the required word count?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: ildi | <a href="#comment-6210751">January 12, 2012 3:17 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210791"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210791"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">47</span> <p><i> I amazed at all the self proclaimed intelligence on this thread, yet no one knows how life was created.</i></p> <p>I'd welcome you telling us your testable hypothesis for how life was created. </p> <p>Until we have solid evidence for one source or another, we must rank the various hypotheses we have by how consistent they are with what we <i>do</i> observe - i.e. based on the evidence we have at hand. </p> <p>We do observe organic chemical reactions producing macromolecules. We don't observe living critters in meteorites. We don't observe intelligent alien agents producing life. So, therefore, we rank organic abiogenesis as more likely than either panspermia or intelligent agency.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: eric | <a href="#comment-6210791">January 12, 2012 4:58 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210805"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210805"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">48</span> <blockquote>I'd welcome you telling us your testable hypothesis for how life was created. </blockquote> <p>Going by what has been written by "chas" so far, the thesis -- hardly a testable or a scientific hypothesis -- seems to be something along the lines that: We can't rule out that something that cannot be defined and may not be definable maybe did something.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210805">January 12, 2012 5:42 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210832"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210832"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">49</span> <p>Its certainly not incomprehensible that there is a creator out there that hasn't given humans the intelligence to define our creator & what the creator did & is doing.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210832">January 12, 2012 6:45 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210859"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210859"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">50</span> <blockquote>Its certainly not incomprehensible that there is a creator out there that hasn't given humans the intelligence to define our creator & what the creator did & is doing.</blockquote> <p>This is incoherent mystical bafflegab. Just because you're confused and unwilling to address your own confusion is no reason to barf your confused ideas out <i>repeatedly</i>. I get that you're confused. I get that you aren't interested in learning anything. I get that you aren't interested in figuring out how you're confused.</p> <p>You can stop repeating your confusion now. You fulfilled your assignment: you posted your pathetic argument from ignorance; you refuse to engage in discussion of your multiple logical fallacies.</p> <p>I'm sure you're very proud of yourself. But isn't that enough?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210859">January 12, 2012 7:51 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210923"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210923"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">51</span> <p>Tell us again how you evolved from nonliving matter.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210923">January 12, 2012 9:53 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210941"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210941"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">52</span> <p>And how long had nonliving matter existed before it evolved into living matter?</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: chas | <a href="#comment-6210941">January 12, 2012 10:52 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210950"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210950"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">53</span> <blockquote>Tell us again how you evolved from nonliving matter.</blockquote> <p>Your brain is in fact made of nonliving matter.</p> <blockquote>And how long had nonliving matter existed before it evolved into living matter?</blockquote> <p>Your nonliving brain can't handle a number that large.<br/> </p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6210950">January 12, 2012 11:17 PM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210972"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6210972"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">54</span> <blockquote>And how long had nonliving matter existed before it evolved into living matter?</blockquote> Somewhere between 9 and 10 billion years. Why do you ask? <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: mikel | <a href="#comment-6210972">January 13, 2012 12:19 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6210995"></a> <div class="comment oddcomment " id="comment-6210995"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">55</span> <p>"I may be misreading you, but it sounds like you're trying to suggest that "ID" is falsifiable, and a scientific hypothesis.</p> <p>This is, quite simply, false."</p> <p>The following hypothesis has been offered as a response to Behe (and has been attributed to Jerry Coyne, writing in the New Republic):<br/> "Thus our eyes did not suddenly appear as full-fledged camera eyes, but evolved from simpler eyes…in ancestral species…. A possible sequence of such changes begins with pigmented eye spots (as seen in flatworms), followed by an invagination of the skin to form a cup protecting the eyespot and allowing it to better localize the image (as in limpets), followed by a further narrowing of the cup’s opening to produce an improved image (the nautilus), followed by the evolution of a protective transparent cover to protect the opening (ragworms), followed by coagulation of part of the fluid in the eyeball into a lens to help focus the light (abalones), followed by the co-opting of nearby muscles to move the lens and vary the focus (mammals). The evolution of a retina, an optic nerve, and so on would follow by natural selection…. And each step of this process is exemplified by the eye of a different living species."</p> <p>Behe's hypothesis is falsifiable by the discovery of evidence of the evolution of the human eye. Coyne's does not appear to be falsifiable, and, at least as stated above, is not supported by evidence.</p> <p>My point was that Behe's theory clearly stimulated discussion, pace Wallace.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Kevin | <a href="#comment-6210995">January 13, 2012 1:57 AM</a></p> </div> </div> <a id="c6211023"></a> <div class="comment evencomment " id="comment-6211023"> <div class="commentContent"> <span class="commentNumber">56</span> <blockquote>Behe's hypothesis is falsifiable by the discovery of evidence of the evolution of the human eye.</blockquote> <p>No, actually it's not.</p> <p>Behe's notion -- it's not a hypothesis -- is that something that is <i>in addition</i> to evolution happened. He doesn't deny the fact of evolution, just the "mechanism" of some aspects of it.</p> <p>So in order to be falsifiable, he would have to specify exactly what that mechanism is, show that the mechanism has definitely occurred, and show that it specifically applies to the cases he claims it applies to. He hasn't done that yet. All he's done is make an argument from ignorance -- that in the absence of knowledge of the specifics of some aspect of biology, his supposed mechanism happened. But an argument from ignorance is a logical fallacy, not a scientific hypothesis.</p> <blockquote>Coyne's does not appear to be falsifiable, and, at least as stated above, is not supported by evidence.</blockquote> <p>Evolution is falsifiable, and has not been falsified, and is indeed supported by evidence. The fact that you have not studied evolutionary biology, and thus make the ludicrous claim that it isn't supported by evidence, is your own argument from ignorance.</p> <p class="commentFooter">Posted by: Owlmirror | <a href="#comment-6211023">January 13, 2012 3:38 AM</a></p> </div> </div> </div> <form method="post" action="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/javascript-is-required-to-comment/" name="comments_form" onsubmit="if (this.bakecookie.checked) rememberMe(this)"> <input type="hidden" name="static" value="1"/> <input type="hidden" name="entry_id" value="181352"/> <div class="comments-open" id="comments-open"> <h3 class="metaHeader">Post a Comment</h3> <p id="trackbackInfo">(Email is required for authentication purposes only. On some blogs, comments are moderated for spam, so your comment may not appear immediately.)</p> <div class="comments-open-content"> <script type="text/javascript"> writeTypeKeyGreeting(commenter_name, 181352); </script> <div id="comments-open-data"> <div id="name-email"> <p> <label for="comment-author">Name:</label><br/> <input id="comment-author" name="author" size="30"/> </p> <p> <label for="comment-email">Email Address:</label><br/> <input id="comment-email" name="email" size="30"/> </p> </div> <p> <label for="comment-url">URL:</label><br/> <input id="comment-url" name="url" size="30"/> </p> <p id="comments-open-text"> <label for="comment-text">Comments: (you may use simple HTML tags for style)</label><br/> <textarea id="comment-text" name="text" rows="10" cols="30"></textarea> </p> <input type="hidden" id="comment-bake-cookie" name="bakecookie" value="0"/> </div> <div id="comments-open-footer" class="comments-open-footer"> <input type="submit" accesskey="v" name="preview" id="comment-preview" value="Preview"/> <input type="submit" accesskey="s" name="post" id="comment-post" value="Post"/> </div> </div> </div> </form> <script language="Javascript">document.comments_form.action = 'ht' + 'tp://scienceblogs.com/mtcomments'; </script> </div> </div> <script type="text/javascript" src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059js_/http://mathcache.s3.amazonaws.com/replacemath.js"></script> <script type="text/javascript"> replaceMath( document.body ); </script> </div> <div id="rightCol"> <div id="rightColInner"> <div id="greenCol"> <h2><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/">ScienceBlogs</a></h2> <h3>Search ScienceBlogs:</h3> <form action="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.google.com/cse" id="searchbox_017254414699180528062:uyrcvn__yd0" class="searchbox"> <input type="hidden" name="cx" value="017254414699180528062:uyrcvn__yd0"/> <input type="text" name="q" class="text"/> <input type="image" src="/web/20120113103059im_/http://scienceblogs.com/-/img/button_search.gif" value="search" alt="search" name="sa"/> </form> <h3>Go to:</h3> <p class="dropdown"><select onchange="location.href=this.options[this.selectedIndex].value + '?utm_source=bloglist&utm_medium=dropdown';"> <option>Choose a blog...</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/worldsciencefestival/">2010 World Science Festival Blog</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/illconsidered/">A Few Things Ill Considered</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/aardvarchaeology/">Aardvarchaeology</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/aetiology/">Aetiology</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/art_of_science_learning/">Art of Science Learning</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/bioephemera/">bioephemera</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com.br/brazillion/">Brazillion Thoughts</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/brookhaven/">Brookhaven Bits & Bytes</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/builtonfacts/">Built on Facts</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/casaubonsbook/">Casaubon's Book</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/classm/">Class M</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/commonknowledge/">Common Knowledge</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/confessions/">Confessions of a Science Librarian</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/corpuscallosum/">The Corpus Callosum</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/deanscorner/">Dean's Corner</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/deltoid/">Deltoid</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/">denialism blog</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/developingintelligence/">Developing Intelligence</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/digitalbio/">Discovering Biology in a Digital World</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/dispatches/">Dispatches from the Culture Wars</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/drugmonkey/">DrugMonkey</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/catdynamics/">Dynamics of Cats</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/erv/">erv</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/evolution/">Evolution for Everyone</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/">EvolutionBlog</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/">Greg Laden's Blog</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/guiltyplanet/">Guilty Planet</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/SETI/">Life at the SETI Institute</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/lifelines/">Life Lines</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/mikethemadbiologist/">Mike the Mad Biologist</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/neurophilosophy/">Neurophilosophy</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/neurotopia/">Neurotopia</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/observations/">Observations of a Nerd</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/omnibrain/">Omni Brain</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/isisthescientist/">On Becoming a Domestic and Laboratory Goddess</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/oscillator/">Oscillator</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/seed/">Page 3.14</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/">Pharyngula</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/photosynthesis/">Photo Synthesis</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/thepumphandle/">The Pump Handle</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/">Respectful Insolence</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/scienceisculture/">Science is Culture</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/bookclub/">The ScienceBlogs Book Club</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/sb/">ScienceBlogs HQ</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/sciencepunk/">SciencePunk</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/scientificactivist/">The Scientific Activist</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/thescian/">The Scientific Indian</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/startswithabang/">Starts With A Bang</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/stoat/">Stoat</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/tetrapodzoology/">Tetrapod Zoology</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/thoughtfulanimal/">The Thoughtful Animal</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/tfk/">Thoughts from Kansas</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/tomorrowstable/">Tomorrow's Table</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/principles/">Uncertain Principles</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/universe/">Universe</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/usasciencefestival/">USA Science and Engineering Festival: The Blog</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/webeasties/">We Beasties</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/weizmann/">The Weizmann Wave</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/worldsfair/">The World's Fair</option> <option value="http://scienceblogs.com/zooillogix/">Zooillogix</option> </select></p> <div id="sliders"> <h3 id="channelsLink">Channels</h3> <ul id="channelsList" class="topList"> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/24-hours/">Last 24 Hours</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/life-science/">Life Science</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/physical-science/">Physical Science</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/environment/">Environment</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/humanities/">Humanities & Social Science</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/education/">Education</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/politics/">Politics</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/medicine/">Medicine & Health</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/brain-and-behavior/">Brain & Behavior</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/technology/">Technology</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/information-science/">Information Science</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/jobs/">Jobs</a></li> </ul> <h3 id="rssLink">RSS Feeds</h3> <ul id="rssList" class="topList"> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/sample/editors-feed.xml">ScienceBlogs Select</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/sample/combined.xml">The Combined Feed</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/sample/peer-review.xml">Peer Review on Sb</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/sample/sb-news.xml">News-Related Posts</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/rss.php">All Feeds</a></li> </ul> <h3 id="moreLink">More ScienceBlogs</h3> <ul id="moreList" class="topList"> <li><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://twitter.com/scienceblogs/"><span class="new">New!</span> Sb on Twitter</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/email.php">Email Alerts</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/newsletter/subscribe.php">Weekly Newsletter</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/shop/">The ScienceBlogs Shop</a></li> <li><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/comments/">The Latest Comments</a></li> </ul> </div>  <div style="margin:0; text-align:center;"> <iframe src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059if_/http://www.facebook.com/plugins/likebox.php?id=256321580087&width=160&connections=3&stream=false&header=false&width=190&height=200&border=false" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" style="border:none; overflow:hidden; width:190px; height:200px;" allowtransparency="true"></iframe>  </div> <div class="skyscraper"> Advertisement <div class="adHolder">   <script language="JavaScript1.1"> var bust; if (typeof bust == 'undefined') { bust = Math.floor(1000000*Math.random()); } if ((!document.images && navigator.userAgent.indexOf('Mozilla/2.') >= 0) || navigator.userAgent.indexOf("WebTV")>= 0) { document.write('<a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/jump/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_articles;sz=160x600;tile=3;ord='+bust+'">'); document.write('<img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/ad/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_articles;sz=160x600;tile=3;ord='+bust+'" border="0" height="600" width="160"></a>'); } else { document.write('<scr' + 'ipt language="JavaScript1.1" SRC="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/adj/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_articles;dcopt=;sz=160x600;tile=3;ord='+bust+'">'); document.write('<a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/jump/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_articles;sz=160x600;tile=3;ord='+bust+'">'); document.write('<img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/ad/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_articles;sz=160x600;tile=3;ord='+bust+'" border="0" height="600" width="160"></a>'); document.write('</scr' + 'ipt>'); } </script> <noscript> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://ad.doubleclick.net/jump/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_articles;sz=160x600;tile=3;ord=20021017123955"> <img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://ad.doubleclick.net/ad/ng.scienceblogs/lifescience_articles;sz=160x600;tile=3;ord=20021017123955" border="0" height="600" width="160"></a> </noscript>  </div> </div> <div class="listHolder"> <h3 class="big">Editor's Picks</h3> <ol id="mostGermanList"> <li><b>1</b> <a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/weizmann/2012/01/weizmann_and_max_planck_join_f.php?utm_source=editorspicks">Weizmann and Max Planck Join Forces in Hi-Tech Archaeology Center</a> <p class="blogTitle"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/weizmann/">the weizmann wave</a> 01.11.2012</p></li> <li><b>2</b> <a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/2012/01/a_solution_to_the_17-clue_prob.php?utm_source=editorspicks">A Solution to the 17-Clue Problem?</a> <p class="blogTitle"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/evolutionblog/">evolutionblog</a> 01.10.2012</p></li> <li><b>3</b> <a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/deanscorner/2012/01/iphone_sausage_making.php?utm_source=editorspicks">iPhone Sausage Making</a> <p class="blogTitle"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/deanscorner/">dean's corner</a> 01.10.2012</p></li> <li><b>4</b> <a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/thepumphandle/2012/01/totally_drug-resistant_tubercu.php?utm_source=editorspicks">Totally drug-resistant tuberculosis cases reported in India</a> <p class="blogTitle"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/thepumphandle/">the pump handle</a> 01.10.2012</p></li> <li><b>5</b> <a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/principles/2012/01/how_to_read_a_scientific_paper.php?utm_source=editorspicks">How to Read a Scientific Paper</a> <p class="blogTitle"><a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/principles/">uncertain principles</a> 01.10.2012</p></li> </ol></div>  <div class="adHolder" style="width: 160px; margin: 0 0 24px 14px;"> <iframe width="160" height="500" style="border:0;overflow:hidden;" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059if_/http://researchblogging.org/widget-request/posts?key=3msu4pf2gqg&tags=life_science;"></iframe></div> <div style="margin-bottom: 24px; text-align: center;"> <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://twitter.com/scienceblogs"><img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://scienceblogs.com/promos/Blogpage_Unit1_twitter.gif" alt="Follow ScienceBlogs on Twitter"/></a> </div> <div class="listHolder" style="display: none;"> <h3 class="big">Science News from <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://nytimes.com/science/">NYTimes.com »</a></h3> <div id="nytimesBlock"> <h3>From NYTimes.com</h3> <p id="top">Latest science stories | <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://nytimes.com/science/">More at nytimes.com<img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/img/icon_arrow_org-right.gif" alt="" style="vertical-align: middle; margin-top: -3px; margin-left: 4px;"/></a></p> <ol id="nytimesList"> <li><b>1</b><a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://feeds.nytimes.com/click.phdo?i=683a83677bff42efa58d647b8fd13beb">Smaller Magnetic Materials Push Boundaries of Nanotechnology</a> <p class="blogTitle"></p></li> <li><b>2</b><a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://feeds.nytimes.com/click.phdo?i=d6597e1a9b0eaf53b7047b3f78cda194">Surgeons Implant Synthetic Trachea in Baltimore Man</a> <p class="blogTitle"></p></li> <li><b>3</b><a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://feeds.nytimes.com/click.phdo?i=4fd1243a04843ebcf642703be63f87c8">Chicago News Cooperative: Robotic Technology to Help Understand and Treat Strokes</a> <p class="blogTitle"></p></li> <li><b>4</b><a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://feeds.nytimes.com/click.phdo?i=0066f39b719d0e1d9903a347d89788dd">About New York: Vision for Cheap Power Even if Indian Point Nuclear Plant Is Closed</a> <p class="blogTitle"></p></li> <li><b>5</b><a class="title" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://feeds.nytimes.com/click.phdo?i=4b50fe9409bdf77500ad2bcbc2672602">Study Ranks Countries on Nuclear Security</a> <p class="blogTitle"></p></li> </ol> </div> </div> <div style="margin-bottom: 24px; text-align: center;"> <script type="text/javascript" language="javascript" src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059js_/http://www.kqzyfj.com/placeholder-4798562?target=_blank&mouseover=Y"></script> </div>   </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> <div id="footerBlock"> <div class="inner"> <p class="blogLinks"><a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/theblogs.php">The Blog Index</a> | <a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/about.php">About ScienceBlogs</a> | <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/mailto:advertising@scienceblogs.com?subject=Advertising%20with%20ScienceBlogs%20inquiry">Advertise with ScienceBlogs</a> | <a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/main/privacy/">Privacy Policy</a> | <a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/main/terms/">Terms & Conditions</a> | <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/main/code/">Code of Conduct</a> | <a href="/web/20120113103059/http://scienceblogs.com/channel/about.php#contact">Contact Us</a></p> <p>© 2006-2011 ScienceBlogs LLC. ScienceBlogs is a registered trademark of ScienceBlogs LLC. All rights reserved.</p>  <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://seedmediagroup.com/" class="smgLink"></a> </div> </div> <script type="text/javascript"> var gaJsHost = (("https:" == document.location.protocol) ? "https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/https://ssl." : "https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www."); document.write(unescape("%3Cscript src='" + gaJsHost + "google-analytics.com/ga.js' type='text/javascript'%3E%3C/script%3E")); </script> <script type="text/javascript"> var pageTracker = _gat._getTracker("UA-163469-3"); pageTracker._initData(); pageTracker._trackPageview(); </script>  <script type="text/javascript" src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059js_/http://edge.quantserve.com/quant.js"></script> <script type="text/javascript"> _qacct="p-99371ybtcwVuI";quantserve();</script> <noscript> <img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://pixel.quantserve.com/pixel/p-99371ybtcwVuI.gif" style="display: none" height="1" width="1" alt="Quantcast"/></noscript>  <input type="hidden" name="OBKey" value="8kVDobuc8+AAEjPuKp2edA=="/> <script language="JavaScript">var OBCTm=1248980629434; </script><script language="JavaScript" src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059js_/http://widgets.outbrain.com/claim.js"> </script>  <script> document.write(unescape("%3Cscript src='" + (document.location.protocol == "https:" ? "https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/https://sb" : "http://b") + ".scorecardresearch.com/beacon.js' %3E%3C/script%3E")); </script> <script> COMSCORE.beacon({ c1:2, c2:3005368, c3:"", c4:"", c5:"", c6:"", c15:"" }); </script> <noscript> <img src="https://web.archive.org/web/20120113103059im_/http://b.scorecardresearch.com/p?c1=2&c2=3005368&c3=&c4=&c5=&c6=&c15=&cj=1"/> </noscript>   <script type="text/javascript"> document.write('<s'+'cript language="JavaSc'+'ript" src="' + document.location.protocol + '//web.archive.org/web/20120113103059/http://www.nationalgeographic.com/stats/ax/nielsen.js"></s'+'cript>'); </script>  </body> </html>