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contain-intrinsic-size: 1px 1000px;"> <header class="entry-header"> <div class="entry-meta"><span class="posted-on"><span class="screen-reader-text">Posted on</span> <a href="https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/" rel="bookmark"><time class="entry-date published" datetime="2008-07-21T19:35:15-07:00">July 21, 2008</time><time class="updated" datetime="2020-01-16T13:29:02-08:00">January 16, 2020</time></a></span><span class="byline"> by <span class="author vcard"><a href="https://tim.blog/author/tferriss/" title="Posts by Tim Ferriss" class="author url fn" rel="author">Tim Ferriss</a></span></span></div><h1 class="entry-title">Push vs. Pull Processes</h1> <div class="entry-meta"> <a href="https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comments" class="comments-link" >58 Comments</a> </div> <div class="entry-meta"><span class="cat-tags-links"><span class="cat-links">Topics: <span class="screen-reader-text">Categories</span><a href="https://tim.blog/category/automation/" rel="category tag">Automation</a></span></span></div><div class="sharedaddy sd-sharing-enabled"><div class="robots-nocontent sd-block sd-social sd-social-icon-text sd-sharing"><h3 class="sd-title">Share this:</h3><div class="sd-content"><ul><li class="share-twitter"><a rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" data-shared="sharing-twitter-389" class="share-twitter sd-button share-icon" href="https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/?share=twitter" target="_blank" title="Click to share on Twitter" ><span>Twitter</span></a></li><li class="share-facebook"><a rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" data-shared="sharing-facebook-389" class="share-facebook sd-button share-icon" href="https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/?share=facebook" target="_blank" title="Click to share on Facebook" ><span>Facebook</span></a></li><li class="share-linkedin"><a rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" data-shared="sharing-linkedin-389" class="share-linkedin sd-button share-icon" href="https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/?share=linkedin" target="_blank" title="Click to share on LinkedIn" ><span>LinkedIn</span></a></li><li class="share-email"><a rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" data-shared="" class="share-email sd-button share-icon" href="mailto:?subject=%5BShared%20Post%5D%20Push%20vs.%20Pull%20Processes&body=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F&share=email" target="_blank" title="Click to email a link to a friend" data-email-share-error-title="Do you have email set up?" data-email-share-error-text="If you're having problems sharing via email, you might not have email set up for your browser. 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I agree to the <a href="/privacy-policy" target="_blank">privacy policy</a>.</label> </div> </fieldset> </div> <button data-element="submit" class="formkit-submit formkit-submit"> <div class="formkit-spinner"> <div></div> <div></div> <div></div> </div> <span>Get Access</span> </button> </div> <div class="formkit-disclaimer" data-element="disclaimer"> <p></p> </div> </div> </div> </form></div></section> </div> </header> <div class="entry-content"> <p><img data-recalc-dims="1" decoding="async" src="https://i0.wp.com/tim.blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/510823909_367b932cf4.jpg?w=450&ssl=1" /></p> <p><small><strong>All push and no pull doesn’t work in personal or professional life. </strong>(Photo: <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/markal/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">markal</a>)</small></p> <p>Preface: This is a guest post from <strong>Michael Port</strong> on standardizing business processes–or personal productivity–to minimize excessive trial-and-error.</p> <p>###</p> <p>Waste is a constraint. Reducing waste in your organization is one the easiest ways of reducing constraints.</p> <p>And here’s a surprise—waste in offices is usually greater than in factories, especially because it’s easy to hide waste in cumbersome or non-existent processes. Creating unnecessary information inventory is another common waste in offices. Doing too many tasks “in anticipation” of a possible client, for example…<span id="more-389"></span></p> <p>One way to think about waste is in terms of push and pull systems. A push system, like much of traditional manufacturing, produces as much product as the company can and/or wants to produce and then gets it out to the customer. The result is usually large inventories.</p> <p>A pull system only produces what a customer needs and has asked for. You want to have as much “pull” in your systems as you can. Toyota has very little excess inventory. That’s why when the Prius was so unexpectedly popular, people found themselves on waiting lists for the car. Seems like a problem, but Toyota is much more profitable as a result of being so lean. You might also hear this concept referred to as “just-in-time production” or JIT (remember?—it came from the supermarkets).</p> <p>I think of it this way—there’s a place for everything and everything in its place. No more. No less.</p> <p>Here’s a story on how to reduce waste (figuratively and literally), by integrating people and process in a pull system. My Aikido dojo is on the top floor of a barn on a lavender farm with a view of a lake. It’s as extraordinary as it sounds. We don’t have a conventional toilet.</p> <p>Instead, there is an incinerator toilet. You first press a button to start the heating system and then put a special purpose coated paper bowl liner (like a coffee filter, but don’t try using one for this purpose it won’t work) down between two sloping pieces of steel (sort of like a toilet bowl liner). You do “your business” into the paper filter, step onto a lever, and wave goodbye to your waste and any toilet paper. The toilet incinerates the filter and extra donations from you at a very high temperature, somewhere around 7,000 degrees Fahrenheit or the surface temperature of the sun, whichever is hotter. It’s a great way to eliminate waste. However, you can’t use the toilet without these special purpose coated paper bowl liners—they’re needed to keep the steel clean while also aiding in the incineration process. Many have tried and got a good scolding for it.</p> <p>My teacher and his wife have implemented a very simple “pull system” so that we always have just the right number of liners. Not too many, which ties up money and takes up extra space with excess inventory. Not too little which can shut down the incinerator if it’s overburdened by non-regulation uses.</p> <p>Over time my teacher and his wife have determined just how many boxes of this paper to keep on hand, based on the frequency of use. It happens to be four boxes. These boxes are then stacked on a specific shelf (the one closest to the toilet, not down the hall, which would create a different kind of production problem, but right where you need them—and can reach them).</p> <p>On the bottom box is written—when you open this box tell George or Patti. You do tell them because it’s built into the culture of the dojo and you are part of the smooth functioning of the system. They then order 4 more boxes—and have determined, through learning by doing, just how long it takes to receive a shipment of 4 new boxes. It’s a very simple pull system that, in this case, only produces the right kind of waste.</p> <p>As you can tell, there are a number of keys to success in this process.</p> <p>Everything about this process is clearly visible and apparent to everybody involved in the process. If the box marked when you open this box tell George or Patti was inside a dark, hard to reach, cabinet, or it was written on the bottom of the box instead of on the flap that you have to open to get at the liners, it might not get noticed. The process relies on this visual indicator. Visual indicators or management charts, or checklists, etc. allow for communication and sharing. You can create standardized work sheets, but if you don’t have a way of seeing them, and the process, as if it were in a glass box, it’s likely that the standard practice won’t be followed and breakdown and waste will occur.</p> <p>Problems have a way of bubbling up to the surface. The longer you let them simmer the bigger the problem will be when it surfaces. Our goal is to create standardized work processes that bring issues and problems to the surface, using visual indicators so no problems are hidden, at the earliest possible moment. People are stimulated by the visual, tactile and audible. People are part of the process.</p> <p>Remember, we’re integrating. So it stands to reason that being able to see everything you manage is a balanced and harmonious way of creating flow in your work.</p> <h3>The Importance of Documentation</h3> <p>Early on in my business, I had a team member who would not document her processes, no matter how many times I asked, begged, and pleaded.</p> <p>I spent hours coaching her on how to do it. I offered to hire someone to walk her through the process and essentially create the system for her. All to no avail. She eventually admitted to me that she thought that if she documented what she did, then I would just let her go. She seemed to think that standardizing might render her useless, as if it were somehow like mechanizing her job. Or maybe she thought that if I saw what she really did I wouldn’t think she was doing a good job. I told her that I wanted to standardize her tasks so her job would be easier and improve workflow throughout the organization. And furthermore, at this point, if she didn’t document and standardize her tasks I would be forced to hire someone to fill her shoes. Sadly, she didn’t come around and we parted ways.</p> <p>Of course, this was ultimately my responsibility for not making documentation of process a standard procedure during the hiring process.</p> <p>I know better now and have built into the hiring process a system of testing the ability of potential new hires to document a number of tasks. That way I can assess in advance of hiring them if they can and will do it.</p> <h3>Postscript from the Comments: The 7 Wastes of Toyota</h3> <p>Jeffrey K. Liker, author of <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Toyota-Way-Jeffrey-Liker/dp/0071392319/?tag=offsitoftimfe-20" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">The Toyota Way</a>, says that Toyota has identified seven primary types of non value-adding waste in its business: over-production, motion (of operator or machine), waiting (of operator or machine), conveyance, processing itself, inventory (raw material), and correction (rework and scrap). Liker included an 8th waste (a personal favorite)—untapped employee creativity.</p> <p>I have adapted Toyota and Liker’s lists for our purposes. So that they relate, not to a manufacturing process, but to a service business:</p> <p><strong>• Overstaffing</strong>—hiring people for whom there is not enough work.</p> <p><strong>• Overproduction</strong>—producing items (work) for which there are no clients or orders.</p> <p><strong>• Waiting</strong>—for information, resources, supplies, anything that slows down flow and creates waste.</p> <p><strong>• Over-processing or incorrect processing</strong>—activity, conversations, or processes that are not necessary or are incorrectly executed.</p> <p><strong>• Unused employee creativity</strong>—not enlisting and empowering your team, both intellectually and emotionally, in a continuous process of improvement.</p> <p>In manufacturing, it’s often argued that overproduction is the greatest of all waste, since it causes most of the other wastes. I think the same could hold true for a service-based business. Not only overproduction of your services, but doing too much of everything that is not valuable to the internal or external customer. Overproduction waste, as Liker points out, “…leads to other suboptimal behavior, like reducing your motivation to continuously improve your operations.”</p> <p>…</p> <p>Typical business processes might be 90% waste and only 10% value-added work. Your objective is to create continuous flow in information processes and service processes. No one produces anything before it is needed by the next person or for the next step in the process.</p> <p>Nothing should ever sit around waiting; except maybe things like cash savings in the bank for security and protection. Shortening the elapsed time from start of process to finished good or service will lead to best quality, lowest cost and shortest delivery time. There are at least two customers in this process—you and your paying customers at the other end of the process. Ensuring the best quality service benefits your paying customers and it’s also the best marketing. Ensuring the lowest cost benefits you as customer. Achieving the shortest delivery time might serve both you and your paying customer. But it might not. What’s the value of each of these objectives and where is it being created?</p> <p>You might not have the best service, lowest cost and shortest delivery time. You might, however, find the optimal balance between the three. That’s the objective of all your processes.</p> <p>###</p> <p>The above is a combination of two excerpts from <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0470174366?ie=UTF8&tag=offsitoftimfe-20&linkCode=as2&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=0470174366" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer"><strong>Beyond Booked Solid</strong></a>, authored by <strong>Michael Port</strong>, who has been featured in the Wall Street Journal and on The Big Idea for his exploration of concepts ranging from Toyota’s best practices to standardized management of virtual assistants.</p> <div id='jp-relatedposts' class='jp-relatedposts' > <h3 class="jp-relatedposts-headline"><em>Related</em></h3> </div> <p id="fhcp"> <p><em><a href="/podcast"><strong>The Tim Ferriss Show</strong></a> </em><span>is one </span>of the most popular podcasts in the world with more than one billion downloads. It has been selected for "Best of Apple Podcasts" three times, it is often the #1 interview podcast across all of Apple Podcasts, and it's been ranked #1 out of 400,000+ podcasts on many occasions. To listen to any of the past episodes for free, check out <strong><a href="/podcast">this page</a></strong>.</p> </p> </div> <footer class="entry-footer"><span class="cat-tags-links"><span class="cat-links">Topics: <span class="screen-reader-text">Categories</span><a href="https://tim.blog/category/automation/" rel="category tag">Automation</a></span><span class="tags-links">Tags: <span class="screen-reader-text">Tags</span><a href="https://tim.blog/tag/beyond-book-solid/" rel="tag">beyond book solid</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/tag/michael-port/" rel="tag">michael port</a></span></span></footer>  </article> <div class="wpdiscuz_top_clearing"></div> <div id='comments' class='comments-area'><div id='respond' style='width: 0;height: 0;clear: both;margin: 0;padding: 0;'></div> <div id="wpdcom" class="wpdiscuz_unauth wpd-default wpd-layout-1 wpd-comments-open"> <div class="wc_social_plugin_wrapper"> </div> <div class="wpd-form-wrap"> <div class="wpd-form-head"> <div 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(Thanks to Brian Oberkirch for the inspiration.)</p> <div id="wpd-threads" class="wpd-thread-wrapper"> <div class="wpd-thread-head"> <div class="wpd-thread-info " data-comments-count="58"> <span class='wpdtc' title='58'>58</span> Comments </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-thread-filter"> <div class="wpd-filter wpdf-reacted wpd_not_clicked " wpd-tooltip="Most reacted comment"> <i class="fas fa-bolt"></i></div> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-info-bar"> <div class="wpd-current-view"><i class="fas fa-quote-left"></i> Inline Feedbacks </div> <div class="wpd-filter-view-all">View all comments</div> </div> <div class="wpd-thread-list"> <div id='wpd-comm-26710_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Shama Hyder' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/f3242a6133b385dc7a7b3ba3d16cdda8?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/f3242a6133b385dc7a7b3ba3d16cdda8?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26710" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Shama Hyder </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 21, 2008 8:28 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Hi Tim- Glad to see Michael’s post here. He definitely knows his... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26710' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Hi+Tim-%0AGlad+to+see+Michael%26%238217%3Bs+post+here.+He+definitely+knows+his+stuff.%0AHis+point+about+the+im...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26710' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26710'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Hi Tim-</p> <p>Glad to see Michael’s post here. He definitely knows his stuff.</p> <p>His point about the importance of documentation is quite solid. So many people see it as “just the details”-but it can definitely save a lot of time and money if implemented correctly.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26710_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26711_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Ken' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/09360c6074306b7712faa99e2e61f70a?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/09360c6074306b7712faa99e2e61f70a?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26711" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Ken </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 21, 2008 8:33 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Very good post. However, I work in a college, where people equate know... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26711' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Very+good+post.+However%2C+I+work+in+a+college%2C+where+people+equate+knowledge+with+power+and+value.+Th...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26711' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26711'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Very good post. However, I work in a college, where people equate knowledge with power and value. There is also very little in the way of negative consequences, if they fail to comply. How can you convince employees that documenting their jobs & processes is critical to the organization’s growth and the security of it’s intellectual capital? Which I believe equates to competitive advantage.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26711_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26712_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Chris' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/154a0220cf682d4cc51b3986e9677137?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/154a0220cf682d4cc51b3986e9677137?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26712" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Chris </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 21, 2008 8:34 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=I’m going to reference this in an upcoming post on software arch... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26712' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=I%26%238217%3Bm+going+to+reference+this+in+an+upcoming+post+on+software+architecture.++Why+the+tie+in%3F++Pu...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26712' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26712'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>I’m going to reference this in an upcoming post on software architecture. Why the tie in? Push vs pull describes a fundamental problem we face when integrating different computer systems…do we push the data to them or make them come get it?</p> <p>This gives a lot of substance to the arguments for pull. Great post, useful in more ways than thought of I’m sure.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26712_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26713_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Gates VP' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/f78bb8dde52f12c7f7eb5e989f766cb8?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/f78bb8dde52f12c7f7eb5e989f766cb8?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26713" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Gates VP </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 21, 2008 9:16 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Congrats on firing the “non-documenter”. I’m a progr... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26713' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Congrats+on+firing+the+%26%238220%3Bnon-documenter%26%238221%3B.+I%26%238217%3Bm+a+programmer+and+failure+to+document+...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26713' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26713'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Congrats on firing the “non-documenter”. I’m a programmer and failure to document adequately can become a company plague. But really, anyone who fears losing their job as a result of documenting it is not someone you want on your team.</p> <p>Personally, I would have told them that the documentation needed to be in place so that they could spend their time doing more important, valuable and high-paying tasks.</p> <p>My current office actually has an internal wiki to manage these documents. They’re invaluable for things like accounting processes. Wikis are likely the future for this type of work.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26713_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26714_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Luke Harvey-Palmer' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/71c97d4fbf36a5f6a2e77cdc798c1e3b?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/71c97d4fbf36a5f6a2e77cdc798c1e3b?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26714" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Luke Harvey-Palmer </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 21, 2008 9:43 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Now TIm, great post from Michael’s material…I just wanted ... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26714' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Now+TIm%2C+great+post+from+Michael%26%238217%3Bs+material%26%238230%3BI+just+wanted+to+drop+you+a+line+to+say+I+fr...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26714' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26714'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Now TIm, great post from Michael’s material…I just wanted to drop you a line to say I freaking luved your book – it just took a while to get a copy here in Oz! Not meaning to bring everything back to Personal Branding, but push v pull is also relevant to Personal Branding. Great brands have plenty of ‘pull’ going on where business and contacts come to them – they are ‘pulled’ in by the power and persuasion of the brand. Building a great personal brand is not all about push neither. Your personal brand is not what you say about yoursef, but what others say about you…therefore, do a great job, return calls, stay in touch, help others, and live an interesting life…and you will ‘pull’ business and interest in to everything you do! Hope this connection is not too long a shot! Stay well…keep busy in the things you love!</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26714_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26715_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Raina Gustafson' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/f190d42474dc3f698201ecfd0c2384a8?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/f190d42474dc3f698201ecfd0c2384a8?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26715" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Raina Gustafson </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 21, 2008 10:59 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Glad I tried a 2nd time to watch the video. I don’t know what an... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26715' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Glad+I+tried+a+2nd+time+to+watch+the+video.+I+don%26%238217%3Bt+know+what+any+of+the+moves+are+called%2C+but...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26715' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26715'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Glad I tried a 2nd time to watch the video. I don’t know what any of the moves are called, but the single forearm spins are very sweet. I’m way jealous of some of their vertical leaps, too. I’ve always wished I could jump, but sadly, not in this lifetime.</p> <p>I might check out Dharma Mittra in Napa this weekend – he’s a well-known yogi that does handless headstands. I’ve never practiced with him before. Ought to do something fun for my birthday.</p> <p>Anyone know about tickets for BC One? I went to an international juggling festival with a friend once. It was kinda cool, but this would be way cooler. Do they sell out? Are they hard/easy to get? It would be a good excuse for me to go to Paris for the first time. I might be as close as London around that time anyway.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26715_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26716_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Seb Zar Bourcheix' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/22acc125818abb787c190cc1bf20cc99?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/22acc125818abb787c190cc1bf20cc99?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26716" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Seb Zar Bourcheix </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 21, 2008 11:15 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Hi Tim, I see you can document, it is a requirement to the members of ... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26716' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Hi+Tim%2C%0AI+see+you+can+document%2C+it+is+a+requirement+to+the+members+of+my+mastermind+group.+How+about...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26716' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26716'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Hi Tim,</p> <p>I see you can document, it is a requirement to the members of my mastermind group. How about you join ? Hehe. That would be interesting.</p> <p>My pro. activity is quite uncommon as you can see on my site. People wouldn’t think it’s a field of documentation, and it’s not, for the majority of “other-people-who-try-to-do-the-same-thing-and-do-not-succeed”.</p> <p>Since I decided to shift my way of working by documenting (for example: time spent on each piece, maximizing a pull system and so on ), the quality of my work has skyrocketed. Success in business will take care of itself.</p> <p>Yes, even in the arts, you will produce better by documenting every action and setting up a pull system.</p> <p>Thanks</p> <p>Seb</p> <p>P.S.: next piece : tango theme 😉</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26716_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26717_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Jon' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/5e014e95def2c335ef5c66eff2f1dc6c?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/5e014e95def2c335ef5c66eff2f1dc6c?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26717" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Jon </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 21, 2008 11:33 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=I thought pooping would be “push” technology? Sorry, could... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26717' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=I+thought+pooping+would+be+%26%238220%3Bpush%26%238221%3B+technology%3F%0ASorry%2C+couldn%26%238217%3Bt+resist.%0A URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26717' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26717'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>I thought pooping would be “push” technology?</p> <p>Sorry, couldn’t resist.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26717_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26718_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Cam' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/726a3fabc78f3d2ec7fe5a478ddebaf2?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/726a3fabc78f3d2ec7fe5a478ddebaf2?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26718" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Cam </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 2:14 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Hey Tim,.. This is a very interesting (and rather humorous) post. I wa... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26718' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Hey+Tim%2C..%0AThis+is+a+very+interesting+%28and+rather+humorous%29+post.+I+was+thinking+that+some+people+ma...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26718' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26718'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Hey Tim,..</p> <p>This is a very interesting (and rather humorous) post. I was thinking that some people may get overwhelmed with stuff in their business just through Parkinson’s Law. It’s my theory that Parkinson’s Law has a similar and/or same effect on time as it does on money. E.g something that normally will make you $500, that makes you $10k, all the sudden becomes a mental monster. This is perhaps why people overcomplicate the process.</p> <p>What are your thoughts?</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26718_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26719_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='nick' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/b39bef3181c4913c57627f57ddb1be31?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/b39bef3181c4913c57627f57ddb1be31?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26719" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> nick </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 3:12 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=All of the problems you mentioned above plague my work place. The wors... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26719' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=All+of+the+problems+you+mentioned+above+plague+my+work+place.+The+worst+part+is+that+almost+no+one+w...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26719' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26719'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>All of the problems you mentioned above plague my work place. The worst part is that almost no one wants to change them. Luckily the 4 Hour Work Week has helped me create a barrier around myself. Now if I can just get everyone else to read it.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26719_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26720_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Michael Port' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26720" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Michael Port </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 3:49 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Hi Ken, I understand your challenge regarding inspiring others to docu... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26720' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Hi+Ken%2C%0AI+understand+your+challenge+regarding+inspiring+others+to+document+their+processes+in+an+edu...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26720' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26720'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Hi Ken,</p> <p>I understand your challenge regarding inspiring others to document their processes in an educational environment.</p> <p>Some people are more motivated by the positive outcomes of taking on documentation projects, others are highly motivated by the negative outcomes.</p> <p>If you can show/demonstrate the outstanding benefits of doing this kind of work you may help them disclose new worlds (open up their thinking to see things they have not seen before). And, if you can demonstrate what will happen if they don’t do this work — like they won’t have a job any longer (I know sounds harsh but reality isn’t wrong it just is and more of us need to deal with it) you may get them to move in the right direction.</p> <p>Warmly and with respect,</p> <p>Michael Port</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26720_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26721_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Michael Port' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26721" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Michael Port </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 3:52 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Nick, I hear you! I totally hear you! Sometimes it seems that people d... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26721' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Nick%2C%0AI+hear+you%21+I+totally+hear+you%21+Sometimes+it+seems+that+people+don%26%238217%3Bt+want+to+change.+But...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26721' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26721'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Nick,</p> <p>I hear you! I totally hear you! Sometimes it seems that people don’t want to change. But, I beg you to be a revolutionary. Don’t let their current perspective negatively influence yours. Keep believing in change and be an agent for it. Continue to find the elegant solutions and you’ll turn on those around you. They’ll start to come to you and offer help. They’ll want to be involved and start jumping on your bandwagon.</p> <p>Michael Port</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26721_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26722_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Michael Port' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26722" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Michael Port </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 3:56 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=By the way, one of the best ways to create your “operation manua... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26722' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=By+the+way%2C+one+of+the+best+ways+to+create+your+%26%238220%3Boperation+manual%26%238221%3B+is+through+a+private%2C...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26722' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26722'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>By the way, one of the best ways to create your “operation manual” is through a private, internal blog. Since you can password protect it, it’ll stay private and you can upload, edit, and comment on all of your systems and processes. Create various categories and have multiple authors. It’s really a wonderful way to create an online operation manual. And, the best part is that it’s free and accessible from anywhere in the world. Ideal for a small business.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26722_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26723_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='RhondaK' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/af42ca9254463f3f5bd8329be34f0660?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/af42ca9254463f3f5bd8329be34f0660?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26723" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> RhondaK </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 5:24 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Tim…could you do a post on surviving your mentor? I had a situat... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26723' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Tim%26%238230%3Bcould+you+do+a+post+on+surviving+your+mentor%3F+I+had+a+situation+earlier+this+year+where+a+...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26723' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26723'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Tim…could you do a post on surviving your mentor? I had a situation earlier this year where a man counted in the holy trinity of my mentors pretty much slammed what I’d managed then told me why my success as I did it wasn’t possible. That was a strange dark night of the soul. My other mentor killed himself Saturday. That’s going to be an ongoing one. But my sanity relies in keeping it up, not failing and not laying down. If success was actually “possible” everyone would have it every day.</p> <p>I know this isn’t uncommon. How does one survive one’s mentor…both literally and figuratively? How do you dis-entangle their sage advice and guidance from what you’ve become?</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26723_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26724_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Maria | Never the Same River Twice' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/8358c5a1c1ed5d0d47570c1026889149?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/8358c5a1c1ed5d0d47570c1026889149?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26724" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Maria | Never the Same River Twice </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 5:52 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=@Gates VP – my office has a wiki as well, but frankly, I struggl... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26724' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=%40Gates+VP+%26%238211%3B+my+office+has+a+wiki+as+well%2C+but+frankly%2C+I+struggle+with+using+it.+On+the+surfac...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26724' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26724'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>@Gates VP – my office has a wiki as well, but frankly, I struggle with using it. On the surface, it seems to add yet another layer of documentation to my work when there are already several layers in place. I would love to hear from you or anyone else who has pushed through that barrier: How did you do it? What has the be ROI in terms of time gained, etc.?</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26724_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26725_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Karl Staib - Your Work Happiness Matters' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bbd96323fe94891ec23e8cfa045e8327?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bbd96323fe94891ec23e8cfa045e8327?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26725" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Karl Staib - Your Work Happiness Matters </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 6:11 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=I love the Toyota system. They also reward their employees for any sug... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26725' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=I+love+the+Toyota+system.+They+also+reward+their+employees+for+any+suggestion+that+is+implemented+in...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26725' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26725'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>I love the Toyota system. They also reward their employees for any suggestion that is implemented into the company.</p> <p>This is a great article because it applies to everyday life. We need to make tasks as simple and easy as possible. The more time and space we waste the more we can’t do what we really love to do.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26725_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26726_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='_Jon' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/cdd6382f4c158f504980aab761dfbd36?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/cdd6382f4c158f504980aab761dfbd36?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26726" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> _Jon </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 6:29 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=I work in a large corporate environment (300,000+ employees) Process d... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26726' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=I+work+in+a+large+corporate+environment+%28300%2C000%2B+employees%29%0AProcess+documentation+is+required+by+la...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26726' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26726'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>I work in a large corporate environment (300,000+ employees)</p> <p>Process documentation is required by law (ISO 9000) and by corporate policy.</p> <p>Cross-training is required as well. In large corporations, no one is allowed to be the ‘sole go-to person’ because the company must continue when each person is off work. The company has been around for 100+ years, so clearly no one is irreplaceable. In fact, most people feel like cogs in a wheel – or less. But we all have processes and when they are followed, work flows smoothly.</p> <p>It is up to the management to recognize when they are not pushing hard enough for the processes to be documented or followed. Good on you, Michael, to recognize where the oversight was and for taking the action to correct it. From personal experience, I can assure that if one person in a team “gets away” without having to perform a (perhaps mundane) task then other members of the team will either feel slighted or will stop following the procedures. It’s the ‘bad apple” scenario and it can ruin a small company. It can get a mid-level manager fired or ruin a career.</p> <p>As for the push vs pull, it is always subjective and situation dependent. In the example of the Prius, the question arises as to how far back does the manufacturer go? Do they stock up on steel and plastic just in case a vehicle sells well? Increasing production when your JIT goes as far back as raw materials can take a year or longer. Contracts are written for X amount of goods over Y amount of time. Adjusting those values – and they are huge values – is expensive and time consuming. For some products there isn’t sufficient profit to respond to small increases in demand. Analyzing and predicting consumer demand in some markets is more art than science. The above vehicle is an example, as are Nintendo’s Wii (very hard to find for a very long time) and Apple’s iPhone 2 (currently sold out and only shipping 45 per day). These should be setup as Pull.</p> <p>On the other hand, there are many products – mostly consumables – that should be setup as Push. For example, the supplies needed by hospitals, schools, and restaurants can be relatively easily predicted. In as much as ‘consumer actions’ will normalize over time and the cost of having a small local stockpile of these items on site is not overly expensive, a supplier can count on shipping X amount of Y items on a regular basis. For example, a regional manager at McDonald’s can predict very accurately how much supplies are required at each of the local stores and can setup regular deliveries without much input from the local store. Yes, the stores have a feedback system that indicates how much product has been sold recently, but those numbers are not used for planning and distribution purposes as much as they are for trends and sales. And the cost of storing an extra unit of each item at the store isn’t tremendous, so over-pushing isn’t really a concern.</p> <p>Examples of systems where both push and pull are used about in the retail space. A great example is clothing stores. They are push when the season changes and new styles are released. These are sent out to stores regardless of their local need. Extra / old stock is shipped back. But the pull comes into play after the initial push for product that is selling well. In this industry, pull works at the retail level but is nearly impossible at the manufacturing level. Cloth is cloth, so it can be amassed by the manufacturer. But it is in the manufacturer’s best interest to make as many as may be necessary, then move on the to next product. By the time a product is seen as a ‘smashing success’ that would result in a major pull, the manufacturer is on making another product – possibly two more more removed from the in-demand product. To accommodate the increased demand, the pull manufacturing is usually performed by smaller, secondary shops that are more dynamic and have faster setup times – with higher per unit cost and less quantity capability. But by that time in the product cycle, the retailer can either afford to charge a higher price for an in-demand product or the designer has already recovered the initial design / bring-to-market costs and can absorb the increased manufacturing costs. Either way, in this industry, switching from a push to a pull results in increased costs, not less. But it has a value, so it is useful.</p> <p>As a final item, I want to point out that ‘waste’ isn’t always bad. To a certain extent, excess capacity is waste. But if that waste allows a competitive advantage, then it is a good thing. For example, if the Prius manufacturing process had been designed with sufficient excess capacity such that all consumer demand had been satisfied, the result could have been near-total market control. If everyone wanting a fuel efficient car had been able to get a Prius when they wanted one, the result would have an effect on all of the other car makers. It would have had an impact on their product plans knowing that they would have to ‘break into’ a field that is already dominated by a single product. While not perfect examples, I point to the success of Chrysler in the mini-van market and Ford in the pickup truck market. Their over-capacity and saturation strategies (both ‘push’) resulted in dominance of the area for a long time (in one case, 30+ years). Again, not perfect examples in light of how the auto industry is going right now, but they are examples of how excess is not always waste.</p> <p>Thanks for letting me post such a lengthy comment.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' 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class='avatar avatar-64 photo' width='64' height='64' src='https://149346886.v2.pressablecdn.com/wp-content/plugins/wpdiscuz/assets/img/trackback.png' alt='trackback'> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26727" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> <a href='http://weswear.ws/2008/07/22/push-vs-pull/' rel='noreferrer ugc nofollow' target='_blank'>We Swear » Blog Archive » Push vs Pull - figuratively. literally. irregardlessly.</a> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 6:31 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=[…] Swear July 22nd, 2008 Push vs Pull (Author: _Jon) In this... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26727' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=%5B%26%238230%3B%5D+Swear+++July+22nd%2C+2008+Push+vs+Pull+%28Author%3A+_Jon%29++In+this+post%2C+guest+Michael+writes+ab...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26727' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26727'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>[…] Swear July 22nd, 2008 Push vs Pull (Author: _Jon) In this post, guest Michael writes about Push vs Pull as it relates to inventory control […]</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26727_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26728_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Allen' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/eb529fb85f0baeca4c298ec0939e9264?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/eb529fb85f0baeca4c298ec0939e9264?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26728" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Allen </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 6:39 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Another way to document and therefore improve processes is to hire som... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26728' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Another+way+to+document+and+therefore+improve+processes+is+to+hire+someone+else+to+do+it.++Many+comp...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26728' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26728'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Another way to document and therefore improve processes is to hire someone else to do it. Many companies pay big dollars to consulting firms to document process work flows and perform process improvement. It’s not always worth the cost, but it’s an option.</p> <p>Often when performing consulting we find that each person only knows their own job, and has no idea where they fit in the big picture or even why they do certain tasks. They may be performing tasks that someone else undoes later on. Having a single person or team talk to each person/department allows them to see how each process fits together.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26728_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26729_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Brian Buck' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/541f70df717c26fef9169a70eba72e5e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/541f70df717c26fef9169a70eba72e5e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26729" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Brian Buck </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 7:47 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Tim and Michael, Thank you for bringing Lean improvement concepts to t... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26729' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Tim+and+Michael%2C%0AThank+you+for+bringing+Lean+improvement+concepts+to+the+4HWW.++I+read+your+book+rig...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26729' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26729'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Tim and Michael,</p> <p>Thank you for bringing Lean improvement concepts to the 4HWW. I read your book right before I began learning about the Toyota Production System. They both compliment each other in the focus on reducing waste and increasing effectiveness (not efficiency!)</p> <p>I really like your point about adding documentation of process a standard into the hiring process. I think this could even go into a job description!</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26729_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26730_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='topseekrit' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/49003feca1546b08e7ddd357e413c281?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/49003feca1546b08e7ddd357e413c281?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26730" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> topseekrit </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 7:54 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=This type of practice is part of my job security, lol. I get hired as ... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26730' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=This+type+of+practice+is+part+of+my+job+security%2C+lol.+I+get+hired+as+a+Consultant+to+document+busin...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26730' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26730'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>This type of practice is part of my job security, lol. I get hired as a Consultant to document business processes and workflows (“as-is” and “to-be”) for Fortune 100 Companies, and it’s amazing how many corporation under-estimate the true value in doing this in the beginning. It’s all about optimizing time, managing tasks, knowledge transfer, reducing reduancy, smooth workflows, integrating new business processes, etc. etc.</p> <p>I think it’s definitely worth the investment, so kudos to Michael for making it top priority.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' 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class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='michael port' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26731" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> michael port </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 8:40 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Hi all, I’m giving a seminar today so it’s a little diffic... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26731' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Hi+all%2C%0AI%26%238217%3Bm+giving+a+seminar+today+so+it%26%238217%3Bs+a+little+difficult+to+get+away+but+I%26%238217%3Bm+...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26731' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26731'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Hi all,</p> <p>I’m giving a seminar today so it’s a little difficult to get away but I’m going to come back this evening to respond to your comments, which are great.</p> <p>I’ll also talk more about the importance of reducing waste.</p> <p>– michael port</p> <p>Author of Beyond Booked Solid</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' 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alt='Ryan Crysler' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/603d07fce5b07ac9ce0a0028683304b4?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/603d07fce5b07ac9ce0a0028683304b4?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26732" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Ryan Crysler </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 10:34 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=I’m a fan of this post. To me it’s more like documenting ... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26732' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=I%26%238217%3Bm+a+fan+of+this+post.++To+me+it%26%238217%3Bs+more+like+documenting+your+system+so+that+your+prote...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26732' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26732'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>I’m a fan of this post. To me it’s more like documenting your system so that your protege can take over allowing you to focus on bigger and better things. Plus once everything is on paper, it’s easier to visualize, make enhancements and trim down.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26732_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26733_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Marvin' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/2ce3abf95144baa2c25ac8c84cd8fed3?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/2ce3abf95144baa2c25ac8c84cd8fed3?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26733" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Marvin </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 11:55 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=In this day and age of replaceable people, where organizations large a... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26733' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=In+this+day+and+age+of+replaceable+people%2C+where+organizations+large+and+small+tend+to+view+their+%26%23...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26733' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26733'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>In this day and age of replaceable people, where organizations large and small tend to view their ‘human resources’ as expendable, I can see why there may be resistance to documenting workflows. Once the workflow is documented, what’s stopping the organization from just letting the person go? After all, that’s exactly what happened to Michael’s employee, wasn’t it?</p> <p>Another concern is Michael’s concept of, “making documentation of process a standard procedure during the hiring process.” As if HR folk don’t use enough filters (some legitimate, many not), from personality and MBTI-type testing to even – I swear I’m not making this up – handwriting analysis.</p> <p>What’s missing, and what would make this process easier for everyone involved, is a level of commitment from employers to employees that process documentation will be used to enhance productivity and upward mobility, rather than simply be used to let people go and hire someone who’s cheaper.</p> <p>All that said, I’m a personal believer in documenting workflows, if for no other reason than it means I don’t have to worry about how work is getting done when I’m not in the office. But, frankly, the employer-employee level of trust was shattered in the layoff-happy 1990s, and it’s going to take a lot of work and time before any employee is going to willingly be put in a position of being expendable again.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26733_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26734_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Ian Waring' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/c06f41c80b985dd8bfa0241021449b7a?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/c06f41c80b985dd8bfa0241021449b7a?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26734" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Ian Waring </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 12:27 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=I’m going to be first here to say “Muda”. Many good... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26734' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=I%26%238217%3Bm+going+to+be+first+here+to+say+%26%238220%3BMuda%26%238221%3B.+Many++good+things+seem+to+trace+back+to+...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26734' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26734'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>I’m going to be first here to say “Muda”. Many good things seem to trace back to Toyota and onto the works of Dr W Edwards Deming. Just applying them to new contexts…</p> <p>Ian W.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26734_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26735_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Chris' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/20039017ed4883b519e3d35bfc4280ed?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/20039017ed4883b519e3d35bfc4280ed?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26735" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Chris </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 1:02 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=The idea of firing someone because I was unable to convince them to do... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26735' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=The+idea+of+firing+someone+because+I+was+unable+to+convince+them+to+document+seems+too+much+like+try...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26735' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26735'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>The idea of firing someone because I was unable to convince them to document seems too much like trying to sweep mistakes under the sofa rather than dealing with them outright. The post’s author even acknowledges that failing to deal with little problems now can create the opportunity for big problems in the future, just not that the problem could be with the management style rather than with the employee’s behavior.</p> <p>I’ve found that saying things like, “Documentation is part of your job. If you’re not doing your job, we’ll fire you. So if you don’t document, we’ll fire you,” is just bullying and won’t do much but get my employees to resent me. Sure it gets the job done in the short run, but it turns every new hire into a short-run problem and something else I’m obliged to micromanage.</p> <p>Contrast that with getting the employees involved in the process, “We as a company are going to create a documentation scheme together to make sure everyone knows what everyone else is doing, so nobody has to run around for hours on end, playing tag, to find out who’s done what when. We intend for this to make everyone’s job easier, giving us spare capacity, which means we will be able to pull in more clients and make more money. This will help us raise salaries and hire on new people for bigger and more lucrative projects.”</p> <p>In our company, not only did our workers likely come up with a better solution that’s more usable for the work they do, but by participating in its creation they’ve committed to not only the goal of improving workflow (and thus profitability), but also to using and improving the documentation system.</p> <p>The trick was in asking them the right questions and presenting options that show I’m trying to fix a real problem, not just getting them to do my job for me. I started with general ideas like wikis and forums and proprietary ticketing software, and asked how they’d improve them for what they did, and for ideas for incentive schemes to get people to use the system and create good documentation.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26735_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26736_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Brian Buck' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/541f70df717c26fef9169a70eba72e5e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/541f70df717c26fef9169a70eba72e5e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26736" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Brian Buck </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 3:44 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=A key pillar of Lean and the Toyota Production System is “Respec... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26736' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=A+key+pillar+of+Lean+and+the+Toyota+Production+System+is+%26%238220%3BRespect+For+People%26%238221%3B.%0AMany+corp...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26736' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26736'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>A key pillar of Lean and the Toyota Production System is “Respect For People”.</p> <p>Many corporations who implement Lean add a NO LAY-OFF guarantee. True, some organizations think Lean is a way to cut headcount but they are foundationally incorrect. Toyota currently has a plant and half of capacity due to slower sales but they are keeping their workers.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26736_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26737_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Michael Port' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26737" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Michael Port </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 22, 2008 5:47 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Excellent comments Jon… and I agree that waste isn’t alway... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26737' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Excellent+comments+Jon%26%238230%3B+and+I+agree+that+waste+isn%26%238217%3Bt+always+a+bad+thing%2C+especially+when...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26737' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26737'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Excellent comments Jon… and I agree that waste isn’t always a bad thing, especially when it comes in the form of inventory that meets consumer demand–but then it isn’t waste, is it? 🙂</p> <p>– Michael Port</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26737_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26738_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Michael Port' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26738" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Michael Port </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 23, 2008 4:04 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Jeffrey K. Liker, author of The Toyota Way, says that Toyota has ident... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26738' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Jeffrey+K.+Liker%2C+author+of+The+Toyota+Way%2C+says+that+Toyota+has+identified+seven+primary+types+of+n...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26738' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26738'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Jeffrey K. Liker, author of The Toyota Way, says that Toyota has identified seven primary types of non value-adding waste in its business: over-production, motion (of operator or machine), waiting (of operator or machine), conveyance, processing itself, inventory (raw material), and correction (rework and scrap). Liker included an 8th waste (a personal favorite)—untapped employee creativity.</p> <p>I have adapted Toyota and Liker’s lists for our purposes. So that they relate, not to a manufacturing process, but to a service business:</p> <p>• Overstaffing—hiring people for whom there is not enough work.</p> <p>• Overproduction—producing items (work) for which there are no clients or orders.</p> <p>• Waiting—for information, resources, supplies, anything that slows down flow and creates waste.</p> <p>• Over-processing or incorrect processing—activity, conversations, or processes that are not necessary or are incorrectly executed.</p> <p>• Unused employee creativity—not enlisting and empowering your team, both intellectually and emotionally, in a continuous process of improvement.</p> <p>In manufacturing, it’s often argued that overproduction is the greatest of all waste, since it causes most of the other wastes. I think the same could hold true for a service-based business. Not only overproduction of your services, but doing too much of everything that is not valuable to the internal or external customer. Overproduction waste, as Liker points out, “…leads to other suboptimal behavior, like reducing your motivation to continuously improve your operations.”</p> <p>In my book, Beyond Booked Solid, I discuss Hal Macomber’s Two Great Wastes™; not speaking or listening. It turns out that there are a lot of less-than-Great Wastes, too. Wastes will have different priorities, depending on the business. It’s up to you to identify what the big wastes are to you and your business. The list I’ve given you should help in the identification process.</p> <p>Typical business processes might be 90% waste and only 10% value-added work. Your objective is to create continuous flow in information processes and service processes. No one produces anything before it is needed by the next person or for the next step in the process. Nothing should ever sit around waiting; except maybe things like cash savings in the bank for security and protection. Shortening the elapsed time from start of process to finished good or service will lead to best quality, lowest cost and shortest delivery time. There are at least two customers in this process—you and your paying customers at the other end of the process. Ensuring the best quality service benefits your paying customers and it’s also the best marketing. Ensuring the lowest cost benefits you as customer. Achieving the shortest delivery time might serve both you and your paying customer. But it might not. What’s the value of each of these objectives and where is it being created? You might not have the best service, lowest cost and shortest delivery time. You might, however, find the optimal balance between the three. That’s the objective of all your processes.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26738_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26739_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Jen Blackert' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/7e11070379fa900e0074b4e796f8f627?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/7e11070379fa900e0074b4e796f8f627?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26739" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Jen Blackert </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 23, 2008 8:22 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Thank you Tim and Michael for spreading the word. Another thought. I... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26739' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Thank+you+Tim+and+Michael+for+spreading+the+word.++Another+thought.++In+this+day+an+age+it%26%238217%3Bs+y...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26739' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26739'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Thank you Tim and Michael for spreading the word. Another thought. In this day an age it’s yes about ROI, but for environmental issues as well.</p> <p>Thank you!</p> <p>Jen</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26739_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26740_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='sean' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/29ad5d27aa7dc10dd3f3923472a9ec9e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/29ad5d27aa7dc10dd3f3923472a9ec9e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26740" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> sean </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 23, 2008 9:35 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Twitter response: AskSunday has been offering that promotion for a few... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26740' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Twitter+response%3A%0AAskSunday+has+been+offering+that+promotion+for+a+few+months+now.%0A URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26740' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26740'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Twitter response:</p> <p>AskSunday has been offering that promotion for a few months now.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26740_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26741_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Chris Chrebet' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/70dc90f69dc7dbd96f5f52b05ede25e1?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/70dc90f69dc7dbd96f5f52b05ede25e1?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26741" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Chris Chrebet </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 23, 2008 10:22 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Really appreciate the Importance of Documentation: I’m not a pro... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26741' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Really+appreciate+the+Importance+of+Documentation%3A%0AI%26%238217%3Bm+not+a+production+manager%3B++I+just+produ...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26741' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26741'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Really appreciate the Importance of Documentation:</p> <p>I’m not a production manager; I just produce a weekly event on South Beach. We have a people go on a flyer route each week to all the hotels, stores and touristy streets.</p> <p>Before I used to have people call me to give me they’re status updates. Now I’m going to have them document themselves. I can easily see how this would give some motivation to work harder, more efficiently and make the job more fulfilling since they will now be managing themselves and just handing me a piece of paper at the end of the day.</p> <p>Again; not a major production line, but this is how the article helped me.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down 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wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='bRIE' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/c95255b854a58e40dba3606aef2a7e33?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/c95255b854a58e40dba3606aef2a7e33?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26742" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> bRIE </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 23, 2008 4:33 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Response to Chris: The methods you used to get your employees to colla... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26742' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Response+to+Chris%3A%0AThe+methods+you+used+to+get+your+employees+to+collaborate+should+be+shared%26%238211%3B...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26742' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26742'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Response to Chris:</p> <p>The methods you used to get your employees to collaborate should be shared–step by step–in the national interest.</p> <p>A how-to manual on the subject is sooo much needed!</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26742_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26743_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Adam' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/c80de56dd7e4fcd2be3c2fb27609cf0f?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/c80de56dd7e4fcd2be3c2fb27609cf0f?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26743" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Adam </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 23, 2008 8:31 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Hello, I read your book when I was a sophomore in college. It inspired... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26743' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Hello%2C%0AI+read+your+book+when+I+was+a+sophomore+in+college.+It+inspired+me+to+start+a+website%26%238230%3B+...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26743' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26743'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Hello,</p> <p>I read your book when I was a sophomore in college. It inspired me to start a website… I used many of the principles that you preached in your book. I used many of the principles you explained, I outsourced all the development and all of the design.</p> <p>I just wanted to say thanks for helping me….</p> <p>Adam Lawrence</p> <p>The site is up but w/out ads.</p> <p>###</p> <p>Hi Adam,</p> <p>You’re most welcome! Thanks so much for putting principles into action.</p> <p>Pura vida and best of luck 😉</p> <p>Tim</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26743_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26744_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Martin Jul' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/37e3da6f3d377350e98e3ee68654a042?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/37e3da6f3d377350e98e3ee68654a042?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26744" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Martin Jul </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 24, 2008 1:58 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Actually, there is an even bigger waste when it comes to product devel... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26744' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Actually%2C+there+is+an+even+bigger+waste+when+it+comes+to+product+development+or+other+creative+activ...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26744' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26744'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Actually, there is an even bigger waste when it comes to product development or other creative activities:</p> <p>The waste of re-learning things that the organisation already knows.</p> <p>As an example just think about how much learning is lost in hand-offs in projects…</p> <p>In my coaching I usually compare product development to a learning process – we are learning to understand the problem better, and at the same time exploring the constraints of various solution approaches. This is the essence of the process. The actual finished product that comes out at the end is just part of it. The learning is what makes it the right product.</p> <p>Now since hand-offs are a waste, if we have other people do the work than the ones defining the work and even take the feedback from the actual work back to the design process we have a recipe for a very wasteful organisation.</p> <p>I think I have seen a few of them – but I am working on helping stop that mess 🙂</p> <p>(begin shameless plug): I have written a bunch of articles on this on my blog – look under the “lean” tag(end plug).</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26744_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26745_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Martin Jul' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/37e3da6f3d377350e98e3ee68654a042?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/37e3da6f3d377350e98e3ee68654a042?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26745" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Martin Jul </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 24, 2008 2:16 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Response to Chris: The importance of documentation (“Standard wo... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26745' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Response+to+Chris%3A%0AThe+importance+of+documentation+%28%26%238220%3BStandard+work%26%238221%3B+in+Lean+lingo%29+is+to...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26745' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26745'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Response to Chris:</p> <p>The importance of documentation (“Standard work” in Lean lingo) is to serve as a baselines for process optimization – eg. if you do it the same way every time you can also measure if any changes to the process make it better or not.</p> <p>Taiichi Ohno of Toyota writes about this in his book about the Toyota Production System, and relates a story about him calling people “salary thieves” because their standard work posters were turning yellow and obviously had not been updated recently. That’s the spirit of it all – use the standard as a baseline and make experiments to make an even better one all the time.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26745_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26746_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='micah' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/5608dfb16931fb331ed47f6cd9ce6e4c?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/5608dfb16931fb331ed47f6cd9ce6e4c?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26746" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> micah </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 24, 2008 9:58 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=i’m a creative arts pastor at a larger church and have found man... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26746' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=i%26%238217%3Bm+a+creative+arts+pastor+at+a+larger+church+and+have+found+many+uses+for+%26%238220%3Bpull%26%238221%3B+...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26746' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26746'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>i’m a creative arts pastor at a larger church and have found many uses for “pull” especially in a volunteer driven work environment. we have each of our volunteer leaders create and constantly maintain checklists and will soon have them create procedures that are detailed descriptions of how to execute the items on the checklists. probobly in google docs so multiple volunteer leaders can colaborate easily as processes evolve with the growth of each department.</p> <p>this not only allows us to maintain consistant systems to serve our people but also will allow us to train new people as we grow and need new volunteers.</p> <p>the pain of maintaining them is way worth the payoff of easily growing your organization. because these are living documents that have to be contantly updated, we have to constantly give people a vision for why it is important using how it amplifies their effort into a cause they believe in.</p> <p>I believe that in any organization people have to understand how it will benefit them in addition to knowing its a part of their job.</p> <p>tim, love the book and the blog. believe it or not, I apply most of it to ministry. thanks, your helping us change our community. if your ever in raleigh, nc. let me know i’d love to take u skydiving.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26746_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26747_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Gates VP' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/f78bb8dde52f12c7f7eb5e989f766cb8?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/f78bb8dde52f12c7f7eb5e989f766cb8?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26747" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Gates VP </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 25, 2008 1:02 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Michael: I think there may be a technology disconnect here. I don&#821... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26747' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Michael%3A+I+think+there+may+be+a+technology+disconnect+here.%0AI+don%26%238217%3Bt+believe+that+a+blog+is+an+...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26747' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26747'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p><b>Michael</b>: I think there may be a technology disconnect here.</p> <p>I don’t believe that a blog is an appropriate technology for maintaining an “operations manual”. A blog is akin to this website and is not a good spot for maintaining important and changing data. A blog is more akin to a newsletter</p> <p>I think what you’re looking for is a <b>wiki</b> such as the ones offered by <a href="http://www.wetpaint.com/" rel="nofollow">Wetpaint</a> or PBWiki. A wiki is very much akin to a living piece of documentation (which is really the definition of your “ops manual”). A good wiki has methods for controlling user access, tracking an article’s history and providing an integrated forum for tracking comments about an article.</p> <p><b>@Maria</b>: like most new initiatives, management involvement and education is key. I’ve seen three types of problems</p> <p>1. People (who don’t like change) and refuse to use the wiki.</p> <p>2. Barrier to entry (some wikis are still a quite convoluted to use), and people don’t want to “waste time” learning another piece of technology.</p> <p>3. Some people just don’t “get wikis”.</p> <p>I’ve seen all three in our office. Problem #1 is completely solved by management, you need to remove people who cannot adopt to this type of change. Problem #2 likely requires some education time, wiki technology is generally easy to use, but it has a learning curve like all software.</p> <p>Problem #3 is the most insidious, b/c wikis do represent a shift in thinking. For example, you said: <i>On the surface, it seems to add yet another layer of documentation to my work when there are already several layers in place.</i></p> <p>This is indicative of some deeper level process problems. The purpose of the wiki is to <i>centralize</i> data. The wiki should be removing <i>all</i> layers b/c it should contain <i>basically everything</i>. If you’re consistently writing the same stuff both inside and outside of the wiki, then the issue is simply one of understanding.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26747_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26748_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Daniele' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/de3d860c3a8b6872d2b085a4acc55a64?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/de3d860c3a8b6872d2b085a4acc55a64?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26748" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Daniele </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 26, 2008 4:32 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Hi Tim and Michael, another terrific post… @Michael: You say you... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26748' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Hi+Tim+and+Michael%2C+another+terrific+post%26%238230%3B%0A%40Michael%3A+You+say+you+have+built+into+the+hiring+pr...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26748' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26748'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Hi Tim and Michael, another terrific post…</p> <p>@Michael: You say you have built into the hiring process a system of testing the ability of potential new hires to document a number of tasks.</p> <p>Can you give some specifics or references for this?</p> <p>This is very crucial to me right now as I am going through a key recruitment process.</p> <p>Many thanks in advance for the specificity and practicality of the reply offered.</p> <p>Daniele</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26748_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26749_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Michael Port' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26749" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Michael Port </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 27, 2008 5:56 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Sure, Daniele, I’d be happy to… When considering hiring a ... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26749' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Sure%2C+Daniele%2C+I%26%238217%3Bd+be+happy+to%26%238230%3B%0AWhen+considering+hiring+a+new+contractor+%28can+also+be+do...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26749' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26749'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Sure, Daniele, I’d be happy to…</p> <p>When considering hiring a new contractor (can also be done with an employee) simply start with small tasks as projects to see if you’re compatible. Please excuse the analogy but you might think about it like dating. Start slowly and build trust over time. It’s easy for someone to say they are a certain way or are capable of doing certain things but the only way to really know is to see them act in that way.</p> <p>So… contract for a small project made up a task or two or three… and ask them to document, step-by-step, what they did to complete the project. And, of course, you’ll pay them for their time.</p> <p>In Beyond Booked Solid, I discuss how to have conversations that get things done. Be very specific:</p> <p>1. Be clear about what you want</p> <p>2. Ask for what you want (and if they are willing to do what you want)</p> <p>3. Ask for questions/feedback or alternatives (get their input)</p> <p>4. Be clear about when you want it and why (be open to alternative due dates – promises must be mutually agreed upon).</p> <p>This protocol will help you determine whether this potential new hire is willing to offer feedback and opinions and fulfill a promise. You are looking to work with folks that have developed top-notch habits of commitment making and fulfilling.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26749_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26750_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='John P. Kreiss' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/0e82b829322ae330659ba47b0a93e4c0?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/0e82b829322ae330659ba47b0a93e4c0?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26750" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> John P. Kreiss </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 28, 2008 9:08 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=This is a great post by and is relevant to the industries we serve (Co... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26750' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=This+is+a+great+post+by+and+is+relevant+to+the+industries+we+serve+%28Construction+and+Real+Estate%29.++...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26750' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26750'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>This is a great post by and is relevant to the industries we serve (Construction and Real Estate). As recruiters for construction and real estate executives, one of the biggest frustrations we hear about on projects that don’t go well has to do with inefficiencies in scheduling, subcontractors who don’t show up when they’re supposed to or suppliers who don’t deliver on schedule, etc.</p> <p>There are countless other examples. For instance, ask a developer about inefficiencies and inconsistencies in permitting and I’m sure you’ll get an earful.</p> <p>John P. Kriess</p> <p>President & CEO</p> <p>MorganSullivan, Inc.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26750_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26751_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Dave' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/cce7983e6dd9d31320a9371e05da3f63?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/cce7983e6dd9d31320a9371e05da3f63?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26751" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Dave </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 29, 2008 6:38 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=I have been searching for the free Overture tool that finds out how of... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26751' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=I+have+been+searching+for+the+free+Overture+tool+that+finds+out+how+often+a+term+is+searched+for+on+...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26751' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26751'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>I have been searching for the free Overture tool that finds out how often a term is searched for on a specific search engine. (Check “Muse Math” for a background on this topic.) Apparently, this Overture tool no longer exists, or, at least, its not free. I have found a similar tool at WordTracker but it is not free. I am trying to do some preliminary research on a product idea. Does someone know of a FREE tool that will accomplish what Overture once did? Thanks in advance for any help!</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26751_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26752_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='rhea' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/a1b21f0dabf60621a1ec3a91b8b9b5f5?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/a1b21f0dabf60621a1ec3a91b8b9b5f5?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26752" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> rhea </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 29, 2008 8:16 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=I’m interested to know how y’all apply push-pull in person... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26752' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=I%26%238217%3Bm+interested+to+know+how+y%26%238217%3Ball+apply+push-pull+in+personal+relationships%3F++I+have+been...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26752' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26752'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>I’m interested to know how y’all apply push-pull in personal relationships? I have been considering it as a natural and necessary dynamic. Any thoughts?</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26752_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26753_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='tzu' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/55e6bae6419ca5c3f751492ea12cb0d1?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/55e6bae6419ca5c3f751492ea12cb0d1?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26753" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> tzu </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 31, 2008 9:15 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=when you hire – look for consistency – how long have they ... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26753' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=when+you+hire+%26%238211%3B+look+for+consistency+%26%238211%3B+how+long+have+they+worked+there.+how+long+have+th...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26753' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26753'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>when you hire – look for consistency – how long have they worked there. how long have they LIVED there. Ask them why VALUES are important. If they can’t explain that – they likely don’t have any and aren’t a good hire. That keeps it quick and simple. If they pass that – pose simple technical – job related scenarios that have been issues w/ other employees in the past and see how they respond – compared to your desired response.</p> <p>good stuff and i hate to do it but the personal interaction fits nicely with what i just saw here – link above</p> <p>“always take things by the smooth handle” T Jefferson</p> <p>you can’t push a string.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26753_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26754_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='MiniFortunes' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/47b22e8807f82ea5cbd857be914cf8e4?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/47b22e8807f82ea5cbd857be914cf8e4?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26754" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> MiniFortunes </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="July 31, 2008 11:45 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=There are times when push can be a more profitable alternative to pull... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26754' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=There+are+times+when+push+can+be+a+more+profitable+alternative+to+pull%2C+despite+the+potential+for+wa...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26754' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26754'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>There are times when push can be a more profitable alternative to pull, despite the potential for waste. Take an experiment I tried with my web design company. We had projects in the $5000-10000 range that took several months to complete, mostly because of the complex design and programming, and delays in communicating with clients. Because of the complexity of the projects, we spent a lot of time face to face and on the phone with clients to iron out details and get feedback. Even though we outsourced most of the programming and design, we were still a bottleneck in the process.</p> <p>After much thought, we decided to go in a completely different direction by focusing on simpler sites in the sub-$500 range that took only days to complete. The idea being that we could complete dozens or even hundreds of these in the same time as it took us to complete a handful of the more complex sites. The plan worked great, except the problem now was that the clients were still slowing us down with communication delays. Our designer in the Philippines would create a design in a few hours, and the client would take 3 days to give feedback.</p> <p>That’s when we implemented a push model. There are businesses in every industry that don’t have websites, and who aren’t picky or knowledgeable enough about web design to give useful feedback most of the time anyway. What we did is identify these businesses and industries and start creating sites proactively. This way, our offshore designers and programmers could work at full capacity cranking out sites. We would then contact potential businesses and pitch them a completed website.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26754_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26755_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='John' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/ea408d6fb7908435558b71c7388cdba6?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/ea408d6fb7908435558b71c7388cdba6?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26755" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> John </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="August 7, 2008 8:49 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Tim, How can I negotiate a 55% discount like your prosound.com friend,... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26755' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Tim%2C%0AHow+can+I+negotiate+a+55%25+discount+like+your+prosound.com+friend%2C+as+I+research+my+muse.%0AThanks...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26755' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26755'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Tim,</p> <p>How can I negotiate a 55% discount like your prosound.com friend, as I research my muse.</p> <p>Thanks,</p> <p>John</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 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target='_blank'>Encob Blog» Archivi Blog » Four Hours of Lean</a> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="August 18, 2008 6:44 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=[…] author of one of my favorite books The Four-Hour Workweek, r... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26756' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=%5B%26%238230%3B%5D+author+of+one+of+my+favorite+books+The+Four-Hour+Workweek%2C+recently+had+a+post+titled+%26%2382...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26756' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26756'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>[…] author of one of my favorite books The Four-Hour Workweek, recently had a post titled “Push vs. Pull Processes” on his blog. Of course it only makes sense, as his book describes how to do more with less […]</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26756_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26757_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='J S' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/fdd2d074ef0e401849680e6c18e13196?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/fdd2d074ef0e401849680e6c18e13196?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26757" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> J S </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="August 19, 2008 4:21 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=You’re right about the significant effects of the paperwork proc... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26757' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=You%26%238217%3Bre+right+about+the+significant+effects+of+the+paperwork+processes+leading+up+to+manufactur...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26757' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26757'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>You’re right about the significant effects of the paperwork processes leading up to manufacturing.</p> <p>Many manufacturing companies have spent a lot of time on the shop floor making improvements but forget that the paperwork flow in the front office is a real issue. Imagine making 10,000 parts in the wrong color because an error in the order-taking process?</p> <p>-Eliminate the number of approvers (none or one).</p> <p>-Time track paperwork (electronic forms too!).</p> <p>-Evaluate all forms for data “required” (too often too much that is never needed).</p> <p>-Error-proof processes so no “rework” later.</p> <p>Also, don’t spend all your time “documenting processes” – a ten page dissertation of how to do something is too long – no one will read it nor follow it nor write it. Get the instructions down to a few bullet points. If it cannot be explained in several simple sentences then the process needs to be fixed before any documentation.</p> <p>Remember that you’ll meet resistance to change.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26757_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26758_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Michael Port' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/bd292ec18828cef5296299ec9003d80e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26758" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Michael Port </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="August 20, 2008 3:25 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=JS, Very nice comments. You know your stuff. – Michael Port &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26758' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=JS%2C%0AVery+nice+comments.+You+know+your+stuff.%0A%26%238211%3B+Michael+Port%0A URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26758' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26758'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>JS,</p> <p>Very nice comments. You know your stuff.</p> <p>– Michael Port</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26758_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26759_0' class='pingback odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img class='avatar avatar-64 photo' width='64' height='64' src='https://149346886.v2.pressablecdn.com/wp-content/plugins/wpdiscuz/assets/img/trackback.png' alt='trackback'> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26759" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> <a href='http://rob-thompson.com/link-love-120908/' rel='noreferrer ugc nofollow' target='_blank'>Link Love - 12/09/08 | rob-thompson.com</a> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="September 11, 2008 11:08 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=[…] Push vs. Pull Processes – The Blog of Author Tim Ferri... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26759' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=%5B%26%238230%3B%5D+Push+vs.+Pull+Processes+%26%238211%3B+The+Blog+of+Author+Tim+Ferriss+Tim+Ferriss+discusses+the+L...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26759' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26759'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>[…] Push vs. Pull Processes – The Blog of Author Tim Ferriss Tim Ferriss discusses the Lean philosophy. Typical business processes might be 90% waste and only 10% value-added work. Your objective is to create continuous flow in information processes and service processes. No one produces anything before it is needed by the next person or for the next step in the process. This is something which is discussed all the time over on my other blog […]</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26759_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26760_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Alan' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/1fc33acfa7836d7957ab91ca822df732?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/1fc33acfa7836d7957ab91ca822df732?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26760" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Alan </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="September 13, 2008 2:45 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 16 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Reminds me of one of my favorites quotes by Jim Rohn for systematizing... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26760' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Reminds+me+of+one+of+my+favorites+quotes+by+Jim+Rohn+for+systematizing+decisions+by+employees%2C+%26%23822...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26760' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26760'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Reminds me of one of my favorites quotes by Jim Rohn for systematizing decisions by employees, “Operate by document, not thought”.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 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rel='noreferrer ugc nofollow' target='_blank'>Four Hours of Lean | Encob Blog</a> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="December 1, 2008 8:46 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 15 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=[…] author of one of my favorite books The Four-Hour Workweek, r... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26761' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=%5B%26%238230%3B%5D+author+of+one+of+my+favorite+books+The+Four-Hour+Workweek%2C+recently+had+a+post+titled+%26%2382...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26761' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26761'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>[…] author of one of my favorite books The Four-Hour Workweek, recently had a post titled “Push vs. Pull Processes” on his blog. Of course it only makes sense, as his book describes how to do more with less […]</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26761_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26762_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Martin Jul Hammer' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/6d282422ab05af8fcdbdf952e3c0d112?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/6d282422ab05af8fcdbdf952e3c0d112?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26762" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Martin Jul Hammer </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="January 22, 2016 1:05 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 8 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=A good article. I can definitely see this concept and its effect on my... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26762' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=A+good+article.+I+can+definitely+see+this+concept+and+its+effect+on+my+own+life.+I%26%238217%3Bm+currently...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26762' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26762'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>A good article. I can definitely see this concept and its effect on my own life. I’m currently learning to program, and I seek out new information, even if I don’t really need the information for anything I’m doing right now.</p> <p>The result is me using a ton of time learning stuff I’m not going to use anyway, and then having forgotten when I need to use it, thus forcing me to go through the same material one more time.</p> <p>This article is a good reminder to stop that kind of behavior, and instead focus on learning what you need to solve the current problem facing, instead of preparing to face a problem that *might* come tomorrow.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26762_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26763_0' class='comment odd alt thread-odd thread-alt depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Alexis' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/d154e14cb4dccf8f51c1e21436d0c3ca?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/d154e14cb4dccf8f51c1e21436d0c3ca?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26763" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Alexis </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="September 7, 2017 9:58 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 7 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Super piece. This plus the Semler interview just nail how I feel about... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26763' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Super+piece.+This+plus+the+Semler+interview+just+nail+how+I+feel+about+leadership.+Why%3F+Why%3F+Why%3F+Th...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26763' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26763'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Super piece. This plus the Semler interview just nail how I feel about leadership. Why? Why? Why? Then ice cream.</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 5.1-1-5-4-10-11-11z'/><path d='M0 0h24v24H0z' fill='none'/></svg> <span>Reply</span> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> </div> </div> </div><div id='wpdiscuz_form_anchor-26763_0'></div></div><div id='wpd-comm-26764_0' class='comment even thread-even depth-1 wpd-comment wpd_comment_level-1'><div class="wpd-comment-wrap wpd-blog-guest"> <div class="wpd-comment-left "> <div class="wpd-avatar "> <img alt='Shane San Miguel' src='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/9b92901066dbcedbb3141170e4b2d84e?s=64&d=identicon&r=r' srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/9b92901066dbcedbb3141170e4b2d84e?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26764" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Shane San Miguel </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="October 7, 2017 10:15 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 7 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Hi Tim, Reading this one, I was sparked with an idea for my process t... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26764' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Hi+Tim%2C+%0AReading+this+one%2C+I+was+sparked+with+an+idea+for+my+process+that+will+include+and+inspire+m...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26764' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26764'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Hi Tim, </p> <p>Reading this one, I was sparked with an idea for my process that will include and inspire my team. It is Saturday and I’m losing the fight to wait until Monday to get the team started!</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 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srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/1a426071aa1943eb26fc6101427ebe56?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26765" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> Karsten Madsen </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="March 5, 2018 7:52 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 6 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=“Typical business processes might be 90% waste and only 10% valu... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26765' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=%26%238220%3BTypical+business+processes+might+be+90%25+waste+and+only+10%25+value-added+work%26%238221%3B+that+sound...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26765' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26765'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>“Typical business processes might be 90% waste and only 10% value-added work” that sounds depressing 😀</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 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class="wpd-comment-author "> Brian </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="March 20, 2018 8:48 pm"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 6 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Those are 2 of my favorite sumo wrestlers. Ironically, the wrestler o... &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26766' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Those+are+2+of+my+favorite+sumo+wrestlers.++Ironically%2C+the+wrestler+on+the+left+is+just+about+all+p...+ URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26766' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26766'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Those are 2 of my favorite sumo wrestlers. Ironically, the wrestler on the left is just about all push, due to his relatively small stature. Any analogy in there is not that important. </p> <p>Great article, thank you, Michael Port!</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 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srcset='https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/dbcaf9ac3adfa33bd74fad6c9f47cee3?s=128&d=identicon&r=r 2x' class='avatar avatar-64 photo' height='64' width='64' loading='lazy' decoding='async'/> </div> </div> <div id="comment-26767" class="wpd-comment-right"> <div class="wpd-comment-header"> <div class="wpd-comment-author "> DURAISAMY R </div> <div class="wpd-comment-date" title="August 14, 2018 10:03 am"> <i class='far fa-clock' aria-hidden='true'></i> 6 years ago </div> <div class="wpd-comment-share wpd-hidden wpd-tooltip wpd-top"> <i class='fas fa-share-alt' aria-hidden='true'></i> <div class="wpd-tooltip-content"> <a class='wc_tw' rel='noreferrer' target='_blank' href='https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?text=Fantastic post &url=https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26767' title='Share On Twitter'><i class='fab fa-twitter wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a><a class='wc_whatsapp' rel='noreferrer' href='https://web.whatsapp.com/send?text=Fantastic+post%0A URL: https%3A%2F%2Ftim.blog%2F2008%2F07%2F21%2Fpush-vs-pull-processes%2F%23comment-26767' target='_blank' title='Share On WhatsApp'><i class='fab fa-whatsapp wpf-cta' aria-hidden='true'></i></a> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-space"></div> <div class="wpd-comment-link wpd-hidden"> <span wpd-tooltip='Comment Link' wpd-tooltip-position='left'><i class='fas fa-link' aria-hidden='true' data-wpd-clipboard='https://tim.blog/2008/07/21/push-vs-pull-processes/#comment-26767'></i></span> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-text"> <p>Fantastic post</p> </div> <div class="wpd-comment-footer"> <div class="wpd-vote"> <div class="wpd-vote-up wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-up' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-up fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M240.971 130.524l194.343 194.343c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941l-22.667 22.667c-9.357 9.357-24.522 9.375-33.901.04L224 227.495 69.255 381.516c-9.379 9.335-24.544 9.317-33.901-.04l-22.667-22.667c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941L207.03 130.525c9.372-9.373 24.568-9.373 33.941-.001z'></path></svg> </div> <div class='wpd-vote-result' title='0'>0</div> <div class="wpd-vote-down wpd_not_clicked"> <svg aria-hidden='true' focusable='false' data-prefix='fas' data-icon='chevron-down' class='svg-inline--fa fa-chevron-down fa-w-14' role='img' xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 448 512'><path d='M207.029 381.476L12.686 187.132c-9.373-9.373-9.373-24.569 0-33.941l22.667-22.667c9.357-9.357 24.522-9.375 33.901-.04L224 284.505l154.745-154.021c9.379-9.335 24.544-9.317 33.901.04l22.667 22.667c9.373 9.373 9.373 24.569 0 33.941L240.971 381.476c-9.373 9.372-24.569 9.372-33.942 0z'></path></svg> </div> </div> <div class="wpd-reply-button"> <svg xmlns='https://www.w3.org/2000/svg' viewBox='0 0 24 24'><path d='M10 9V5l-7 7 7 7v-4.1c5 0 8.5 1.6 11 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href="https://tim.blog/category/the-tim-ferriss-show/">The Tim Ferriss Show</a> (740) </li> <li class="cat-item cat-item-41"><a href="https://tim.blog/category/the-tim-ferriss-show-transcripts/">The Tim Ferriss Show Transcripts</a> (544) </li> <li class="cat-item cat-item-42"><a href="https://tim.blog/category/tim-ferriss-book-club/">Tim Ferriss Book Club</a> (6) </li> <li class="cat-item cat-item-43"><a href="https://tim.blog/category/tools-of-titans/">Tools of Titans</a> (9) </li> <li class="cat-item cat-item-44"><a href="https://tim.blog/category/travel/">Travel</a> (67) </li> <li class="cat-item cat-item-45"><a href="https://tim.blog/category/tribe-of-mentors/">Tribe of Mentors</a> (11) </li> <li class="cat-item cat-item-46"><a href="https://tim.blog/category/writing-and-blogging/">Writing and Blogging</a> (58) </li> </ul> </section><section id="custom_html-7" class="widget_text widget widget_custom_html"><h2 class="widget-title">Books by Tim Ferriss</h2><div class="textwidget custom-html-widget"><div class="tim-ferriss-bookcovers"> <div class="tim-ferriss-bookcover"> <a href="https://www.amazon.com/4-Hour-Workweek-Escape-Live-Anywhere/dp/0307465357/?tag=offsitoftimfe-20" target="_blank"><img width="182" height="277" src="/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/the-4-hour-workweek.jpeg" alt="The 4-Hour Workweek bookcover" title="The 4-Hour Workweek"> <h5 class="book-title">The 4-Hour Workweek</h5> </a> </div> <div class="tim-ferriss-bookcover"> <a href="https://www.amazon.com/Hour-Body-Uncommon-Incredible-Superhuman/dp/030746363X/?tag=offsitoftimfe-20" target="_blank"><img width="182" height="277" src="/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/The-4-hour-Body.jpg" alt="The 4-Hour Body bookcover" title="The 4-Hour Body"> <h5 class="book-title">The 4-Hour Body</h5> </a> </div> <div class="tim-ferriss-bookcover"> <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0547884591/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=offsitoftimfe-20&linkCode=as2&camp=217145&creative=399373&creativeASIN=0547884591" target="_blank"><img width="182" height="277" src="/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/The-4-Hour-Chef.jpg" alt="The 4-Hour Chef bookcover" title="The 4-Hour Chef"> <h5 class="book-title">The 4-Hour Chef</h5> </a> </div> <div class="tim-ferriss-bookcover"> <a href="http://amzn.to/2eNKHGC" target="_blank"><img width="182" height="277" src="/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/Tools-of-Titans.jpg" alt="Tools of Titans bookcover" title="Tools of Titans"> <h5 class="book-title">Tools of Titans</h5> </a> </div> <div class="tim-ferriss-bookcover"> <a href="https://www.amazon.com/Tribe-Mentors-Short-Advice-World/dp/1328994961/ref=as_li_ss_tl?_encoding=UTF8&tag=offsitoftimfe-20&qid=1504712515&sr=1-1/" target="_blank"><img width="182" height="277" src="/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/Tribe-of-Mentors.jpg" alt="Tribe of Mentors bookcover" title="Tribe of Mentors"> <h5 class="book-title">Tribe of Mentors</h5> </a> </div> </div></div></section></aside> </div> </div> <footer id="colophon" class="site-footer" 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