CINXE.COM

<!DOCTYPE html> <html class="client-nojs vector-feature-language-in-header-enabled vector-feature-language-in-main-page-header-disabled vector-feature-sticky-header-disabled vector-feature-page-tools-pinned-disabled vector-feature-toc-pinned-clientpref-1 vector-feature-main-menu-pinned-disabled vector-feature-limited-width-clientpref-1 vector-feature-limited-width-content-enabled vector-feature-custom-font-size-clientpref-1 vector-feature-appearance-pinned-clientpref-1 vector-feature-night-mode-enabled skin-theme-clientpref-day vector-toc-available" lang="en" dir="ltr"> <head> <meta charset="UTF-8"> <title>Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2010 August 6 - Wikipedia</title> <script>(function(){var className="client-js vector-feature-language-in-header-enabled vector-feature-language-in-main-page-header-disabled vector-feature-sticky-header-disabled vector-feature-page-tools-pinned-disabled vector-feature-toc-pinned-clientpref-1 vector-feature-main-menu-pinned-disabled vector-feature-limited-width-clientpref-1 vector-feature-limited-width-content-enabled vector-feature-custom-font-size-clientpref-1 vector-feature-appearance-pinned-clientpref-1 vector-feature-night-mode-enabled skin-theme-clientpref-day vector-toc-available";var cookie=document.cookie.match(/(?:^|; )enwikimwclientpreferences=([^;]+)/);if(cookie){cookie[1].split('%2C').forEach(function(pref){className=className.replace(new RegExp('(^| )'+pref.replace(/-clientpref-\w+$|[^\w-]+/g,'')+'-clientpref-\\w+( |$)'),'$1'+pref+'$2');});}document.documentElement.className=className;}());RLCONF={"wgBreakFrames":false,"wgSeparatorTransformTable":["",""],"wgDigitTransformTable":["",""],"wgDefaultDateFormat":"dmy", "wgMonthNames":["","January","February","March","April","May","June","July","August","September","October","November","December"],"wgRequestId":"223d0794-1b64-42ae-ae8a-e31c81ae3a7c","wgCanonicalNamespace":"Project","wgCanonicalSpecialPageName":false,"wgNamespaceNumber":4,"wgPageName":"Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6","wgTitle":"Reference desk/Archives/Language/2010 August 6","wgCurRevisionId":1136079623,"wgRevisionId":1136079623,"wgArticleId":28314684,"wgIsArticle":true,"wgIsRedirect":false,"wgAction":"view","wgUserName":null,"wgUserGroups":["*"],"wgCategories":[],"wgPageViewLanguage":"en","wgPageContentLanguage":"en","wgPageContentModel":"wikitext","wgRelevantPageName":"Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6","wgRelevantArticleId":28314684,"wgIsProbablyEditable":true,"wgRelevantPageIsProbablyEditable":true,"wgRestrictionEdit":[],"wgRestrictionMove":[],"wgNoticeProject":"wikipedia","wgCiteReferencePreviewsActive":false,"wgFlaggedRevsParams":{ "tags":{"status":{"levels":1}}},"wgMediaViewerOnClick":true,"wgMediaViewerEnabledByDefault":true,"wgPopupsFlags":0,"wgVisualEditor":{"pageLanguageCode":"en","pageLanguageDir":"ltr","pageVariantFallbacks":"en"},"wgMFDisplayWikibaseDescriptions":{"search":true,"watchlist":true,"tagline":false,"nearby":true},"wgWMESchemaEditAttemptStepOversample":false,"wgWMEPageLength":40000,"wgRelatedArticlesCompat":[],"wgCentralAuthMobileDomain":false,"wgEditSubmitButtonLabelPublish":true,"wgDiscussionToolsFeaturesEnabled":{"replytool":true,"newtopictool":true,"sourcemodetoolbar":true,"topicsubscription":false,"autotopicsub":false,"visualenhancements":false,"visualenhancements_reply":false,"visualenhancements_pageframe":false},"wgDiscussionToolsFallbackEditMode":"source","wgULSPosition":"interlanguage","wgULSisCompactLinksEnabled":false,"wgVector2022LanguageInHeader":true,"wgULSisLanguageSelectorEmpty":false,"wgCheckUserClientHintsHeadersJsApi":["brands","architecture","bitness","fullVersionList", "mobile","model","platform","platformVersion"],"GEHomepageSuggestedEditsEnableTopics":true,"wgGETopicsMatchModeEnabled":false,"wgGEStructuredTaskRejectionReasonTextInputEnabled":false,"wgGELevelingUpEnabledForUser":false};RLSTATE={"ext.globalCssJs.user.styles":"ready","site.styles":"ready","user.styles":"ready","ext.globalCssJs.user":"ready","user":"ready","user.options":"loading","ext.discussionTools.init.styles":"ready","oojs-ui-core.styles":"ready","oojs-ui.styles.indicators":"ready","mediawiki.widgets.styles":"ready","oojs-ui-core.icons":"ready","skins.vector.search.codex.styles":"ready","skins.vector.styles":"ready","skins.vector.icons":"ready","ext.wikimediamessages.styles":"ready","ext.visualEditor.desktopArticleTarget.noscript":"ready","ext.uls.interlanguage":"ready","wikibase.client.init":"ready","ext.wikimediaBadges":"ready"};RLPAGEMODULES=["site","mediawiki.page.ready","mediawiki.toc","skins.vector.js","ext.centralNotice.geoIP","ext.centralNotice.startUp", "ext.gadget.ReferenceTooltips","ext.gadget.switcher","ext.urlShortener.toolbar","ext.centralauth.centralautologin","mmv.bootstrap","ext.popups","ext.visualEditor.desktopArticleTarget.init","ext.visualEditor.targetLoader","ext.echo.centralauth","ext.discussionTools.init","ext.eventLogging","ext.wikimediaEvents","ext.navigationTiming","ext.uls.interface","ext.cx.eventlogging.campaigns","ext.checkUser.clientHints"];</script> <script>(RLQ=window.RLQ||[]).push(function(){mw.loader.impl(function(){return["user.options@12s5i",function($,jQuery,require,module){mw.user.tokens.set({"patrolToken":"+\\","watchToken":"+\\","csrfToken":"+\\"}); }];});});</script> <link rel="stylesheet" href="/w/load.php?lang=en&modules=ext.discussionTools.init.styles%7Cext.uls.interlanguage%7Cext.visualEditor.desktopArticleTarget.noscript%7Cext.wikimediaBadges%7Cext.wikimediamessages.styles%7Cmediawiki.widgets.styles%7Coojs-ui-core.icons%2Cstyles%7Coojs-ui.styles.indicators%7Cskins.vector.icons%2Cstyles%7Cskins.vector.search.codex.styles%7Cwikibase.client.init&only=styles&skin=vector-2022"> <script async="" src="/w/load.php?lang=en&modules=startup&only=scripts&raw=1&skin=vector-2022"></script> <meta name="ResourceLoaderDynamicStyles" content=""> <link rel="stylesheet" href="/w/load.php?lang=en&modules=site.styles&only=styles&skin=vector-2022"> <meta name="generator" content="MediaWiki 1.44.0-wmf.4"> <meta name="referrer" content="origin"> <meta name="referrer" content="origin-when-cross-origin"> <meta name="robots" content="max-image-preview:standard"> <meta name="format-detection" content="telephone=no"> <meta name="viewport" content="width=1120"> <meta property="og:title" content="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2010 August 6 - Wikipedia"> <meta property="og:type" content="website"> <link rel="preconnect" href="//upload.wikimedia.org"> <link rel="alternate" media="only screen and (max-width: 640px)" href="//en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6"> <link rel="alternate" type="application/x-wiki" title="Edit this page" href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit"> <link rel="apple-touch-icon" href="/static/apple-touch/wikipedia.png"> <link rel="icon" href="/static/favicon/wikipedia.ico"> <link rel="search" type="application/opensearchdescription+xml" href="/w/rest.php/v1/search" title="Wikipedia (en)"> <link rel="EditURI" type="application/rsd+xml" href="//en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=rsd"> <link rel="canonical" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6"> <link rel="license" href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/deed.en"> <link rel="alternate" type="application/atom+xml" title="Wikipedia Atom feed" href="/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&feed=atom"> <link rel="dns-prefetch" href="//meta.wikimedia.org" /> <link rel="dns-prefetch" href="//login.wikimedia.org"> </head> <body class="ext-discussiontools-replytool-enabled ext-discussiontools-newtopictool-enabled ext-discussiontools-sourcemodetoolbar-enabled skin--responsive skin-vector skin-vector-search-vue mediawiki ltr sitedir-ltr mw-hide-empty-elt ns-4 ns-subject mw-editable page-Wikipedia_Reference_desk_Archives_Language_2010_August_6 rootpage-Wikipedia_Reference_desk skin-vector-2022 action-view"><a class="mw-jump-link" href="#bodyContent">Jump to content</a> <div class="vector-header-container"> <header class="vector-header mw-header"> <div class="vector-header-start"> <nav class="vector-main-menu-landmark" aria-label="Site"> <div id="vector-main-menu-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown vector-main-menu-dropdown vector-button-flush-left vector-button-flush-right" > <input type="checkbox" id="vector-main-menu-dropdown-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-vector-main-menu-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox " aria-label="Main menu" > <label id="vector-main-menu-dropdown-label" for="vector-main-menu-dropdown-checkbox" class="vector-dropdown-label cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet cdx-button--icon-only " aria-hidden="true" ><span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-menu mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-menu"></span> <span class="vector-dropdown-label-text">Main menu</span> </label> <div class="vector-dropdown-content"> <div id="vector-main-menu-unpinned-container" class="vector-unpinned-container"> <div id="vector-main-menu" class="vector-main-menu vector-pinnable-element"> <div class="vector-pinnable-header vector-main-menu-pinnable-header vector-pinnable-header-unpinned" data-feature-name="main-menu-pinned" data-pinnable-element-id="vector-main-menu" data-pinned-container-id="vector-main-menu-pinned-container" data-unpinned-container-id="vector-main-menu-unpinned-container" > <div class="vector-pinnable-header-label">Main menu</div> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-pin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-main-menu.pin">move to sidebar</button> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-unpin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-main-menu.unpin">hide</button> </div> <div id="p-navigation" class="vector-menu mw-portlet mw-portlet-navigation" > <div class="vector-menu-heading"> Navigation </div> <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="n-mainpage-description" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Main_Page" title="Visit the main page [z]" accesskey="z"><span>Main page</span></a></li><li id="n-contents" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Contents" title="Guides to browsing Wikipedia"><span>Contents</span></a></li><li id="n-currentevents" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Portal:Current_events" title="Articles related to current events"><span>Current events</span></a></li><li id="n-randompage" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Special:Random" title="Visit a randomly selected article [x]" accesskey="x"><span>Random article</span></a></li><li id="n-aboutsite" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:About" title="Learn about Wikipedia and how it works"><span>About Wikipedia</span></a></li><li id="n-contactpage" class="mw-list-item"><a href="//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Contact_us" title="How to contact Wikipedia"><span>Contact us</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="p-interaction" class="vector-menu mw-portlet mw-portlet-interaction" > <div class="vector-menu-heading"> Contribute </div> <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="n-help" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Help:Contents" title="Guidance on how to use and edit Wikipedia"><span>Help</span></a></li><li id="n-introduction" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Help:Introduction" title="Learn how to edit Wikipedia"><span>Learn to edit</span></a></li><li id="n-portal" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Community_portal" title="The hub for editors"><span>Community portal</span></a></li><li id="n-recentchanges" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Special:RecentChanges" title="A list of recent changes to Wikipedia [r]" accesskey="r"><span>Recent changes</span></a></li><li id="n-upload" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:File_upload_wizard" title="Add images or other media for use on Wikipedia"><span>Upload file</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </nav> <a href="/wiki/Main_Page" class="mw-logo"> <img class="mw-logo-icon" src="/static/images/icons/wikipedia.png" alt="" aria-hidden="true" height="50" width="50"> <span class="mw-logo-container skin-invert"> <img class="mw-logo-wordmark" alt="Wikipedia" src="/static/images/mobile/copyright/wikipedia-wordmark-en.svg" style="width: 7.5em; height: 1.125em;"> <img class="mw-logo-tagline" alt="The Free Encyclopedia" src="/static/images/mobile/copyright/wikipedia-tagline-en.svg" width="117" height="13" style="width: 7.3125em; height: 0.8125em;"> </span> </a> </div> <div class="vector-header-end"> <div id="p-search" role="search" class="vector-search-box-vue vector-search-box-collapses vector-search-box-show-thumbnail vector-search-box-auto-expand-width vector-search-box"> <a href="/wiki/Special:Search" class="cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet cdx-button--icon-only search-toggle" title="Search Wikipedia [f]" accesskey="f"><span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-search mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-search"></span> <span>Search</span> </a> <div class="vector-typeahead-search-container"> <div class="cdx-typeahead-search cdx-typeahead-search--show-thumbnail cdx-typeahead-search--auto-expand-width"> <form action="/w/index.php" id="searchform" class="cdx-search-input cdx-search-input--has-end-button"> <div id="simpleSearch" class="cdx-search-input__input-wrapper" data-search-loc="header-moved"> <div class="cdx-text-input cdx-text-input--has-start-icon"> <input class="cdx-text-input__input" type="search" name="search" placeholder="Search Wikipedia" aria-label="Search Wikipedia" autocapitalize="sentences" title="Search Wikipedia [f]" accesskey="f" id="searchInput" > <span class="cdx-text-input__icon cdx-text-input__start-icon"></span> </div> <input type="hidden" name="title" value="Special:Search"> </div> <button class="cdx-button cdx-search-input__end-button">Search</button> </form> </div> </div> </div> <nav class="vector-user-links vector-user-links-wide" aria-label="Personal tools"> <div class="vector-user-links-main"> <div id="p-vector-user-menu-preferences" class="vector-menu mw-portlet emptyPortlet" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="p-vector-user-menu-userpage" class="vector-menu mw-portlet emptyPortlet" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> </ul> </div> </div> <nav class="vector-appearance-landmark" aria-label="Appearance"> <div id="vector-appearance-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown " title="Change the appearance of the page's font size, width, and color" > <input type="checkbox" id="vector-appearance-dropdown-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-vector-appearance-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox " aria-label="Appearance" > <label id="vector-appearance-dropdown-label" for="vector-appearance-dropdown-checkbox" class="vector-dropdown-label cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet cdx-button--icon-only " aria-hidden="true" ><span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-appearance mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-appearance"></span> <span class="vector-dropdown-label-text">Appearance</span> </label> <div class="vector-dropdown-content"> <div id="vector-appearance-unpinned-container" class="vector-unpinned-container"> </div> </div> </div> </nav> <div id="p-vector-user-menu-notifications" class="vector-menu mw-portlet emptyPortlet" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="p-vector-user-menu-overflow" class="vector-menu mw-portlet" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="pt-sitesupport-2" class="user-links-collapsible-item mw-list-item user-links-collapsible-item"><a data-mw="interface" href="https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:FundraiserRedirector?utm_source=donate&utm_medium=sidebar&utm_campaign=C13_en.wikipedia.org&uselang=en" class=""><span>Donate</span></a> </li> <li id="pt-createaccount-2" class="user-links-collapsible-item mw-list-item user-links-collapsible-item"><a data-mw="interface" href="/w/index.php?title=Special:CreateAccount&returnto=Wikipedia%3AReference+desk%2FArchives%2FLanguage%2F2010+August+6" title="You are encouraged to create an account and log in; however, it is not mandatory" class=""><span>Create account</span></a> </li> <li id="pt-login-2" class="user-links-collapsible-item mw-list-item user-links-collapsible-item"><a data-mw="interface" href="/w/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&returnto=Wikipedia%3AReference+desk%2FArchives%2FLanguage%2F2010+August+6" title="You're encouraged to log in; however, it's not mandatory. [o]" accesskey="o" class=""><span>Log in</span></a> </li> </ul> </div> </div> </div> <div id="vector-user-links-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown vector-user-menu vector-button-flush-right vector-user-menu-logged-out" title="Log in and more options" > <input type="checkbox" id="vector-user-links-dropdown-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-vector-user-links-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox " aria-label="Personal tools" > <label id="vector-user-links-dropdown-label" for="vector-user-links-dropdown-checkbox" class="vector-dropdown-label cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet cdx-button--icon-only " aria-hidden="true" ><span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-ellipsis mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-ellipsis"></span> <span class="vector-dropdown-label-text">Personal tools</span> </label> <div class="vector-dropdown-content"> <div id="p-personal" class="vector-menu mw-portlet mw-portlet-personal user-links-collapsible-item" title="User menu" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="pt-sitesupport" class="user-links-collapsible-item mw-list-item"><a href="https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:FundraiserRedirector?utm_source=donate&utm_medium=sidebar&utm_campaign=C13_en.wikipedia.org&uselang=en"><span>Donate</span></a></li><li id="pt-createaccount" class="user-links-collapsible-item mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Special:CreateAccount&returnto=Wikipedia%3AReference+desk%2FArchives%2FLanguage%2F2010+August+6" title="You are encouraged to create an account and log in; however, it is not mandatory"><span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-userAdd mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-userAdd"></span> <span>Create account</span></a></li><li id="pt-login" class="user-links-collapsible-item mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&returnto=Wikipedia%3AReference+desk%2FArchives%2FLanguage%2F2010+August+6" title="You're encouraged to log in; however, it's not mandatory. [o]" accesskey="o"><span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-logIn mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-logIn"></span> <span>Log in</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="p-user-menu-anon-editor" class="vector-menu mw-portlet mw-portlet-user-menu-anon-editor" > <div class="vector-menu-heading"> Pages for logged out editors <a href="/wiki/Help:Introduction" aria-label="Learn more about editing"><span>learn more</span></a> </div> <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="pt-anoncontribs" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Special:MyContributions" title="A list of edits made from this IP address [y]" accesskey="y"><span>Contributions</span></a></li><li id="pt-anontalk" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Special:MyTalk" title="Discussion about edits from this IP address [n]" accesskey="n"><span>Talk</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> </div> </div> </nav> </div> </header> </div> <div class="mw-page-container"> <div class="mw-page-container-inner"> <div class="vector-sitenotice-container"> <div id="siteNotice"></div> </div> <div class="vector-column-start"> <div class="vector-main-menu-container"> <div id="mw-navigation"> <nav id="mw-panel" class="vector-main-menu-landmark" aria-label="Site"> <div id="vector-main-menu-pinned-container" class="vector-pinned-container"> </div> </nav> </div> </div> <div class="vector-sticky-pinned-container"> <nav id="mw-panel-toc" aria-label="Contents" data-event-name="ui.sidebar-toc" class="mw-table-of-contents-container vector-toc-landmark"> <div id="vector-toc-pinned-container" class="vector-pinned-container"> <div id="vector-toc" class="vector-toc vector-pinnable-element"> <div class="vector-pinnable-header vector-toc-pinnable-header vector-pinnable-header-pinned" data-feature-name="toc-pinned" data-pinnable-element-id="vector-toc" > <h2 class="vector-pinnable-header-label">Contents</h2> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-pin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-toc.pin">move to sidebar</button> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-unpin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-toc.unpin">hide</button> </div> <ul class="vector-toc-contents" id="mw-panel-toc-list"> <li id="toc-mw-content-text" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1"> <a href="#" class="vector-toc-link"> <div class="vector-toc-text">(Top)</div> </a> </li> <li id="toc-August_6" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-1 vector-toc-list-item-expanded"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#August_6"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1</span> <span>August 6</span> </div> </a> <button aria-controls="toc-August_6-sublist" class="cdx-button cdx-button--weight-quiet cdx-button--icon-only vector-toc-toggle"> <span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-expand"></span> <span>Toggle August 6 subsection</span> </button> <ul id="toc-August_6-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> <li id="toc-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-2"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of""> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1.1</span> <span>Double adjectives following "a pair of"</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">40 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> <li id="toc-Usage_of_"American"" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-3"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Usage_of_"American""> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1.1.1</span> <span>Usage of "American"</span> </div> </a> <ul id="toc-Usage_of_"American"-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-2"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1.2</span> <span>Bringing a language back from extinction</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">14 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-2"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Etymology_of_Yugoslavia"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1.3</span> <span>Etymology of Yugoslavia</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">5 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Japanese" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-2"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Japanese"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1.4</span> <span>Japanese</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">2 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Japanese-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig"" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-2"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig""> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1.5</span> <span>"oly gyenge jellem, hogy mindent elkölt, az utolsó fillérig"</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">1 comment</span> <ul id="toc-"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig"-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-Japanese_help" class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-2"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#Japanese_help"> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1.6</span> <span>Japanese help</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">3 comments</span> <ul id="toc-Japanese_help-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> <li id="toc-"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"..." class="vector-toc-list-item vector-toc-level-2"> <a class="vector-toc-link" href="#"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"..."> <div class="vector-toc-text"> <span class="vector-toc-numb">1.7</span> <span>"The couple <b>is</b>" or "the couple <b>are</b>"...</span> </div> </a> <span class="ext-discussiontools-init-sidebar-meta">14 comments</span> <ul id="toc-"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"...-sublist" class="vector-toc-list"> </ul> </li> </ul> </li> </ul> </div> </div> </nav> </div> </div> <div class="mw-content-container"> <main id="content" class="mw-body"> <header class="mw-body-header vector-page-titlebar"> <nav aria-label="Contents" class="vector-toc-landmark"> <div id="vector-page-titlebar-toc" class="vector-dropdown vector-page-titlebar-toc vector-button-flush-left" > <input type="checkbox" id="vector-page-titlebar-toc-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-vector-page-titlebar-toc" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox " aria-label="Toggle the table of contents" > <label id="vector-page-titlebar-toc-label" for="vector-page-titlebar-toc-checkbox" class="vector-dropdown-label cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet cdx-button--icon-only " aria-hidden="true" ><span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-listBullet mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-listBullet"></span> <span class="vector-dropdown-label-text">Toggle the table of contents</span> </label> <div class="vector-dropdown-content"> <div id="vector-page-titlebar-toc-unpinned-container" class="vector-unpinned-container"> </div> </div> </div> </nav> <h1 id="firstHeading" class="firstHeading mw-first-heading"><span class="mw-page-title-namespace">Wikipedia</span><span class="mw-page-title-separator">:</span><span class="mw-page-title-main">Reference desk/Archives/Language/2010 August 6</span></h1> <div id="p-lang-btn" class="vector-dropdown mw-portlet mw-portlet-lang" > <input type="checkbox" id="p-lang-btn-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-p-lang-btn" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox mw-interlanguage-selector" aria-label="This article exist only in this language. Add the article for other languages" > <label id="p-lang-btn-label" for="p-lang-btn-checkbox" class="vector-dropdown-label cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet cdx-button--action-progressive mw-portlet-lang-heading-0" aria-hidden="true" ><span class="vector-icon mw-ui-icon-language-progressive mw-ui-icon-wikimedia-language-progressive"></span> <span class="vector-dropdown-label-text">Add languages</span> </label> <div class="vector-dropdown-content"> <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> </ul> <div class="after-portlet after-portlet-lang"><span class="uls-after-portlet-link"></span><span class="wb-langlinks-add wb-langlinks-link"><a href="https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Special:NewItem?site=enwiki&page=Wikipedia%3AReference+desk%2FArchives%2FLanguage%2F2010+August+6" title="Add interlanguage links" class="wbc-editpage">Add links</a></span></div> </div> </div> </div> </header> <div class="vector-page-toolbar"> <div class="vector-page-toolbar-container"> <div id="left-navigation"> <nav aria-label="Namespaces"> <div id="p-associated-pages" class="vector-menu vector-menu-tabs mw-portlet mw-portlet-associated-pages" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="ca-nstab-project" class="selected vector-tab-noicon mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6" title="View the project page [c]" accesskey="c"><span>Project page</span></a></li><li id="ca-talk" class="vector-tab-noicon mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6" rel="discussion" class="mw-redirect" title="Discuss improvements to the content page [t]" accesskey="t"><span>Talk</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="vector-variants-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown emptyPortlet" > <input type="checkbox" id="vector-variants-dropdown-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-vector-variants-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox " aria-label="Change language variant" > <label id="vector-variants-dropdown-label" for="vector-variants-dropdown-checkbox" class="vector-dropdown-label cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet" aria-hidden="true" ><span class="vector-dropdown-label-text">English</span> </label> <div class="vector-dropdown-content"> <div id="p-variants" class="vector-menu mw-portlet mw-portlet-variants emptyPortlet" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> </ul> </div> </div> </div> </div> </nav> </div> <div id="right-navigation" class="vector-collapsible"> <nav aria-label="Views"> <div id="p-views" class="vector-menu vector-menu-tabs mw-portlet mw-portlet-views" > <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="ca-view" class="selected vector-tab-noicon mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6"><span>Read</span></a></li><li id="ca-edit" class="vector-tab-noicon mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit" title="Edit this page [e]" accesskey="e"><span>Edit</span></a></li><li id="ca-history" class="vector-tab-noicon mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=history" title="Past revisions of this page [h]" accesskey="h"><span>View history</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> </nav> <nav class="vector-page-tools-landmark" aria-label="Page tools"> <div id="vector-page-tools-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown vector-page-tools-dropdown" > <input type="checkbox" id="vector-page-tools-dropdown-checkbox" role="button" aria-haspopup="true" data-event-name="ui.dropdown-vector-page-tools-dropdown" class="vector-dropdown-checkbox " aria-label="Tools" > <label id="vector-page-tools-dropdown-label" for="vector-page-tools-dropdown-checkbox" class="vector-dropdown-label cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--fake-button--enabled cdx-button--weight-quiet" aria-hidden="true" ><span class="vector-dropdown-label-text">Tools</span> </label> <div class="vector-dropdown-content"> <div id="vector-page-tools-unpinned-container" class="vector-unpinned-container"> <div id="vector-page-tools" class="vector-page-tools vector-pinnable-element"> <div class="vector-pinnable-header vector-page-tools-pinnable-header vector-pinnable-header-unpinned" data-feature-name="page-tools-pinned" data-pinnable-element-id="vector-page-tools" data-pinned-container-id="vector-page-tools-pinned-container" data-unpinned-container-id="vector-page-tools-unpinned-container" > <div class="vector-pinnable-header-label">Tools</div> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-pin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-page-tools.pin">move to sidebar</button> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-unpin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-page-tools.unpin">hide</button> </div> <div id="p-cactions" class="vector-menu mw-portlet mw-portlet-cactions emptyPortlet vector-has-collapsible-items" title="More options" > <div class="vector-menu-heading"> Actions </div> <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="ca-more-view" class="selected vector-more-collapsible-item mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6"><span>Read</span></a></li><li id="ca-more-edit" class="vector-more-collapsible-item mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit" title="Edit this page [e]" accesskey="e"><span>Edit</span></a></li><li id="ca-more-history" class="vector-more-collapsible-item mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=history"><span>View history</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="p-tb" class="vector-menu mw-portlet mw-portlet-tb" > <div class="vector-menu-heading"> General </div> <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="t-whatlinkshere" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Special:WhatLinksHere/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6" title="List of all English Wikipedia pages containing links to this page [j]" accesskey="j"><span>What links here</span></a></li><li id="t-recentchangeslinked" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Special:RecentChangesLinked/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6" rel="nofollow" title="Recent changes in pages linked from this page [k]" accesskey="k"><span>Related changes</span></a></li><li id="t-upload" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:File_Upload_Wizard" title="Upload files [u]" accesskey="u"><span>Upload file</span></a></li><li id="t-specialpages" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/wiki/Special:SpecialPages" title="A list of all special pages [q]" accesskey="q"><span>Special pages</span></a></li><li id="t-permalink" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&oldid=1136079623" title="Permanent link to this revision of this page"><span>Permanent link</span></a></li><li id="t-info" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=info" title="More information about this page"><span>Page information</span></a></li><li id="t-urlshortener" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Special:UrlShortener&url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FWikipedia%3AReference_desk%2FArchives%2FLanguage%2F2010_August_6"><span>Get shortened URL</span></a></li><li id="t-urlshortener-qrcode" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Special:QrCode&url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FWikipedia%3AReference_desk%2FArchives%2FLanguage%2F2010_August_6"><span>Download QR code</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="p-coll-print_export" class="vector-menu mw-portlet mw-portlet-coll-print_export" > <div class="vector-menu-heading"> Print/export </div> <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> <li id="coll-download-as-rl" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Special:DownloadAsPdf&page=Wikipedia%3AReference_desk%2FArchives%2FLanguage%2F2010_August_6&action=show-download-screen" title="Download this page as a PDF file"><span>Download as PDF</span></a></li><li id="t-print" class="mw-list-item"><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&printable=yes" title="Printable version of this page [p]" accesskey="p"><span>Printable version</span></a></li> </ul> </div> </div> <div id="p-wikibase-otherprojects" class="vector-menu mw-portlet mw-portlet-wikibase-otherprojects emptyPortlet" > <div class="vector-menu-heading"> In other projects </div> <div class="vector-menu-content"> <ul class="vector-menu-content-list"> </ul> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </nav> </div> </div> </div> <div class="vector-column-end"> <div class="vector-sticky-pinned-container"> <nav class="vector-page-tools-landmark" aria-label="Page tools"> <div id="vector-page-tools-pinned-container" class="vector-pinned-container"> </div> </nav> <nav class="vector-appearance-landmark" aria-label="Appearance"> <div id="vector-appearance-pinned-container" class="vector-pinned-container"> <div id="vector-appearance" class="vector-appearance vector-pinnable-element"> <div class="vector-pinnable-header vector-appearance-pinnable-header vector-pinnable-header-pinned" data-feature-name="appearance-pinned" data-pinnable-element-id="vector-appearance" data-pinned-container-id="vector-appearance-pinned-container" data-unpinned-container-id="vector-appearance-unpinned-container" > <div class="vector-pinnable-header-label">Appearance</div> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-pin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-appearance.pin">move to sidebar</button> <button class="vector-pinnable-header-toggle-button vector-pinnable-header-unpin-button" data-event-name="pinnable-header.vector-appearance.unpin">hide</button> </div> </div> </div> </nav> </div> </div> <div id="bodyContent" class="vector-body" aria-labelledby="firstHeading" data-mw-ve-target-container> <div class="vector-body-before-content"> <div class="mw-indicators"> </div> <div id="siteSub" class="noprint">From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia</div> </div> <div id="contentSub"><div id="mw-content-subtitle"><div class="subpages">< <bdi dir="ltr"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk">Wikipedia:Reference desk</a></bdi> | <bdi dir="ltr"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives">Archives</a></bdi> | <bdi dir="ltr"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language" class="mw-redirect" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language">Language</a></bdi></div></div></div> <div id="mw-content-text" class="mw-body-content"><div class="mw-content-ltr mw-parser-output" lang="en" dir="ltr"><table width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <th colspan="3" align="center"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Language" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Language">Language desk</a> </th></tr> <tr> <th width="20%" align="left">< <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_5" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2010 August 5">August 5</a> </th> <th width="25%" align="center"><< <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/July_2010" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/July 2010">Jul</a> | <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/August_2010" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/August 2010">August</a> | <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/September_2010" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/September 2010">Sep</a> >> </th> <th width="20%" align="right"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_7" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2010 August 7">August 7</a> > </th></tr></tbody></table> <table align="center" width="95%" style="background: #FFFFFF; border: 1px solid #003EBA;" cellpadding="8" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr> <th style="background: #5D7CBA; text-align: center; font-family:Arial; color:#FFFFFF;"><b>Welcome to the Wikipedia Language Reference Desk Archives</b> </th></tr> <tr> <td>The page you are currently viewing is an archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions on one of the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk">current reference desk</a> pages. </td></tr></tbody></table> <p><br/> </p> <meta property="mw:PageProp/toc"/> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading1"><h1 id="August_6" data-mw-thread-id="h-August_6-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-August_6-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z"></span>August 6<span data-mw-comment-end="h-August_6-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z"></span></h1><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit&section=1" title="Edit section: August 6"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></div> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"" data-mw-thread-id="h-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"-August_6-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z"><span id="Double_adjectives_following_.22a_pair_of.22"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"-August_6-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z"></span>Double adjectives following "a pair of"<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"-August_6-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit&section=2" title="Edit section: Double adjectives following "a pair of""><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><i><a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/08/06/2975186.htm"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of""></span>A pair of Japanese and United States computer whizzes</a> claim to have calculated pi to five trillion decimal places …</i> </p><p>That says to me that both these people had dual nationality or dual citizenship. However, the rest of the story makes clear that one was from Japan, the other from the USA, and there is no mention of dual anything. </p><p>Are there any exceptions to the rule (I assume there is such a rule) that whatever adjectives follow “a pair of” apply equally to both members of the pair? </p><p>Is there an easier way to rephrase the sentence than <i>“A pair of computer whizzes, one from Japan, the other from the United States, claim to have …”</i>? -- (Jack of Oz =) <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/202.142.129.66" title="Special:Contributions/202.142.129.66">202.142.129.66</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:202.142.129.66" title="User talk:202.142.129.66">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:49, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of""><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of""></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z"></span>It's very bad wording, but people make that kind of mistake all the time. You could say "A Japanese and an American computer whiz claim...", but it doesn't sound quite right. (I would never use "United States" as an adjective, either. As much as I hate it, the correct adjective form is "American".) --<a href="/wiki/User:Tango" title="User:Tango">Tango</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Tango" title="User talk:Tango">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:25, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z"></span>If you like the "pair", you could say, "A pair of computer whizzes, one Japanese and one American, claim to have ..." and then maybe wonder what the point would be considering that each decimal place is only 1/10th the magnitude of the previous one. ←<a href="/wiki/User:Baseball_Bugs" title="User:Baseball Bugs">Baseball Bugs</a> <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baseball_Bugs" title="User talk:Baseball Bugs">What's up, Doc?</a></i></sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs" title="Special:Contributions/Baseball Bugs">carrots</a>→ <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:36, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z"></span>If you were talking about a couple (as in two partners in a romantic relationship), I think you could say "a Japanese-American couple", but somehow "a Japanese-American pair of computer whizzes" doesn't seem to work, perhaps because it's less of a unified entitiy than <i>couple</i>?---<a href="/wiki/User:Sluzzelin" title="User:Sluzzelin">Sluzzelin</a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:Sluzzelin" title="User talk:Sluzzelin"><small>talk</small></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:28, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:02:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z"></span>"A Japanese-American couple, Yuki Yamaguchi and Sarah Finkelstein, ..." would leave one in no doubt they were one of each nationality, and which one had which. But "A British-Australian couple, Mary Smith and Brian Jones .. " could easily mean they were both born British, got together in the UK, and moved as a couple to Australia; when the truth may be that Mary was British, and she met her Australian partner Brian while both were holidaying in Majorca. So, it depends. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:02:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:02, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:02:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:02:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z"></span></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T22:06:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z"></span>"Japanese-American" would usually mean an American citizen of Japanese descent (analogous to African-American). --<a href="/wiki/User:Tango" title="User:Tango">Tango</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Tango" title="User talk:Tango">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Tango-2010-08-06T22:06:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:06, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T22:06:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Tango-2010-08-06T22:06:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <p><span class="anchor" id="An_off-topic_excursion_into_semantics_of"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading3"><h3 id="Usage_of_"American"" data-mw-thread-id="h-Usage_of_"American"-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z"><span id="Usage_of_.22American.22"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Usage_of_"American"-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z"></span>Usage of "American"<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Usage_of_"American"-Double_adjectives_following_"a_pair_of"-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z"></span></h3><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit&section=3" title="Edit section: Usage of "American""><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span></div> <dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""></span>Oh, <b>Bugs</b>, if you think the five trillionth decimal in pi is a pointless thing to know, then I'm sorry to say you just haven't got what it takes to be a pure mathematician. <b>Tango</b>, side issue, but what's the objection to "American", apart from any possible confusion with other parts of the Americas (which isn't really a confusion at all since nobody ever refers to Canadians or Mexicans or Uruguayans using the contintental sense of "American")? The country is, after all, the United States of America, not the United States of Anywhere Else. -- <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/202.142.129.66" title="Special:Contributions/202.142.129.66">202.142.129.66</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:202.142.129.66" title="User talk:202.142.129.66">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American"" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:45, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:50:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z"></span>"American", by itself, refers to the USA. Regarding pi, I wonder if they found a "Hi There" message in the middle of it, as postulated in the book that was made into a movie called <i>First Contact</i> or something like that (a Jodie Foster movie). ←<a href="/wiki/User:Baseball_Bugs" title="User:Baseball Bugs">Baseball Bugs</a> <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baseball_Bugs" title="User talk:Baseball Bugs">What's up, Doc?</a></i></sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs" title="Special:Contributions/Baseball Bugs">carrots</a>→ <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:50:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:50, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:50:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:50:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z"></span></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z"></span>That is the objection. "American" ought to mean anyone form the continents of America rather than from one country. (BTW, calculating pi to lots of decimal places has nothing to do with pure maths, it's just a way of showing off how good your computer is.) --<a href="/wiki/User:Tango" title="User:Tango">Tango</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Tango" title="User talk:Tango">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:54, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T03:03:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z"></span>Then what business did the founding fathers have in using the word "America" in the name of the country? Whatever, but they did so use it. Hence "American". "USian" etc just don't wash. -- <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/202.142.129.66" title="Special:Contributions/202.142.129.66">202.142.129.66</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:202.142.129.66" title="User talk:202.142.129.66">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T03:03:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">03:03, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T03:03:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T03:03:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z"></span></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z"></span>Bugs, don't be sidetracked by sillinesses of the 4th kind. Focus on the number itself in all its glory, and be enrichulated. -- <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/202.142.129.66" title="Special:Contributions/202.142.129.66">202.142.129.66</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:202.142.129.66" title="User talk:202.142.129.66">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">02:59, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z"></span>202.142 has a point. Off the top of my head I would say there isn't another country on the continent (nor anywhere else in the world) with "America" in its name. <a href="/wiki/User:Rimush" title="User:Rimush">Rimush</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rimush" title="User talk:Rimush">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:04, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z"></span>There might not be at the moment. But if e.g. <a href="/wiki/Myanmar" title="Myanmar">Myanmar</a> suddenly decided to rename themselves the <a href="/w/index.php?title=United_Republic_of_Asia&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="United Republic of Asia (page does not exist)">United Republic of Asia</a>, would you then accept that the term <a href="/wiki/Asian" class="mw-disambig" title="Asian">Asian</a> then would only apply to persons from there? Hardly. <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/88.131.68.194" title="Special:Contributions/88.131.68.194">88.131.68.194</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:88.131.68.194" title="User talk:88.131.68.194">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:48, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z"></span>Nobody is saying that "American" <b>only</b> refers to people and things from the USA. Of course it can have wider meanings than this. But the USA is the only <b>country</b> whose demonym is "American". As well, context is everything. If a random person says "I am an American", then unless there is some context that indicates to the contrary, that is taken to mean by 100% of people that he is a citizen or national of the USA, not of anywhere else in the world in general, and not of anywhere else in the Americas in particular. This has never been a problem, so it amazes me that of recent times some people have tried to make a problem out of it. Words mean what they <i>do</i> mean, not what someone thinks they <i>should</i> mean. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:59, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z"></span>You're right. I've heard many Europeans refer to the USA as "America". It's common usage. ←<a href="/wiki/User:Baseball_Bugs" title="User:Baseball Bugs">Baseball Bugs</a> <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baseball_Bugs" title="User talk:Baseball Bugs">What's up, Doc?</a></i></sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs" title="Special:Contributions/Baseball Bugs">carrots</a>→ <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:27, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z"></span>And not just Europeans. See <i><a href="/wiki/Coming_to_America" title="Coming to America">Coming to America</a></i>, <i><a href="/wiki/America,_America" class="mw-redirect" title="America, America">America, America</a></i>, <i><a href="/wiki/The_Americanization_of_Emily" title="The Americanization of Emily">The Americanization of Emily</a></i>, <i><a href="/wiki/The_American_President" title="The American President">The American President</a></i>, and numerous other native uses. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:44, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:51:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z"></span>I don't know, but I wonder if the USA was the first nation in the western hemisphere to gain independence from its European counterpart? If so, it would have made sense to glom onto the "America" part. What else would they call it? Washingtonia? ←<a href="/wiki/User:Baseball_Bugs" title="User:Baseball Bugs">Baseball Bugs</a> <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baseball_Bugs" title="User talk:Baseball Bugs">What's up, Doc?</a></i></sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs" title="Special:Contributions/Baseball Bugs">carrots</a>→ <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:51:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">10:51, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:51:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:51:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:08:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z"></span>How are people from the <a href="/wiki/United_Arab_Emirates" title="United Arab Emirates">United Arab Emirates</a> usually referred to? The article lists "<a href="/wiki/Emirati_people" class="mw-redirect" title="Emirati people">Emirati</a>" but also "<a href="/wiki/Arab" class="mw-redirect" title="Arab">Arab</a>" as demonyms. This sort of corresponds with either "Statesian" (or something like that) and "American", doesn't it? ---<a href="/wiki/User:Sluzzelin" title="User:Sluzzelin">Sluzzelin</a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:Sluzzelin" title="User talk:Sluzzelin"><small>talk</small></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:08:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:08, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:08:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:08:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""></span>The basic reality is that there is no convenient English-language single-word true adjective corresponding to Spanish <i>estadounidense</i>, and as long as no such word exists in English, then some other word will have to be pulled in to fill the linguistic gap (currently "American" is used as the gap-filler). Frank Lloyd Wright advocated for the word "<a href="/wiki/Usonian" class="mw-redirect" title="Usonian">Usonian</a>" to fill the gap, but it never really caught on... <a href="/wiki/User:AnonMoos" title="User:AnonMoos">AnonMoos</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AnonMoos" title="User talk:AnonMoos">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American"" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:04, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z"></span>Well, no <i>formal</i> English-language single-word true adjective. Over here in Ukland, we generally use "Yank" as an adjective and noun in casual conversation, unless there are any citizens of the USA actually present :-) . <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/87.81.230.195" title="Special:Contributions/87.81.230.195">87.81.230.195</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:87.81.230.195" title="User talk:87.81.230.195">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:50, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z"></span>Being called a "Yank" by a Brit is a badge of honor. :) ←<a href="/wiki/User:Baseball_Bugs" title="User:Baseball Bugs">Baseball Bugs</a> <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baseball_Bugs" title="User talk:Baseball Bugs">What's up, Doc?</a></i></sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs" title="Special:Contributions/Baseball Bugs">carrots</a>→ <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:54, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z"></span>We've called ourselves "Yank" on occasion, as with <a href="/wiki/Yank,_The_Army_Weekly" class="mw-redirect" title="Yank, The Army Weekly">Yank, The Army Weekly</a> and "I'm a Cranky Old Yank in a Clanky Old Tank on the Streets of Yokohama with my Honolulu Mama Doin' Those Beat-o, Beat-o Flat-On-My-Seat-o, Hirohito Blues", but as a general-purpose "demonym" it's somewhat lacking... <a href="/wiki/User:AnonMoos" title="User:AnonMoos">AnonMoos</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AnonMoos" title="User talk:AnonMoos">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:00, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:30:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z"></span>Soytenly! I'm also thinking of this patriotic American song that goes "Over there / over there / send the word / send the word / over there / that the Yanks are coming / the Yanks are coming / the drums rum-tumming everywhere ... and we won't come back till it's over / over there." ←<a href="/wiki/User:Baseball_Bugs" title="User:Baseball Bugs">Baseball Bugs</a> <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baseball_Bugs" title="User talk:Baseball Bugs">What's up, Doc?</a></i></sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs" title="Special:Contributions/Baseball Bugs">carrots</a>→ <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:30:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:30, 9 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:30:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:30:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z"></span>"Yank" is fine as a noun and as a predicate adjective, but it's a little awkward as a prenominal adjective, or if you try to use it in the comparative and superlative degree... <a href="/wiki/User:AnonMoos" title="User:AnonMoos">AnonMoos</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AnonMoos" title="User talk:AnonMoos">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:57, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z"></span>What's this? "American" a gap-filler? and a temporary one at that? What a load of rubbish, if I may speak bluntly. It is the <i>permanent</i> demonym of the United States of America, and has been since the inception of that country. It is as cemented in as it is possible for any word to be. It is not <i>ever</i> going to be supplanted by any other word, unless they change the name of the country to something that doesn't include the word "America". And is that likely to happen? Well, we don't do crystal ball gazing here, but NO. Get over it, get lives, and move on. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:51, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z"></span>I said nothing about "temporary". However, if there <i>had</i> been a convenient English-language single-word true adjective handy in the 1770s, then "American" probably never would have come into use in that meaning in the first place... <a href="/wiki/User:AnonMoos" title="User:AnonMoos">AnonMoos</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AnonMoos" title="User talk:AnonMoos">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:57, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z"></span>Oh, but that's like saying we call those things we sit on "chairs" because there was no better word available. Isn't it? -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:10, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z"></span>The United Mexican States is Mexico, the Federal Republic of Germany is Germany but the United States of America has no name. I don't think it works like that. <a href="/wiki/User:Rmhermen" title="User:Rmhermen">Rmhermen</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Rmhermen" title="User talk:Rmhermen">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:20, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z"></span>Y'all are missing a key point. There is no <i>other</i> place that is also Mexico. There is no <i>other</i> place that is also Germany. There are many other places that are also in The Americas. Please try to address that in further responses.</dd> <dd><a href="/w/index.php?title=User:DaHorsesMouth&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User:DaHorsesMouth (page does not exist)">DaHorsesMouth</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:DaHorsesMouth" title="User talk:DaHorsesMouth">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:45, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z"></span>OK, but how often are things outside the USA described as "American"? Well, let's see. There's the <a href="/wiki/Organization_of_American_States" title="Organization of American States">Organization of American States</a>. And there are the adjectives for North, Central, Latin and South America, and the Americas in general. Probably a few other uses. But BY FAR the primary use of "American" is in reference to the USA. That is its default meaning, because you need a special context for it mean something else. That's in English. What other languages, particularly Spanish, might choose to do is their own affair. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">03:24, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z"></span>Well, exactly. I always say the English word <i>American</i> and the Spanish word <i>americano</i> are <a href="/wiki/False_friend" title="False friend">false friends</a>. They look and sound similar but have different meanings: the English word <i>American</i> corresponds in meaning to Spanish <i>estadounidense</i>, and the Spanish word <i>americano</i> corresponds to English phrases like <i>New-World</i> or <i>Western-Hemisphere</i> (with hyphens because they're being used attributively) or <i>of the Americas</i>. And anyone who doesn't believe that is invited to ask an English-speaking Canadian if he's an American and see what he says. +<a href="/wiki/User:Angr" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Angr"><b>An</b></a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Angr" class="mw-redirect" title="User talk:Angr"><i>gr</i></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:11, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z"></span>What does German <i>amerikanisch</i> mean? The German-speaking people use the attributive <i>US-amerikanisch</i> to strictly refer to something or someone of or from the United States. --<a href="/wiki/User:Theurgist" title="User:Theurgist">Theurgist</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Theurgist" title="User talk:Theurgist">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:22, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z"></span>Well, when I tell Germans <i>Ich bin Amerikaner</i>, they know I mean I'm specifically from the U.S., not from just anywhere between <a href="/wiki/Alert,_Nunavut" title="Alert, Nunavut">Alert</a> and <a href="/wiki/Ushuaia" title="Ushuaia">Ushuaia</a>. +<a href="/wiki/User:Angr" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Angr"><b>An</b></a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Angr" class="mw-redirect" title="User talk:Angr"><i>gr</i></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:43, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T21:34:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z"></span>Those other "American" contexts are where that handy coinage of mine, 'novomundane', would come into its own, <small> if only someone would bloody well actually use it. The 'Organization of Novomundane States' does have a nice ring. But why stop there? To end the ceaseless confusion, they could rename North (etc) America as North (etc) Novomundania. :) </small> -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T21:34:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:34, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T21:34:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T21:34:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Visite_fortuitement_prolongée-2010-08-08T15:17:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""></span>See also <a href="https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikip%C3%A9dia:Prise_de_d%C3%A9cision/%C3%89tats-unien" class="extiw" title="fr:Wikipédia:Prise de décision/États-unien">fr:Wikipédia:Prise de décision/États-unien</a>. <a href="/wiki/User:Visite_fortuitement_prolong%C3%A9e" title="User:Visite fortuitement prolongée">Visite fortuitement prolongée</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Visite_fortuitement_prolong%C3%A9e" title="User talk:Visite fortuitement prolongée">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Visite_fortuitement_prolongée-2010-08-08T15:17:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American"" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:17, 8 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Visite_fortuitement_prolongée-2010-08-08T15:17:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Visite_fortuitement_prolongée-2010-08-08T15:17:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""></span> </p><p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""></span>By the way, the common Spanish use of <i>norteamericano</i> for <i>estadounidense</i> is also technically inaccurate, and potentially insulting to the inhabitants of Canada, Greenland, and St. Pierre and Miquelon <span typeof="mw:File"><a href="/wiki/File:SFriendly.gif" class="mw-file-description"><img src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/58/SFriendly.gif/20px-SFriendly.gif" decoding="async" width="20" height="20" class="mw-file-element" srcset="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/58/SFriendly.gif/30px-SFriendly.gif 1.5x, //upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/58/SFriendly.gif/40px-SFriendly.gif 2x" data-file-width="54" data-file-height="53"/></a></span> -- <a href="/wiki/User:AnonMoos" title="User:AnonMoos">AnonMoos</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AnonMoos" title="User talk:AnonMoos">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American"" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">11:45, 9 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_"American""></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z"></span>"American" by itself refers to the USA. The Spanish <i>americano</i> means "American", <i>latinoamericano</i> means "Latin American, <i>norteamericano</i> means "North American" (or sometimes "American"), <i>sudamericano</i> means "South American", <i>estadounidense</i> means a citizen of or pertaining to the USA, and is really more like "United Statesian" or the Frank Lloyd Wrightism "USonian" as noted earlier. Maybe it shouldn't be this way, but it is. ←<a href="/wiki/User:Baseball_Bugs" title="User:Baseball Bugs">Baseball Bugs</a> <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baseball_Bugs" title="User talk:Baseball Bugs">What's up, Doc?</a></i></sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs" title="Special:Contributions/Baseball Bugs">carrots</a>→ <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:26, 9 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z"></span>Yes, but using <i>norteamericano</i> in Spanish to refer to an inhabitant of the U.S.A. is theoretically just as insulting to Canadians, Greenlanders, and St.-Pierre-and-Miquelonites as using "American" in English to refer to an inhabitant of the U.S.A. is theoretically insulting to inhabitants of the Americas outside the U.S.A... <a href="/wiki/User:AnonMoos" title="User:AnonMoos">AnonMoos</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AnonMoos" title="User talk:AnonMoos">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:27, 9 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z"></span>"Theoretically insulting"? I don't know about the Spanish part, but as for the "American" thing: How about we wait for someone to claim they've actually been insulted by this, and then take whatever action might be appropriate (which would be none), before spending any of our precious worry time over it. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:58, 9 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Atemperman-2010-08-10T17:37:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z"></span>Does anyone here know whether if you told a Spaniard or an Argentinian or a Mexican, "Soy norteamericano", they would understand it to mean that you're from the U.S. or that you're from the U.S. or Canada? --<a href="/wiki/User:Atemperman" title="User:Atemperman">Atemperman</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Atemperman" title="User talk:Atemperman">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Atemperman-2010-08-10T17:37:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:37, 10 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Atemperman-2010-08-10T17:37:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Atemperman-2010-08-10T17:37:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction" data-mw-thread-id="h-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction-August_6-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction-August_6-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z"></span>Bringing a language back from extinction<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction-August_6-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit&section=4" title="Edit section: Bringing a language back from extinction"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction"></span>What is the longest period of time in which a language went extinct and was revived later on? It seems Cornish was revived 150 years after it went extinct. Also is it possible to speak Gaulish the extinct language of the Celtic gauls of France, today, I'm not sure if it's a written language or not.--<a href="/wiki/User:Queen_Elizabeth_II%27s_Little_Spy" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Queen Elizabeth II's Little Spy">Queen Elizabeth II's Little Spy</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Queen_Elizabeth_II%27s_Little_Spy" class="mw-redirect" title="User talk:Queen Elizabeth II's Little Spy">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">07:55, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z"></span>Just to clarify, by 'revived', do you mean that the language once again began to be spoken as an everyday means of communication, and taught to children as their 'mother tongue', rather than being intelligible to and potentially useable in conversation by just a few expert archeologists and historical linguists, like <a href="/wiki/Sumerian_language" title="Sumerian language">Sumerian</a>? Also, by 'extinct', do you mean that it became <i>totally</i> disused in spoken form, rather than being preserved only as a liturgical language for a period before being reintroduced as a living language, like classical and Modern <a href="/wiki/Hebrew_language" title="Hebrew language">Hebrew?</a> <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Signatures" title="Wikipedia:Signatures">unsigned</a> comment added by <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/87.81.230.195" title="Special:Contributions/87.81.230.195">87.81.230.195</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:87.81.230.195" title="User talk:87.81.230.195">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:26, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a></span><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><dl><dd><small><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:47:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z"></span>Oops! Sorry for not signing. I usually do, honest! <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/87.81.230.195" title="Special:Contributions/87.81.230.195">87.81.230.195</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:87.81.230.195" title="User talk:87.81.230.195">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:47:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">20:47, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span data-mw-comment-end="c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:47:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z"></span></small><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:47:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span></dd></dl></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z"></span>87.81 brings up a good point with the relative nature of "revived." The following doesn't directly answer the original question but I think shows why it's not all that easy to answer.</dd> <dd>Linguist Geoff Pullum wrote on <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/001783.html">The Language Log</a> in 2005 about efforts to revive Cornish. While the following is his (educated) opinion, I think it's a relevant one: <dl><dd><dl><dd>Let me remind you what is necessary for a language to be living: there must be little kids who speak the language with each other because it is their only language or else their favorite. Little kids who would speak it even if they were told not to. It is not enough that a community of grownups (squabbling or not) has learned it from books and reads to each other each Tuesday night in someone's living room...</dd> <dd>Ask around the village and find the age of the youngest people using a language every day for all their normal conversational interaction. If the answer is a number larger than 5, the language is probably dying. If the answer is a number larger than 10, it is very probably doomed. If the answer is a number larger than 20, you can kiss it goodbye right now.</dd></dl></dd></dl></dd> <dd>Pullum refers to a colleague who believes that "traditional Gaeltacht [Irish_language|Irish]" (Gaeilge) will be dead before the middle of the century. Jim McCloskey's <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://158.130.17.5/~myl/languagelog/archives/001768.html">thoughts</a> are more nuanced than I can summarize here. He makes a case for second-language use while making clear that "what is ‘maintained’ or ‘revived’ in this process, is very different indeed from the language which was the original focus of revivalist efforts." --- <a href="/wiki/User:OtherDave" title="User:OtherDave">OtherDave</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:OtherDave" title="User talk:OtherDave">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:52, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Angr-2010-08-06T22:38:00.000Z-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z"></span>That's an interesting article, thanks for the link. (One interesting thing about it is that as recently as 2004, Jim McCloskey still hadn't figured out how to put an acute accent over a vowel on his computer and was still using the vowel + slash kludge people were using in the early 1990s when only ASCII was available.) +<a href="/wiki/User:Angr" class="mw-redirect" title="User:Angr"><b>An</b></a><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Angr" class="mw-redirect" title="User talk:Angr"><i>gr</i></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Angr-2010-08-06T22:38:00.000Z-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:38, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Angr-2010-08-06T22:38:00.000Z-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Angr-2010-08-06T22:38:00.000Z-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><a href="/wiki/Esperanto" title="Esperanto"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Wavelength-2010-08-06T16:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z"></span>Esperanto</a> was brought to life as a language which had never existed.—<a href="/wiki/User:Wavelength" title="User:Wavelength">Wavelength</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Wavelength" title="User talk:Wavelength">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Wavelength-2010-08-06T16:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:26, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Wavelength-2010-08-06T16:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Wavelength-2010-08-06T16:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <hr/> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction"></span>There isn't really a critical mass of surviving long connected texts in Gaulish Celtic, so if you were to try to make it be a full usable language, a lot of speculative filling in of gaps would necessarily be involved. The only language which has been fully resurrected from being the childhood language or birth tongue of nobody to being a well-established language with full recognition from at least one government in the world (i.e. not just the hobby project of a few individuals) is Hebrew. Cornish definitely does not qualify -- its enthusiasts can't even agree which of three competing spelling systems to use... </p><p>Wavelength -- There are a few people who grew up speaking Esperanto (since that was the only language which their mother and father had in common), but there are no real Esperanto monolinguals, and interestingly such childhood native speakers of Esperanto generally end up using a form of the language which is rather divergent from Esperanto as approved by Zamenhoff, so it's hard to say that Esperanto is actually a living language, in any meaningful sense of the term. </p><p>In any case, in censuses of India, there are always a few people who claim to be native Sanskrit speakers... <a href="/wiki/User:AnonMoos" title="User:AnonMoos">AnonMoos</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AnonMoos" title="User talk:AnonMoos">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">16:48, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z"></span>Do you have a source regarding the non-standard use of Esperanto by "native" speakers? Not that I doubt you—I'd just like to read more about it. WP's <a href="/wiki/Esperanto" title="Esperanto">Esperanto</a> and <a href="/wiki/Native_Esperanto_speakers" title="Native Esperanto speakers">Native Esperanto speakers</a> say nothing of it.--<a href="/wiki/User:El_aprendelenguas" title="User:El aprendelenguas">el <b>Apre</b>l</a> (<sup><a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/El_aprendelenguas" title="Special:Contributions/El aprendelenguas">facta</a></sup>-<sub><a href="/wiki/User_talk:El_aprendelenguas" title="User talk:El aprendelenguas">facienda</a></sub>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">03:17, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Nyttend-2010-08-08T00:55:00.000Z-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z"></span>My source was oral folklore among academic linguists, that native Esperanto speakers "creolize" the language to some degree, and that such departures are often looked down upon by those who learned Esperanto as adults -- whereas if Esperanto were a true living language, they would set the direction of future language change (as happened in the early 20th century when early native modern Hebrew speakers departed in some details from classical Biblical/Mishnaic Hebrew). <a href="/wiki/User:AnonMoos" title="User:AnonMoos">AnonMoos</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AnonMoos" title="User talk:AnonMoos">talk</a>) <dl><dd>See <a href="/wiki/Native_Esperanto_speakers" title="Native Esperanto speakers">Native Esperanto speakers</a>. <a href="/wiki/User:Nyttend" title="User:Nyttend">Nyttend</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Nyttend" title="User talk:Nyttend">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Nyttend-2010-08-08T00:55:00.000Z-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">00:55, 8 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Nyttend-2010-08-08T00:55:00.000Z-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Nyttend-2010-08-08T00:55:00.000Z-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z"></span>Wouldn't the <a href="/wiki/Revival_of_the_Hebrew_language" title="Revival of the Hebrew language">revival of the Hebrew language</a> be the best example of this? <a href="/wiki/User:John_M_Baker" title="User:John M Baker">John M Baker</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:John_M_Baker" title="User talk:John M Baker">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:34, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-07T09:53:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z"></span>It was already mentioned several times above... <a href="/wiki/User:AnonMoos" title="User:AnonMoos">AnonMoos</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:AnonMoos" title="User talk:AnonMoos">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-AnonMoos-2010-08-07T09:53:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:53, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-07T09:53:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-AnonMoos-2010-08-07T09:53:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z"></span>Yes, the <a href="/wiki/Revival_of_the_Hebrew_language" title="Revival of the Hebrew language">revival of the Hebrew language</a>, in its literary form with the <a href="/wiki/Haskalah" title="Haskalah">Haskalah</a>, and especially as a spoken language, through <a href="/wiki/Eliezer_Ben-Yehuda" title="Eliezer Ben-Yehuda">Eliezer Ben-Yehuda</a>, is really interesting. It may be an example for the speakers of endangered languages. --<a href="/wiki/User:Keguligh" title="User:Keguligh">Keguligh</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Keguligh" title="User talk:Keguligh">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:35, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z"></span>Just to go back to the original question; the last people who could speak Cornish died towards the end of the 19th Century<a rel="nofollow" class="external autonumber" href="http://www.cornish-language.org/english/faq.asp">[1]</a>, at about the time that the revival began. This page<a rel="nofollow" class="external autonumber" href="http://home.btconnect.com/htm_cornwall/">[2]</a> refers to them as "semi-speakers". The initial aim of the revival was to give access to the Cornish literary canon, hence the strange mix of early and middle strands of the language in the "Unified Cornish" system. It would be like learning English which was a mix of Chaucer, Mallory, Shakespeare and the King James Bible. <a href="/wiki/User:Alansplodge" title="User:Alansplodge">Alansplodge</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Alansplodge" title="User talk:Alansplodge">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">17:45, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><small> <b><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-78.43.71.155-2010-08-08T18:20:00.000Z-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z"></span>Uni</b>fied <b>Corn</b>ish? I smell a bad unicorn pun... -- <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/78.43.71.155" title="Special:Contributions/78.43.71.155">78.43.71.155</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:78.43.71.155" title="User talk:78.43.71.155">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-78.43.71.155-2010-08-08T18:20:00.000Z-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">18:20, 8 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span data-mw-comment-end="c-78.43.71.155-2010-08-08T18:20:00.000Z-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z"></span></small><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-78.43.71.155-2010-08-08T18:20:00.000Z-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Etymology_of_Yugoslavia" data-mw-thread-id="h-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia-August_6-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia-August_6-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z"></span>Etymology of Yugoslavia<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia-August_6-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit&section=5" title="Edit section: Etymology of Yugoslavia"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia"></span>What is the etymology of Yugoslavia? The article does not say?<a href="/wiki/User:Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet" title="User:Ritta Margot Clantagenet">Ritta Margot Clantagenet</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet" title="User talk:Ritta Margot Clantagenet">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:56, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:01:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z"></span>Hmm, if not, it should. Yug-, yugo- and similar terms are commonly found in Slavic languages, meaning "south, southerly". Yugoslavia was the land of the south Slavs. The tennis player <a href="/wiki/Mikhail_Youzhny" title="Mikhail Youzhny">Mikhail Youzhny</a> might otherwise be called Michael South. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:01:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:01, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:01:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:01:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z"></span>See <a href="/wiki/Socialist_Federal_Republic_of_Yugoslavia#Etymology" title="Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia">Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia#Etymology</a>. I agree it should be moved/copied to the "main" article. <a href="/wiki/User:No_such_user" class="mw-redirect" title="User:No such user">No such user</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:No_such_user" title="User talk:No such user">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:02, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T09:03:00.000Z-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z"></span>Thanks a bundle! So fast!<a href="/wiki/User:Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet" title="User:Ritta Margot Clantagenet">Ritta Margot Clantagenet</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet" title="User talk:Ritta Margot Clantagenet">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T09:03:00.000Z-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:03, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T09:03:00.000Z-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T09:03:00.000Z-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-84.46.3.47-2010-08-07T03:31:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia"></span>There is also a <a href="/wiki/List_of_country_name_etymologies" class="mw-redirect" title="List of country name etymologies">list of country name etymologies</a>. (And a <a href="/wiki/List_of_etymologies_of_country_subdivision_names" class="mw-redirect" title="List of etymologies of country subdivision names">list of etymologies of country subdivision names</a>.) --<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/84.46.3.47" title="Special:Contributions/84.46.3.47">84.46.3.47</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:84.46.3.47&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:84.46.3.47 (page does not exist)">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-84.46.3.47-2010-08-07T03:31:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">03:31, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-84.46.3.47-2010-08-07T03:31:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-84.46.3.47-2010-08-07T03:31:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia"></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Japanese" data-mw-thread-id="h-Japanese-August_6-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Japanese-August_6-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z"></span>Japanese<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Japanese-August_6-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit&section=6" title="Edit section: Japanese"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="http://www.gamefreak.co.jp/blog/dir/"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z-Japanese"></span>http://www.gamefreak.co.jp/blog/dir/</a> </p><p>Could someone translate the four most recent entries on there? I tried Google translator (which gave me a lot of gibberish), and the English version on the site is a year out of date. --<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/138.110.206.102" title="Special:Contributions/138.110.206.102">138.110.206.102</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:138.110.206.102" title="User talk:138.110.206.102">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z-Japanese" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:29, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z-Japanese"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z-Japanese"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-06T13:02:00.000Z-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z"></span>That's quite a lot you're asking for... I'll give you the last entry, because it's the shortest, somebody else might have more time on their hands and do the rest: <dl><dd><i>Game Freak is going on summer vacation from tomorrow. </i></dd> <dd><i>Masuda will be in Hawaii from the 12th to the 18th for the WCS!</i></dd> <dd><i>What country will be the first in the world?</i></dd> <dd><i>Check out this site for more: </i></dd> <dd><i><a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="http://www.pokemonworldchampionships.com/2010/">http://www.pokemonworldchampionships.com/2010/</a></i></dd> <dd><i>Ciao!</i></dd></dl></dd> <dd>Hope that starts you off. <a href="/wiki/User:TomorrowTime" title="User:TomorrowTime">TomorrowTime</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:TomorrowTime" title="User talk:TomorrowTime">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-06T13:02:00.000Z-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">13:02, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-06T13:02:00.000Z-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-06T13:02:00.000Z-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id=""oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig"" data-mw-thread-id="h-"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig"-August_6-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z"><span id=".22oly_gyenge_jellem.2C_hogy_mindent_elk.C3.B6lt.2C_az_utols.C3.B3_fill.C3.A9rig.22"></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig"-August_6-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z"></span>"oly gyenge jellem, hogy mindent elkölt, az utolsó fillérig"<span data-mw-comment-end="h-"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig"-August_6-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit&section=7" title="Edit section: "oly gyenge jellem, hogy mindent elkölt, az utolsó fillérig""><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Dweller-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z-"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig""></span>If you understand that, please help answer the question at <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Humanities#what_english_word_expression" title="Wikipedia:Reference desk/Humanities">Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Humanities#what_english_word_expression</a>. Thanks. --<a href="/wiki/User:Dweller" title="User:Dweller">Dweller</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Dweller" title="User talk:Dweller">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Dweller-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z-"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig"" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:41, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Dweller-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z-"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig""><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Dweller-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z-"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig""></span> </p> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id="Japanese_help" data-mw-thread-id="h-Japanese_help-August_6-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-Japanese_help-August_6-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z"></span>Japanese help<span data-mw-comment-end="h-Japanese_help-August_6-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit&section=8" title="Edit section: Japanese help"><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><a rel="nofollow" class="external free" href="http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ds/irbj/index.html"><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z-Japanese_help"></span>http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ds/irbj/index.html</a> </p><p>Click the link under Reshiram (the left one). What do the labels on the map say? --<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/138.110.206.101" title="Special:Contributions/138.110.206.101">138.110.206.101</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:138.110.206.101" title="User talk:138.110.206.101">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z-Japanese_help" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">19:41, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z-Japanese_help"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z-Japanese_help"></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z"></span>I only get an error message for that site. Maybe you could take a screenshot and upload it somewhere? <a href="/wiki/User:TomorrowTime" title="User:TomorrowTime">TomorrowTime</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:TomorrowTime" title="User talk:TomorrowTime">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:57, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Decltype-2010-08-08T12:22:00.000Z-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z"></span>A screenshot can be found <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://www.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?473c16b5f7.jpg">here</a>. There are more labels (the map is scrollable), but you get the idea. <code><a href="/wiki/User:Decltype" title="User:Decltype">decltype</a></code> <small>(<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Decltype" title="User talk:Decltype">talk</a>)</small> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Decltype-2010-08-08T12:22:00.000Z-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">12:22, 8 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Decltype-2010-08-08T12:22:00.000Z-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Decltype-2010-08-08T12:22:00.000Z-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <div class="mw-heading mw-heading2 ext-discussiontools-init-section"><h2 id=""The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"..." data-mw-thread-id="h-"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"...-August_6-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z"><span id=".22The_couple_is.22_or_.22the_couple_are.22..."></span><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="h-"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"...-August_6-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z"></span>"The couple <b>is</b>" or "the couple <b>are</b>"...<span data-mw-comment-end="h-"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"...-August_6-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z"></span></h2><span class="mw-editsection"><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">[</span><a href="/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&action=edit&section=9" title="Edit section: "The couple is" or "the couple are"..."><span>edit</span></a><span class="mw-editsection-bracket">]</span></span><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-bar"><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-metadata"></div><div class="ext-discussiontools-init-section-actions"></div></div></div> <p><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z-"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"..."></span>...expecting their next child? <a href="/wiki/User:Shshshsh" title="User:Shshshsh"><span style="color:blue"><i><b>Shahid</b></i></span></a> • <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Shshshsh" title="User talk:Shshshsh"><span style="color:teal">Talk</span><span style="color:black"><b>2</b></span><span style="color:teal">me</span></a></i></sup> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z-"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"..." class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:04, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z-"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"..."><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z-"The_couple_is"_or_"the_couple_are"..."></span> </p> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z"></span>My understanding is that you use "is" or "was" when referring to the couple as a whole, but "are" or "were" when referring to individual members. For example, "The couple are getting married next week", but "The couple is expecting their next child". Regardless of which verb you use, the pronoun is almost universally "their", not "its". <a href="/wiki/User:Xenon54" title="User:Xenon54">Xenon54</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Xenon54" title="User talk:Xenon54">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:14, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:33:00.000Z-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z"></span>Whoa, hang on a minute there, Xenon54. <i>The couple <b>is</b> expecting <b>their</b> next child</i> - ?? That doesn't sit well in my brain. That's one case where I'd retroactively readjust the verb to agree with the the pronoun. <i>The couple <b>are</b> expecting their next child</i> sounds much more natural, even if it's a joint expectation. Same with cases like <i>The couple is making their travel plans</i> > <i>The couple <b>are</b> making their travel plans</i>, even if they're travelling together at all times. Technical correctness has to take a back seat in such cases. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:33:00.000Z-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:33, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:33:00.000Z-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:33:00.000Z-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z"></span>In British English, we would almost always use the plurals. American English tends to be a little more logical and use singular verbs and pronouns for singular nouns, even if they refer to multiple individuals. For example, in British English we would say "The government <b>are</b> doing a bad job." and in American English they would say "The government <b>is</b> doing a bad job.". --<a href="/wiki/User:Tango" title="User:Tango">Tango</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Tango" title="User talk:Tango">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:19, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z"></span>You're right. Typical usage would be "The couple is..."; not "The couple are..."; although saying it the second way would not be the end of the world. ←<a href="/wiki/User:Baseball_Bugs" title="User:Baseball Bugs">Baseball Bugs</a> <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baseball_Bugs" title="User talk:Baseball Bugs">What's up, Doc?</a></i></sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs" title="Special:Contributions/Baseball Bugs">carrots</a>→ <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:25, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z"></span>That's typical usage <b>in the US</b>. --<a href="/wiki/User:Tango" title="User:Tango">Tango</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Tango" title="User talk:Tango">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">21:43, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z"></span>The US usage is what matters. --<a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/138.110.206.101" title="Special:Contributions/138.110.206.101">138.110.206.101</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:138.110.206.101" title="User talk:138.110.206.101">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">22:33, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl> <dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z"></span>Do you bloody mind? This is the English <b>speaking</b> WP and many others apart from Merkins use it! So the exclusive US interpretation of everything is not welcome!</dd> <dd>BTW, verb should <b>always</b> agree with subject. Therefore: 'The couple is' is correct. Couple is a singular noun.--<a href="/wiki/User:BrianSturgeon" title="User:BrianSturgeon">BrianSturgeon</a> (<a href="/w/index.php?title=User_talk:BrianSturgeon&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:BrianSturgeon (page does not exist)">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:38, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T23:52:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z"></span>I agree, it should, but in British English it doesn't. --<a href="/wiki/User:Tango" title="User:Tango">Tango</a> (<a href="/wiki/User_talk:Tango" title="User talk:Tango">talk</a>) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Tango-2010-08-06T23:52:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">23:52, 6 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Tango-2010-08-06T23:52:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Tango-2010-08-06T23:52:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z"></span></dd> <dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z"></span>But does it always work as a singular noun, Brian? <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=212649">Here</a> are some opinions to the contrary. Sometimes it refers to the multiple individual elements of the set, rather than the set itself. -- <a href="/wiki/User:JackofOz" title="User:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;">Jack of Oz</span></a> <a href="/wiki/User_talk:JackofOz#top" title="User talk:JackofOz"><span style="font-family:Papyrus;"><i> ... speak! ... </i></span></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">07:43, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z"></span>Yes, it is common outside the USA for technically singular group nouns to be used to refer to the members of the group ("the members of the government ..."; "the individuals in the couple ..."). Whilst a singular subject must always take a verb in the singular, the "members of ..." usage is sufficiently common to many speakers of English that they automatically read a plural subject when they see a verb in the plural. This may sound odd to pedants, and to those who are unfamiliar with the idiom, but it reads as perfectly natural and correct as an idiom to those who see it regularly in print. In very formal writing, even in the UK, it would be preferable to re-cast the sentence for the benefit of pedants. <a href="/wiki/User:Dbfirs" title="User:Dbfirs"><i><span style="font-family:verdana;"><span style="color:blue;">D</span><span style="color:#00ccff;">b</span><span style="color:#44ffcc;">f</span><span style="color:#66ff66;">i</span><span style="color:#44ee44;">r</span><span style="color:#44aa44;">s</span></span></i></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:21, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><i><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z"></span>"I saw a couple of people along the road. It was jogging."</i> <a href="/wiki/User:Dbfirs" title="User:Dbfirs"><i><span style="font-family:verdana;"><span style="color:blue;">D</span><span style="color:#00ccff;">b</span><span style="color:#44ffcc;">f</span><span style="color:#66ff66;">i</span><span style="color:#44ee44;">r</span><span style="color:#44aa44;">s</span></span></i></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">09:47, 7 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z"></span>The road was jogging? ←<a href="/wiki/User:Baseball_Bugs" title="User:Baseball Bugs">Baseball Bugs</a> <sup><i><a href="/wiki/User_talk:Baseball_Bugs" title="User talk:Baseball Bugs">What's up, Doc?</a></i></sup> <a href="/wiki/Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs" title="Special:Contributions/Baseball Bugs">carrots</a>→ <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">15:15, 9 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z"></span> <dl><dd><span data-mw-comment-start="" id="c-Dbfirs-2010-08-10T08:31:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z"></span>My point exactly! We expect "couple" to be plural, so we automatically say "they were jogging", at the same time avoiding confusion. <a href="/wiki/User:Dbfirs" title="User:Dbfirs"><i><span style="font-family:verdana;"><span style="color:blue;">D</span><span style="color:#00ccff;">b</span><span style="color:#44ffcc;">f</span><span style="color:#66ff66;">i</span><span style="color:#44ee44;">r</span><span style="color:#44aa44;">s</span></span></i></a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6#c-Dbfirs-2010-08-10T08:31:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z" class="ext-discussiontools-init-timestamplink">08:31, 10 August 2010 (UTC)</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-buttons" data-mw-thread-id="c-Dbfirs-2010-08-10T08:31:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z"><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">[</span><a class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-reply" role="button" tabindex="0" href="">reply</a><span class="ext-discussiontools-init-replylink-bracket">]</span></span><span data-mw-comment-end="c-Dbfirs-2010-08-10T08:31:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z"></span></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl></dd></dl>    </div><noscript><img src="https://login.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:CentralAutoLogin/start?type=1x1" alt="" width="1" height="1" style="border: none; position: absolute;"></noscript> <div class="printfooter" data-nosnippet="">Retrieved from "<a dir="ltr" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&oldid=1136079623">https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&oldid=1136079623</a>"</div></div> <div id="catlinks" class="catlinks catlinks-allhidden" data-mw="interface"></div> </div> </main> </div> <div class="mw-footer-container"> <footer id="footer" class="mw-footer" > <ul id="footer-info"> <li id="footer-info-lastmod"> This page was last edited on 28 January 2023, at 17:07<span class="anonymous-show"> (UTC)</span>.</li> <li id="footer-info-copyright">Text is available under the <a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:Text_of_the_Creative_Commons_Attribution-ShareAlike_4.0_International_License" title="Wikipedia:Text of the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 International License">Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 License</a>; additional terms may apply. By using this site, you agree to the <a href="https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Policy:Terms_of_Use" class="extiw" title="foundation:Special:MyLanguage/Policy:Terms of Use">Terms of Use</a> and <a href="https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Policy:Privacy_policy" class="extiw" title="foundation:Special:MyLanguage/Policy:Privacy policy">Privacy Policy</a>. Wikipedia® is a registered trademark of the <a rel="nofollow" class="external text" href="https://wikimediafoundation.org/">Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.</a>, a non-profit organization.</li> </ul> <ul id="footer-places"> <li id="footer-places-privacy"><a href="https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Policy:Privacy_policy">Privacy policy</a></li> <li id="footer-places-about"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:About">About Wikipedia</a></li> <li id="footer-places-disclaimers"><a href="/wiki/Wikipedia:General_disclaimer">Disclaimers</a></li> <li id="footer-places-contact"><a href="//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Contact_us">Contact Wikipedia</a></li> <li id="footer-places-wm-codeofconduct"><a href="https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Policy:Universal_Code_of_Conduct">Code of Conduct</a></li> <li id="footer-places-developers"><a href="https://developer.wikimedia.org">Developers</a></li> <li id="footer-places-statslink"><a href="https://stats.wikimedia.org/#/en.wikipedia.org">Statistics</a></li> <li id="footer-places-cookiestatement"><a href="https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Policy:Cookie_statement">Cookie statement</a></li> <li id="footer-places-mobileview"><a href="//en.m.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Language/2010_August_6&mobileaction=toggle_view_mobile" class="noprint stopMobileRedirectToggle">Mobile view</a></li> </ul> <ul id="footer-icons" class="noprint"> <li id="footer-copyrightico"><a href="https://wikimediafoundation.org/" class="cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--size-large cdx-button--fake-button--enabled"><img src="/static/images/footer/wikimedia-button.svg" width="84" height="29" alt="Wikimedia Foundation" loading="lazy"></a></li> <li id="footer-poweredbyico"><a href="https://www.mediawiki.org/" class="cdx-button cdx-button--fake-button cdx-button--size-large cdx-button--fake-button--enabled"><img src="/w/resources/assets/poweredby_mediawiki.svg" alt="Powered by MediaWiki" width="88" height="31" loading="lazy"></a></li> </ul> </footer> </div> </div> </div> <div class="vector-settings" id="p-dock-bottom"> <ul></ul> </div><script>(RLQ=window.RLQ||[]).push(function(){mw.config.set({"wgHostname":"mw-web.codfw.main-6d67bf974d-lqzfj","wgBackendResponseTime":143,"wgDiscussionToolsPageThreads":[{"headingLevel":1,"name":"h-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z","type":"heading","level":0,"id":"h-August_6-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z","replies":[{"headingLevel":2,"name":"h-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z","type":"heading","level":0,"id":"h-Double_adjectives_following_\"a_pair_of\"-August_6-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z","author":"202.142.129.66","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z-Double_adjectives_following_\"a_pair_of\"","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z","author":"Tango","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T00:49:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z","author":"Baseball Bugs","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:25:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z","author":"Sluzzelin","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:36:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T22:02:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:02:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T22:06:00.000Z","author":"Tango","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Tango-2010-08-06T22:06:00.000Z-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:28:00.000Z","replies":[]}]}]}]}]},{"headingLevel":3,"name":"h-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z","type":"heading","level":0,"id":"h-Usage_of_\"American\"-Double_adjectives_following_\"a_pair_of\"-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z","author":"202.142.129.66","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_\"American\"","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T02:50:00.000Z","author":"Baseball Bugs","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T02:50:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z","replies":[]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z","author":"Tango","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:45:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T03:03:00.000Z","author":"202.142.129.66","type":"comment","level":6,"id":"c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T03:03:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z","replies":[]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z","author":"202.142.129.66","type":"comment","level":6,"id":"c-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T02:54:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z","author":"Rimush","type":"comment","level":7,"id":"c-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z-202.142.129.66-2010-08-06T02:59:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z","author":"88.131.68.194","type":"comment","level":8,"id":"c-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z-Rimush-2010-08-06T08:04:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":9,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z","author":"Baseball Bugs","type":"comment","level":10,"id":"c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:59:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":11,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:27:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T10:51:00.000Z","author":"Baseball Bugs","type":"comment","level":12,"id":"c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T10:51:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T10:44:00.000Z","replies":[]}],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"}]}],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T11:08:00.000Z","author":"Sluzzelin","type":"comment","level":9,"id":"c-Sluzzelin-2010-08-06T11:08:00.000Z-88.131.68.194-2010-08-06T09:48:00.000Z","replies":[]}]}]}]}]}]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z","author":"AnonMoos","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z-Usage_of_\"American\"","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z","author":"87.81.230.195","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z","author":"Baseball Bugs","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z","author":"AnonMoos","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T20:54:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-09T15:30:00.000Z","author":"Baseball Bugs","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:30:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T23:00:00.000Z","replies":[]}]}]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z","author":"AnonMoos","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:50:00.000Z","replies":[]}]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T17:04:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z","author":"AnonMoos","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:51:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T21:57:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z","author":"Rmhermen","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-06T22:10:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z","author":"DaHorsesMouth","type":"comment","level":6,"id":"c-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z-Rmhermen-2010-08-06T22:20:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":7,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z-DaHorsesMouth-2010-08-06T22:45:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z","author":"Angr","type":"comment","level":8,"id":"c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T03:24:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z","author":"Theurgist","type":"comment","level":9,"id":"c-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:11:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z","author":"Angr","type":"comment","level":10,"id":"c-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z-Theurgist-2010-08-07T09:22:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T21:34:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":11,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T21:34:00.000Z-Angr-2010-08-07T09:43:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"}],"displayName":"An"}]}],"displayName":"An"}],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"}]}]}],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"}]}],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"}]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-08T15:17:00.000Z","author":"Visite fortuitement prolongée","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Visite_fortuitement_prolongée-2010-08-08T15:17:00.000Z-Usage_of_\"American\"","replies":[]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z","author":"AnonMoos","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z-Usage_of_\"American\"","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z","author":"Baseball Bugs","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T11:45:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z","author":"AnonMoos","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:26:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-09T16:27:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-10T17:37:00.000Z","author":"Atemperman","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Atemperman-2010-08-10T17:37:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-09T20:58:00.000Z","replies":[]}],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"}]}]}]}]}]},{"headingLevel":2,"name":"h-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z","type":"heading","level":0,"id":"h-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction-August_6-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z","author":"Queen Elizabeth II's Little Spy","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z","author":"87.81.230.195","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T20:47:00.000Z","author":"87.81.230.195","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T20:47:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z","replies":[]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z","author":"OtherDave","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z-87.81.230.195-2010-08-06T13:26:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T22:38:00.000Z","author":"Angr","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Angr-2010-08-06T22:38:00.000Z-OtherDave-2010-08-06T13:52:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"An"}]}]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T16:26:00.000Z","author":"Wavelength","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Wavelength-2010-08-06T16:26:00.000Z-Queen_Elizabeth_II's_Little_Spy-2010-08-06T07:55:00.000Z","replies":[]}]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z","author":"AnonMoos","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z-Bringing_a_language_back_from_extinction","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z","author":"El aprendelenguas","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-08T00:55:00.000Z","author":"Nyttend","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Nyttend-2010-08-08T00:55:00.000Z-El_aprendelenguas-2010-08-07T03:17:00.000Z","replies":[]}],"displayName":"el Aprel"},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z","author":"John M Baker","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z-AnonMoos-2010-08-06T16:48:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T09:53:00.000Z","author":"AnonMoos","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-AnonMoos-2010-08-07T09:53:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z","replies":[]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z","author":"Keguligh","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z-John_M_Baker-2010-08-06T17:34:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z","author":"Alansplodge","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z-Keguligh-2010-08-06T23:35:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-08T18:20:00.000Z","author":"78.43.71.155","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-78.43.71.155-2010-08-08T18:20:00.000Z-Alansplodge-2010-08-07T17:45:00.000Z","replies":[]}]}]}]}]}]},{"headingLevel":2,"name":"h-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z","type":"heading","level":0,"id":"h-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia-August_6-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z","author":"Ritta Margot Clantagenet","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T09:01:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T09:01:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z","author":"No such user","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T08:56:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T09:03:00.000Z","author":"Ritta Margot Clantagenet","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Ritta_Margot_Clantagenet-2010-08-06T09:03:00.000Z-No_such_user-2010-08-06T09:02:00.000Z","replies":[]}]}]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T03:31:00.000Z","author":"84.46.3.47","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-84.46.3.47-2010-08-07T03:31:00.000Z-Etymology_of_Yugoslavia","replies":[]}]},{"headingLevel":2,"name":"h-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z","type":"heading","level":0,"id":"h-Japanese-August_6-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z","author":"138.110.206.102","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z-Japanese","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T13:02:00.000Z","author":"TomorrowTime","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-06T13:02:00.000Z-138.110.206.102-2010-08-06T12:29:00.000Z","replies":[]}]}]},{"headingLevel":2,"name":"h-Dweller-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z","type":"heading","level":0,"id":"h-\"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig\"-August_6-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z","author":"Dweller","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Dweller-2010-08-06T15:41:00.000Z-\"oly_gyenge_jellem,_hogy_mindent_elkölt,_az_utolsó_fillérig\"","replies":[]}]},{"headingLevel":2,"name":"h-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z","type":"heading","level":0,"id":"h-Japanese_help-August_6-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z","author":"138.110.206.101","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z-Japanese_help","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z","author":"TomorrowTime","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T19:41:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-08T12:22:00.000Z","author":"Decltype","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Decltype-2010-08-08T12:22:00.000Z-TomorrowTime-2010-08-07T08:57:00.000Z","replies":[]}]}]}]},{"headingLevel":2,"name":"h-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z","type":"heading","level":0,"id":"h-\"The_couple_is\"_or_\"the_couple_are\"...-August_6-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z","author":"Shshshsh","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z-\"The_couple_is\"_or_\"the_couple_are\"...","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z","author":"Xenon54","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T21:33:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-06T21:33:00.000Z-Xenon54-2010-08-06T21:14:00.000Z","replies":[],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"}]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z","author":"Tango","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z-Shshshsh-2010-08-06T21:04:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z","author":"Baseball Bugs","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:19:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z","author":"Tango","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-06T21:25:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z","author":"138.110.206.101","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z-Tango-2010-08-06T21:43:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z","author":"BrianSturgeon","type":"comment","level":6,"id":"c-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z-138.110.206.101-2010-08-06T22:33:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-06T23:52:00.000Z","author":"Tango","type":"comment","level":7,"id":"c-Tango-2010-08-06T23:52:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z","replies":[]},{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z","author":"JackofOz","type":"comment","level":7,"id":"c-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z-BrianSturgeon-2010-08-06T23:38:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z","author":"Dbfirs","type":"comment","level":8,"id":"c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z-JackofOz-2010-08-07T07:43:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z","author":"Dbfirs","type":"comment","level":9,"id":"c-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T08:21:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z","author":"Baseball Bugs","type":"comment","level":10,"id":"c-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z-Dbfirs-2010-08-07T09:47:00.000Z","replies":[{"timestamp":"2010-08-10T08:31:00.000Z","author":"Dbfirs","type":"comment","level":11,"id":"c-Dbfirs-2010-08-10T08:31:00.000Z-Baseball_Bugs-2010-08-09T15:15:00.000Z","replies":[]}]}]}]}],"displayName":"Jack of Oz"}]}]}]}]}]}],"displayName":"Shahid"}]}]}],"wgPageParseReport":{"discussiontools":{"limitreport-timeusage":"0.048"},"limitreport":{"cputime":"0.174","walltime":"0.230","ppvisitednodes":{"value":297,"limit":1000000},"postexpandincludesize":{"value":318,"limit":2097152},"templateargumentsize":{"value":0,"limit":2097152},"expansiondepth":{"value":5,"limit":100},"expensivefunctioncount":{"value":2,"limit":500},"unstrip-depth":{"value":0,"limit":20},"unstrip-size":{"value":0,"limit":5000000},"entityaccesscount":{"value":0,"limit":400},"timingprofile":["100.00% 25.187 1 Template:Anchor","100.00% 25.187 1 -total"]},"scribunto":{"limitreport-timeusage":{"value":"0.007","limit":"10.000"},"limitreport-memusage":{"value":633287,"limit":52428800}},"cachereport":{"origin":"mw-web.codfw.main-7d89b5d4c4-zgnpd","timestamp":"20241120204444","ttl":2592000,"transientcontent":false}}});});</script> </body> </html>